Beyond Abbate
An interesting question posed by a reader in response to our contention that we are in for a boatload of new training and videos about this supposed "code of silence" we're all a part of now:
- So, if training or whatever is not the answer, then let me ask you in all sincerity: What do you suggest to keep people like him from getting away with such behavior? How shall people like me, who support the good cops and can't afford the monetary consequences of abuse and corruption, be served and protected from bad apples?
--Law Abiding Citizen
We'll open this one up to the floor - how do we, as a Department, address the conception that there is some "code of silence" conspiracy?
Are there crooked cops? Unfortunately, yes, but there are crooked people in all walks of life.
Do cops extend courtesy to other cops (and city workers) in terms of parking or moving violations? It happens, but everyone has stories about the guy who writes everything, regardless of who it is. And don't even get us start about those assholes in Revenue.
But none of that has anything to do with a "code of silence."
Look at our fearless leader - an inter-agency brouhaha following a traffic altercation in his previous job, shooting out streetlights, liberal use of a particularly offensive racial pejorative and guess what? The media ignores it and let's Rahm hire this guy to drive the Department into the ground. This is a "code of silence?"
We're pretty sure we are going to see training videos - remember Hillard and Mrs. Hillard starring in that training video? Racial profiling or something? We just don't think videos that everyone knows are simply a knee-jerk reaction to the scandal of the moment are going to change anything institutionally.
Opinions?
Labels: department issues
posted by SCC at 12:05 AM
189 Comments:
my opinion isthat Im glad Im retired
It's easy.... Stop the nepatism. Stop the phone call. Stop the micro-managing.
Tell the reverands to go fuck themselves. Start failing people in the academy that shouldn't be on the job... Start failing people in their field training.
You know... Kinda act like a Police Department para milatary organization and not this liberal bullshit. Teach bosses to grow a set a balls again!
Just my 2 cents.
It's almost always the clouted. Assholes who probably should have never gotten in the job but are covered for over and over because who they know. They get such a sense of entitlement until finally they step on their dick big time. Abbate, SOS, Flagg/Jones and on and on.
And Kirby the fixer, lets not even get started with that woman.
The city should do a better job of screening--and not just in the police department. Abbate should never have been hired.
Every profession has it's Code of Silence.
In the last election 5 judges were retained that should not of been. The Bar Associations does not complain about these individuals except at election time.
Doctors are sued for malpractice and other doctors come to their defense.
Professional organizations do not want allegations of misbehavior brought forth for public scrutiny and comment.
Then we come to politicians, especially in minority communities, who are accused of acting poorly. Their contemporaries immediately come to their defense. A prime example of this was just last month when Danny Davis and Bobby Rush came to the defense of JJJ.
During the reign of Phil Cline CPD had a series of incidents, which reflected badly on the organization.
Koschman
Weems
SOS-Finnegan
Jefferson Tap
Abbate
CPD did not respond in a fashion that it should of and we are currently paying the price in bad publicity and leaders foisted on us from outside the organization. CPD is exorcising the organization of bad leaders and practices while other institutions are still wallowing in the stench of corruption.
We are reforming but the law profession, media and politicians are doing nothing to address their problems!
Anyone seen the new gwc law firm commercial? Out right asking people if they have come in contact with the police and have been the victim of police brutality? What a joke day after the abate verdict you got these assholes just looking to get paid
Oh, poor citizen. Cops protect cops? Do you mean like doctors protect doctors, or lawyers protect lawyers, or politicians protect politicians? You mean people who work closely look out for each other?
Go fuck yourself. People always look out for those close to them and cops are no different. But you want us to be, because you have been conditioned to hate us. Conditioned by the same leftist assholes you voted into office again and again to steal from you and distract you with this simpleton bullshit.
This asshole cop was a friend to NO real cops, only to the politicians who put him in place. The same left wing, asshole leftists YOU voted for and continue to support. In case you hadn't noticed, he was CHARGED AND CONVICTED and then hit again in civil court. Do you think anyone else would have been for a drunken bar incident?
How many other professions pay so high a price for the same stupid behavior? You want your pound of flesh, and you got it. WE WANTED IT TOO. But we want more. We want the assholes who YOU put into play to suffer for this sorry excuse of a human even being allowed to be in OUR ranks in the first place.
But that won't happen, because you won't allow it. You are the problem, not we. We are a band of brothers who suffer to protect you even though, at times, you don't deserve it.
Now go get your shine box, you sniveling cowards. We need a shine.
Code of silence?
Are you f***ing kidding me?
Here are some examples of the MSM silence ;
Benghazi, incident watched real time via airborne drone and no help sent. Same with request for help, refused. 4 Americans dead.
Fast & Furious, DOJ scandal in which 2 Americans and approximately 300 Mexican Nationals dead from USGVT. gun running program.
10 " green energy " companies that received taxpayer money via stimulus " investment " now bankrupt.
The answer is simple, this "code of silence" is the city's problem and this "code" simply spills into the police dept. 95% of the dept has nothing to do with it although we have to suffer the consequences when it rears its ugly head I.e. SOS and abbate. When I say suffer I mean everytime some fool gets on tv saying how the police did him/her wrong the public believes it and we take the brunt of internal discipline so the dept can say "look, we punish people".
For as long as the human element is involved in Policing, there will ALWAYS be some type of silly-shit.
Coppers don't fall from the sky...
They're from the same cross section of people that makes up this city.
Which is why?
There will continue to be people doing stupid shit...
Just as there will continue to be people who do their jobs, do them well and go about their business while being small, hard to hit and difficult to see targets.
Even though the media and the public tries to pretend that isn't the case.
Especially in this place and time of all out war against The Police and all their concerns.
An old timer once said, "Ya gotta work this job like ya don't have any friends in order to survive it."
Harsh, mean and nasty...
But true.
And you know it...
It's easier to fool people rather than convince them that they've been fooled.
Mark Twain
Every job has its perks. We can never rid the Dept. of such Individuals. People inherently don't rat. Most just avoid the trash. It's human nature. It occurs in ever profession and even non professions. Will survive with more Abbate's .
There's only been one Abbatte.
Aren't we always hearing about school faculty members catching sexual assault cases with underage students? These are people raping children. If you want to be outraged about something, be outraged about people like this; not some drunken idiot copper. But of course we only hear about these cases on page 9 of the paper and they go away. But we've seen the Abbatte story pop up 100 times and it's only one story.
Of course it's alot more trendier and accepted to trash the cops more than any other profession.
Police brutality is basicly a non issue today compared to the past. But the media keeps on throwing the BS stories around to steer the sheep away from the real issues.
The so-called code of silence died years ago, but the media and crime drama tv shows perpetuate the myth. Police, in general, have little loyalty to one another these days, beyond their partners (and sometimes not even then).
John Kass on WGN radio today basically said this Abbate trial is nothing compared to the case getting ready to come to trial. It is the one concerning the white girl from California who was bi-polar and locked up a Midway and housed at the 002 District lockup, released and thrown from the projects windows. he seems to think with the evidence and depostions taken that when this hits the courts, it will make all of us look like scum.
If you want to eliminate Abbate-type problems, start with the FTOs. I've heard a lot of them say they 'probably should have failed' their recruit, but it's 'too much trouble' to go through the documentation.
This perception of a "blue code of silence" only seems to apply to protecting those officers with clout, or who are strongly perceived to have clout. THAT IS WHERE THE PROBLEM LIES WITHIN THE DEPARTMENT.
Outside of the department, it lies with the media. They print half truths, ignore real issues, bury stories and do a shitty job of following up on leads.
Consider well, SCC, your descriptive and unbelievable behavior of a certain police superintendent. His past and current antics are NOT SECRET! The media has not reported a word about his actions and his atrocious behavior! Why is McCarthy so sacrosanct that the media refuses to look more closely at him?
Look at what this blog has been saying about JJJr. Look at the leads that were given to the media, but ignored, because the self-serving news outlets in Chicago play their own games. At the time of Blago's arrest, posts were linking JJJr. to a "pay to play" scheme and if the Feds did not cut the investigation off, it would have led to some very uncomfortable news for then President-elect Obama and Rahm Emanuel. What made these political criminals untouchable by the media?
This culture of clout, secrecy, pay-to-play, etc. could be wholly and complete destroyed if the media did their homework and went after the people on the top who enable this system to exist in the first place, but the media makes deals with those very same people.
Better Government Association is no help, either. They rejoice in successfully exposing the small fry who is a peon and overlook the big potato that is rotten to the core.
There are thousands of good men and women who go to work protecting the citizens of Chicago everyday who detest this political culture, but they have no hope for reform because no one in any significant position in the department, city hall or the media wants reform. They have too much at stake. So, the sickness spreads... and we wait for the next Abbate to surface.
God help this forsaken town.
The REAL Code of Silence is in how the media covers for Democrats.
The same corrupt system that allows for such a person to become a member in our department allows for others to be promoted "meritoriously" in our department. When we can stop people like him from getting on the job and unqualified people being promoted to positions of leadership, then we can begin to disrupt this "code of silence". (By no way am I disparaging those who legitimately earned a merit spot, however such a boss is few and far between. Perhaps a nomination for merit by the po's from each unit, presented and voted upon would make for a better supervisor than what currently gets put out there by the powers that is.)
Rahm is hanging on to McCarthy's past personal scandals in the NYPD and the scandals while he was the Chief of the Newark Police Department. Whatever happened to that FBI & DOJ Civil Rights Investigation that was pending against McCarthy and the Newark PD? The investigation was about McCarthy's crime fighting strategies(racial profiling),illegal street stops(contact cards) and other hare-brained schemes(COMPSTAT).When Rahm wants to get rid of McCarthy he will throw him in front of an convoy of CTA Buses using the above reasons.He will act like he just found out about it. McCarthy will be an ass-kissing scrotum sucking lackey until Rahm finds it politically expedient to launch the Goof.
"The media ignores it and let's Rahm hire this guy to drive the Department into the ground. This is a 'code of silence?'"
Drive this place into the ground? The last asshole drove this place into the ground. McCarthy has his shovel and is starting to dig.
There never was a code of silence just some dumb ass boss who doesn't know the first thing about leading troops or testifying.
It starts at the top.
The Chicago Inspector General on down (and on up too I guess)is a joke.
There's no ethics in Chicago. The lawyers are loving it! The charges, lawsuits, appeals upon appeals.
Oh what's that you say? The courts seem to be running out of things to do and the lawyers and judges are whining. ROGER THAT!!!
Let's draw up some more laws that challenge the constitution then, that'll fix it.
79th and Coles tonight
Female P/O btw late 20s or early 30s. was shot in the leg and taken to Advocate Trinity Hospital for treatment, and was treated and released. One other person shot dead
McCarthy was speechless or should we say declined comment.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/chi-police-shooting-s-chicago-officer-leg-1-other-shot-20121114,0,5248741.story
well, here is the simple answer... THERE IS NO CODE OF SILENCE!!!!! It takes a copper looking at someone to get him stripped down at call back these days. Believe me, nobody is covering for anyone... if anything, this trial was decided from incompetent bosses who could not testify and are complete idiots. Nobody knows who is on first or what was going on. If there is something wrong with this department it isnt a supposed "code of silence", its the bosses who play boss and incompetent fools who in turn make every officer look stupid.
ive been on for 17+ years how come no one has told me about this "code of silence".
The idiots embarrassing this department should have never been hired; change the hiring standards.
We currently hire based on a minimum standard/multiple hurdles approach. As long as you barely make it past a standard- physical, psychology, or background history- you advance to the next step.
That's how this Dept hires it's recruits.
Ask anyone in 011 a few years ago about G.A. The tattoo on his forearm was enough to alert this Dept of his gang affiliations YET this City hired him because he was able to meet the minimum standards
The cop who wrote the report intentionally omitted the fact Abbate was a cop. PERIOD !
It all has to do with hiring and promotional standards. PERIOD.
The defense built their case on this so called "code of silence," they knew that the idiots in charge would drip over each other trying to avoid blame, and they did in grand fashion. The reports of testimony from this case were so disgusting it made many of us wonder how any of these key players were ever law enforcement in the first place.
For the record this cost ALL of us big, the citizens(taxpayers) as well as the police(taxpayers). It also cost the police a lot more in the way of credibility, accountability, and reputation.
The best part is at the end of the day, the beating was NOT THAT BAD. It was perception, it looked God Awful but her injuries were basically nonexistent. He is a big, fat, stupid, useless, savage, that has no place on the police department(or any other job with responsibility), but that aside it never warranted all this attention. He deserved to be fired and he was, end of story. It was a misdemeanor case of battery like the hundreds that happen EVERY DAY in this violent city, but almost all of them slide under the radar. Him being a police officer had nothing to do with him sitting in a bar "crying over his sick dog."
The sad fact is most juries are made up of people that don't pay taxes and have no problem giving away tax money. Lawsuits are completely out of hand throughout this Country and it is one of many contributing factors in killing this economy.
Fuck ABBATE he can rot. Even though I felt bad for her get cracked, fuck the polish girl too, she is just a scamming hustler.
The blood sucking lawyers go without question.
"We just don't think videos that everyone knows are simply a knee-jerk reaction to the scandal of the moment are going to change anything institutionally"
Couldn't agree more, well said...
Will Dirty Deb and Juan Rivera survive the Truth?
IAD is corrupt!
Man acts like child! Man gets help! man acts like man!
City lawyers act like children! Buy new lawyers!
IN DREAMLAND, we could ask that only professional and qualified people with morals and integrity be promoted to the exempt ranks, not people who are indebted to the slimey politicians.
And when people are promoted to exempt ranks, make public their qualifications for said positions: such as experience as a police officer, number of quality arrests in which they were box one or two (not all those paper jumpers on tact teams--the ones who put ten coppers from their tact team on a dopw arrest so that all can pad their statistics. don't be mad you tact people, you know you do it), cases they have solved, classes they have taken to become subject matter experts, educational experience, leadership experience, degrees, pedigree (example: is this promoted person the third cousin of Daley). the promoted person's loyalties should not be to the political elites, but to the job and citizens of the city who pay their salaries.
but in reality, in this city in which the police department is some sort of fiefdom in which political allies are rewarded with their little bits of turf to rule over, cases like abbate could happen again.
the strength of the police department, and the source of any good feelings toward the police, lies in the working coppers whose daily, individual acts of heroism, make the rest of the department look good.
Good work to the police in 004 tonight involved in putting a permanent end to one violent criminal's life. Get well office.
Excellent question. A close friend of mine has a "problem" employee. Every time he or another supervisor initiates any kind of discipline against this officer, it gets quashed by THEIR Lt. because he thinks this officer walks on water.
A prime example of this officers behavior...he was 2 hours late to work, no call, no slip, nothing. When he finally showed up, my buddy didn't bother to say anything to him because it was fruitless. The Lt . said something to this officer and his response was, "Hah, what are you gonna do about it?"
People, if you have a spineless boss like this, make sure you keep a record of any aberrant behavior and what YOU tried to do to correct it and the people who blocked your efforts. This way, you're not grasping at straws when the time comes.
"How shall people like me, who support the good cops and can't afford the monetary consequences of abuse and corruption, be served and protected from bad apples?
--Law Abiding Citizen"
face reality.
Chalkie
I've worked with some of the finest people on CPD that I've ever met. I've also seen scumbags that have done shit so stupid as try to sell a stolen superbike on ebay and kept said stolen bike on the top of the garage in the 016th district parking lot. Some people must have a blessing so strong that they just cant get in trouble.
All in all, it's a great job and I'm happy to have it!
We need a new unit. Blue Window Unit; it provides a clear look beyond the blue wall of silence. We'll need a new Deputy, Assistant Dep and Commander, ofcourse. It could be filled with all merit supervisors, giving the job (as if needed) a reason to promote JKIII. After all who would know better than he who kept his job after an armed robbery of a defenseless cab driver while Cozzi sat in prison.
Here is just one suggestion to start rebuilding the departmen's reputation and improve morale.
Start with promoting off the list without ANY meritorious spots at all.
The problem with the department is with people who took a test and scored lousy. But thanks to the meritorious clause they were able to get promoted anyway. Look at the current list of exempts and lets investigate what number they were on the list and if they were meritorious. I would bet the percentage would be close to 90% of them were meritorious most of the way up the ladder.
signed,
West side police
THE Academy is a Joke! The Building is also dirty. Instructors that have been inside for over 6yrs on averasge. Gym staff even longer. But all of this is due to the BS Clouted system of the CPD.
There is no "military" in the semi military system we claim as the CPD. Ahat Cops never get disciplined. -Semper FI
Unfortunately, we take our officers from society. Among us in society you have sociopaths, psychopaths, thieves, sexual deviants, and others with undesirable characteristics. These characteristics will come to light when the opportunity presents itself.
Our testing process is meant to weed out those with these undesirable traits. Unfortunately, it is not foolproof. Bad apples slip through the cracks. These bad apples can sometimes go through their career without incident.
However, when the right situation presents itself, alcohol abuse, narcotic abuse, theft, narcotic sales, bribery, etc., will be brought to light.
We are human. We respond to situations in the best way we know how. Those with undesirable characteristics will revert to these base instincts when pushed to the brink.
No matter what the media says, there is no "code of silence" or "conspiracy". Anyone who knows the police know that you can't get 4 officers to agree on a lunch location without a lengthy discussion.
The media would have you believe that one officer would walk up to another and say "Hey, we are framing OJ, you in?" and elicit a positive response. I am sorry to burst that bubble but 99.9% of all police officers are good, decent human beings with a conscience.
We are out to do a thankless job and accept the mantle that society has bestowed on us to the best or our ability. We have families and friends that we want to look up to us. We will not throw this away for a thrill or a couple of dollars.
Bad officers generally do not do stuff at work if you notice, Abate and others involve off duty personnel. They will hide their bad behavior. On duty, you will see these bad officers doing their job to the best of their ability. Many times they will not step out of line at work so there is nothing the supervision can do.
There are those that do screw up on duty and this was allowed due to bad supervision. Either the situation was ignored as it developed or the supervisors were stretched too thin to properly supervise their people.
Supervisors are held responsible for the on duty actions of their people. They will be suspended the same if not harsher than the officers that stepped out of line if they allow stuff to happen.
The "Code of Silence" theory is groundless but unfortunately, the media will steer the sheep who can't think for themselves.
The chicken little media members don't realize the power they possess. They can steer elections, destroy companies, and lives with just a few words. They are the ones that stoke the us vs them fire. They are the ones that create a situation from nothing for the sake of ratings. They are immune from prosecution for their incendiary remarks due to the 1st amendment.
Abate's incident was 5 years ago and yet, we have seen the video at least 200 times in the past few weeks again. Why? Because it is good for ratings to paint him as a bad cop. He wasn't a bad cop, he was a drunken, stupid person who happened to be a police officer. You don't see a video repeatedly shown of a drunken teacher, banker, or garbage man. That isn't good for ratings.
There is no rampant abuse and corruption as the media would have you believe. We have roughly 10000 personnel in the CPD and every year, we have a a couple of people that step out of line. This happens in all fields of employment. People get fired for being stupid. Situations get out of control and those involved suffer consequences for it.
If there was a "Code of Silence", we wouldn't have anyone receiving discipline. The police board is suspending people on a monthly basis for lengthy suspensions.
I will stop there. SCC, sorry for getting on the soapbox and ranting but this topic has been irking me. Thank you for letting me rant. Sorry, can't sign my name.
We'll open this one up to the floor - how do we, as a Department, address the conception that there is some "code of silence" conspiracy?
-----
I respectfully think your sentence should have read "misconception"....but anyway...
Every single book I've read on business ethics, or ethics at all, purports that the tone is set at the top.
Take Enron for example. It was a good old boys club where playing hard and hitting hard was encouraged. The top management set the tone. Same thing here in Chicago.
When you have headline after headline where corrupt contractors get the rewards (hired truck, planter boxes, iron fences, to name a few) and the mayor sold the city's resources out from under us, well, that breeds corruption from the top of the police dept. down. Not to mention city hall controls the supe, promotions, etc.
Every job has some bad apples. But when you have aldermen putting people in positions of power, the trickle down is WTF?
Then you have bosses who simply don't want to deal with the consequences if officers do come forward. The whole system is fucked up.
99.9% of the blue shirts on this job would never compromise their integrity....but there's got to be a better system of reporting what they see.
When IAD is fucked up from top to bottom, where do you go?
The so called code of "Silence" is prevelant in all walks of society, when was the last time a Doctor blew the whistle on another doctor who he knew was wrong. or another Lawyer, and how about that "code" of Silence at Penn State.
None of this makes it right but its not exclusively a police thing and to hint that it is is an injustice. There are bad apples in every barrel.
From the perspective of the City and upper management, "training" is merely used to protect the city from civil litigation such as this. If the City/department "trains" someone in a certain aspect, that releases them, to an extent, from liability and covers them in case an incident occurs.
Real training, on the other hand, is used to strengthen your work force and make them more efficient, or more productive, or improve their skills. Our department has never had "real training."
In this particular case, if the city/department could have shown that they trained people to act responsibly, or could show some sort of proof that they made an attempt to train people on the evils of drinking, they may have faired better, maybe. Although juries, as we are all well aware, are very biased against us in Crook county.
So bottom line,what protects "joe citizen" from bad cops, the answer is us. Was Abatte a dirtbag? Yes. Did someone know this? Based on many of the posts here on SCC over the past couple of years, Yes people knew he was a useless dirtbag. Did anyone do anything about it? Possibly, but if you have clout or you threaten to sue, they leave you alone.
We are all responsible for the way this department is run. If you see someone make a mistake, you should point it out to them. If they do it again,then point it out to someone higher up. At the very least you have cleared yourself of culpibility by doing that. If the higher ups do nothing, that is not on you, that is on them. But the fact is that most people just don't say anything to anyone, why? Because of apathy. "No one is going to do anything about it anyway, so why should I even bother." Because you might just save us all from having to go through another scandal like this.
"Do good things and good things will come to you."
— Earl Hickey, My Name is Earl
An even handed disciplinary system would be a start.
It seems like a bunch of other people, besides Officer Abbate, need to be fired.
In fact, it would have been much better if that happened BEFORE the jury took the CPD to school this week.
"Look at me...never rat on your friends, and always keep your mouth shut"- Jimmy Conway "Goodfellas"
I don't know how this would work and I'm fairly certain the union would oppose the idea but if you want to cut down on Abbate type of behavior - make the police union, not the taxpayers, pay the court mandated fines.
Get rid of the 2nd watch Lt in 011. He comes in 5 hours late everyday, that is if he even shows up at all. I'm sure one call down to random drug could help get him some time off.
I (not a cop) am retired. I've worked for the city, state and other govt. agencies. All had a so-called "Code of Silence". One part had situations such as; the guy who ducks out early to take his wife to chemo. I was his boss and along with my boss we covered it up so he didn't lose pay. The other part is the guy whose last name is on a public building and disappears after lunch every day. We didn't cover for him, but we also didn't blow the whistle. We're not stupid and we had families to feed.
People who think everything is black and white are stupid or crazy. Take care and good luck.
We're all screwed. If you see wrongdoing and stay silent, its a code of silence. If you see it and report it, you're a rat. Get ready for the new training, keep your mouth shut and pray for retirement...
OT Rita Crundwell of Dixon stole $53M and gets 20 years....wonder how JJJr, Shortshanks and 9.5 will fare.............
Here is what tge public fails to realize. We as police officers more tubes than not give joe citizen a break when we pull them over. I have let more of them slide in 3 mos than p.o's I pulled over during my entire career.
People forget that. People also forget that police officers are still human and will also make mistakes. There are numerous DUI fatality crashes. Does the news ever put that individual up on tv and slam their profession. He'll no. Yet the instant o police officer screws up its front page news. Our union and spokespeople need to be out there defending us and explaining what goes on.
The code of silence is a rumor/wives tale/urban megwnd that really no longer exists. The news media loves to eun with it. The most evident code of silence are the shitheads on the street when a shooting occurs or a robbery happens. That is the only code of silence. Officers these days are no longer risking their neck to go out of their way to protect each other. I am not losing my career in order to protect someone that screwed up. I bieve that though is held true throughout 95% of our dept.
It's not the department with the blue wall. It's the politically connected. Look at all the recent cases. The past history was all disregarded to to whom they knew. It's stems from politics. We are the worst most corrupt state in the land and the most corrupt city. It all starts with the politicians and the too their of leaders. It's not a blue wall in the department at all. It's a political wall of the elite and connected. Somehow that will never make it to print tho. Our alderman and governors all belong in prison as does out mayor and 3/4 of the people in sprinfield. It's not a police department issue its a politico one and that's the message we need to get out in the open. These assholes win by landslides and are never touched so things will unfortunately never change til the IG, AG OR FEDS actually do their job.
Funny thing is, there might be some type of "screaming video" however in the funny farm known as 025 they never show any of those videos. But when sued in federal court they show you a list of videos you were "trained" in yet never saw nor new existed. So you end up standing there in disbelief that the city and department claims you were trained in something and it's all your fault that shit went bad. Bottom line is you might already be trained. So anything above writing a mover or parker remember that the city and department have a nice large bus all warmed up and are ready to throw you under it. Watch your ass boys and girls- they don't care!!! Now go bust some heads!! LOL!!!
The Code of Silence begins at the top with meretorious picks for promotion, clout assignments and a feeling that the connected all take of each other. Training in the academy, not in service video is essential. So is a disciplined police force. That is lacking big time. We look and act like a casting for Hill Street Blues. Finally, there has to be leadership to set the example. You've already pointed out McNutty's past SCC, so I won't add to that but think of the incidents that exempts were involved in with no consequences.
There is no code of silence. It should be called the friend and family plan. Because if it was a regular copper with no clout that happen with Abbate he would of been thrown under the bus so fast it wouldn't of been funning. I seen enough bosses kids and friends of bosses do dumb stuff and nothing happen to them.
I for 1 as a veteran police officer have always been troubled by the fact (and we all have a few in our districts or know of somebody), that is a complete screw up and should have NEVER been hired in the 1st place, but because of who they know or what they are, nothing is ever done ,or the city does fires them, and the police board gives them their job back.the drunks,the thieves,the nut jobs,the useless medical abusers,the ones always i.o.d. How about the sgt. who ran a pole dancing class and all the trouble she has been in, and again.....NOTHING HAPPENS,but then we all know someone who has had a minor infraction,and gets hammered. until the dept. is serious about weeding out these bad apples instead of bosses protecting them,we will always have these types of embarrasing incidents.
Well, I have given Ray, Ray, and Pookie a play on minor infractions. I have given a break to the working joe, I have given a break to people who definitely did not deserve the courtesy. I have given a break to people from all walks of life. Guess what, a copper from any jurisdiction will receive the same courtesy I have afforded to the citizens.
As far as code of silence, well, it is what it is, when it comes to situations like this. Report and let the powers to be take mercy on the soul of the offender.
To all taxpayers, demand that your politicians specially the dirtbag ones, not influence the selection process of Chicago Police officers.
I personally do not like working with the people they have imposed upon us. Even worse, then promote these individuals to a grade way beyond their level of education and comprehension.
Virtually all cops show favoritism towards fellow officers. Very very few write other cops tickets. As Barry Sotero would say, this is a false balance.
there is a code of silence in all work places and with all groups. ethnic groups have a code of silence along with religious groups too. lawyers and judges HAVE A CODE OF SILENCE!!! people do not want to get involved in others nonsense, nobody does and can you blame them. there was no code of silence here just alot of stupidity in all parties involved.
How about we worry more about how a Presidental election can get stolen in America right in our face
Dear Law Abiding Citizen,
This is not The Shield, Training Day, Die Hard, NYPD Blue, etc... This is not Hollywood. Hollywood could never make a true portrayal of police work because it doesn't fit their mold. I could go on forever with examples but I don't have the time. Let me just say, there is no code of silence, the cops are not perfect, but cops are definitely the good guys. And what cops see? Well the evil out there exists, and it is much much worse than anything you will see in a cop movie or cop show, or read in a paper. that is why there is professional courtesy, but there is no code of silence. that is a creation of hollywood and sensationalist journalism and unfortunately the jury buys it everytime
Maybe Rahm can help us with the code of silence surrounding Barry Sotelo's education and funding records as well as BAR application.
Speaking as the son, nephew, brother and cousin (not to mention friend of many and enemy of a few) of cops, it's not just the CPD or other departments that have to change their ways to eliminate the idea of a code of silence. It will also require civilians to stop putting up with the behavior of the cops whose behavior requires covering up by other cops. When men and women working in coffee shops and small restaurants ask cops to pay for their food and drink, and cops do so without complaint, then things will change. When bartenders start cutting off over-served cops, knowing that the bar owner or manager will back them up, then situations like the Abbate Event will not happen. When bar-owners don't let cops keep drinking after closing, and the cops willingly leave (in accordance with the law) instead of playing the "C'mon. . . I can be here after hours, if anyone tries to bust you I'll flash my badge" card, then the perception that cops consider themselves above the law will fade. This site has always argued that cops are not above the law, and not below it; they have the same constitutional rights and privileges of any American citizen. But the code of silence is primarily about cops letting each other act as though they were above the law, from routine traffic stops to DUI and worse. And changing that perception will require non-cops to stop acting like the rules don't apply to the men and women with badges.
Here is something you can casually observe that defeats the paramilitary ( us vs them ) viewpoint
Look at any grouping of CPD officers ( be it 2,5, or more of them ) how many are dressed identical? Chances are none. We are not a lock step black booted ( code of silence) organization. You can't get us even to dress the same let alone tell the same story.
Well Im glad "Legitmacy training" was an easy day cause it was Bullshit. Not the message but the fact that we had to sit thru it.
29 years and never one verbal beef and I had to sit thru it. And the rest of the guys in there all had plenty of time to. They all knew the score.
Waste of time. The jerkoffs that are going to bring heat on themselves, and us, will do so whether or not they have to sit in a fucking classroom for a day.
More millions spent when the system itself is the thing at fault.
There are 10,000 of us. If there are 5-6 or even 20 bad apples that's substantially less than ANY other profession out there. We are human and we act like humans. We give other coppers breaks just as anyone else would for a friend or acquaintance. I still don't know ONE guy that supports abbate or his actions and this code of silence is such bullshit it's ridiculous. We will never fully rid the department of bad apples it's not humanly possible. As for fixing things, stop the clout hacks from constantly being promoted and taken care of and go from there. When you have clout u feel above everything. Unfortunately we live in Chicago and that will never change. The same liberals that bitch about this stuff go to the polls and continue to vote for Daleys, Madigan, Quinn, rahm, Jesse jr, etc. You can't have it both ways
"Code of Silence" conspiracy?
ATTENTION MEDIA:
Here's a blatant code of silence conspiracy if you need a scoop.
EXAMPLE: Mr. X, a stone cold gang banging killer tells Mr. Y that he tortured and killed Mr. Z giving him all the grizzly details.
Mr. Y does NOT go to the police with this information or offer to testify vs. him in court. In furtherance, Mr.Y conspires with Mr. X to conceal these facts and takes a bribe to HELP him in court.
(Still with me on this?)
QUESTION: Why is there no public outcry and media attention to THIS egregious example of, 'Code of Silence' conspiracy?
CLUE: All they did was change name. They call it...
"Lawyer/Client Privilege"
QUESTION TWO: How come alligators don't eat lawyers?
ANSWER: Professional Courtesy
The guy had a drinking problem-period! Let's not over analyze this. The lawyers needed an angle for a lawsuit and came up with the "code of silence."
It's easy. Fire him asap. Don't put up blog messages supportimg him or condoning his behavior. The few knuckleheads months ago who were sticking up for Abatte should be eating their words right now- they just look stupid to insiders, but to citizens, they make the rest of us look like we are a bunch of thugs, protected by the "code of silence".
After 35 years on the job, I have seen this so-called "code of silence" many times. This is usually confined to the political heavys, not the working cop on the street.
This goes on in the promotion process, where a clout baby get promoted over the officers who could really do the job.
If you want to blame someone, start at city hall, thats where is all starts.
He's not the first drunk to beat up a bartender. But in this case you "had a vast conspiracy to cover up" and the bartender collected 800K even though she had no bruises and refused EMS.
Was there a code of silence for Patrick Daley and his sewer contract? Why didn't the politicians speak out?
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/11/13/us-bernardino-bankrupt-idUSBRE8AC0HP20121113
Cali town going to shit, who gets blamed? Police and Fire pensions.
Principals and teachers cover for bullies in school because of their connections. Every industry has problems. Justice is hard to find. Let me know when you find her.....
How about Leftist media out lets keeping quiet about Leftist politicians?? Who will come forward about Rham for violating the law? Who came forward for Daley pointing a rifle at a reporter??
John Kass on WGN radio today basically said this Abbate trial is nothing compared to the case getting ready to come to trial. It is the one concerning the white girl from California who was bi-polar and locked up a Midway and housed at the 002 District lockup, released and thrown from the projects windows. he seems to think with the evidence and depostions taken that when this hits the courts, it will make all of us look like scum.
11/15/2012 01:00:00 AM
I'm sorry, did the police throw her from the window after raping her? no. That family should go after the gang banging drug dealing black that did that to her. Not the deep pockets for Chicago. Bullshit I say.
as long as the special kids get to cheat on the promo tests, you will have an inept management system.
Oh, poor citizen. Cops protect cops? Do you mean like doctors protect doctors, or lawyers protect lawyers, or politicians protect politicians? You mean people who work closely look out for each other?
Go fuck yourself. People always look out for those close to them and cops are no different. But you want us to be, because you have been conditioned to hate us. Conditioned by the same leftist assholes you voted into office again and again to steal from you and distract you with this simpleton bullshit.
This asshole cop was a friend to NO real cops, only to the politicians who put him in place. The same left wing, asshole leftists YOU voted for and continue to support. In case you hadn't noticed, he was CHARGED AND CONVICTED and then hit again in civil court. Do you think anyone else would have been for a drunken bar incident?
How many other professions pay so high a price for the same stupid behavior? You want your pound of flesh, and you got it. WE WANTED IT TOO. But we want more. We want the assholes who YOU put into play to suffer for this sorry excuse of a human even being allowed to be in OUR ranks in the first place.
But that won't happen, because you won't allow it. You are the problem, not we. We are a band of brothers who suffer to protect you even though, at times, you don't deserve it.
Now go get your shine box, you sniveling cowards. We need a shine.
11/15/2012 12:30:00 AM
This just about nails it. Why is that police get nailed to the cross when someone stupid fucks up ? Carry on officers. We need you. Period.
Hey "law abiding citizen", why don't you start by convincing all the other "law abiding citizens" to stop voting all these fucking shit criminal politicians into office. All you idiot voters out there who are good at bitching about the police need to wake the fuck up and realize that this department is fucked up because of the shit at the top of city government. Guess who put those people there ? You, you fuck. Stop wasting your hard earned tax dollars on corruption and vote these criminals out. Do you have any clue how stupid the voting public in Shitcago and Crook County really are? The people you keep voting in do. Change that and things should start rolling down hill and in time you will have less criminals and goofs working in city government and all it's departments.
District lockup, released and thrown from the projects windows. he seems to think with the evidence and depostions taken that when this hits the courts, it will make all of us look like scum.
All of who? I wasn't working the desk or lock up. I wasn't the WC. Abbate doesn't make me look like scum. Abbate makes Abatte look like scum.
There's a million jags on this department. Can't do shit about most, if not all, of them.
During the reign of Phil Cline CPD had a series of incidents, which reflected badly on the organization.
Koschman
Weems
SOS-Finnegan
Jefferson Tap
Abbate
You are missing a few there. Phil's tenure is marked with a tremendous amount of CLOUT and with a direct correlation to CORRUPTION.
CLOUT = CORRUPTION
Believe it or not there is more scandal in the pipe and on the way.
Chicago never ceases to amaze me.
I've always heard he should not have been even hired.
Please tell me what he did prior to being hired that should have sent up the red flags.
When that is shown to all, the question becomes why/if the background investigator did not red line the application. If the background investigator did redline the application, then who overrode it?
I/We need to know who is accountable and then go after that person.
America
How about this, the police who responded to that job actually report that the alleged offender is a copper. Then they notify their supervisor. Maybe, just maybe if they do that little thing, this thing as bad as it is, is above board.
Then you can let iAd and dk screw it up.
In the end tony is laughing it off as he has a new job, we have to deal with the fallout, his clout should be exposed. I
think we should at least have bartender sensitivity
classes taught department wide.
Kirby Kirby Kirby = insidious onset of the clouted problems within the top leadership of Command Staff
Rham time to Flush the clouted perhaps even a test for the rank of commander?? But that would remove the aldercreatures power
If you find yourself having to lie for your partner in ANY manner, you need to get a new partner immediately.
Trust me. I've been burned twice and didn't realize it until it was too late. That includes off duty behavior like sidegals/guys. Once you start covering, once you get involved, you can't ever go back and sooner or later it ALWAYS blows up. Just a tip from a guy who has been around the block a few times in various Districts, Units and ranks. Be safe, not just physically.
What is sad is that this blog is no longer for CPD. This original post was by a law abining citizen. Guess who else reads this "cop" blog. Lawyers, IAD, gangbangers, federal prosecutors,cops wives etc... This is exactly whats wrong with this job today. People go on here and say things that are better left unsaid. Loose lips sink ships.
one star
I can't wait for some true damage control to come through for a Obama or Rahm staffer, you would really see some witness intimidation then.
Anonymous said...
An even handed disciplinary system would be a start.
11/15/2012 06:55:00 AM
Remember Pete Brust? Most hated him. He was specifically brought in by Weis to do exactly that. He was supposed to design a matrix that was evenly applied to EVERYONE. Even the past Fed regime couldn't get it done because of outside, Political interference in the process. It happens just as much in IPRA. This is Chicago. We will NEVER rid the Department of outside political influence. NEVER! It's not right, but there is already so much wrong...
We all know at least one person on the job that shouldn't be here. Not just because we don't like the guy, but because he does things he shouldn't do. The problem is, I have seen through the years that it is damn near impossible to get people like this removed or even disciplined. Multiple complaints from citizens, mulitiple complaints from other p/os (including supervisors), mulitiple outrageous off-duty incidents and these people remain untouched. If the department continues to allow clout to trump responsibility, then the rest of us will continue to take the hit publicly and be lumped into the same category with these a-holes. So all we can do is keep our distance from these fools and continue doing things the right way, like the VAST majority of us do everyday.
To: 11/15/2012 12:30:00
Sir, take a bow. We owe you a standing ovation!
The Code of Silence, wasn't that a song back in the 60's by Simon and Garfunkel?
Anonymous said...
"Look at me...never rat on your friends, and always keep your mouth shut"- Jimmy Conway "Goodfellas"
11/15/2012 06:59:00 AM
If Jimmy were alive you could ask him about Henry Hill. Henry ratted everyone out. In any group of wise guys or dirty cops the 1st one on the bus gets the best seat. A guy gets nailed and starts thinking, what the fuck, if he doesn't rat the next guy might, then they are all fucked. So the first guy nailed usually sings like a canary.
Remember, two guys can always keep a secret if one of them is dead.
John Kass on WGN radio today basically said this Abbate trial is nothing compared to the case getting ready to come to trial. It is the one concerning the white girl from California who was bi-polar and locked up a Midway and housed at the 002 District lockup, released and thrown from the projects windows. he seems to think with the evidence and depostions taken that when this hits the courts, it will make all of us look like scum.
ummmmmmmmm, where have you been? That case cancelled its trial date. They have a judge assigned for mediation handling settlement talks. Its about a week or two away from a final settlement. Catch up and stop with the dramatics geek.
THE Academy is a Joke! The Building is also dirty. Instructors that have been inside for over 6yrs on averasge. Gym staff even longer. But all of this is due to the BS Clouted system of the CPD.
There is no "military" in the semi military system we claim as the CPD. Ahat Cops never get disciplined. -Semper FI
11/15/2012 06:21:00 AM
<><><><><<><><><><><><><><><><><><>
there never has been, and if it did exist it was over 20 years ago when the police were permitted to be the police, not like it is now and has been... but if the city changes with us, then why can't we the police do the same ??? if a recruit is not worhty then fail him during his probation period with the fto. if you want change then stop bitching and do something about it because its apparent that the city will not , has not and defiantely will not stray from demoralizing this dept. deeper. You want change then stfu and do something about it boys and girls
just sayin
The idiot ex-sup Brzeczek, now a bottom feeding defense scumbag, actually turned on the department on the radio yesterday speaking with another bottom feeder defense attorney Sam Adams Jr. Stated that the cover up is still inherent across the CPD and, even better, suggested all civil judgements be payed, then the amount taken out of all active duty officer's salaries. What a freakin' two faced piece of garbage.
"We just don't think videos that everyone knows are simply a knee-jerk reaction to the scandal of the moment are going to change anything institutionally."
...but they will make money for video producers and "diversity coaches" and "trainers" and "we train the trainers" and "consultants," the endless array of parasites that has taken the place of productive workers in our has-been-inverted society.
Criminals are out there somewhere, harder to locate, problematic. The police are right there in that building. Go after them instead. Expend unlimited time and money rearranging the furniture.
The Mayor of the city -- whom one would think had better things to do -- is now a ferocious Wellness Lady, fussing about the calorie content of items in vending machines, as the lockups and emergency rooms and morgue lockers fill and empty night and day.
I don't know how this would work and I'm fairly certain the union would oppose the idea but if you want to cut down on Abbate type of behavior - make the police union, not the taxpayers, pay the court mandated fines.
11/15/2012 07:04:00 AM
You are a riot, alice, a real riot.
"Do good things and good things will come to you."
— Earl Hickey, My Name is Earl
11/15/2012 06:52:00 AM
no good deed ever goes unpunished.
Chalkie
We are all responsible for the way this department is run. If you see someone make a mistake, you should point it out to them. If they do it again,then point it out to someone higher up. At the very least you have cleared yourself of culpibility by doing that. If the higher ups do nothing, that is not on you, that is on them. But the fact is that most people just don't say anything to anyone, why? Because of apathy. "No one is going to do anything about it anyway, so why should I even bother." Because you might just save us all from having to go through another scandal like this.
11/15/2012 06:51:00 AM
it takes a village to raise an idiot.
ive been on for 17+ years how come no one has told me about this "code of silence".
11/15/2012 02:17:00 AM
it's a secret.
shhhhhhhhhhhh........
Let's draw up some more laws that challenge the constitution then, that'll fix it.
11/15/2012 01:57:00 AM
i vote for no more Right to Life.
but than, that's just me exercising my Right to Pursue Happiness.
Chalkie
McCarthy will be an ass-kissing scrotum sucking lackey until Rahm finds it politically expedient to launch the Goof.
11/15/2012 01:43:00 AM
c'mon, Keesing Bandit, how can you resist this one?
BCP says--
"Doctors are sued for malpractice and other doctors come to their defense."
11/15/2012 12:27:00 AM
One complaint against a "provider" and that person will turn the entire organization against the patient.
There are some genuinely disturbed people in white coats -- real savages -- who make Abbate look like the mere drunken knucklehead he is.
"Professional organizations do not want allegations of misbehavior brought forth for public scrutiny and comment..."
...so, paradoxically, they act in ways that will GUARANTEE complaints and litigation.
Gotta go. I have a certified letter to get out.
Code of silence? just like with Petraeus. Or does anyone think that NOT ONE PERSON knew what was going on with him? screw whoever you want, but pass out classified info? That code did a lot more harm.
Cops out of control...Sure,...Code of Silence...Good Movie....You are all being suckered in by the Media who decides what is a heater for ratings time and by lawyers seeking large settlements. The media also hides the truth when it doesn't fit their agenda. You are all being pimped.
I think 10's of thousands of black people killed by black people since 1962 would be a real story, but you will never see that.
Unfortunately, shit truly rolls down hill. And as for the in service training - All POs will have to complete training blocks..... White Shirts will have to complete none
The answer has always stared us in the face, yet we continue to ignore it. The insanity comes from doing the same things over and over, yet expecting a different result each time.
Organizational integrity
Put simply, it is an unrealistic expectation for all members of any organization to maintain professional integrity when the organization itself displays a continued lack of integrity in the way it conducts itself... with its personnel as well as its "customers."
A lack of organizational integrity always results in organizational corruption... which most times can be traced as an underlying cause to individual corruption within its ranks.
As law enforcement officers, we have undertaken an oath of office. We also subscribe to the Law Enforcement Code of Ethics. As sacrosanct as both are, an organizational culture that is corrupt become easily identified, as it does not mirror either the words or the spirit of these creeds.
While most in the ranks have the personal integrity to serve professionally with honor and integrity, some slide down the slippery slope... sometimes following the displayed cues of their organization's corrupt culture.
The higher one progresses within an organization, the more one feels pressured to conform to the status quo culture of the organization – be it positive or negative.
If the organizational culture is corrupt (political corruption, as it many times pertains to law enforcement agencies), its leaders can easily become corrupt, if not already corrupt.
How?
The two ways are: Through their personal participation in organizational corruption activities within its "culture"... or, by turning a blind eye... keeping their head down... and not "rocking the boat", so they can keep their position.
Make no mistake - Either is a failure of leadership.
Honorable people of integrity serving within an organization where its culture is corrupt feel as though they have no voice. They are constantly demoralized from within. These members of honor are truly the silent heroes. holding a sometimes thin blue line... not a code of silence... but instead maintaining their personal and professional integrity (often in the face of career path consequences). Their professional conduct, day in and day out, is what keeps an organization from becoming completely corrupt.
When a law enforcement agency has a culture of corruption, it should not come as any surprise that the influences of that culture infects not only those within, but those it serves.
Unfortunately, until the honorable people serving within an organization collectively use their voices in mass to say enough is enough... to compel positive change... don't expect anything different.
An organization must walk the walk if it is to talk the talk, on expectations of professional and personal integrity of its members.
It begins with YOU.
Work safe!
John Andrews
"This culture of clout, secrecy, pay-to-play, etc. could be wholly and complete destroyed if the media did their homework and went after the people on the top who enable this system to exist in the first place, but the media makes deals with those very same people."
11/15/2012 01:05:00 AM
THE MEDIA PEOPLE ARE "THESE PEOPLE".
All in the Inner Party Rolodex.
"Better Government Association is no help, either."
Andy Shaw, hot from his post at Channel 7.
I rest my point.
Unfortunately, people like this slip through the cracks of the hiring process and we all pay for it. No matter how much you tighten ship these things will still happen. When you have a police force of 10-11,000 that are grinded down everyday...something is going to snap. It happens in NY, LA, Detroit etc...the difference is Chicago media.
They salivate when this kind of stuff happens. Not to say that the other cities don't have their liberal media jag-bags, but there's something different about our town. No matter who you hire, this shit will still happen. People who deserve the job with f-up at the same rate that people who don't deserve this job.
My two cent's worth:
1) Our disciplinary process is broke. We have the scaffold in place, it just isn't used. We all know what to do, and love to tell everyone how to do it, but when it boils right down to it, WE DON"T DO IT!
This is a three fold problem: Discipline is not timely (a five year investigation, really?)
Inept bosses confuse "being a good guy" with being a good boss
Our "Band of Brothers" mentality is used to help undeserving scumbags who are all about themselves and not the team
2) THERE IS NO COMMON SENSE.
3) Bosses fail to shoulder their portion of accountability for what happens on their watch (Captains should go down with their ships, not flee the sinking ship while looking out for their own gain, thanks captains for that last sell-out everyone contract...)
4) NO ONE GETS IN TROUBLE FOR BEING A DOG!!!
and the corollary: If you work hard, but screw up, you get pilloried for your mistake, rather than instructed/taught/corrected
5) If you do screw up, no one tells you to your face, which means if you truly wanted to improve yourself you have to flounder on your own. The above issues make it impossible for the boss to tell you why or how you screwed up, so they would rather "let you know" with a transfer order.
I guess I could go on, but why bother. No one gives a shit anyway.
I tell on everyone. I have gotten at least 50 CR numbers on other policemen in my career.
I am not the problem.
06:50 Well said
02:07 There might be a reason the supt was speechless
Anonymous said...
It's easy.... Stop the nepatism. Stop the phone call. Stop the micro-managing.
ell the reverands to go fuck themselves. Start failing people in the academy that shouldn't be on the job... Start failing people in their field training.
You know... Kinda act like a Police Department para milatary organization and not this liberal bullshit. Teach bosses to grow a set a balls again!
Just my 2 cents.
11/15/2012 12:18:00 AM
***********************************
It is really hard to argue with the above statement. It is all true and following the recommendation would be a huge step in the right direction. Unfortunately the problem goes a little deeper. The "code of silence," which does exist to varying degrees throughout the Department is the result of a deep seated culture that has existed for probably as long as the CPD has existed. It has always been difficult to get an officer to take a stand against someone else's misconduct. I guess in a way the uniqueness of the job causes this because we really are on our own in many situations with little or no protection. Join that with the natural tendency to protect fellow cops and you have the "code." It has always been nearly impossible, except in he most egregious cases, to get an FTO to take action againd a sub-standard recruit. The same is true of the Training Division, but they will say that you really can't judge a recruit until he is actually on the street. There is some truth to this.
The odd thing is that this i pretty much unique to Chicago. Yeah, you will find traces of it elsewhere, but in most departments bad cops are villified and brought down. This is particularly true in smaller departments, but is also true to larger departments, notably New York and Los Angeles.
I suppose it can be changed with a great deal of concerted effort, but I know, as do most of you, that effort has to start at the top, with bosses from the Superintendent down holding people responsible for their actions. The would have to learn to disregard the derision they will get from the ranks, including their peers. I get the impression that the current Supt. is attempting to do this, but has a lot of built in resistance.
Obviously this whole situation is difficult to address in a city of with a reputation like Chicago's
I personally have been retired for over 11 years, after 40 of working in several ranks, some near the top, and I can tell you that in those 50 totalyears or so, things have changed very little.
WAIT....WAIT JUST A DAMN MINUTE!!!! Code of silence you say? Well, great...just great...I thought you said CONE of silence. And I thought I was just watching a Get Smart re-run. Damn...never mind. And dat ain't no hibbity jibbity...mmmm hhmmm.
I think for a process to work, it has to start from the top. I mean the very top, mayor alderman etc. Alderman fioretti or beale actually wen on tv and radio stating that there is a code of silence among alderman and that no one will talk or tell on a fellow alderperson. On tv and radio. WOW!
If this drunken asshole was a carpenter or a plumber or a cashier at Jewel this never ever would've made the news. The bartender wouldn't have even made a complaint. The fatass would've been kicked out of the bar and that would have been the end of it. Since he was a "cop" she saw $ signs and there was no shortage of lawyers looking to cash in. Most lawyers wouldn't even waste there time with this case if he wasn't a cop. Lawyer: "What does he do for a living?"
Bartender: "He's works at Jiffy Lube."
Lawyer: "I don't think there is a case here."
Now that I have read the comments to date, I would like to expand on my previous, rather lengthy comment. Many, actually most of the existing comments make sense, simply because there are a lot of facets to the problem. I do take issue with those of you that say it does not exist, it most emphaticaly does, and it is not going away. None of you wants to be the guy that testifies about the wrong doing of another officer, unless you are coerced by the threat of discipline against you. In all of my time I only know of one incident where a P.O. initiated action against other P.O.'s and supervisors. In that case the fact is he had evidence of wrongdoing that, for lack of other witnesses, could never be proven.
I don't believe that most of you have any idea of just how difficult it is to suspend someone, let alone fire someone. All of you have due process rights when it comes to this employment and due process must be used to take actions. You also have the Union that properly serves to protect its members. The power of the union in Chicago is also a somewhat unique situation that doesn't exisn in many other places. Perhaps that is as it should be, but it contributes to the lack of discipline.
I have really said enough. YHou guys have to continue to protect each other, but it would be nice to find some way to overcome the general CPD culture to allow necessary actions to be taken.
Anonymous said...
I don't know how this would work and I'm fairly certain the union would oppose the idea but if you want to cut down on Abbate type of behavior - make the police union, not the taxpayers, pay the court mandated fines.
11/15/2012 07:04:00 AM
The 'police union' did not hire this goof. The City did.
The 'police union' did not testify in this trial and screw it up sixteen ways to Sunday. The City did.
Why would the 'police union', whatever you mean by that, be liable?
Both of our major papers published editorials today about the CPD's code of silence. Well I watched the entire Presidental new's conference yesterday. I witnesses a real code of silence by the national press and the free pass they gave our leader. Lets see if the Tribune or Sun Times mentions that code of silence. Oh, I forgot they are part of the problem. The press is not telling the people what is really happening in this country. We are fucked.
Anonymous said...
The answer is simple, this "code of silence" is the city's problem and this "code" simply spills into the police dept. 95% of the dept has nothing to do with it although we have to suffer the consequences when it rears its ugly head I.e. SOS and abbate. When I say suffer I mean everytime some fool gets on tv saying how the police did him/her wrong the public believes it and we take the brunt of internal discipline so the dept can say "look, we punish people".
11/15/2012 12:33:00 AM
There isn't a code of silence, there is a code of clout, in all city departments, not just the CPD.
We've got our share of political prima donnas and those of us who are legit, begrudgingly tolerate them.
Lets start by taking politics out of the police department. The mayor should not appoint the superintendent.
Let it be a civil service examination for all. Take away the meritorious promotions. It has been abused by the department and is the biggest sham.
To much to ask? Not if you want a police department that works. What we have now is a national joke.
All exempts should pass civil service exams and be promoted based on test scores and interviews. To much to ask?
Mt Greenwood Hillbilly said...
The REAL Code of Silence is in how the media covers for Democrats.
11/15/2012 01:07:00 AM
How very true.
http://abcnews.go.com/US/chicago-police-found-guilty-covering-bartender-beating/story?id=17716840
Too funny, the City is claiming they cleaned up the CLOUT!
LMAO!
just a guess , 90 % of offenders arrested in chicago for violent crimes are democrats from single parent homes , half raised by granny .
Whistle blowing is a thing of the past well at least to help out officers. Now the new kind of whistle blower is the one that tries to get ahead and screw evryone else over even if he/she lies. I am a sgt up north and know of a sgt running a sat who makes up things just so he can look good. He has been the same ever since his TRU days. He lies and tries to look good in front of bosses. Nice job. Sgt W. You should be ashamed of your useless self. This is what our Dept. Has come too. So sad.
RIP PO Sergio "The Myth" Oliva. You will be missed.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/chi-retired-chicago-cop-former-champion-bodybuilder-dies-20121113,0,3844901.story
There is definitely room to break SCC's rule #4 on this topic, so I'll just reiterate in essence what the 1st poster had to say, man, am I ever glad that I'm retired!
Anonymous said...
as long as the special kids get to cheat on the promo tests, you will have an inept management system.
11/15/2012 10:35:00 AM
Or the sneaky clout mutts downgrade people on interviews.
How do you explain something complex to the simple minded?
Lets face it,most every district has at least 1 loser in it that makes Abbate look like Officer Of The Month.One of the worst things about this job is that it's damn near impossible to get rid of thieves,habitual drunks,wife beaters and other criminally insane types if they have even the slightest bit of clout.I'm not talking about the guy who makes one bad incident in an otherwise spotless career,but the guy who's been a royal fuck-up from their recruit days.When they finally get caught on video or kill a few people in their latest drunk drive or rob an undercover fed or when the last hooker they shakedown/rape beefs everyone acts shocked.From the newest PPO to the oldest Gold Star this job is infected with shit.There is a code of silence and I've looked the other way plenty times during a 27 yr career.I don't have any solutions.This just seems to be the nature of this job at this time.Sometimes its hard to look at my star and not laugh......
yes there is a code of silence. i worked at ops and was one of the more pro police than anyone there. there were times that it was obvious that people were covering for each other. until the video came out it was "that's our story and we are sticking to it" unless you were in 003 and they were telling on each other left and right but that is a different story!
Let's face it in every profession there are those bad apples that spoil the whole damn bunch..I would say the everyday people WANT the truth.. don't believe the MSM .. but have NO contact with the police therefore confirm they are NOT the bad guy's they are portrayed to be..THAT is the problem.. Everyday people have heard to many times and to often it wasn't my kid he/she was a saint to buy that story anymore..however when someone who's a complete idiot is allowed on the force it might be good to figure out a way to let the public know.. pay for a background check on them and have it printed in the newspaper or something,.. it's not as much a code of silence as a forced code of silence by your superiors..
After 35 years on the job, I have seen this so-called "code of silence" many times. This is usually confined to the political heavys, not the working cop on the street.
This goes on in the promotion process, where a clout baby get promoted over the officers who could really do the job.
If you want to blame someone, start at city hall, thats where is all starts.
11/15/2012 10:04:00 AM
City Hall? You mean, the place where Mayor Rahm Emanuel laughs off the Class Four Felonies committed by his staff when they illegally taped phone conversations? At a PRESS CONFERENCE? THAT City Hall?
THE Academy is a Joke! The Building is also dirty. Instructors that have been inside for over 6yrs on averasge. Gym staff even longer. But all of this is due to the BS Clouted system of the CPD.
There is no "military" in the semi military system we claim as the CPD. Ahat Cops never get disciplined. -Semper FI
_________________________________
You do not know the half of it. They need to assign instructors who are qualified to do the job. The "educated" ones are as dumb as a box of rocks. And the uneducated ones barely have enough intelligence to stay alive. But I digress, the supervisors are even dumber.
Anonymous said:
Oh, poor citizen. Cops protect cops? Do you mean like doctors protect doctors, or lawyers protect lawyers, or politicians protect politicians? You mean people who work closely look out for each other?
Go fuck yourself.
-----
And yet some cops wonder why citizens don't trust them? Cops are PAID TO PROTECT US ALL, even against each other. Doctors are not. Lawyers are not. Go fuck myself? OK. You too.
The code of silence started years ago in the mayors office and continues today.This will continue on because its passed on to the city officials because they are told what to say and when to say it. Example:the goofs at city hall taping the reporters and 9.5 saying its no big deal unless it was done to him then it would be a crime.Move on nothing more to see. Same b/s will continue until city hall goes to jail for all the cover ups.The whole system is ass backwards.
Tony was wrong for what he did, without a question wrong!!! Cops will make mistakes and other cops love to make it more then it is. Two things I have discovered in my time as a cop, is that A) do not love this job cuz it will never love you back. B) we have been and always will be the enemy within! I never could understand how cops love to backstabb each other. So what if a guy gets promoted!!! If you have clout use it!!! We need to learn to respect each other regardless of what you do or where you come from. When we learn to treat each other with respect and dignity! Joe citizen will be easy to handle.
There is no "code of slence" per-say.
Its a term coined by defense attorneys, and loved by the media.
But a code doesn't exclusively exist.
The "code" is an officers constitutional right to remain silent during an investigtion.
Most officers know that IPRA, OPS et al, are incompetent investigator's, so they avoid their end of an investigation.
Officers also know Chicago politics factor in on the outcome of the investigation or the discipline that gets handed down hill.
Remember this, for every one Abatte, there are 10,000 more that are his opposite.
Code of silence; VANECKO AND THE DALEY CLAN need I say more.
Bill
You are pretty close to hitting the nail on the head.
Back in the 80's there were a whole lot of guys on the job who benefitted from (and perpetuated) this mentality on a daily basis - the north side districts were full of 'em. Maybe this 'disease' was fed by the fact that the resident population had something to offer (unlike the ghetto districts of the south and west side). Funny how not much has changed in the past 30 years, other than the faces of the players. They became the FTO's for the current generations.
There will always be coppers who believe the badge is some sort of currency - good for free food, booze, sex, services (auto or home repairs), etc... but when the citizenry stops offering such gratuities and accommodating those requests then perhaps some of the 'entitlement' mentality will go away. That, and perhaps more video cameras.
Some logic lessons: to all of the Anonymous commentors who point out that the Media ignores Democratic cover-ups, and that's the real conspiracy of silence! That's the logical fallacy of changing the subject. The media might indeed be covering up for Democratic evils, but that doesn't mean that there's not a Code of Silence on the CPD. And the media seemed pretty into various Democratic events like the Lewinsky business, and the current JJJ meltdown. But that's neither here nor there.
For those who argue that other professions, from bartenders to doctors and lawyers and teachers cover for each other, that's the logical fallacy of false equivalence.
When such people cover up for each other, we want them to get caught--by cops.
When Cops cover up for each other, who is there to catch the bad guys?
And if another bartender or teacher turns his or her colleague in, they do not become pariahs. Whistleblowers might never be popular, but it's seems to be easier to blow that whistle when you're not wearing a badge.
Relentlessly negative media coverage should not make you all forget one thing: most people respect and admire police officers. Little kids grow up wanting to be cops (or firemen) in a way that no one grows up wanting to be a lawyer or reporter or politician. Most people believe most cops are working hard to do a good job.
And when anyone points out that there's no Code of Silence as firm as the one among gang-bangers, who will die without identifying the rival 'banger who shot them, my head reels. Do two wrongs make a right? I thought cops were BETTER than the bad guys. And the vast majority are. Even if many of the Anonymous commentors here are not using logical arguments about this issue.
He was a random drunk.
The fact that he was a police officer had absolutely nothing to do with his actions.
"Training" isn't the answer. His actions went beyond what any normal, decent person would do.
Perhaps his parents failed to train him properly. I mean if you as an adult, don't know that beating on your server is not socially acceptable, what kind of "training" could there possibly be for you?
You're a sociopath.
"4) NO ONE GETS IN TROUBLE FOR BEING A DOG!!!"
The city has created a situation in which, if you do nothing you will get in less trouble (perhaps even no trouble) than if you do something.
And yet some cops wonder why citizens don't trust them? Cops are PAID TO PROTECT US ALL, even against each other. Doctors are not. Lawyers are not. Go fuck myself? OK. You too.
11/15/2012 08:02:00 PM
no.
law enforcement.
enforce the laws, made by lawmakers, elected by whoever voted.
that's it.
trust ain't got shit to do with it.
Tony was wrong for what he did, without a question wrong!!! Cops will make mistakes and other cops love to make it more then it is. Two things I have discovered in my time as a cop, is that A) do not love this job cuz it will never love you back. B) we have been and always will be the enemy within! I never could understand how cops love to backstabb each other. So what if a guy gets promoted!!! If you have clout use it!!! We need to learn to respect each other regardless of what you do or where you come from. When we learn to treat each other with respect and dignity! Joe citizen will be easy to handle.
11/15/2012 08:29:00 PM
--------
Right, Abbate just made a simple mistake. This job needs an I.Q. test.
CODE OF SILENCE??? Are you kidding? Is there a code of silence in the Vanecko case, where one related to the mayor decks another on the PUBLIC WAY, said victim dies, and said mayoral relative leaves town without so much as an indictment or, gee, a misdemeanor complaint signed against him? NOW there's a place to go looking for your code of silence and see who is involved in that one.
26 California. Criminal court building on Nov. 14, 2012, a criminal defendant with no clout and no relatives in politics pled guilty to aggravated battery for throwing a single punch at a victim who is now permanently brain damaged, said punch resulted in the victim (also no political connections or blue bloodline) falling onto the cement resulting in said permanent damage. Can get you the case number if you like.
This offender was arrested and charged. later convicted by a plea and most pleas are done in lieu of trials (think for yourself why they plea out cases).
So how come Vanecko wasn't sitting in County with this guy?
... ..... Nothing but silence, crickets chirping, and the sound of wind whistling around the corner of the building on LaSalle known as City Hall.
Ask anyone in 011 a few years ago about G.A. The tattoo on his forearm was enough to alert this Dept of his gang affiliations YET this City hired him because he was able to meet the minimum standards
11/15/2012 02:18:00 AM
Actually that piece of garbage was brought in as a political favor. Proof of ties between politicians and gang members. JJ tried to fire him many times when GA was a PPO. Luckily GA fell on his own sword due to being a dumb, illiterate, ghetto rat, piece of shit. Good riddance.
I'm just curious and do not know all the facts. Did the video show how Karolina Obryka over served Abbate?
Everyone keeps talking about Abatte's clout. It is non-existent. Get over it. At best, his dad was a do nothing detective who knew another do nothing detective in personnel, remember when they had actual detectives doing the background checks, and that is the end of it. At worst, whatever his alleged back ground is, it's all nothing but rumor. If really did have a DUI but was found not guilty and had it expunged, exactly where does that show a "clout" connection. Enough with this angle. It's subterfuge. The guy is, was and always be an asshole. If we had an asshole detector, half of us wouldn't be employed right now!
Dear Law-Abiding Citizen,
Move to a Red state that enforces and acknowledges the constitution.
Preferably a fiscally responsible red state. Your taxes will be less, crime reduced, it will probably have a quality education system and your overall quality of life will be improved.
Problem solved.
Code of silence? just like with Petraeus. Or does anyone think that NOT ONE PERSON knew what was going on with him? screw whoever you want, but pass out classified info? That code did a lot more harm.
11/15/2012 02:03:00 PM
Pass on classified info????? You're a fucking idiot. He cheated on his wife. No info was passed, and if you took the time to read ANY story about the incident you would know this. Carry on Obama voter.
I had a public defender tell me the other day that he has defended many many cases of people charged with felonies for what is nothing more then simple battery on the public way.The same charge that they convicted Abatte on. Frankly, I have never seen this. Usually you need great bodily harm. Am I wrong on this?
We as police officers more tubes than not give joe citizen a break when we pull them over
------------
part of the problem is that you did not do yourself or anyone else any favors by this kind of thing. yea, the guy avoided paying a ticket but you just reinforced the perception of unfairness in the system by stopping someone in the first place. not stopping them is giving them a break, stopping them, hassling them over their paper work, and wasting a half hour of their time is not all that much of a break for the average Joe. you would be better off to just issue a ticket to them. if you had good reason to stop them in the first place, just issue the damn citation, and no games around your generous nature and letting them off.
people hate that kind of crap. it makes the whole system seem capricious.
you want the average law abiding citizen to start respecting and appreciating the average cop - stop pulling people over unless there is a real need to do so.
people will accept that they earned a speeding ticket for going 75 in a 55. and issuing it for 65 instead of 75 is a legit break that most people will appreciate. stopping them for a rolling stop at a deserted intersection and then letting them go after a long hassle is not doing anyone any favors. either don't stop them in the first place, or stop them and ticket.
not a cop
Hey, Bill. Go fuck yourself AGAIN. You seem to have missed the point of my post. I made no apologies for the behavior of an idiot drunk, nor for any cops who covered for that idiot. In fact, I condemned all of that behavior and pointed out the fact that it all comes back to those democrats, like you, who put them into our ranks.
Logical fallacy? Fuck you. Reality. You, in whatever profession you are, have no idea of what it's like to be a police officer. We, the MAJORITY of cops, have to put up with the political assholes that come from YOUR party of democrat assholes. That's where the code of silence comes from. It's a democratic machine thing. When you don't have to cover for anyone or anything you can do your job honorably. These assholes can't and the democratic machine covers for them.
And you want to give logic lessons? You are a hypocritical leftist, supporting the problem, and then making excuses for your party. We are the good guys and have to put up with the shit that YOU vote into office again and again.
And then you try to give lessons to us about codes of silence that come from YOUR fucking party!? FUCK YOU AGAIN! You think you're smarter than you are, you fucking moron. But that is typical of a brain dead libtard like you. Your lack of reading comprehension speaks volumes, asshole.
Now go fetch your shine box. I scuffed my boot putting it up your sorry ass.
i don't think it is so much a code of silence
you have to remember that when one is a police officer or a fireman you life depends on those around you and their lives depend on you
thus this makes like a family
and families normally don't air their
dirty laundry i bet he was told time and time again to cut it out by fellow workers and management knew
it's management's fault for not stepping in and stopping it i'm sure others said things but management did nothing i'm sure there were other screw-ups before this some thing like does not happen overnight
you're sort in the barrel because you have to "police" you own
@11/16/2012 03:10:00 AM
Just remember that the next time you ignore bike riders that blow a light, or the stroke in a tow zone getting Starbucks; or the jagoff that blocks a bike lane just to deliver Beer or Soda to some store.
Law Enforcement is all encompassing and it also isn't something you as police are allowed to ignore unless you are already down on a call or on some mission for a white shirt. Just because its a Parker or a Mover that doesn't really teach a lesson and only gets the city money is besides the point. And I know that moral sucks, the exempts are a joke, and man power is light about 2k officers.
You guys don't hesitate to bitch about revenue...but at the very least they are honest about what they do every shift. And know why I say that? I see PO's every day rush their vehies to get to Rush Hour and Street Cleaning in 019, 018, 020, 024. But then the same POs will call us harsh for enforcing school zones or pickup trucks or RPP zones. Or outright act the fool because something was wrong with the vehicle and we found it before they did (024 district PO comes to mind).
I personally respect those that were blessed to get on the Job. And knowingly accept the risks that are inherent with the Job. But FFS, we are all City Union Employees. The better you treat us, the more likely we will cut a cop a break if the citation isn't printed out yet. And the reverse is true. Plus I know who wins in a inter-departmental fight...
9.5 wins and the stuporintendant has to deal with the fallout.
Hey, just face it. The entire government process is just plain out of whack and it is not just the CPD. These things happen way too often in the suburbs. The city, state and country are going broke and they are on the highway to insolvency. Nothing can stop it and the unions are not planning on even trying. I am retired from CPD and am on the long side of 65 years old. I do not see our pension lasting more then 7-8 years. The thought of losing my house and being broke in my 70's does not appeal to me, but I dont think I will be alone.
I really really don't think we need any new policies or regulations, just ACTUAL enforcement of these existing ones.
Fire the Academy recruits who just plain can't hack it, not just keep on passing them along with the "City's sunk-cost" argument, as these people just cost more money down the line.
And the same should go for field training. When they get out on the street and just clearly aren't willing or able to be the police (and that doesn't mean new POs don't have a huge learning curve, as they certainly do), fire them while they are still at-will employees.
And I know a lot of people don't want to hear it, but how about some actual discipline for the officers who constantly fuck up? We all know who the problem children, the headcases and the entitled are in each of our districts/units. Hold them accountable for their actions or lack thereof.
A lot more of those things would be a phenomenal start.
Dear Anonymous: Nothing like the sweet sound of someone who knows he's wrong shouting (and hiding in anonymity, of course). Put that shine box on your head that's up your own ass, chump.
There's a good reason I don't write off-duty cops...
The last time I was 99 and stopped a car with multiple occupants, an ODPO pulled alongside me, identified himself, and asked if I was ok;
The last time I was 99 and fighting to take an offender into custody, it was an ODPO who stopped to assist me.
I always do the same and have even taken police action off-duty to assist the on-duty police regardless of what town I was in.
I'm not saying that the good citizen would never stop to help, but it's a far greater likelihood that the help will come in the form of another PO. For that reason, I'm not going to write POs parkers or movers if I can avoid it.
How's does WRONG and made a mistake compare? They do not. He was wro g bottle Line!!!! Cops in general will make mistakes!!! Tony did not make a mistake, he was completely wrong!!! You should read and undstand what you have read before shouting off about I.Q testing. Maybe you r wrong
people will accept that they earned a speeding ticket for going 75 in a 55. and issuing it for 65 instead of 75 is a legit break that most people will appreciate. stopping them for a rolling stop at a deserted intersection and then letting them go after a long hassle is not doing anyone any favors. either don't stop them in the first place, or stop them and ticket.
not a cop
11/16/2012 09:51:00 AM
The point was to teach you that you would have spent far less time ding the right thing and coming to a full stop (maybe eight seconds) than you spent providing proof of insurance and a driver's license and being name-checked (maybe eight or ten MINUTES).
But, heck, if you want the ticket, TOO, we can comply with your wishes .
11:23, good post, hit nail on the head
Not a cop: your idiocy amazes me, you think getting pulled over for a legitimate moving violation and making sure you have a valid d.l., are not under the influence and have valid insurance and then BEING LET GO, SPARING YOU HUNDREDS IN FINES AND A POSSIBLE INSURANCE INCREASE after 5min, not 30, is harrassment? My guess is that your parents have never corrected you in your life. 99.99% of people are elated if they get a break and can't wait to tell people how they got a break. They come of all races and creeds.
By the way, what is your obsession with this blog if you have authority issues? Your posts reveal how strange you are more and more as time go on.
Not a civilian
It seems that most of these "people" who embarrass CPD are hired during "hiring booms." Miami in 1980 showed that causes more problems than the hiring solves. Of course, the pols (and the Trib) don't want to pay for hiring 50 officers every month ... .
ASHAMED TO BE THE CHICAGO POLICE
I do no wrong follow the rules and Jagoffs the clouted get ahead fuk the CPD COmmand Staff That's why I do Nothjing!! Fuk you
My dream is to see much bigger code of silences come to light. As one poster said we all have benefited from police cutting us a break (unless you are an idiot with attitude) I'm not the police but why not just throw his stupid butt in jail? I think anyone who condemns the whole department is a moron. We have bad humans in all walks of life, just ignore stupidity and focus on the fact most of us understand and don't look at a drunk idiot as a reflection on the 1000's of great officers doing a great job in a tough environment. Keep up the good work guys, more of us appreciate you than you realize.
7:16
Am:absolutely right.I would rather work with a thief than work with a rat-bastard!
Will Mayor Rahm Emanuel hold Deb Kirby accountable for the perjury, lies, coverup and corruption at IAD?
11:15 at 01:22. Hey numb nuts, how can you connect merit promotions to Abbate? If your pussy ass was ever given the opportunity for promotion, you would take it in a heart beat. You are nothing but a whiney do nothing clown. Why don't you get a job at McDonald's bitch.
You guys are giving me a headache! I'll make my comments short and sweet:
Fuck you, Abbate!
Fuck you, (poster above) Bill!
Fuck you, Revenue hack, police wannabe!
And fuck you, police-haters!
To 5:46 11 15----- you're so on the money with that comment. I know exactly who you are speaking about. He was a rat in TRU. It never got too me that he would tell on P.O.s. It was the fact that he would make things up to try to make his tards on his team real big asshats look good. Seems that is the new trend with the CPD. Make next guy look worst and fuck him or her over. So no clout or covering up is occuring. Sgt. W over in area 5 can attest to that.. MG
"Meritorious Selection process for promotion"..........Nuff Said!
Bill said...
Dear Anonymous: Nothing like the sweet sound of someone who knows he's wrong shouting (and hiding in anonymity, of course). Put that shine box on your head that's up your own ass, chump.
11/16/2012 03:39:00 PM
Wow, "Bill." You put a first name on and now your Captain Courageous. Go fuck yourself you clown. Give some money to Obama and the machine. They need idiots like you.
I don't know if it goes to the top but I do believe it exists. Why do I say that?
It's simple; If you see an Officer go overboard (excessive force) on someone and this person beefs. You get the request for the to-from to send to IPRA.
If you don't put down I don't recall or no, listed Officer did not do (insert allegation), you will be labelled a rat, you will more than likely never get back up again,other PO's will talk shit about you and you will be stuck with that reputation everywhere you go.
Everything I've ever heard from any copper regarding this, including supervisors, makes me believe this will be the out come. For that reason alone, unless I see someone just out right execute an offender, I'll keep my mouth shut because I do need back up every now and again.
Even as far back as the Academy, it's instilled in you , dont be a rat. Don't snitch on other coppers, etc.
If you are doing something that puts yourself and others at risk, you will not be looked down upon as bad as if you are the copper to report them to a Supervisor. Sad
Hey Anonymous: It's "you're" not "your."
But seriously: if you (or anyone else) read all of my comments here, I am trying to have a serious conversation about this situation, to learn from the Anonymous (whom I assume are mostly on-the-job cops who don't need the trouble of having brass read their comments and screw them over about them). But anonymity makes it easier to just tell people to fuck themselves right left and center rather than, you know, responding to the content of what they actually said. I am sure that if I said something totally bullshit, SCC just wouldn't post it.
So, when some Anonymous tells me to fuck myself because I'll never know what it means to be a cop (despite decades of talk with my father, uncles, brother, cousins and others about the reality of being a cop), well, it ticks me off. And when when my attempts to focus the conversation on the Abbate case itself instead of other not-logically-connected issues get rejected because I'm a libtard (apparently, my voting record is embedded in my posts), well, that strikes me as illogical bullshit.
And by the by, this last logical fallacy is "ad hominem." Arguing to the man, not the argument. Don't like being called on making illogical arguments? Then don't make them.
And, finally: you Anonymous who get so filled with rage? Relax. This is just an online conversation. I'd hate to read in the papers about some copper having a grabber on the job due to rage at a comments thread on SCC.
Hey, Bill. Decades of talking to family members who are cops still doesn't give you any clue to what it's like to actually walk in their shoes. So I have to agree with the go fuck yourself part, because you sound like you don't want to be called out when you're full of shit. And the fact that you need to be the spelling police on a simple typo just shows what a fucking stroke you are.
So once again, go fuck yourself.
Maybe perhaps in the form of a psychological question on an entrance exam....you walk into a bar off duty and you've already been over served,but you definetly want a few more,do you ? A. Ask politely and after being told no,walk away and leave with dignity in tact. B. haul off kicking ass until you get served and fired C. Shoot up the place. D.drink at home anticipating excessive behavior.
When you were little and your brother or sister did something that was not good behavior ,did you run to mom and dad and tell,when your buddy your hanging with does something minor like throw trash out the window or pee in the alley did u tell his parents ,call 911 or simple talk to him privately and say You didn't like the behavior,in any instance you did not tell on someone that had done something you had operated under a code of silence,why even neigborhoods,organizations,company's,mayors,practice this code of silence ,this terrible behavior ,as a wise man knows when to keep his mouth shut,avoiding trouble before it happens or preventing it from happening,what did the guy in the bar do,run out of there real quick,an act of silence is also a code of silence,as an officer I may not tell anyone my friend or colleague has a drinking problem,but I certainly would not sit idley while he beats up a female bartender,if your looking for an answer across the board that is individually based then your not going to get the right answer,code of silence decoded!
Rahm doesnt have the Balls to Challlenge the 19th Ward over MISST Kirby
Bill, you don't know what it means to be a cop. I don't care how many close relatives you have that were on the job, it doesn't put you even close. We don't know what its like to be a cop sometimes until a few years into our career. We have family members and there are things we see and experience that we would never tell our loved ones about because we don't want to share that emotional burden with them and worry them. There are things that we have to bottle inside no matter what so that the people we care about are also "protected and served". I don't know if this will convince you otherwise, but regardless it is true.
Signed, a different anonymous guy
Anonymous wrote
Hey, Bill. Decades of talking to family members who are cops still doesn't give you any clue to what it's like to actually walk in their shoes.
So, you say my family members are too inarticulate to express in understandable terms what it's like to be on the job? Jeez, I had no idea that they were so stupid, or that the experience of being a cop was existentially unique, beyond the power of mere humans to communicate in language. Why, then, I wonder, do cops ever talk?
This blog, and others, are all about cops expressing what it is to be on job. If it's something that only other cops can understand, well, then, make it a limited-access blog, just for the people who know.
Or is that just me being the logic police? You, not being the logic and spelling police, can never understand what it is to walk in my shoes, right?
Over and out.
Anonymous said...
"4) NO ONE GETS IN TROUBLE FOR BEING A DOG!!!"
The city has created a situation in which, if you do nothing you will get in less trouble (perhaps even no trouble) than if you do something.
11/16/2012 01:45:00 AM
LLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
NO SHIT!!
Now someone inform MJ the dispatcher on Zone 1 and her Sgt buddies she sends her messages too in 017 on 1st watch as she GPS's everyone when there is NOTHING going on but radio silence!
Her favorite one is always sleeping in the Cemetary and running to Starbucks in 018 but thats ok right DSS?
Anyone notice that this Bill character doesn't know when to shut the fuck up, and thinks he's smarter than everyone else? And he just has to have the last word. Know the type?
Hey, Bill. Just go away. Find a blog in your profession to bother people on. You can tell them how you're existentially unique because you know what it's like to be a cop from talking to so many over the years. You're too smart to be on here with us illogical types anyway.
Anyone can create a google blog and choose a phony name. Right "Bill"?
LOL.
Go back to the BGA/Sun Times rat nest you crawled out of.
We are on to you.
Bill. Typical liberal retard who has to be right all the time. And he said, "Over and out." That means it's the end of the conversation on his terms in words dumb cops can understand.
My God, what a huge asshole.
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