CFD Backs Chico
Mayoral candidate Gery Chico picked up the firefighters union's endorsement Tuesday and opened the door to dropping the long-reviled requirement that city workers live in Chicago.
Police, firefighters and other municipal employees have pined for decades for permission to be allowed to move their families to the suburbs. With city workers concentrated in a handful of neighborhoods at the fringes of the Northwest and Southwest Sides, lifting the residency requirement could lead to a transformation of what are now solidly middle-class enclaves.
Chico stopped well short of endorsing such a move, but said it's a topic he would consider at the request of firefighters and police officers. He said he doubted workers would flee the city if the restriction was eliminated.
"If I thought it was threatening to the middle class of Chicago, I wouldn't put it on the table," he said. "I think we're absolutely mature enough to put the issue on the table to discuss."
Is Chico pandering? Sure, a bit. So was Rahm. It's what politicians do.
Labels: city politics, elections
posted by SCC at 12:37 AM
141 Comments:
You know things are screwed up when Carol Mosley Braun is the only one who can clearly say what will happen if the residency rule is dropped
If u have a home in the city , it's the worst idea. Your house will not have a buyer all the police neighborhoods will loose value and sit on market waiting for a buyer for a very long time. How about giving us a tax break instead for living here.
Lifting the residency will only lower the property values of our already undervalued properties in the city.
it might be great to move to the suburbs, but who would else would buy in our neighborhoods, that are so far from downtown, far from any remaining industries, far from any areas of economic growth?
this opinion is that if the city workers move out, will prospective buyers ask themselves, "why are they leaving? what do they know that we don't?"
the flip side is this: if they lift the residency requirement, will your home increase in value?
I live 15 minutes from work so moving doesn't appeal to me, but I bet at least half the city workers would leave.
I think most of the NW and SW side "cop areas" would probably remain OK for the forseeable future, since they're still pretty decent places. The SE side would absolutely fall into the abyss.
Whatever sanity it has left is being tenuously held together by the remaining city workers and old-timer hold outs in their 70's and 80's... Unlike Mt. Greenwood or Edison Park, Hegewisch/East Side are places where city workers who have enough financial discipline to save three whole paychecks would definitely be compelled to leave, if they had that option.
Two links for today...
Tom Jaconetty and Burt Odelson who are they really working for?? None of your business
Youtube link below:
Jaconetty on how it really works
I thought you couldn't find a bigger prick than Daley to be mayor. I was wrong. Rahm would be much worse.
Heard a rumor the other day that the Fop isn't going to support
Cochran in 20th anymore.
Anyone know?
OT - Police quit a chase of a carjacked cab this morning out of Des Plaines that wound all around the Northern suburbs but all of the Chicago news choppers continued the chase.
Kind of embarrassing when the media is more anxious to pursue criminals than law enforcement is!
Careful what we wish for More of the same SHIT. Burke will be worse than Daley ever was trust me. We are doomed
He smart guys and gals where are we going to go live? The Burbs are expensive too and then the drive into work. Chicago will become like NYC very very high priced. How about Ford Heights of Markham. BTW Jerry Chico the mann live at Randolph and Mich in a million dollar condo. Some man of the people
Great job guys in catching the taxi cab car jacker. Just watched the whole thing on WGN, remember guys and girls, there are cameras everywhere. The PO's didnt do anything wrong and WGN statements were definitely good for CPD.
I assume that is 024 that made the pinch, again great job!!!
Stay safe, stay alert.
OT: WGN morning news just had live footage of a police chase that started in Des Plaines and ended in the northwest side of Chicago. It ended in a crash, but of course the offender fled on foot. CPD grabbed this guy after a short foot chase, but great job by the officer who caught him. Way to keep your cool and not use any excessive force especially when the camera's were out.
OFF TOPIC
Nice work by all in the arrest of carjacker that WGN covered live--esp. Skycam 9. Tip of the hat to Robin Baumgarten for her favorable comments too. Expect the trolls to talk 'smack' but nicely done. Also, seeing the shithead face-plant on icy sidewalk made my day.
Why bother voting, whoever wins will do like the prior lackeys who had the office.
Residency, for the most, is about the schools. Living in the NW side cop areas, there are several top notch public elementary schools that rival or exceed any private school education. High school is the problem. Taft should be turned into a NEIGHBORHOOD school. You'd still have to deal with the Polish Mafia shitheads, but the majority of the gang and graffiti problems would be gone. And the decent CPS high schools race norm, so a kid from the NW side with straight A's can be looked over for a west sider with B's and C's. Real fair...
OT...caught the LIVE police chase for a veh. hijacking on WGN this morning. Great job by all officers involved. Bad guy in custody, nobody hurt. Also, a big thank you to news anchors Larry Potash and Robin Baumgarten (sp?). They both said repeatedly on the air that it was a great job by Chicago police and Robin even said "this is what Chicago police deal with every day." Nice to get credit finally.
Don't get hurt. Don't get sued. Take advantage of tuition reimbursement. Get off this job youg enough to start a new career. If anyone gives you shit about being a dog just say like the pension there is just nothing left in me.
OT Great grab CPD on channel 7 news live this morning! My kids were excited to see "the bad guy" get caught. To quote " That was awesome!"
The East Side and Hegwisch both WERE city worker onclaves and a great place to live and raise your kids. To the people who ask who could afford to buy your house if all city workers move out of Mount Greenwood and Edison Park? The same people who bought up the houses on the East Side and Hegwisch and section 8'd them out as well as those who got government loans to buy a house only to let their gang bangin kids run loose and destroy these once great neighborhoods. To all those in 004 who still work hard to get them off the streets, we know your hands are tied a lot of the times by irresponsible jugdes and ASA's, but we do appreciate you. At every election vote NO for EVERY judge on the ballot when asked to retain them until the message is sent that we will not accept judges who give the criminals a slap on the wrist and return them to act like fools in our city.
What's wong with K9
Raum residency all over national news the past few days and Chicago city workers having to live in the city has been referenced on national news... if Raum stays on ballot, it will be intresting to see how he can justify our residency requiremnts
LIFT RESIDENCY... provide TAX BREAKS for P.O.'s to encourage them to stay in the city.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
If u have a home in the city , it's the worst idea. Your house will not have a buyer all the police neighborhoods will loose value and sit on market waiting for a buyer for a very long time. How about giving us a tax break instead for living here.
1/26/2011 12:43:00 AM
Your right 100% a tax break would be much better!
LET's write daley in on the ballot... hate to say it but I would vote for him over any of these canidate clowns
If u have a home in the city , it's the worst idea. Your house will not have a buyer all the police neighborhoods will loose value and sit on market waiting for a buyer for a very long time. How about giving us a tax break instead for living here.
Oh, you mean like it is now?
Common. Do you honestly think that each and every cop, fireman, and other city worker will automatically put their house up for sale if the residency issue changes?
If you think that city workers only sell to city workers then you need to get out more. When it comes right down to it, some of our fellow officers don't look past the $$$ and will (and have) sold to just about any shit head that is out there.
If the residency rule is rescinded, I will not move. Being close to retirement, I do not want to be saddled with another mortgage. I'll stay put, keep saving my money and when the time comes move the hell out of this state.
How much do you think you will get for your house if the whole neighborhood is for sale? Especially Mt. Greenwood homes were 300k now below that you would be looking at 120 to 150 can you take a loss like that? It would be Roseland all over again.
It's because y'all don't know just how good the school districts in the burbs are. Its such a shame that you'd send, on purpose, your kids to the same schools that those other keedz attend. Quit being so damn needy/ selfish and start caring about their futures for once! Their your life? You'd do anything for them you say? Right... What a shame.
The impact would not be as big as some people think; there are about 35,000 city workers(being generous) all of them would not move, if half did, how many are homeowners? The impact would be minimal. To go one step further, only allow workers with 10 or more years on to move, thus lessening the impact even more; problem solved.
Residency is STATE LAW, regardless of what municipal code claims, the city doesn't have the authority to lift a requirement of state law, only make it more stringent. So sorry, residency ain't being lifted.
This blog and this space should be focused on nothing other than repeatedly getting the message out that WE are not to blame for the pension funds and that WE are not the ones who should have to take huge pay concessions for our few familys when that responsiblity lies with ELECTED OFFICIALS.
Readers need to be constantly reminded as the scumbags do in their media outlets against us, that ELECTED OFFICIALS REFUSED TO FUND the pensions as required by law and that the TAXPAYERS, ourselves included in that group, are now going to have to correct those pension defecits for all current employees as the constitution provides.
We are not required by any state law or constitutional law to agree to lesser pension payments or to have to increase OUR share when the city will NOT, in order to pay for the violations of Daley to our funds.
PENSION PROTECTION FOR CURRENT EMPLOYEES IS THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS NOW AND IN THE NEAR FUTURE.
Don't slack off on this duty to ensure our pensions are NOT diminshed in any way in violation of state constitution and the pension act.
Don't let the scumbag media be the only ones pimping for the criminals to rally the public against the employees. Otherwise, assholes like Emanuel and his buddy Obama will just rewrite any laws they feel suits them best as they're currently attempting to do with the SUPREME COURT!
I would guess that maybe 30% of city workers would move out of the city. Most city workers have family in the city and have close ties to their neighborhoods. The surrounding communities property taxes are just as high if not higher than Chicago's. True that public schools would be able to be attended in suburbs. However, if everyone moved out to the surrounding suburbs their resources would stretched thin. Also if you moved further out for a better deal your commute could be real long. Don't forget about when you have court. I would not give up much for this.
Multi-millionaire Daley Crime Family hack vs: the law. Guess who will win. Remember, this is Illinois, the most corrupt state in the USA. The Justices are just waiting to get there "instructions" before they stab the law in the back.
The city would not fall because some cops and firefighters decided to leave. Not all would leave and the world doesn't revolve around the rest.
Entire neighborhoods wouldn't change because the cops weren't there. Get over yourselves already.
From the Sun-Times comment section:
Actually it would be more than amusing to see residency go extinct. All the haters would chew their tongues in outrage if Police and Fire drove off into the sunset giving the public the same "flip you and have a ham sandwich too" the public has been giving them. They should section 8 every piece of property they own. Why not? Could you honestly blame them for being far less altruistic in taking their cue from the public and becoming more inward looking and mercenary? Your new, non-contributor neighbors are the kings and queens of this city anyway. They incur none of the financial risks that comes with having an ownership stake but you can bet your very last dime they will demand any and all benefits. You will be the ones left to put up with constant reminders that they are the ones you work for. It's the Chicago way.
You point and laugh now, be prepared to cry later.
To the patrolman who made the outstanding arrest today of the shitbird who carjacked the cab; sweet takedown, I hope to buy you a beer sometime soon. Great to watch with my morning coffee. Channel 9 missed the actual tackle but Channel 7 captured it perfectly. Great job.
at least relax the residency.... allow workers to leave after a certain amount of time of service.
Chico, Chico, Chico.....what about DeValle? I'm still disappointed that Waugespack decided to not run for Mayor.
Chico is a politician like the rest of them. Following CFD's announcement, DeValle, said Chico was pandering. Yeah, they do that, like SCC stated, they're politicians. Ok, so suppose someone lifts the residency ban and you and your neighbors flee to the suburbs along with the additional property taxes associated with your new home. The large tax base in Chi-town will collapse, and most likely, the job you're depending on to pay for that new mortgage and property tax, may very well go away. Why, because that tax based income in Chicago (you and yours) is gone and they may have to lay off CPD, CFD, Streets and San, etc. because there is no money to fund the salaries. Remember, Chico offered to discuss concerns and did say at some exec. brd meetings, not all requests will be granted but would be listened to. My comments by no means is an endorsement for Rahm, we are in big, big, trouble if Rahm is crowned Mayor.
CFD Wife
The other candidates are using scare tactics when it comes to city employee residency. All of the usual phrases that it will ruin neighborhoods, destroy the middle class of the city, drive up taxes, ruin real estate values, employees have to live in the city because the taxes pay their salary, etc. And, all of these arguements have proven to be without foundation through the experiences of cities that had residency and ended this practice. None of these scary things happened anywhere in the country where the cities ended employee residency. For one, the end of residency will go a long way in ending the power of the politician over your job.
I hate to say it, but this idea would hurt city workers who already own a home. Their home values would certainly drop. If I didn't own a home though...I would love this idea.
So even if this chico wins don't you think rahm will be back in 4 years?
Off topic, last night watching the State of the Union and Terry Gainer escorting the President as Sgt of Arms to Congress, the same Terry Gainer who was a Sgt in the CPD and was on the TV show Lets Make a Deal wearing his CPD Sgts uniform in violation of rules and regulations. And what happens to him, up the political ladder. Its all legit.
The real question is what will we have to give up to get the residency lifted?
If the il supreme court says rahm was still a resident even though his house was rented and he could not live there, does that not mean we could live anywhere as long as we rent out the house we own and stay registered to vote there?
Look, i feel bad for the people that might lose some money on their houses if the property value goes down, but come on, think about the rest of us. Think about all the future hires and the guys/gals on now that don't own. If you think about it in any other aspect besides the current owners losing some $$, it is an absolute no brainer that someone should have the RIGHT to live anywhere they want no matter who they work for. The only people to opose this ideal are people that own in the sw and nw sides b/c they're afraid of their prop value. Well hey, wtf, what about the rest of us that didn't buy out there?
We do not need anyone to change the residency law, as when I get caught for living in the suburbs, I will simply "rahm it" and say my "intent"is to live in chicago and use the san me definition of "reside" he is using.
ok, all you fuckers freaking about about losing money on your over priced bungalow just chill out. There's only 10,000 cops and about 3,000 firemen. So 13,000 people we're talking about spread out way across the city. So just cause a couple thousand people might flee chicago, that doesn't mean that the city or your neighborhood is going to go down the tubes. There are millions of people that live here and would love to buy your house.
Anonymous said...
Your house will not have a buyer all the police neighborhoods will loose value and sit on market waiting for a buyer for a very long time.
1/26/2011 12:43:00 AM
And this will be different how?
Welcome to big Zs 23rd ward.
My dream is to win the lottery and donate my house to a drug rehab non-profit to fuck my ass-hole neighbors who never showel snow for the seniors next door.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
If u have a home in the city , it's the worst idea. Your house will not have a buyer all the police neighborhoods will loose value and sit on market waiting for a buyer for a very long time. How about giving us a tax break instead for living here.
1/26/2011 12:43:00 AM
REALLY? Well, let ME worry about that... Let ME sell my house at under value, I want to get the hell out of here. I don't think many of us will leave, but at least having the option would make it feel like we live in a free society. And I have news for you...taxes are going UP. way up. Not down.
I've been out home shopping recently and as a cop i have news for you - we are already priced out of most of the neighborhoods in the city.
I can't afford anything in the downtown area.
I can't afford almost anything on the Northwest side.
The only place i can get a decent place for my money is the Southwest side.
People like me are getting screwed. Imagine knowing that i'm gonna have to work side jobs for years just to be able to afford a decent house, when if i was just allowed to go the burbs i could get a much nicer house at a LESS price.
As city workers we're down to just two little spickets of the city that we can affor anyway. So the city is not going to go down in flames if they lift the residency.
Ley us be honest; if Rahm was a regular guy, there is no way he would get on ballot. It doesn't matter he was the presidents COS. THAT position is a political one that does NOT need senate ratification. So, if the prez wanted me to be his kids' nanny, would I be able to come back and run after giving my abode up? No. When Vallas thought about running for governor and he was still in philly, serving the government of philly, he wad quickly told he would not meet residency challenges. Lastly, both times and trib stated rahm should be on ballot and echoed rahm's "let the people decide"...THEY ARE MISSING THE POINT. the goofs we elect made laws about election...they need updating as the"intent" was serving gov as a congressman or military...so change them. Until then, abide by them. even the FOP has rules and policies in place for our elections; you must attend x meetings...so, can I challenge that? I did not attend the required amount but I "intended" to. No!...until we change the bylaws...and the city changes its election rules..until then we should all follow the policies our leaders chose. And stop
Food for thought how about, city workers who have 15 year of service. Have the right to be able to choose whether or not they would like to continue living in the city.
If the residecy is not lifted by the end of this year I am going to file a lawsuit that will take this issue to the courts.
This archaic law/rule will be overturned as seen in other cities recently. The case law is already set.
I will post an email shortly that you can contact me at if you want to be on the suit. Enough is enough.
Lifting residency would not kill the middle class of the city. City workers & their families make up only a small portion of the population. If every single city working family moved out of the city it would have little to no impact on these neighborhoods. Property values would not suffer any more than they are suffering now. The true city neighborhoods that have remained strong are strong because of families wanting to live near their own families. My guess is most won't move.
OT: Must see!
If anyone shoots or shoots at a law enforcement member and gets caught and survives to make it to court, he should look like this guy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZfHZtI_dls
Bonus points for Mama's Hoopin and Hollerin!!!
If you look at the property values now in the Mt.Greenwood area you would see that they have already plummeted. If you remodeled your home with expensive cabinets and granite counter tops you can forget about re-couping that investment.
I am in the business and I can tell you that when banks are doing appraisals now they don't even consider those things anymore. How many bedrooms, how many bathrooms & square footage.That's what matters.
The future of the City is on the North side and Downtown.
Yes, if they lift residency and you pack up and move you will lose money but it is money that is already lost and will take many years to get back. There will be buyers for your houses but it will be people that make about half of what you make and need to live near shopping and schools because they only have 1 family vehicle. It was just not very realistic to think that a typical chicago style raised ranch would hold a value for very long near $400,00 on the south side so close to so many high crime areas and poor public schools. You may be better off taking your loss now and buying again in an area that is on the rise, not one that peaked 5 yrs ago.
How about having employees make a ten year commitment to live in the city and than they can move ? This may provide some stability for middle class neighborhoods and also allow workers to purchase a home in an area that they would like to retire.
Okay, i'm slow, I admit it. Can anyone please explain why the Teamsters would be supporting Rahm who has vowed to lower our pensions? Is it now divide and conquer the unions? Have we been sold out?
OT: Helicopter News Crew filmed what was called a police chase this morning. A taxi cab was carjacked this morning from Rosemont. Cab enters Chicago where the film crew picks up the chase on camera. Luckily CPD officer's stayed far back away from the vehicle which crashed into a school bus. Subject exited the vehicle and fled the scene. Entire arrest caught on film. NO mistreatment of the subject, NO CHASE, so police should not be held responsible or a party to any lawsuits. RIGHT? Hell this is Chicago, Cook County,IL. Remember your always being filmed or recorded.
SCC, the title of your post is grossly misleading, to say the least.
The entry informs the reader that it is the "firefighters [sic] union's endorsement" at issue. No mention whatever is made of the CFD's management endorsing a candidate.
Now, a moment's relection before you pressed the "enter" key should have been sufficient to realize that the firefighters' union is in no way the CFD.
Also, as for anyone upset about "the long-reviled requirement that city workers live in Chicago":
Did every one of those city workers know of the requirement IN ADVANCE, prior to accepting a job offer? Well, yes.
Does not every one of them have the liberty TO QUIT and to seek gainful employment elsewhere? Well, yes.
Granted, SCC, you don't claim here to favor such a change. Still, Maybe this entry could be used as a segue to a discussion about the malcontents who are dissatisified with the consequences of their own decision to sell labor to the city on terms that those vendors of labor agreed to freely.
OT: Big News!!1
Court strikes down state’s $31 billion capital program.
A state appeals court Wednesday struck down Illinois’ $31 billion capital construction program, asserting that the legislation that authorized it was unconstitutional
The ruling invalidates the revenue streams for the borrowing that has funded the construction program, meaning that video poker, privatization of the lottery and higher liquor taxes are now on hold. The case was brought by W. Rockwell Wirtz, owner of the Chicago Blackhawks, and his liquor distributorship, Wirtz Beverage Illinois. The court found that the legislation that was the basis for the construction program violated the state Constitution’s single-subject requirement.
and from -CapitalFax.com we have this on the ruling.
This has to be, without a doubt, the biggest appellate court ruling on Illinois policy in decades. Everything, and I mean everything has to be redone if the capital projects are to be saved.
Oy.
* 12:42 pm - So much for that new $5 billion capital construction bond the state is about to sell. There’s no longer a funding source and the program itself is now declared unconstitutional. The Lottery privatization deal was just finalized, but that’s now out the window as well, pending appeal.
This is just unreal, campers. It’s beyond huge.
* 1:56 pm - Fox Chicago…
A spokesman for Illinois House Speaker Michael Madigan estimated that the ruling eliminated at least 40 percent of the funding sources devoted to the state’s giant capital construction program.
Check out the CapitolFax link for updates, apparently there are a bunch of public acts that are falling like domino's because of this opinion.
Now how is the Illinois Supreme Court going to have time for this when they have the much more important Rahm ballot b.s going on?
Meanwhile, Cicero gives Wirtz the thumbs up to build a $70 million dollar liquor distribution hub at the old Sportsman Park site.
Seems like ol' Rocky is on a roll! The beginning of this month he won a deal with the Barcardi brand.
Maybe Rocky should run for mayor eh?
I'll betcha we got the attention of those Illinois bondholders now!
UPDATE 2-Illinois appeals court voids revenue for state bonds
Making matters worse, the state sold at least $1.2 billion of taxable general obligation Build America Bonds for capital projects last year. The official statements for the deals said the $33 billion capital plan includes about $14.6 billion of bonds with debt service paid through the revenue sources that were struck down by the appeals court on Wednesday.
Illinois was planning another $1 billion to $1.5 billion bond sale for capital projects in late spring or early summer, the state's capital markets director said this month.
Another Lame Duck Daley move before his forced retirement by Rahm:
"The revolving door of Winnetka’s top administrative staff continues to turn. Police Chief Joseph De Lopez has announced he is stepping down at the end of the week to accept a job in Chicago.
De Lopez was appointed Winnetka’s top cop in March 2002. He had previously spent more than 30 years with the Chicago Police Department where he retired as a Deputy Superintendent of Police.
He has accepted the position of Vice Chancellor for Safety and Security for the City Colleges of Chicago, according to a press release. His new position will entail the coordination of all safety and security at eight primary City College sites as well as seven satellite locations."
...congtratulations! for being connected. HOW MANY PENSIONS WILL HE GET!? Two, three?
Chico vows to find $200 mil. in city budget, hire 2,000 officers
http://www.suntimes.com/news/politics/3507990-418/story.html
Prices in the nearby burbs will jump in anticipation of our arrival.
Mt. Greenwood is toast anyway. Surrounded by crap and closing in. Put a fork in it. Get out while you can.
Yes no more residency when Chico is in, but he thinks we wont leave LOL
Which burn would YOU move to? Which one DOESN'T have hood rats?
the flip side is this: if they lift the residency requirement, will your home increase in value?
No it will go down quick and then quicker when the hood changes. Thats why I put my house on the market today. Anyone want to move to Mt G
Fireman have always been given a play for living outside the city, but when cops get caught they get fired, bad idea, our houses will devalue so so quick
I live 15 minutes from work so moving doesn't appeal to me, but I bet at least half the city workers would leave.
You would be a fool to stay unless you rent.
Unlike Mt. Greenwood or Edison Park, Hegewisch/East Side are places where city workers who have enough financial discipline to save three whole paychecks would definitely be compelled to leave, if they had that option.
You looked at Mt Greenwood lately....bordered up homes popping up, unfinished additions and sec 8 popping up...I'm out as most city workers would be gone.
Imagine the loss you'll take when you sell your homes in areas like Mt greenwood, Beverly, Edison Pk, Sauganash, etc.
Think about the tax hike on your home if you can't sell it.
He said he doubted workers would flee the city if the restriction was eliminated.
HAHAHAAAAHAAA Too funny he is misinformed
Anonymous said...
You know things are screwed up when Carol Mosley Braun is the only one who can clearly say what will happen if the residency rule is dropped
1/26/2011 12:39:00 AM
Rahm the "crumb" and chico "not a man" also know damn well what will happen to our homes but they choose to treat you (us) as dumb hicks while asking for your vote. Fuckem'
How about giving us a tax break instead for living here.
1/26/2011 12:43:00 AM
I absolutely agree. A tax reduction or tax credit on our property taxes serves as an incentive to buy and reside in areas targeted by the city. Similar to what they did to attract buyers to Englewood.
Anonymous said...
Lifting the residency will only lower the property values of our already undervalued properties in the city.
And let me add: O V E R T A X E D !
Personally, I hope residency stays. I like the NW side of the city, hope neighborhoods like mine on the NW and SW sides stay as they are, and do think there is something to be said about city workers living in the city. HOWEVER, it's also extremely important that the fact that we must commit to living in the city is a huge thing, and that should be recongnized as a major concession in collective bargaining. Whether it be salary, allowances, benefits, taxes...whatever...it should be something that we get credit for. While I actually (sadly) agree with Braun in the end, Chico opening this up for discussion is huge because it can lead to hopefully something better in return from the city or arbitrator in future deals.
I would bet a lot of city workers would head for better digs if they had a chance.
Just the opportunity for a decent school system would do it for many.
It would put a major hurt on already pained property values.
If it comes, some kind of phase in will be tried at first. Maybe by seniority, like 5% a year, so it would take 20 years for all the city workers to move out of the city.
If it happens, I would expect to see some kind of city program to pay city employees to stay. Maybe lower interest mortgages.
One of the hospitals around here was having an issue with undesirables moving into the neighborhood around the hospital.
They responded by having a lower interest rate mortgage plan for their employees that were willing to live within 4 blocks of the hospital. Now there is a solid band of employees living in that area as a buffer zone to the riff raff that was starting to invade. They billed it as wanting employees to live nearby so they could respond in an emergency. But everyone knew why they really did it.
I don't think you can extend that to a whole city though. Just not enough employees.
Did Chico just accept the endorsement of Walter "Gator" Bradley???? WTF???? Gutierrez endorsement wasnt enough??? Can't no how, no way, vote for him now!!
Although I at one time thought how nice it would be to be on the CPD and reside elsewhere, I know that this will only bring our property value lower than what it already is.
Anonymous said...
Residency is STATE LAW, regardless of what municipal code claims, the city doesn't have the authority to lift a requirement of state law, only make it more stringent. So sorry, residency ain't being lifted.
1/26/2011 09:17:00 AM
___________________________________
Can you provide the statutory citation for the above statement? No you can't! Why you ask? Because it isn't state law.
There is NO law on the IL Compiled Statutes requiring City of Chicago employees from living outside of the city.
What is the law is that the residency issue can not be brought before an arbitrator for resolution in a City with over 1,000,000 residents.
So the city can say no to the unions and the unions cannot bring the matter before an arbitrator like they do with wage issues, contracts, etc.
You simply do not know what you are talking about.
If the city said you can leave today, and the FOP agreed we could.
Residency is still in our contract.
The city would not fall because some cops and firefighters decided to leave. Not all would leave and the world doesn't revolve around the rest.
Entire neighborhoods wouldn't change because the cops weren't there. Get over yourselves already.
Well said. People need to grow up.
It comes down to having a choice of where you want to live, where your children are going to grow up and go to school. LIFT THE RESIDENCY.....
The city wont fall to pieces! It already has!
Anonymous said...
If u have a home in the city , it's the worst idea. Your house will not have a buyer all the police neighborhoods will loose value and sit on market waiting for a buyer for a very long time. How about giving us a tax break instead for living here.
1/26/2011 12:43:00 AM
That makes much more sense. FOP should add that to the negotiations.
He smart guys and gals where are we going to go live? The Burbs are expensive too and then the drive into work. Chicago will become like NYC very very high priced. How about Ford Heights of Markham. BTW Jerry Chico the mann live at Randolph and Mich in a million dollar condo. Some man of the people
1/26/2011 06:57:00 AM
hey, junior, didn't carol just tell you to get coffee, and not to play on the campaign's computers?
bobbo said...
Why bother voting, whoever wins will do like the prior lackeys who had the office.
1/26/2011 07:37:00 AM
when you're old enough to wipe your own ass, let alone vote, you'll understand.
LIFT RESIDENCY... provide TAX BREAKS for P.O.'s to encourage them to stay in the city.
1/26/2011 08:36:00 AM
how about tax breaks for everybody who pays on time?
LET's write daley in on the ballot... hate to say it but I would vote for him over any of these canidate clowns
1/26/2011 08:39:00 AM
sure.
spread the word around the west and south sides.
The question is where are you going to go? The southeast suburbs are off limits. You would have to go to Orland, Tinley or Palos to give yourself enough breathing room on the sw side. Only about 1/10 of 1% of us could afford the North Shore and the nw suburbs are very high in property taxes and have already seen an influx of section 8 into their apartment buildings. I don't think residency is going to be lifted without a price tag: no raise, wage decrease, medical purged. Lets pressure this guy to fix our pension and manpower woes and worry about residency at a later time.
It's because y'all don't know just how good the school districts in the burbs are. Its such a shame that you'd send, on purpose, your kids to the same schools that those other keedz attend. Quit being so damn needy/ selfish and start caring about their futures for once! Their your life? You'd do anything for them you say? Right... What a shame.
1/26/2011 08:59:00 AM
so you're an alumni, i presume?
Entire neighborhoods wouldn't change because the cops weren't there. Get over yourselves already.
1/26/2011 09:48:00 AM
there are entire neighborhoods that will never change no matter how many cops are there.
If u have a home in the city , it's the worst idea. Your house will not have a buyer all the police neighborhoods will loose value and sit on market waiting for a buyer for a very long time. How about giving us a tax break instead for living here.
Ya, because so many Police Officers live in Bucktown, Lincoln Park Wrigleyville ect...
Besides not everyone would leave. A large number of officers would stay because of family reasons.
The amount of Police Officers that would actually move wouldn't hurt a thing, and believe it or not Police Officer are not the only good people in this world. The city would be just fine without us.
But some neighborhoods would change. Nw sw sides because it's simple supply dans. The demand comes from new police who are looking for a house. They now have option too move to burbs creating more supply and if few police hired less demand
Residency, for the most, is about the schools. Living in the NW side cop areas, there are several top notch public elementary schools that rival or exceed any private school.
Ya ok, it has nothing to do with you sacrificing your childs education to save a buck. And if you honestly believe the public schools are as good as the private schools, stop drinking the kool aid they are giving you.
Its not just the high schools fault that 50% of the public school kids don't graduate.
Anonymous said...
The city would not fall because some cops and firefighters decided to leave. Not all would leave and the world doesn't revolve around the rest.
Entire neighborhoods wouldn't change because the cops weren't there. Get over yourselves already.
1/26/2011 09:48:00 AM
That's our point exactly! Glad to have a civilian agree. Now vote for Gery Chico so we can move out.
Anonymous said...
Residency is STATE LAW, regardless of what municipal code claims, the city doesn't have the authority to lift a requirement of state law, only make it more stringent. So sorry, residency ain't being lifted.
1/26/2011 09:17:00 AM
It is state LABOR LAW. Easily changed with the cooperation of Chicago, City of.
It merely prohibits collective bargaining on the issue of residency. And it effects ONLY Chicago.
Not in the state constitution, just snuck in by guess who to put a stop to city employees clamoring to move to the suburbs. NO other city on the state is effected by this labor law.
OT-
I'm sure this will teach those rascals a lesson:
http://southtownstar.suntimes.com/3504380-522/court-matthews-berman-judge-community.html
1/26/2011 09:17:00 AM
STATE LAW only allows the city to have a Chicago city ordinance restricting city worker residency. STATE LAW does not mandate residency, it is up to the Chicago Aldermen NOT the state to make that ordinance and they (NOT THE STATE) can refuse.
The only thing STATE LAW mandates is that no other Illinois municipality except Chicago MAY restrict residency.
STATE LAW COULD prohibit the Chicago ordinance....
hahahahaha
Gator Bradley and Luis Gutierrez have endorsed Chico. I will never support any politician who is supported by criminals and terrorists.
Did Chico just accept the endorsement of Walter "Gator" Bradley???? WTF???? Gutierrez endorsement wasnt enough??? Can't no how, no way, vote for him now!!
ARE YOU KIDDING ME..ANYONE CAN SAY THEY ARE ENDORSING HIM... I ENDORSE HIM.. SO WHAT, DOES IT MEAN I HAVE A SAY IN HIS POLICIES??? NOOOO.. GATOR JUST HAS THE EARS OF THE KISS ASS MEDIA FOR SOME REASON.. THE ENDORSEMENT MEANS NOTHING OTHER THAN YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT A NEGATIVE REPLY NOT TO PISS OFF ANYONE BY CALLING IT A RACE ISSUE.
bobbo said...
Why bother voting, whoever wins will do like the prior lackeys who had the office.
1/26/2011 07:37:00 AM
----------------------------------
That's the great fucking mentality that got Quinn back in. What an asshat. Last to vote, first to bitch.
WTF is with the UAW endorsing him?????????????????????
1/26/2011 02:53:00 PM
so, you just discovered ayn rand, did you?
I'm still disappointed that Waugespack decided to not run for Mayor.
1/26/2011 10:18:00 AM
he's too smart to take it now, he'll wait for the blood letting to diminish.
Anonymous said...
Residency, for the most, is about the schools. Living in the NW side cop areas, there are several top notch public elementary schools that rival or exceed any private school.
Ya ok, it has nothing to do with you sacrificing your childs education to save a buck. And if you honestly believe the public schools are as good as the private schools, stop drinking the kool aid they are giving you.
Its not just the high schools fault that 50% of the public school kids don't graduate.
1/26/2011 06:51:00 PM
Hey asshat, sorry to burst your bubble but children that graduate from the northwest side public schools go onto the magnet schools and then to major colleges. The schools in Edison park have made major changes with parents involved in their child's education. 50% may not graduate on the south and west side, not the northwest side. Be smart and move to the northwest side and talk to your child's teachers. You might be surprised.
Why bumrap Terry Gainer? You don't know him. I worked with him in Area 4, he was a hard working good detective. He is also an attorney and has a master's degree. Whatis your problem? He worked hard and made some connections to get where he is at. What do you think? Daley controls the US Senate? He was chief of the capital police and made a few friends, So what? Go fys.
I like living in the city. I would prefer a tax break instead of moving. That would save $400-$600 a month. Seriously, I live close to work, no way will I move to the suburbs and sit in traffic to go to work. I mean how many coppers stop home during their tour or go down on a uniform adjustment. You can't do that if you live in the burbs.
the fix is in
Anonymous said...
The city would not fall because some cops and firefighters decided to leave. Not all would leave and the world doesn't revolve around the rest.
Entire neighborhoods wouldn't change because the cops weren't there. Get over yourselves already.
1/26/2011 09:48:00 AM
That's our point exactly! Glad to have a civilian agree. Now vote for Gery Chico so we can move out.
1/26/2011 07:10:00 PM
==
Both of you, get over yourselves. It was NEVER about the security or stability of a neighborhood. It's all about the tax dollars.
The STABLE, GUARANTEED tax base income for the City of Chicago.
I was very anti-Rahm/Pro-Chico until the last two days when it was revealed that the Daley machine is pushing Chico and doing everything they can to shitcan Rahm. I find that pretty damn scary. I can't bring myself to vote Rahm, but Chico will most certainly be more of the same.
ARE YOU KIDDING ME..ANYONE CAN SAY THEY ARE ENDORSING HIM... I ENDORSE HIM.. SO WHAT, DOES IT MEAN I HAVE A SAY IN HIS POLICIES??? NOOOO.. GATOR JUST HAS THE EARS OF THE KISS ASS MEDIA FOR SOME REASON.. THE ENDORSEMENT MEANS NOTHING OTHER THAN YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT A NEGATIVE REPLY NOT TO PISS OFF ANYONE BY CALLING IT A RACE ISSUE.
Quote by Chico:
"If somebody has paid their time and has shown a record of civic responsibility, and you're asking me whether or not they're going to volunteer to help my campaign, I see nothing wrong with that," said Chico, after accepting the endorsement of "Gator" Bradley.
come on....the FOP, CFD, Luis Gutierrez, and Gator Bradley....I still think that Chico would have been a stronger choice for the Police and Fire if he graciously declined being endorsed by the likes of the other two...I'm just saying
Love my new flyer from Marty Quinn and a Chicago Police Brass... not
Now which group is supporting the homeless man on the ballot :)
First of all, Chico said he'd consider the issue of residency. That is hardly a promise. Second, Luis Gutierrez, the rat-face terrorist, and now Gator Bradley, urban translator, have endorsed Chico. I will never support a man who associates with those two characters.
To.........1/26/2011 09:17:00 AM
WELL SAID and on spot!!!!! Thanks for putting it in a cohesive manner.
And by the way.... After paying 12k a year in taxes I totally agree with lowering taxes for city workers. I actually believe if we are allowed outside the city, it will destroy chicago and the beautiful homes we worked so hard for....... I actually believe there should be an incentive program for city workers. just my 2 cents.
Lifting residency would not kill the middle class of the city. City workers & their families make up only a small portion of the population. If every single city working family moved out of the city it would have little to no impact on these neighborhoods.
Not true I sell real estate on the side. I live on the far northwest side a beautiful block we have 5 police families and two fire dept families along with 4 other city workers with good jobs. I will tell you we have all lost value in our homes and yes we all did the upgrades. thousands of dollars worth we will never get a return on, the other poster said only square footage counts to the banks he is right. If all these workers leave or even Half the domino will start to fall. No new Mayor will allow residency to change any time soon. The middle will leave when we leave, also the middle class is shrinking, this country is turning into the POOR and Rich. Lincoln park and the real Gold cose will do just fine.
LA TIMES.... BETTER OFF BANKRUPT!
by Jeb Bush and Newt Gingrich.
Great job ain't it? Unfucking believable.This is no joke. If you got less than 10 years or over twenty you are screwed if you don't pull the pin now or make plans to scoot. This job will be just like J-Fraud wanted it to be. Privates in the army that he can fuck with and fire at will to serve any political purpose or agenda. Pension...what pension? They can terminate any provision in our contract at will and renegotiate. Think about it. It's coming.
OT - Police quit a chase of a carjacked cab this morning out of Des Plaines that wound all around the Northern suburbs but all of the Chicago news choppers continued the chase.
Kind of embarrassing when the media is more anxious to pursue criminals than law enforcement is!
No, not really. Remember they don't have to do the paperwork or get sued when the car crashes..
The police, fire and city workers ARE NOT the tax base of the city!!!
DO THE MATH:
A city worker pays maybe $4,000 / year in taxes and draws $50,000 and up a year in tax payer paid wages.
Tho without the city workers the private parochial school system probably would collapse.
The East Side and Hegwisch both WERE city worker onclaves and a great place to live and raise your kids.
--
They still kinda are- Hegewisch, anyway. For whatever step it's taken down, it's still not that bad. You have the shitheads on 134 block of Brandon and the surrounding area, a few bangers in the 130/131 blocks but for the most part, it's still pretty blue collar and safe there. There's something worth saving in Hegewisch and its not too late. East Side, another story. They're toast.
"this opinion is that if the city workers move out, will prospective buyers ask themselves, 'why are they leaving? what do they know that we don't?'"
If prospective buyers want to know what it is that we know that they don't, all they have to do is read this blog. Or pick up a newspaper. Or watch (and pay attention to) the news.
Chicago is becoming Detroit.
City workers see it every day. We want to leave for the very same reasons that so many moved into the suburbs in the first place; better schools, safer streets and if nothing else, not feeling as if we're prisoners here.
Sure we knew that we had to live in the city upon taking this job, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with trying to better our situation and change the law that forces us to live in Chicago. At the very least, they could open up residency to Cook County.
Another thing you have to look at is that when most of us came on, we were young and single.
Now that we're getting older and rasing a family, we want the same things in a neighborhood as everyone else (see above).
Maybe the threat of city workers leaving would force the administration (whoever it ends up being) to provide true improvement to the city, not just street-clogging flower boxes, cost overrun-laden downtown parks and airport expansions that even the airlines said years ago that they didn't really want or need.
To 7:14 pm:
Is it so hard to live in the city? Can not the taxpayers expect that at least those that we are paying and supporting our among our brethren?
At least so that they would have an understanding of what we, the taxpayers of the city, are going through?
By the way, I would love to have a job that is not subject to a layoff, in this environment, come on! Instead of always about what is not right, how about sometimes saying what is good about being a CPD/CFD?
Also, as an afterthought, I think you mean, affect, not effect, since affect is a verb and effect is a noun, right?
Anonymous said...
Why bumrap Terry Gainer? You don't know him. I worked with him in Area 4, he was a hard working good detective. He is also an attorney and has a master's degree. Whatis your problem? He worked hard and made some connections to get where he is at. What do you think? Daley controls the US Senate? He was chief of the capital police and made a few friends, So what? Go fys.
1/26/2011 08:54:00 PM
Packers suck and so do you.
Anonymous said...
I'm still disappointed that Waugespack decided to not run for Mayor.
1/26/2011 10:18:00 AM
he's too smart to take it now, he'll wait for the blood letting to diminish.
1/26/2011 08:24:00 PM
Yes, that and it's hard running for mayor with twenty six dollars in your campaign chest.
"Residency is STATE LAW, regardless of what municipal code claims, the city doesn't have the authority to lift a requirement of state law, only make it more stringent. So sorry, residency ain't being lifted."
Yes, but Tricky Dick Daley wouldn't allow that law to be changed.
It's going to require a mayor with some balls to give the okay for that law to change.
It serves no purpose but to keep CHICAGO employees prisoners. It's an arcane law dating back to when things here were ruled by politics. (Oh wait, they still are!)
45th Ward forum:
Lt. John Garrido was exceptionally knowledgeable about the issues and was well received by the audience in attendance. His comments displayed a keen intellect and he represented the CPD as a consummate professional. He is in a very good position to make the runoff given his level of support from the neighborhood. He was very personable and presented himself well. John got a few laughs when he related being transferred to the South side after throwing his hat into the ring to run for office. He is a serious contender and gave the best overall performance at the forum. If you want someone from the CPD in the City Council.....give him your support. He's got my vote.
Marina Faz Huppert had a rough night answering questions about her short term residency and campaign funding, mostly all from unions. Since Marina has resided in the ward for over a year, she will not be getting ejected from the ballot. Even though she is not a long term resident, it is evident that she is very intelligent and capable of performing the duties of alderman. Even if she does not get elected, she has a bright future ahead of her: political contacts, advanced ivy league education, and only 34.
John Arena had quite a few followers, but his refusal to reduce the number of alderman from 50 to 25 was met with a collective groan from the audience. He seemed knowledgeable, but he was the reason so many developments at Six Corners pulled out. He reminds me of a California liberal moonbeam. He talked about privatizing recycling and refuse pick up...CITY WORKERS BEWARE!!
Business leader Don Blair was putting on a flawless presentation, but made one damaging admission. Blair stated that he would continue to do consulting work in addition to being an Alderman. He may have been too honest for his own good as all the other candidates stated that being alderman would be their ONLY job. He has solid business expertise and an extensive background working in high level positions. He's very well educated and has a visionary outlook for the ward.
Bruno Bellisimo has an accounting background and worked for the City previously in the Revenue Department. He had good working knowledge of the issues, and appeared to be an excellent number cruncher. They could probably use some help downtown with the budget numbers. He was personable and seemed like a likable guy. Problem is he doesn't have much visibility in the area and isn't likely to make the runoff.
Michael Fitzgeard (I'm Irish vote for me) Ward was more bluster than anything else. His lack of formal education came shining through. City workers need to work until 67 to retire "so we get our moneys worth." Fortunately he's not likely to make the cut.
Anna Klocek took a few catty digs at Marina Faz Huppert, describing herself as a "mother of four and older and wiser." At the end she waved a couple of mailers from Marina Faz Huppert exclaiming that someone had stole her identity as a reformer. Sad that Klocek felt compelled to insult the other woman on stage with her.
If I had to rank the candidates in order of preference
John Garrido
Marina Faz Huppert
Don Blair
John Arena
Bruno Bellisimo
Michael Fitzpatrick Ward
Anna Klocek
Anonymous said...
I was very anti-Rahm/Pro-Chico until the last two days when it was revealed that the Daley machine is pushing Chico and doing everything they can to shitcan Rahm. I find that pretty damn scary. I can't bring myself to vote Rahm, but Chico will most certainly be more of the same.
1/26/2011 10:20:00 PM
--------------------------------
Better to shitcan Rahm before he shitcans you! Don't cry for Rahmbo, he was well compensated for his four months of shaking hands on the rubber chicken circuit. If he's off the ballot for good, he has a cool $ 11 million for less than half a year of work. He gets to keep the money and will not have any of the headaches of actually having to run the City.
A year from now, after the media hoopla has subsided, Rahm can go on an extended vacation and soak up a tan while Chico is stuck here trying to keep the garbage picked up, snow plowed, and maintain order with all newbie and entrenched City Council members.
Poor picked on Rahm will be laughing all the way to the bank. He made more in two months than we'll make in our lifetime.
the flip side is this: if they lift the residency requirement, will your home increase in value?
No it will go down quick and then quicker when the hood changes. Thats why I put my house on the market today. Anyone want to move to Mt G
Move to Mt Greenwood? Uh I don't think so
1/26/2011 04:09:00 PM
If residency is lifted in speaking with other officers, not one said they would stay in the city. So from this I guess it's time to start looking at the burbs
Chico accepts the "endorsement" of Wallace "Gator" Bradley???
Does Chico have rocks in his head?
How much is an endorsement from the "Urban Translator" worth?
Many fewer votes from police officers and decent people I'd say.
Maybe Bradley is working for Rahm or one of Rahm's people.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
If residency is lifted in speaking with other officers, not one said they would stay in the city. So from this I guess it's time to start looking at the burbs
1/27/2011 02:45:00 AM
I will be in the city! before you decide to "dump"your home and take a huge loss,you better be sure the area is secure from the illegals and all the "surprise"section 8 scum! Check out the taxes as they are based on a percentage of the sale price not what the other person your buying from is paying! Watch the commute times! Don't forget you will be paying double the water bill,extra for garbage pick up and they will not pick up everything you throw out ala the city guys! Are the schools really that good? My sister lives in Tinley sends her kid to Lincoln way,it is way overcrowded and the education is not what you think,not to mention the notorious drug problems!
Mom would always say "The grass is always greener on the other side," and it could be but check it out before you throw it all away and regret it! Also don't forget no more walking to transportation,grocery store,you will need that car always!
Anonymous said...
To 7:14 pm:
Is it so hard to live in the city? Can not the taxpayers expect that at least those that we are paying and supporting our among our brethren?
At least so that they would have an understanding of what we, the taxpayers of the city, are going through?
By the way, I would love to have a job that is not subject to a layoff, in this environment, come on! Instead of always about what is not right, how about sometimes saying what is good about being a CPD/CFD?
Also, as an afterthought, I think you mean, affect, not effect, since affect is a verb and effect is a noun, right?
1/27/2011 12:57:00 AM
Wrong.
Both are verb forms, transitive and both are also nouns.
I used the correct form for the meaning I intended.
Also, as an afterthought, I think you mean "are among our brethren" not "our among our brethren," right?
And I AM a taxpayer here and have been since Carter made pills.
Give city workers a tax break to live in the city....no way that is called a subsidy . Then I should get a break also to live in the city because my business brings people into the city which spend money and I know I pay more taxes then you do.
The end of residency is the loss of property values?Well in Garfield Ridge, I don't think they can go any lower. The average price for a bungalow is under 200 grand, way under. It is considered a depressed area. You really want your kids to grow up in that area? Loaded with gangs.
I will not sell but I will move and rent my house out for several years in attempt to regain some of my equity and then sell.
The law won't get changed. He said it will be open for discussion. That is it. Dont bank on a change.
Read through the line people. Politicicans just telling the masses what they want to hear.
Wont happen and that is my 2cents.
Yes, that and it's hard running for mayor with twenty six dollars in your campaign chest.
1/27/2011 01:01:00 AM
tough to get donations when you're not a whore.
Every major city in America , with the exception of Chicago and Milwaukee has ended residency for city employees. It will come to Chicago too, just going to take a little more time, but it will come.Elected officials must live in the city, employees are required only by city ordinance. The state law just prohibits us for collective barginning over the matter. It is coming.
Off topic, last night watching the State of the Union and Terry Gainer escorting the President as Sgt of Arms to Congress, the same Terry Gainer who was a Sgt in the CPD and was on the TV show Lets Make a Deal wearing his CPD Sgts uniform in violation of rules and regulations. And what happens to him, up the political ladder. Its all legit.
1/26/2011 10:41:00 AM
Who cares! Is it that bad? You should be bitchin about
J-Fled walking around wearing the CPD uniform which he has no right wear.
A city worker pays maybe $4,000 / year in taxes and draws $50,000 and up a year in tax payer paid wages.
I'm on the north side I paid 5,325.00 in taxes some of my neighborhoods paid 6,000.00 or more.
North side gets screwed.
Why bumrap Terry Gainer? You don't know him. I worked with him in Area 4, he was a hard working good detective. He is also an attorney and has a master's degree. Whatis your problem? He worked hard and made some connections to get where he is at. What do you think? Daley controls the US Senate? He was chief of the capital police and made a few friends, So what? Go fys.
I apologize to you. But that's what this board is all about.
The impact would not be as big as some people think; there are about 35,000 city workers(being generous) all of them would not move, if half did, how many are homeowners? The impact would be minimal.
What are you smoking? Most city workers live in about 5 areas of the city. yes indeed it will. On my block alone we have 9 family's that are city workers. and two school teachers who will move once they realize we are living. Others will move once we are gone. Then watch your paycheck disappear.
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