Ballots Arriving
The Contract ballots are arriving, which is odd, because when the FOP came to our part of town to give the contract spiel a couple weeks ago, they told us that they still had to print out the City's proposals and then go over it line-by-line to ensure that there weren't any "alterations" by the City that might affect the final product. We were assured this would take at least a couple months, which sounded about right.
Now, the ballots are arriving and have to be back by 16 October - and the latest (or last) info meeting was just held five hours ago? A little jumping the gun there? This calls to mind a comment from a few days ago regarding the informational meetings:
Now, the ballots are arriving and have to be back by 16 October - and the latest (or last) info meeting was just held five hours ago? A little jumping the gun there? This calls to mind a comment from a few days ago regarding the informational meetings:
- FLOP getting pissed said...
Dean Jr. was running his mouth and let the cat out of the bag tonight after the Northside town hall meeting. Said ballots for the vote on the contract were ready to go out last week but the labor attorneys strongly urged Dean Sr. to hold off on mailing them out after they saw how much members are ripping it to shreds on "that G-d damned blog". Also, they werent happy with how members reacted at yesterday's FOP meeting and especially after the cold reception they got tonight trying to sell this stinker of a contract. They're very nervous and scrambling because no one is buying the story they're selling us. That's why they picked the Southside location that they did. It's a small joint and won't hold too many angry coppers. Dean Jr. also got visibly angry and said how 'that fuckin' SCC is fucking things up for my Pops'.
Again, this brings us back to the opening paragraph above - it seems like there is a big push to "get this done." Sorry, but these informational meetings should have been scheduled first thing. As soon as the Contract was ratified by the FOP Committee in fact. Waiting until the FOP meeting? Almost half the Department couldn't make a third watch meeting and the fact that it ran FOUR HOURS means First Watch couldn't stay. It also tells you that there are issues to hammer out among the membership.
As for "that G-d damned blog" and "that fuckin' SCC [...] fucking this up for my Pops," that isn't our doing. That's a failure of leadership to sell this thing to the members. That means questions aren't getting answered to the satisfaction of those asking. This is a forum. Read everything we've written over the past two weeks. We have ventured NO opinion on the Contract. We have told NO ONE how to vote. We've highlighted a couple of questions that people posed and we felt deserved more answers. We've pointed out the perceived "rush" that many many other commentators brought to our attention. That isn't "fucking things up" - that's attempting to make the membership take an active interest in something that is going to affect them for the rest of their careers, maybe beyond.
The president has his newsletter article up early on the FOP website. It heaps compliments on the involved parties and brags of the accomplishments contained within the agreement. Rah rah rah. We'll close with reminding everyone to vote. Keep asking questions, read the opinions here and elsewhere, talk to your co-workers, and vote.
As for "that G-d damned blog" and "that fuckin' SCC [...] fucking this up for my Pops," that isn't our doing. That's a failure of leadership to sell this thing to the members. That means questions aren't getting answered to the satisfaction of those asking. This is a forum. Read everything we've written over the past two weeks. We have ventured NO opinion on the Contract. We have told NO ONE how to vote. We've highlighted a couple of questions that people posed and we felt deserved more answers. We've pointed out the perceived "rush" that many many other commentators brought to our attention. That isn't "fucking things up" - that's attempting to make the membership take an active interest in something that is going to affect them for the rest of their careers, maybe beyond.
The president has his newsletter article up early on the FOP website. It heaps compliments on the involved parties and brags of the accomplishments contained within the agreement. Rah rah rah. We'll close with reminding everyone to vote. Keep asking questions, read the opinions here and elsewhere, talk to your co-workers, and vote.
Labels: contract stuff
posted by SCC at 12:05 AM
245 Comments:
I voted for Charlie Brown.
Got mine earlier today, voted NO, and then traced down my mailman three blocks over, and hand carried it to him to have delivered. I hope it goes to FLOP by tomorrow.
Well for all you people that think you will do better are smoking dope. The writing was set when the arbitrator ruled on the Sgt. Deal.
Keep in mind the Illinois state troopers arbitration came back in early August and the Illinois Secretary of State Police, and the arbitrators did with them that happened to the Sgt. Union SCREWED THEM. SOS Police got raises of 1.5 & 1.75. And troopers got 2%. Anyone that thinks we will get more is delusional, don't keep harping on what Benn said, you think the city would actually pick Benn or allow him to be picked.
This is the first time in at least 2 contracts that the employee contribution didn't go up in negotiations, you will lose this with arbitration.
Arbitrator will put you in the wellness plan.
Be smart people educate yourself and look at what you have to lose and look at what the Tempo was set with the sgt. Union.
I vote The Chicago Bears NFC North Champions 2014. Fuck the Lions and Packers. Watch for a mid season run from the Bears.
FOP trying to fool the coppers???????
The contract that was sent with the ballot in the mail has rasises for officers totaling 14% over the life the contract. Where in the hell did they get an extra 3% added to the contract?????????
This looks like a lot of trickery and this contract is very scary. And how come no Tier 1 and Tier2 hospital list...where is it?????
Vote NO on this contract. Vote NO!
A used car dealer once told me:
"...to sell the junker on the lot the first thing you want to do is to CREATE A SENSE OF URGENCY"
Ya know, like I can't guarantee the car will still be here when you get back. Or limit time offer the sale ends blah-blah.
Create a sense of urgency works on union contracts too.
Dean Jr. sounds like a class act.
Vote no, anyone who votes yes is either blinded by retro of a complete tool bag. If this is ratified we are dooming ourselves. How is this so hard to understand? No one sees the rush behind all of this? My ballot had some garbage pamphlet that looked put together by my 1st grader. Unreal there are so many coppers in favor of this.
No, because Medical Tiers 1/2, Pension clause in contract, tuition reimbursement, photo dissemination, cars, comp time, 2% tax on retirees annuity at 55...and on and on..
The shit is endless. Fuck that retro. Dean sold us out for peanuts. Vote Hell NO.
ot: Mr. 10g is out 10g!! I said it before I will ride with 10g on all his bets except against the bears. He is a Bears hater and bets against them no matter what.
What day are we getting our retro check. I can hardly wait
You should probably look at bringing in independent international observers to count the ballots the way things are going.
And who did SSC kind of endorse ???
If you want to go to a first class hospital like Christ or Rush you will have to pay a premium to do so. What? You want me to go to a 3rd rate hospital to pay the discounted price? I will be voting no on this contract. It stinks!
I was at this south side meeting. I had an opening mind but after the meeting and realizing what we are getting for what we are giving up I would rather roll the dice and let an arbitrator rule. It truly seems the upside outweighs the downside.I am voting NO!!!
If this apparent deception isn't enough to make you scratch your head and dig a little deeper, then you are truly beyond hope. Do some more asking around and researching. Ask the old timers that have been thru this a few times and see what their take on it is. This just screams impropriety by FLOP. They're trying to sell you a bill of goods that benefits the city, NOT the membership. When the guys that I work with that can retire are soundly voting "NO", that speaks volumes. The old guys trust their gut and they can smell a rat 1000 miles away. The rat they smell is located on the 3rd floor at 1412 W. Washington.
I was promoted to Sgt. a few short months ago. Granted, I am affected by this contract in a small part but I shouldn't have a say in its ratification or defeat. Why did I, as well as several dozen other recent promotees, receive ballots?
Sgt. Phil Collins #1111
24th District
3rd Watch
It is so funny to me that we are trained used judgement. We look out for unusual and strange behaviors. It is suspect to us, all of us. It is part of our routine daily. And after reading endless comments and listening to spew no one finds is suspect that the FOP wants us to vote 'yes' so badly?! Making it seem there is no other way. Using terms like: 'best it's going to get' and 'too much to lose if it goes to arbitration'. I find this behavior to be 'shady' in which the lodge is bullying it's membership into a 'yes' vote. Maybe this contact is the best we will get, yet I feel there are suspect motives behind the push for the 'yes' vote. It seems to raise flags. Maybe I'm just a cynic, or maybe my gut feeling is correct. We usually follow those gut feelings. Based upon that, my vote is a 'no'.
So since the vote is going out has anybody seen a list of the tier 1 - 3 hospitals or should I vote and just hope for the best from the city?
Thank you SCC! You give voice to the little people! You help to level the playing field.
Don't worry SCC I'm rushing my response back today, I'm voting NO as in NO F...... Way. You put ANY opening in the contract about pension and you've opened the door for them. TAHT IS TOTALLY WRONG!!! Then saying it's ok for the Duty availability taken away from the new guys. This contract is S&!t
Good to see we have some coppers thinking for themselves and not toeing the company line from the union. My issues with this contract are the following;
1) Wiping out of Duty Availability Pay for PO's through first 42 months. Here are the numbers people need to know because it seems all too easy to dismiss this as just a few dollars. It is not. The City is trying to find another way to lessen their current contractual contributions to OUR Pension Fund! Think long and hard about this folks....and peoples!
Duty Pay is paid 4 times per year at the current rate of of $805.00 USC per payment to every PO. That is a total of $3220.00 USC per year. Since Duty Pay is "pensionable" that means that 9% of the PO's Duty Pay ($3220.00) goes into the Pension Fund yearly. That figure is $289.80, which is deposited into the Pension Fund. The City of Chicago contributes at a ratio of 2:1 to the Pension Fund, therefore the city has to contribute $289.80 X 2. This amount is $579.60 per year from the City to the Pension Fund.
The total amount per year deposited into the Pension Fund from the PO and the City is $289.8 + $579.60, for a total of $869.40. Using these figures, the total amount for 42 months that is currently going into the Pension Fund is $3042.90 per PO/City contribution.
Let's use as an example 100 new hires in the future that won't get Duty Pay for 42 months, and thus not pay into the Pension Fund, and neither will the city. 100 new hires X $3042.90 equals $304,290.00.
500 new hires and this figure jumps to $1.521 millions dollars not going into the Pension Fund.
1000 new hires equals $3.042 million dollars.
Now what is important to note is that more new hires are going to be coming on in the future, since the largest demographic on the job is around 45 years of age. So within 5-10 years a lot of PO's are going to leave. Do we really want to be ratifying a contract proposal that severely defunds our pension? No for me!
2) The FOP was able to show the city that it was cheaper to pay for a PO's health care premiums at age 55 and allow a PO to retire at 55 with 20 years of service than it was to pay an active PO's benefits, (salary, healthcare, pension). The city is actually saving money when a PO retires at 55. If the contract passes as proposed the city will still reap those savings, but we are going to pay 2% MORE to the city for the privilege of saving the city money? That is insane. Why in the world would the union agree to this? I don't care what the assholes from the CFD agreed to. They only look out for their best interest without regard to how they affected other unions. Fuck the flame chasers! Our union should take our agreement with the city for 55 and out with paid healthcare premiums to the arbitrator and show him/her the amount of money the city is already saving rather than roll over cause the red truck crew sold themselves and every other union in the city out.
There are parts of the contract that I can live with, but not the above 2 issues. That is why I will be voting NO. I urge you to think about the ramifications of this proposal and ultimately, as a wise partner once said, "do what your heart can stand."
I would like to applaud the SCC for the fair and impartial reporting of the ballots arriving. Unfortunately, i can't say the the same for the letter included in the ballot package. It seems as though our representatives at FOP are in a "rush" to get this done and over with. Furthermore, the writer does not hide their support for this contract and even attempts to steer the members to vote yes. That is inappropriate and points should be made stating the positives and the negatives for the members to understand so that we may be able to make a informed decision. I don't get two pay checks like our representatives. I don't have 9.5 promising me shit. It is not the job of our representatives to steer us in one way or another but solely to inform us so that we as members can make a decision that is best for us. I read the booklet included in the ballot package and it stank like a drunk crack head's feet on a muggy day. Posting the video was fine but to even consider delaying the members on their ballot is just childish. You can whine and moan but that's what we pay the FOP for, to represent the members. Why can't we just for once try to take care of one another. No matter what the outcome, i hope it's for the best for us members.
Well I mailed my ballot on the way to work tonight. I marked "yes". Yes to a retro check and yes to not having the wellness program.
Just voted YES and mailed it. The fact is we won't do any better in arbitration and probably lose more.
From a firefighters standpoint you guy's would be nuts to insert contract language about the replacement of your vehicles in this or any contract.
Furnishing you with the tools needed to do your job is not a BENEFIT to be negotiated!
That your negotiating team would even bring this to you is a disgrace and reeks of collusion.
You've been warned.
Voted NO Fuk Rahm
He hates coppers
FUCK YOU! Dean Sr. and Dean Jr.
I already Voted, NO!
I will also be voting for anyone but Rahm!
Rahm MUST Go! Terrible Mayor!
Da Pelon
A YES Vote Helps Rham get REelected
FLOP will endorse Rham
A NO Vote is better We get more and No more Rham or McCarthy
I think the contract is alright but something just doesn't seem right with the whole process. Therefore, I have to vote NO!
It's like the parking meter deal. Don't read it just vote. Trust us.
Hey, didn't shortshanks pull that parking meter deal out of his ass and tell the city council that a deal giving the city $1.5 billion bucks that costs the city around $30 billion bucks over 75 years had to go through rush rush quick quick like because, well because otherwise someone might read it and discover what is in it? Besides, if the city council/trained seals didn't pass it real quick Daley would be mean to them and we wouldn't want that.
Now whatever happened to Mike Shields and his fantastic allegations of collusion and corruption? I expected a huge Federal Investigation, what happened?
Mike, where is the evidence? We need to see that evidence. I forgot, Mike Shields doesn't read the blog. Can someone give this to him? Zach Fardon needs to see the evidence Mike.
How come the ballots are in the mail and we are supposed to vote and the last word the FOP President said about Tier 1 and Tier 2 hospitals is "We will get the information regarding which hospital is on which list to the membership as soon as we (FOP) get it?"
How do they recommend a contract for vote and neither they nor we have the complete list of Tier 1 and 2 hospitals?
This is a mumbling midget type of operation.
Ok....Uncle....Uncle....I can't take it anymore. I'm voting NO !
Every bigy mouth has their opinion on this contract and still the ballots will go right in their garbage. Vote people and show our unity no matter what the outcome.
After the meeting Dean was seen giving Zalewski an I got them in my pocket wink.
Jr. seems like a total stroke bag.
I'm still on the fence on this one. Do we vote yes and get fucked over or vote no and get fucked over. It's so hard to decide.
Hey SCC,
At the general meeting Dean was asked if the Unit Rep's had voted on the agreement. He said he didn't know. Several Unit Rep's in attendance shouted out that they hadn't. I have now learned from talking to several reps that no vote was taken. Per our By-Laws(Article 5 Section 3 -page 8)the Unit Rep's are to vote on this before the Board of Director's does. That didn't happen. Also there was no quorum at the Board meeting when the directors voted on this. How could this go out for a vote?
We have consistently done poorly at arbitration. This is not a great contract, but it's better than we will get from an arbitrator if we turn it down.
Don't cut your nose off to spite your face. Vote yes!
The Two Tier health insurance is going to kill us. If you take a $10,000 hospital bill and assuming that you still have to pay your deductible. Under todays PPO you would pay The $350.00 deductible and 10% of the rest of the bill which would be a Total $1315.00 out of our pocket. Under the Two Tier system the exact same scenario would cost us $2762.50. More than double what we pay now. Now I know that this doesn't include subscriber shares, but we don't know what they are and neither does the FOP. This is why I'm voting NO!
VOTE NO and stop working VRI.
Voted yes. You are crazy if you think you will do better in arbitration.
Didn't vote for him and thought he was too young to hold the spot at the time but I believe Shields was on to something and they set him up to fall flat on his face. All at the expense of the membership. And now we have Angelo continuing with being in bed with the city to f+#k us further.
VOTE NO. VOTE NO. VOTE NO.
With regards to hospitals, you can still use (Advocates,Northwestern,Rush)and the family deductible max stays the same with both tier 1 and 2.Both tiers also will be paying less of a bill because of the "subscriber share " change,which gives us the ability to pay the city discount no matter what tier we use. The union has been trying to get "subscriber share" for years.I was at a general meeting and heard Daugherty say the "subscriber share"was a very good thing that we are trying to get for a while.Use the hospital you are comfortable with,tier 1 hospitals attempting to generate more business because they are not as well regarded as above mentioned hospitals are giving the city an extra discount to be placed in tier 1.Use the Hospital you trust and comfortable with. VOTE YES. ARBITRATION IS A BAD CHOICE FOR US AND BENEFITS RAHM/CITY
Exactly! Just received my "rush" ballot in the mail. Read the rah, rah letter enclosed and still voted NO! Dean Sr has sold his soul like the past presidents.
Every single contract going back to the first one was a sweetheart deal for the city. FOP has been stealing our dues and selling us out for over 30 years. FOP is the best friend the city has. Get in real trouble with and they will back the bosses 100%. They are only good if you shoot someone and in today's climate, they would sell you down the river on a shooting.
At those meetings did they used the phrase they have been using since 1982? "We have to get our foot in the door?"
I just voted YES. I am putting the ballot in the mail on my way to the gym. I have seen some very ill in formed speculation on this blog and thoughout the department. Those worring about the pension language are wrong. The FLOP would have the power to ask for more money should we be forced to contribute more by State Law. The Sgts, Lts, and Capts already have nearly the identical language in their new contracts. Should this go to arbitration it will stay in the contract. Don't vote no on this issue you would be cutting off your head despite your face. The car issue if you look at it is good. A board is being formed to make sure we get equipment. This is something the FOP should be doing. You can't trust the city and everybody knows that. When voting on this contract you are looking at 2 issues.
1. Do you want new hires to get Duty Availability right away or make them wait? I was very torn on this issue. The city has been dividing the Police for years. This drives a huge new nail between old and new.
2. Do you want a retro check? Arbitration guarentees we won't get retro for the first year. The contract rolled over as far as an arbitrator would be concerned.
For those who don't like Dean Sr and Jr, I am with you. Two total assholes!!!!!! Vote them out next time. That is how you deal with them.
Just mailed mine yesterday- voted "NO". The proposed contract is worth shit and is a slap in the face to everyone who puts their ass on the line for the residents of this town. It was loaded with bullcrap promises like usage of time due and new cars which mean nothing with no enforcement or recourse if denied. Giving us proper equipment to do our job shouldn't have to be spelled out in a contract- neither should being able to take time off that is OWED to you. And the 2 tier medical system, loss of differential pay to new officers, 2% medical contribution for retirees 55-60, and elimination of tuition reimbursement are major losses with nothing substantial offered to justify them. Pension language should not even be in there- big red flag. They are hoping the officers will be bedazzled by the retro figures and forget about the rest of the bs. Just shows you how much this shithole city administration really doesn't appreciate us.
10g was still up 9k for week.
Here is my spin. every last one of the FOP regimes should be indicted and imprisoned.
Things are the way they are because coppers dont stick together.
FOP should of been gone 15 years ago.
I voted yes for one reason. IM done very soon and had enough. Why worry about screwing over other coppers?
They do a fine job all by themselves.
I think the contract(s) suck. As does FOP. But again, we never stuck together.
We have never done better with arbitration.Our average retro check is 10k.Vote yes.The arbitrator will not give us first year retro,it will not even be on the table .Do not blow this and go for the head fake of arbitration.
Vote yes. Nothing will be gained in arb.
I voted no. ballot in the mail
Hey SCC - there's no need for you to justify the blog's existence or purpose. You get arrows in your back when you're out front leading the way - and the cowards behind you are too frightened to follow.
As for this stinker of a contract, Rahm ordered Dean to get this done quick before the November elections. If Quinn and the Democrats get spanked, Rahm will be in a much weaker personal position.
The Dem plan for the next two years as its been promised to Rahm is this: Durbin wins re-election, and within two years he will retire. Rahm gets appointed to fill his place for the last two years, putting him right on target for the highest office in the land.
Don't anybody kid yourself; Rahm is as shrewd as they come, and he has his eye on the White House.
I received my ballot in the mail yesterday, and voted YES........
The Angelos have some kind of agenda. Beware.
I read a lot of these comments about the new hires and how their not getting it all right off the bat. The're new. Did new get all the same benefits when you were new? Don't worry they will get the same as everyone else after they get some time under their belts.
Voting Yes, less than ten years on and have a nice assignment on the second watch . Can't do that if old timers get 95% bid spots . I don't ever plan on working weekends or nights. At times there are more office police than beat cars on the street .
Yes is the way to vote , we need new cars in caps office .
Hate shopping in a beat up squad car .
And who did SSC kind of endorse ???
We endorsed anyone but the Citywide crew. In fact, we stated that the best candidate didn't even make it to the runoff but we had committed to vote against the Citywide candidate. We may have had to hold our nose to do it, but that's how poisonous the atmosphere had become. That wasn't even a sideways endorsement - that was a desperate move to clean house.
Now we've got a Contract on the table, a whole bunch of questions, a push and a rush to "get it done" and ballots in the mail BEFORE the last info meeting is held?
You're comfortable with this?
I'm voting No ! Let's see that hospital list . You know ant decent hospital that we all go to - take our kids to - will be tier 3 !!! Screw that- keep your raise . Don't screw with my medical
No, because Medical Tiers 1/2, Pension clause in contract, tuition reimbursement, photo dissemination, cars, comp time, 2% tax on retirees annuity at 55...and on and on..
The shit is endless. Fuck that retro. Dean sold us out for peanuts. Vote Hell NO.
9/23/2014 12:41:00 AM
Can you string together a cohesive thought?
Your statement makes little sense and isn't accurate.
just voted yes thank you fop for all of your hard work all these haters are getting old
If you have the PPO insurance it will now be changed to the PPO choice, which is one step closer to an HMO. I went to the Blue/Cross Blue/Shield website and you are now limited in were you can go,unless you don't mind paying more out-of-pocket.The FOP has not released much information about this change, which angers me. And as far as our $600 a year wellness benefit being eliminated, go to the United States Preventive Services Task Force website site to see what is recommended under level A and B for preventive care. Not much. Switching us to PPO choice will save the city a lot of money over the PPO we have now. The city knew if they gave us the retro we would jump for the money, not realizing the bigger money is in the details.
1) Wiping out of Duty Availability Pay for PO's through first 42 months. Here are the numbers people need to know because it seems all too easy to dismiss this as just a few dollars. It is not. The City is trying to find another way to lessen their current contractual contributions to OUR Pension Fund! Think long and hard about this folks....and peoples!
Duty Pay is paid 4 times per year at the current rate of of $805.00 USC per payment to every PO. That is a total of $3220.00 USC per year. Since Duty Pay is "pensionable" that means that 9% of the PO's Duty Pay ($3220.00) goes into the Pension Fund yearly. That figure is $289.80, which is deposited into the Pension Fund. The City of Chicago contributes at a ratio of 2:1 to the Pension Fund, therefore the city has to contribute $289.80 X 2. This amount is $579.60 per year from the City to the Pension Fund.
The total amount per year deposited into the Pension Fund from the PO and the City is $289.8 + $579.60, for a total of $869.40. Using these figures, the total amount for 42 months that is currently going into the Pension Fund is $3042.90 per PO/City contribution.
Let's use as an example 100 new hires in the future that won't get Duty Pay for 42 months, and thus not pay into the Pension Fund, and neither will the city. 100 new hires X $3042.90 equals $304,290.00.
500 new hires and this figure jumps to $1.521 millions dollars not going into the Pension Fund.
1000 new hires equals $3.042 million dollars.
This is so correct and true. Please vote no Officers. The retirees on the board dont care about this because they will be dead in 10 years. I myself with 14 years on the job have a long way to go. We need these young guys to pay more into the fund and with them not getting duty avail thats bad. We need our pension fund paid into. horrible
voted yes.mailed today!raise sucks,but im outta here soon!
It is so funny to me that we are trained used judgement. We look out for unusual and strange behaviors. It is suspect to us, all of us. It is part of our routine daily. And after reading endless comments and listening to spew no one finds is suspect that the FOP wants us to vote 'yes' so badly?! Making it seem there is no other way. Using terms like: 'best it's going to get' and 'too much to lose if it goes to arbitration'. I find this behavior to be 'shady' in which the lodge is bullying it's membership into a 'yes' vote. Maybe this contact is the best we will get, yet I feel there are suspect motives behind the push for the 'yes' vote. It seems to raise flags. Maybe I'm just a cynic, or maybe my gut feeling is correct. We usually follow those gut feelings. Based upon that, my vote is a 'no'.
9/23/2014 01:33:00 AM
With the way the country, state, city and fop have treated the middle class and police officers over the recent years, I'm cynical too. And with good reason. Your post absolutely makes sense. FOP has proven they are not in our corner at all. None of the items we asked for were included. Only fluff and taking away many important things.
Isn't wonderful to be thought of in such "endearing" terms?
To 12:19 an Arbitrator can not put you in wellness since it was never brought up in this contract he only rules on the issues that we are disputing Dean.
Let's use as an example 100 new hires in the future that won't get Duty Pay for 42 months, and thus not pay into the Pension Fund, and neither will the city. 100 new hires X $3042.90 equals $304,290.00.
12>12 AM
#########
########
Its a good thing your a cop cuz your math skills are WAY off, they dont contribute the full 3 grand, its 9% contribution into the fund..... no wonder people are confused have people like you freaking the shit out of everyone.... ITS A FAIR CONTRACT.
I sent both my ballots in. One yes and one no. I'll sleep like a baby knowing I made the right decision.
as john kerry once said.
"this little thing called the internet, makes it soo much harder to govern"
I think the Nine-Digit-Midget and FOP think the same way concerning contract negotiations.
tiny probably figures that he will get no votes from police/fire, and the CTU to begin with come the election. And has to suck up to some other groups for help
This contract proposal and the ongoing shimmying, gyrating and non-straight answer giving by fop and the city smells as bad as a stinker in a court-yard building.
Everybody recognizes the smell for what it is. You can hear the hum of the blow flies at ground level...
"Why y'all take so long? It's been stankin' up in heah for weeks now..."
Arbitration = A viewing of the true bill of what fop and the city proposed.
The next gambit will likely be fop turning on the membership itself and accepting this stinker contrary to the probable wishes of the membership because "You Coppers are too dumb to see what a great job we did for ya."
As many have pointed out... This thing is DOA because of the finely minced, city hall sourced, municipal corporate lawyer derived word salad it is...
Three things a good Chicago Copper recognizes:
1. Bullshit
2. Danger
3. Treachery
It's an insult that this contract proposal is as full of these as it is and the bargaining unit saw fit to present it.
It seems Dr. Angelo either oversold himself to Rahm or underestimated the membership...
Hence the rush to get it done...
The longer it lingers for the churls to examine it, the worse it stinks.
They're in scramble mode at the FLOP hall.^ They're in the process of throwing together a list of hospitals that they BELIEVE will be participating in Tiers 1 & 2 when it takes effect in 2017. They didn't think many of us would notice this major blunder and now they're thinking of a way to soft sell it.
*** THE MAIN ISSUE IS THAT THESE HOSPITALS WON'T COMMIT TO PARTICIPATING IN OUR INSURANCE PROGRAM BECAUSE THE CITY IS ALWAYS LATE WITH PAYING THEIR PORTION OF THE BILLS.***
They have no clue how far they've put the cart before the horse on this issue and it's damage control time. Expect an 'updated' list of hospitals/ service providers to hit FLOPs website and maybe even another mailer to the membership according to what I heard with my own two ears.
^ You FLOP clowns sucking down mixed drinks at the bar at Billygoat at lunchtime need to lower your voices. You never know who may be listening, maybe even an ODPO. Like I tell my kids, "shhhhh, inside voices", LOL!
P.S. I voted NO
P.S.S. Hey Dean, what do you do about guys coming back to work from lunch breaks "half in the bag"?
YES YES YES TO MY $11600 RETRO CHECK.Vote yes and the hell with arbitration.We always get screwed going to arbitration.
quit bumrapping the fire dept. they got what they wanted no reduction in people on trucks for safety.do we have mandatory two man squads no watch is safe with the amount of gangbanger with guns.too bad so sad if a couple of p.o. get hurt.the city will choose which doctors they see, now a fourth tier doctor and hospital. as far as anything else such as raises they were smart to get a me too clause.the only mistake they made they under estimated how easy the police could brought with for a few dollars of retro. I know the police will have a wild cat strike 30 days after the contact is passed and no one receives their retro. wait how long did they no nothing after nato great praises but no money days off canceled but no overtime paid.had to go to arbitin (may be not so bad) still no checks. there is no unity with the police and the city knows it
Flop u lost my vote when one of your listed "gains" was D2 pay for a helicopter pilot - 12000 cops and we care about one Cush job helicopter guy - ARE YOU FU$&ING KIDDING ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He should pay the dept for that job - now give me an event# squad so I can justify my existence!!!!! WTF
Sgt. Phil Collins #1111
24th District
3rd Watch
Well Phil, The FOP can hear you calling IN THE AIR TONIGHT. You maybe AGAINST ALL ODDS, but if you give them ONE MORE NIGHT,they may fix it for you because YOU CAN'T HURRY LOVE.
Bet you never heard that before.
In the contract book with ballot it shows 14 % raise not 11%
The arbitrator can not add things to the contract. Wellness can not and will not be added. Vote no. I sent mine in yesterday.
I was at Guide's and undoubtedly am a firm No vote.
Both Dean and the labor attorney were confronted on telling half truths.
An arbitrator is selected by BOTH parties from a pool. Each side eliminates one pick until the last man standing is the arbitrstor. Fair process.
The arbitrator will look at our last contract, other large city police Departments benefits, disputed positions by the parties, and make a ruling.
Here is why Rahm wants this shit contract to pass: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-chicago-police-new-contract-met-0905-20140905-story.html
Anonymous Anonymous said...
From a firefighters standpoint you guy's would be nuts to insert contract language about the replacement of your vehicles in this or any contract.
Furnishing you with the tools needed to do your job is not a BENEFIT to be negotiated!
That your negotiating team would even bring this to you is a disgrace and reeks of collusion.
You've been warned.
9/23/2014 04:26:00 AM
They forgot to include tires.
Has anyone contacted the fop about the MISPRINT about 14% not 11% printed in contract booklet? They (fop) should post on fop site the MISPRINT.
Regarding furlo by watch.....
If it goes to arbitration, I don't think the arbitrator really gives a fuck when someone with 25, 3, 18 years or whatever takes furlo.
Furlo, as it is set up now benefits those with more time on against those with less. In other words, it is fop member vs. fop member. Not fop vs. city.
I think the arbitrator is going to look at furlo by watch and realize that it's more practical. Therefore, if the contract is approved its in, and if it goes to arbitration, its coming in.
Arbitrator will fuck us as history shows.The union agreed to this contract and arbitration will not benefit us at this point.We will lose 4% raise from July 2012 through June 2013,that is a lot of money to give up on a pipe dream that the economy is good.The US (GDP) grew by only 1.9 percent in 2013 per Forbes.VOTE YES. Economy is only good for the top 1% not us.
Look at what the other unions got. You stand nothing to lose by arbitration because traditionally he doesn't deviate from the norm. There is nothing that the sgts lost in their last contract. Learn how arbitration works and how negotiations work. There is so much misinformation and stupid, uninformed statements on here its crazy.
Retired officers with family will pay $16,000 for health insurance after working over 30 years .
Why Re disability pensions , some with less than 10 years of service receive free health insurance , many are able to work other jobs . Let them pay same as a retired officer or work part time for police department to earn health insurance . This does not include police officers that are unable to drive ,walk or in need of constant care , pay them 100% pay . I am talking about the disabled that drive , walk , vacation like us that still work but have back,shoulder , leg pain if they stand or sit to long .
Hire investigators to follow them , many should be charged with theft . There was a copper that could hunt , run a business ,some worked for county , there are many that should be in prison .
SCC
When they bitch about the blog I don't think it's directed solely at you its at all the people who write in it as well
Just voted...hell NO !!
I was promoted to Sgt. a few short months ago. Granted, I am affected by this contract in a small part but I shouldn't have a say in its ratification or defeat. Why did I, as well as several dozen other recent promotees, receive ballots?
Sgt. Phil Collins #1111
24th District
3rd Watch
Love yer music !!
Why does my ballot have a hanging chad?
No, No, No. The city still would want to negotiate in order to resolve the issue. Rahm doesn't want this over his head during election.
The counter offer from the city will get better, not worse with time.
That's how negotiations work.
Stay strong, don't blink.
America
I honestly don't know what's worse, the letter not being sent or the language of the contract sent to us being ambiguous and incorrect. How can I vote for something that is not the actual contract? What is going on over on Washington? Do you guys have any regard at all for policemen? I'm totally disgusted with the FOP. 13% over the life of the contract seems better but it's not true!! Are any of you guys professional?
If a majority yes vote is achieved based on the erroneous information sent to the membership, where do we stand? Do we get what we were formally informed of or do we get what was informally mentioned?
Voting no sends to arbitration. If anyone thinks the arbitrator gonna rule in our favor you're nuts.
Anonymous said...
Anonymous said...
The tier hospitals. The out of pocket is getting lowered. The bills will be the lower negotiated rates that the city used to get refunds on. At the end it's probably a wash.
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Its only lower if you go to a tier 1 facility. Another major factor to consider is that there is no list of hospitals available and there is no wording in the proposed contract that prevents them from further limiting the tier 1 hospitals later on down the line.
So if this passes, expect them to raise the maximum for everyone in the following contract and your small savings for using a tier 1 hospital is now gone and anyone not using one is now paying a lot more.
Also expect them to start dropping hospitals that don't "play ball" with minimizing tests and procedures from a tier 1 status. Perhaps a little extreme, but there is nothing in this contract that prevents them from even eliminating all hospitals except cook county.
Think on that.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
So since the vote is going out has anybody seen a list of the tier 1 - 3 hospitals or should I vote and just hope for the best from the city?
9/23/2014 01:36:00 AM
Yes. It's like when Pelosi said 'we have to vote it in, then we can read it' on the universal healthcare law.
Think about this...if we agree on this contract to allow them to make new hires wait a few years for duty availability checks, what will happen on the next contract? This is what will happen...the city or an arbitrator will say, well the new hires did without it so why does any current member need it, lets stop it for everyone. Think about it. If you open that door, only bad things will happen. There is a reason for the city to be asking for this. They know they can't get it all at once so they take baby steps and chip away at it, until over a period of several contracts they completely eliminate it. The city thinks ten steps ahead. We must do the same. I am voting NO!
Looks like this little turd of a mayor is pandering to Preckwinle to get her endorsement. He's proposing misdemeanor charges for all controlled substances under a gram. I hope his kids don't get addicted to drugs.
Why a two tier hospital system? I'm voting No
to all the coppers bidding to 005 for the 10 hour day, I would check with FOP, this is just a rumor which they claim they no nothing about!
After the FOP town hall I went home, got in the shower, and scrubbed. I felt very dirty and violated, like being touched in a private area by a trusted friend. Definitely a No vote from me. I want my innocence back.
This retro check they are dangling out there will be taxed at 41%. Federal government is 33% and another 8% between city and state. Think about it. Is it worth it now? Vote NO.
As I am retired now, I don't know what percentage you would have to pay for Tier 2 hospitals, but Rush is the best for orthopedics. Dr.Richard Berger has done many successful knee and hip replacements for members. Now it will cost you more. I would strongly advise all to think of their future concerning this reduction in benefits. The push to get this done concerns me tremendously!
The arbitrator cannot include anything that is not in dispute. He cannot put us in a wellness program because it is nowhere in the proposed contract. He cannot add it to the discussion simply because it is in someone else's contract. He can agree with us to give us retro. It doesn't automatically disappear because we go to arbitration. It becomes an issue to be decided by him which we could make a good argument for seeing how one guy who was removed caused this discussion.
24 year beat slug says... SOMETHING DON'T SMELL RIGHT.
The sergeants didn't lose out on tuition reimbursement in their contract. Why? Because they are a smaller group and can stay united. Let's go to arbitration, keep everything the same, and take our 11% raise. We will not get any less.
I DON'T even know where Denmark is and this doesn't smell right.
Anyone who calls their DAD "pops" is a jerkoff in my book.
I sent an email to FOP inquiring about this Tier 1 and 2 list for hospitals. FOP sent me a response and said a list was posted on their website. I checked the site and it appears that the site has crashed!!!!!!!!!
It would appear to me that the list is a virus!! LOL
Can anyone list WHY this contact is bad? Other than "reasonable suspicion"....
Voted today sent it in voted yes because do you think rahm won't tell the arbitrator what to do? Fair and impartial you believe that? Many coppers are commenting we will get more money because economy is much better! Ahh better for who? Yes stock market is doing good but how many people do you know in the last few years that have gotten decent jobs? Not hours cut back? Not laid off? How many? Crickets of course!
You want to gamble with rahm and his crew? Go ahead, but don't be crying later! Educated coppers?
Anonymous Anonymous said...
Good to see we have some coppers thinking for themselves and not toeing the company line from the union. My issues with this contract are the following;
1) Wiping out of Duty Availability Pay for PO's through first 42 months. Here are the numbers people need to know because it seems all too easy to dismiss this as just a few dollars. It is not. The City is trying to find another way to lessen their current contractual contributions to OUR Pension Fund! Think long and hard about this folks....and peoples!
Duty Pay is paid 4 times per year at the current rate of of $805.00 USC per payment to every PO. That is a total of $3220.00 USC per year. Since Duty Pay is "pensionable" that means that 9% of the PO's Duty Pay ($3220.00) goes into the Pension Fund yearly. That figure is $289.80, which is deposited into the Pension Fund. The City of Chicago contributes at a ratio of 2:1 to the Pension Fund, therefore the city has to contribute $289.80 X 2. This amount is $579.60 per year from the City to the Pension Fund.
The total amount per year deposited into the Pension Fund from the PO and the City is $289.8 + $579.60, for a total of $869.40. Using these figures, the total amount for 42 months that is currently going into the Pension Fund is $3042.90 per PO/City contribution.
Let's use as an example 100 new hires in the future that won't get Duty Pay for 42 months, and thus not pay into the Pension Fund, and neither will the city. 100 new hires X $3042.90 equals $304,290.00.
500 new hires and this figure jumps to $1.521 millions dollars not going into the Pension Fund.
1000 new hires equals $3.042 million dollars.
Now what is important to note is that more new hires are going to be coming on in the future, since the largest demographic on the job is around 45 years of age. So within 5-10 years a lot of PO's are going to leave. Do we really want to be ratifying a contract proposal that severely defunds our pension? No for me!
2) The FOP was able to show the city that it was cheaper to pay for a PO's health care premiums at age 55 and allow a PO to retire at 55 with 20 years of service than it was to pay an active PO's benefits, (salary, healthcare, pension). The city is actually saving money when a PO retires at 55. If the contract passes as proposed the city will still reap those savings, but we are going to pay 2% MORE to the city for the privilege of saving the city money? That is insane. Why in the world would the union agree to this? I don't care what the assholes from the CFD agreed to. They only look out for their best interest without regard to how they affected other unions. Fuck the flame chasers! Our union should take our agreement with the city for 55 and out with paid healthcare premiums to the arbitrator and show him/her the amount of money the city is already saving rather than roll over cause the red truck crew sold themselves and every other union in the city out.
There are parts of the contract that I can live with, but not the above 2 issues. That is why I will be voting NO. I urge you to think about the ramifications of this proposal and ultimately, as a wise partner once said, "do what your heart can stand."
9/23/2014 02:12:00 AM
PPOs as it is now do not get duty for the first 12 months. So you need to find out the total amount of 30 months, not 42 months.
Remember youngs guys on the job,I can remember being reminded by older gents on the job,to be careful what the city opens the doors to,like health care,and such if it starts with a couple dollars and ends up a couple hundred,but letting the door open was our fault for agreeing and the 2017 retirees and after will open that door,believe it or not you all will retire,be fired or quit,your future is in your hands! Never allow any thing to be taken away that was fought for,for a few gold coins!
So happy retiring next year, wish FOP would put a count on the website for the fantastic 55 and out program. As far as contract voted yes, to the complainers about the 2% you will have to pay next time! that would be a new contract this could be renegotiated to free again! remember the city does not have to provide health insurance at all, to think this is not a huge win for us via fop your either delusional or just plain stupid. The contract is not the best, but it's the best we can get, rahm owns the arbitrator same as Daley did, we did worse in arbitration against the city during daleys tenure, you really think we will get better?
All the "smart people" or you think your education made your more intelligent, look at the other city contracts look what they received, now tell me and everyone we will do better! Not a fan of the dean crew at all, and never will vote for rahm, coppers are still busting their ass on the street in the ghettos why? Do what's required no more, why risk losing your pension,freedom,family, by getting jammed up? Show the city how you feel, do the job take no risks!
Voted "No". This is not a good agreement for the future of this department or new police officers.
After 20 some years on this job I hate to say it, but I don't trust our FOP. To many back door deals and the way they are rushing this through trying to persuade us to vote yes just prove's that. I'm don't want more from an arbitrator. I don't even care about retro. I want something that is fair for all of the department. No just certain people. This tentative agreement is bs and I hope everyone opens their eyes.
ot: Mr. 10g is out 10g!! I said it before I will ride with 10g on all his bets except against the bears. He is a Bears hater and bets against them no matter what.
Who cares!!!
First time commenter: this is a great, informative site. Live in Oak Lawn, wish we had a similar blog dedicated to our PD (and FD), who seem to have been getting screwed by the Village Board for several years now.
The Chicago Public School teachers’ contract has local taxpayers covering 7 percent of a 9 percent total employee contribution, according to the Civic Federation.
AND THEN WE WONDER WHY THE PUBLIC HATES PUBLIC SECTOR EMPLOYEES INCLUDING TEACHERS, THEY DONT EVEN PAY THEIR OWN 9%.....
Do not trust this contract the mayor breaks them all the time and uses the defense of we are broke.
The most scariest thing is the tier hospitals. Wake up boys and girls this is one step closer to OBAMA CARE. When you get hurt on the job superman and woman do you really want o be stuck with Cook County?
To many cracks in this contract can lead to us getting screwed even more. Once something is on the table you can not get it back.
Vote no Retro is not worth our health.
The meeting at Guide's was evident that basically our union is out of tune with its membership.
The FOP addressed the Seniority furlo picks concession like it was just a small issue. They were apologetic but clueless.
Then FOP was caught playing word games and fudging the numbers.
They tried to sell us that since the Sgts and Captains had agreed to garbage we should too.
They makw 20k to 50k more than us to start. They ger.75 ot per day. They sell back 200 hours. It goes on and on.
Why have a union or bargaining unit if we are going to be told leftovers are all you are getting..Vote no.
Let's not forget boys and girls, if this does go to arbitration it is the FOP that will have to argue our case to the arbitrator. If they get slammed with a no vote after all of their rhetoric about what we could lose by not ratifying this contract, what is their incentive to fight hard at arbitration. I'm not saying that the FOP would do that, but who is to say who would make the most persuasive argument to the arbitrator
I voted Yes.
As for the ballots in the mail prior to the last meeting, I received my ballot 22 Sep. That gives me, 24 Days to get it in the mail and post marked. Not a big deal.
As for voting No to show rahm, rahm could give a fuck if we accept it or not. He can make political hay of either decision. No and its look at those greedy cops. Yes and we worked together.
An aribitrator isn't going to give us retro or a raise for the 2012-2012 time frame. He will put us in the wellnes plan with all other city employees. Things he may remove, 400 new cars, furlough by watch, and earlier vacation maturation.
The next contract should be planed for as soon as this one is settled. Get the ducks in a row. Stop crying over who is or isn't FOP president, work with what we have.
Get involved, educate yourselves.
The writing is on the wall, the pols are working hard to make government employees, other than those elected, the common enemy. If you are young enough get out, find a job with the G.
Stay safe!!
I voted no . . . we are just losing too much. I cannot accept it without putting up a fight. Maybe the old saying "You can't fight city hall" fits in this instance but for my self- respect, I have to vote no. I can live with it if the raises are a little less and retro is lost for the first year.
Voted No I'll take my chances. Don't be blinded by the retro check. What are you a hype waiting for your SSI check
Just the fact 9.5 gave us backpay for 2012 tells me something stinks here. This shady little wesel does nothing out of the goodness of his heart. Something doesn't pass the smell test.
Read the contract and make your own judgement.
What are you gaining and what are you losing? What is best for you and your family?
If you go to an arbitrator what can you gain or lose :
The contract will only be 4 years. (probably 9% raise for that time)
The arbitrator can decide that you get 0% for 2012 and 2013 in order to avoid the letter debacle.
You will be going into the Wellness Program.
The 55 is done and it will be the 2% for Health Care (probably 5% at the next contract)
Furlo bids will remain the same
New guys will get duty availability
Medical will still change
Make sure you VOTE
This is what happens when we elect firearms instructors to negotiate a fucking labor contract! Policemen are their own worst enemy.
Voted no....you would be wise to do the same!
VOTE NO!
By FOP's own attorney's admission last night.if it goes to Arbitration, He cannot guarantee but believes from his experience that we will get everything we want (furlough stays same as is now, recruits won't get fucked, medical stays the same we won't go to tier medical, the 55 - 60 old retirees won't have to pay for medical) but we will loose our retro for the first year "and you never get that back". However we will still more than likely get the 11% in the end, only it will be front loaded and not back loaded. We will get stuck with the wellness program, which means that you and your spouse have to log onto a computer once a week otherwise you get fine $50-$100 per month for not logging on and looking at food and exercise recommendations.
However he earlier stated it's inevitable that we will eventually have to go to the wellness program down the line.
Voted no. Walked to the post office and made sure that it was mailed. This whole process is suspicious.
My partner received the ballot package today. The was NO info on the fucking hospitals! !!
WHY???
VOTE THIS SHIT DOWN!!!!!!!!!!!
Voting yes for this contract is a HUGE mistake. Think people don't be blinded by a few dollars(retro check) now that's going to cost you thousands and thousands in the long run
Scc I hope you don't mean Tom "the shitter" Mcdonagh when you say the best candidate. He's a fucking lazy drunk sob on his best day. Has never done a lick of work anywhere. As for Bill, he made two mistakes. One, attacking you out of the gate. Foolish and unwise to take shots at a ghost. Second, he couldn't let go of Geiger, which is worse than number one. With that being said, Bill never wanted the spotlight, but he was clearly the best choice out of a fucked bunch. The contract definitely would have looked better at this point.
Like Obama's so-called emergency powers used to declare war on Syria without congress or the peoples approval Rahm will declare whatever is signed as null and void should the courts rule that the pensions must be funded. PERIOD.
These never ending fear mongering tactics are being used to create a dictatorship.
Fear is a powerful motivator!
We're at war. so the US constitution is void. Laws don't apply it's an emergency. See how it works? What makes anyone think the same b.s. won't be used as the city files for bankruptcy like Detroit?
Average retail food and energy prices.
http://www.bls.gov/ro3/apmw.htm
Read 'em and weep. Beef, pork, dairy, fruit. rising by double digits...25%, 30% in some cases and CLIMBING!
Monthly YoY Illinois tax revenue.
There isn't any revenue increases showing up in the states monthly income tax reports for all these glorious jobs the politicians have told us they created.
http://tax.illinois.gov/aboutidor/taxresearch/monthlyrevenuereports.htm
The scam is gonna end badly.
Has anyone thought about demanding direct control over their pension accounts before that money is put up for loans and confiscated under some b.s. interpretation of "the laws" and contracts?
Approving a contract with a cost of living based upon what the BLS told you was cost of living over the LAST FIVE YEARS IS WAY DIFFERENT THEN WHAT THE NEXT FIVE YEARS IS GONNA BE.
We can see it already.
flop does not have our back
where is the demand for all two man cars , where is demand for increased seniority rights
if you plan on making a career as a police officer , vote NO or you will be working a beat car for 30 years with no chance to bid for a specialized unit or inside assignment
there are over a thousand inside assignment but you will never be selected by seniority
vote no
Guys don't vote based on emotion which I understand. Vote based on whether you think we could do better in arbitration. Nothing will change giving this to some "city friendly" arbitrator. Look at history. We will, however, lose $$$$ and a lot of time with our money. The contract overall isn't that bad. I voted YES.
I forget? Is this the 4'th or 5'th contract Ive voted for that will pass and then after nobody will admit to voting for?
What is all this talk about how this union is rushing the contract. Has it not been expired 2 and 1/2 years already ?? The question should be why did the last union NOT do any thing on the contract. Why do we always have to wait 2 to 3 years after the contract ends to begin negotiations. Can any one tell me what the offer was from the city before Dean took over ??
Voted YES! Better than what we will get in BINDING arbitration. Been through the arbitration process several times (28 yrs) and I don't like it.
If it goes to arbitration I predict there will be silence (crickets- chirp chirp chirp) following the release of the award when everyone realizes just what we gave up.
Vote Yes
An arbitrator already ruled that we didnt have to join Wellness if we didnt want to. So, if this goes to Arbitation, (and i hope it does), then that arb decision better be made part of the fop arguement.
Secondly, I recall posting something a few weeks back when my friend who is not a cop was told by Dean Jr that the contract agreement wassigned off by dad on a Sunday night. -question: why is he telling non-police?!? WTF, non police found out before us?!?
Lastly SCC, I admit I have done my share of "blog bashing", but after your explaination you have just included in the thread, you are doin a heck of a job! I would imagine the time and attention it takes to keep it going and to keep it updated.
Keep up the good work!
Sgt because of this contract delay since 01 July 13 was when retroactive pay begins you may have had a right to vote under that time period tho promotion may take that priveledge away!
I was promoted to Sgt. a few short months ago. Granted, I am affected by this contract in a small part but I shouldn't have a say in its ratification or defeat. Why did I, as well as several dozen other recent promotees, receive ballots?
Sgt. Phil Collins #1111
24th District
3rd Watch
9/23/2014 01:29:00 AM
They better make right...tonight tonight tonight...ohhhhhhohhhhhh!
People do realize that we will be in the wellness program in the next contract, right? Considering we are the only city Union to not be in it. So unless you're retiring around the time the next contract is ratified, all we are doing is delaying the inevitable. Just saying....
Had this contract had concrete language and not double speak which can and will be debated by city lawyers to mean something different in their favor, I would of voted yes. it sounds good but look closely at the clever words they substituted. i had my muffler replaced and their service agreement had clearer meaning, language and guarantees and rights!.
No No No No No
Seems like everyone in 003 is voting yes! And what's the deal with that video that everyone in 003 has been talking about?
That's what we get for electing one old/out of touch guy and a bunch of amateurs. There is rush to pat themselves on the back without doing the work. Makes even the biggest hater long for the old days.
The bribery on the city's behalf to muscle us into ratifying this shitty contract has started in earnest. 011 got 2 new cars today. Any other districts get a call to go pick up new cars? Can anyone who went to physically get these cars chime in and let us all know if these were brand spanking new cars or have the been the ones sitting in the MM lot for months that we shoulda got a longtime ago? They are WAAYYYYYYYYYY too hard trying to get us locked in. VOTE NO. NO-FUCKING-WAY.
Judging by some of the morons comments on here I have an idea. How about you only get duty availability if you have more than 20 years on. Oh wait not such a good idea now huh hair gellers.
Shocker! The guys who brought back Herbert and kept Kathy are trying to screw us over?? No! No one could have seen that coming. Jeez!
Anyone that votes yes without knowing what hospital falls into what tier is a FOOL.
WHERE IS THAT HOSPITAL LIST?
FOP WHERE IS IT?
VOTE THIS SHIT DOWN!!
95% of the printed materials handed out at the meeting last night, in the attorneys opinion, will be included in an arbitrators decision. We lose the retro but should gain back the duty availability, maybe 0% for 55 and out and no furlough by watch. If you vote yes you get the retro but lose this and many other provisions in this contract. A lot of things are unknown in this contract. Think ahead to when this contract expires and beyond....not about the lousy few grand you will get now. I'm a no vote.
Sgt because of this contract delay since 01 July 13 was when retroactive pay begins you may have had a right to vote under that time period tho promotion may take that priveledge away!
From what I tell by the link below we are getting screwed with the insurance. Vote NO!! You may lose your doctor. Having kids I'm very concerned about the insurance.
http://www.ilhealthagents.com/bluecross-blueshield-illinois/ppo-networks.html
"No, because Medical Tiers 1/2, Pension clause in contract, tuition reimbursement, photo dissemination, cars, comp time, 2% tax on retirees annuity at 55...and on and on..
The shit is endless. Fuck that retro. Dean sold us out for peanuts. Vote Hell NO.
9/23/2014 12:41:00 AM
Can you string together a cohesive thought?
Your statement makes little sense and isn't accurate."
Let me break it down to your level.
He's VOTING NO because we are getting screwed on all of the above.
Arbitration is not going to help us. We will lose more than we gain. I voted yes
Vote no
Ballerina signed executive order to raise minimum wage to $13.00 an hour
First responders onlyworth $3.50 an hour over five years
Let him explain that to an arbitrator
Let him e plain why one man car is safe in the city and it takes threeu ion workers to change light bulbs
One man garbage crew for city recycled collection and three men for regular garbage
Let him explain why police are not worth more
Vote No , this union is a sellout in my opinion .
TO 09/23/14 0812AM i voted yes for contract and i also work vri (no clout) contract not the best but not the worse, hate working here may suggest latering to either maywood ILL., gary,in or detroit,mi. also you are right rahm will b e taking durbins seat, patrick daley thompson is your next mayor, if you live in either the 11th or 19th ward everyday will be just like christmaS
Why would the city or citizens of this city offer you more when you settle for so little?
A vote of "Yes" will just confirm to them that you are ok with getting a 2 percent raise and having your benefits reduced!
Even if we lose in arbitration we have to stand together and vote "No" or else all future contracts will only get worse.
Dean Angelo really fucked us good behind secret doors, but ill still vote yes, we will lose more in arbitration. Thanks Dean, you prick...
This contract sounds like some NFL type shit. Young PO's get screwed on duty availability. Sounds like pension contributions will be going up. Medical co-pays will go up for those who will be around after a couple of years. This contract proposal favors the retirees and near retired.
1. Offer the police a shitty contract with sub par raise.
2. Help my buddy Rauner get elected so he/we can changes the pension law giving the city another 30 years to pay the monies that are due. While raising contributions.
3. Win the reelection!
4. Rinse and repeat!
Rahms planner!
I can't believe that anyone would leave any money on the table, knowing that around the country there are departments that haven't gotten a raise and their medical has gone up. I've been on for 25yrs and have been through numerous contracts, and every time it goes to an arbitrator we get screwed. So today I voted yes! I encourage everyone that has a sense of understanding whats at stake to vote yes. As far as all the haters its TRULLY gotten old.
If I vote yes I get a brain,but vote no and use my brain thinking ahead,at what is being offered,but since I can't use a crystal ball and see the future,I'll vote yes,in fear of what we might end up with,I'm tired now,I'm taking a nap,but I'm leaning towards a no!
I was leaning towards voting NO until..... I received an email from the FOP having to explain how to fill out the YES or NO box, YES if you like the contract and NO if you don't like it, if there are that many idiots sending emails to the fop asking how to fill out the ballot, then there is just as many idiots on this job trying to preach there thoughts on this contract. Voted YES
Voted yes. Throwing a vote away if you're voting no. But that's just me.
If we vote "yes" and Rahm gives us what is rightfully ours he will say he's a good guy and went out of his way to take care of the Police! With Dean right next to him. He will be touting himself as a hero!
Go ahead guys and vote "Yes" and make Rahm a hero so he can stay Mayor!
I just voted no. We are giving up too many things to get such a pity raise.This is the fifth contract in my career here with CPD and with what we are giving up it is more than ever before. I voted no!
Rahm wins either way. If you vote "Yes" you're screwed. If you vote "No", the arbitrator will screw you. This is what years of corruption have brought us to.
Anonymous said...
This contract proposal and the ongoing shimmying, gyrating and non-straight answer giving by fop and the city smells as bad as a stinker in a court-yard building.
Everybody recognizes the smell for what it is. You can hear the hum of the blow flies at ground level...
"Why y'all take so long? It's been stankin' up in heah for weeks now..."
Arbitration = A viewing of the true bill of what fop and the city proposed.
The next gambit will likely be fop turning on the membership itself and accepting this stinker contrary to the probable wishes of the membership because "You Coppers are too dumb to see what a great job we did for ya."
As many have pointed out... This thing is DOA because of the finely minced, city hall sourced, municipal corporate lawyer derived word salad it is...
Three things a good Chicago Copper recognizes:
1. Bullshit
2. Danger
3. Treachery
It's an insult that this contract proposal is as full of these as it is and the bargaining unit saw fit to present it.
It seems Dr. Angelo either oversold himself to Rahm or underestimated the membership...
Hence the rush to get it done...
The longer it lingers for the churls to examine it, the worse it stinks.
9/23/2014 09:43:00 AM
Agreed. What's the rush?
Why not do what all the politicians do-delay it until after the election.
I sure hope there is a bonafide legit auditor to count ballots because the way this is going down Dean already made up his mind what he wants. The problem is that its not what he should want, its what WE want. He clearly expressed his slanted opinion from Day 1 and something is little odd here. This is not Washington where we have to rush and sign a bill without reading it. I hope this voting process is honest, because if we can't even trust our highly paid union team, who can we even trust anymore? Just like M.S., its seems like we are going down the same path of incompetence. Or a back room deal where we were never invited.
Anonymous said...
Well for all you people that think you will do better are smoking dope. The writing was set when the arbitrator ruled on the Sgt. Deal.
Keep in mind the Illinois state troopers arbitration came back in early August and the Illinois Secretary of State Police, and the arbitrators did with them that happened to the Sgt. Union SCREWED THEM. SOS Police got raises of 1.5 & 1.75. And troopers got 2%. Anyone that thinks we will get more is delusional, don't keep harping on what Benn said, you think the city would actually pick Benn or allow him to be picked.
This is the first time in at least 2 contracts that the employee contribution didn't go up in negotiations, you will lose this with arbitration.
Arbitrator will put you in the wellness plan.
Be smart people educate yourself and look at what you have to lose and look at what the Tempo was set with the sgt. Union.
9/23/2014 12:19:00 AM
You don't know that.
Hey, remember when Rahm was "considering" lifting the Residency requirement? I have seen houses in Park Ridge going for less than houses on the Northwest Side, and the Public Schools for Park Ridge are the equivalent of those Catholic Schools that cost coppers $10 to $12 thousand a year for their kids. Anyone voting yes needs to go beyond the basic issue of the lousy % offered. Take a look at your water bill, mine comes out to more than $800 a year for a single family home, not a commercial car wash. The hidden costs of living in Chicago will consume the raise offered. Guys like Rahm want to make Chicago a City of Haves and Have Nots, and coppers will be in the Have Nots class.
I'm retired and did so mid 2013 and am due half the retro,but I obviously don't care about the money but rather the future of what officers are and would be entitled to,I say vote no for that unselfish reason,yet risk it all in arbitration,how can you get two officers to agree on which way to vote,depending on whether or not you're at the beginning or end of your career?
Young officer not getting paid enough looks at retro check like Blago" this is effing Golden"! Old officer is like this is some of the same BS we've seen in the past,nice retro,giving up some things that were hard fought for in past negotiations of our contracts,young bull says let run down there and pick up all those retro checks,Old bull says lets stroll on down there and pick up cash and the retro and those cows!
Puro Pendejos! Vote No!
Porque:
Da Mayor wants to LEGALIZE marijuana-State Wide; wants to make it a misdemeanor for 1 gram or less of a controlled substance State Wide; past contracts TOLLWAY, LAZ PARKING; UBER; LYFT; CHARTER SCHOOL NETWORK-UNO; Bike Lanes; are just some of the contracts reduce benefits for the residents and rigged for the private interests in the City of Chicago.
Now to reduce our benefits in our contract is the direction to weaken another UNION, and reduce the MIDDLE CLASS population in the City of Chicago! From World Class city to just one Class of residents has in the Health Care Tier System!
PENDEJOS! VOTE NO!
I am NOT happy with this crap contract, I think it sucks. That being said, it worries me greatly thinking about our economic future. When I went to the meeting at Biagio's to "get informed", Dean, during the course of his sales pitch, uttered the ominous words, "A storm is coming." Not to be pessimistic, but everything points to that statement being true. I really want to vote NO, but am extremely concerned that we will get shafted bigtime by arbitration. WE ARE IN A VERY VULNERABLE AND WEAK POSITION, therefore, we do not have an upper hand and could have our asses handed to us with NO RECOURSE! Are you gamblers? Are you ready for an adverse ruling?
Voting NO. 2% is BS. Next time it will be 4% then 6% and so on. Also the City providing us with 400 cars... Gee thanks....the fleet blows..Bunch of shit boxes. Are they not required to supply us with safe reliable vehicles anyways?
Screw RAHM and currently working with FIORETTI for Mayor campaign. This contract sucks big time and you can kiss my ass if you think my family deserves to go to a third class hospital. I strap on a gun belt and a bullet proof vest to patrol the shitty west side of Chicago Mr Mayor. You can insult me but don't ever short my family you prick.
INSIDE VOICES, FLOP said...
They're in scramble mode at the FLOP hall.^ They're in the process of throwing together a list of hospitals that they BELIEVE will be participating in Tiers 1 & 2 when it takes effect in 2017. They didn't think many of us would notice this major blunder and now they're thinking of a way to soft sell it.
*** THE MAIN ISSUE IS THAT THESE HOSPITALS WON'T COMMIT TO PARTICIPATING IN OUR INSURANCE PROGRAM BECAUSE THE CITY IS ALWAYS LATE WITH PAYING THEIR PORTION OF THE BILLS.***
This poster is 100% dead on. I just checked FLOPS website and indeed they put up the list is hospitals late this afternoon . But how complete is it? HOW ARE WE SUPPOSED TO VOTE ON THIS HOSPITAL SHIT IF THE LIST WONT BE THE SAME COME JAN 2017
THEY WANT US TO VOTE YES ON THE UNKNOWN!?!?!?! FUCK THAT NOISE
Vote NO. HELL FUCKING NO!
Since this is a secret ballot, I'm not sharing my vote with anyone. I will give you a hint. It wasn't yes. Figure it out crime stoppers.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
Looks like this little turd of a mayor is pandering to Preckwinle to get her endorsement. He's proposing misdemeanor charges for all controlled substances under a gram. I hope his kids don't get addicted to drugs.
9/23/2014 11:17:00 AM
He's gravely miscalculating, then. The woman - quite visibly - detests him; it's evident every time his name is mentioned in her presence. She can't hide her inadvertent facial expression (she stiffens and sort of grimaces every single time). No endorsement for Rahm from Toni.
WEEE!!! Just voted NO...Suck it!!!
I must say I'm impressed with most of the responses so far. No matter how you're voting many of you helped me with my decision because you gave thoughtful insight to your vote and posted it here. So here it goes, I just flipped a coin. HEADS...NO.
A no vote is sending a message that we are not sheep. Baaaah Baaah....oops
OT --
Ch. 7 reporting now that the "Khorasan" Al-Quaida offshoot group we blew off the map last night had already tried to blow up cargo planes over Chicago, using bombs hidden in toner cartridges for laser printers. They ran photos of the devices. British intelligence intercepted the bombs at some intermediate point.
We'll be back, you f__ers...the ordies are already rearming those awful planes...
The FOP better make sure all those ballots are valid!
recent retirees and recent promoted sergeant have received ballots.
So that law firm they hire to count better start earning that great cash they make counting a ballot with a yes or no.
And if they find out any non voting members mail a vote they should be banned from any FOP related events etc...
Just got the ballot and just VOTED NO to this shit of a proposal.
Why?
11% over FIVE YEARS!! WHAT the FUCK!
If crime is down 10,000 fucking %% PERCENT, per rahm and mcDrunk,
Then WE made it happen and I want a BETTER raise. PERIOD!
You guys are suckers. Rahm WANTS u to vote no. He save retro money AND he gets 2 Tiers, wellness, 2%, all that soda pop. House wins, always.
VOTE NO!By FOP's own attorney's admission last night.if it goes to Arbitration, He cannot guarantee but believes from his experience that we will get everything we want (furlough stays same as is now, recruits won't get fucked, medical stays the same we won't go to tier medical, the 55 - 60 old retirees won't have to pay for medical) but we will loose our retro for the first year "and you never get that back". However we will still more than likely get the 11% in the end, only it will be front loaded and not back loaded. We will get stuck with the wellness program, which means that you and your spouse have to log onto a computer once a week otherwise you get fine $50-$100 per month for not logging on and looking at food and exercise recommendations.However he earlier stated it's inevitable that we will eventually have to go to the wellness program down the line.
This is a lie. I attended a meeting and the fop attorney never said such a thing. You're trying to start shit and spread lies.
Billy D., I heard Eddie McElroy is now
Giving his Blackhawks tickets to the Angelo clan. I'm hearing Dean Jr., is driving a nice new Cadillac, forget about it!
For what it's worth, I voted no! As far as 10g, he's a chump. Guys, I'm getting absolute blow out winners ever week with Sports consultant Stevie Stevens out of Vegas!
Anonymous said...
Regarding furlo by watch.....
If it goes to arbitration, I don't think the arbitrator really gives a fuck when someone with 25, 3, 18 years or whatever takes furlo.
Furlo, as it is set up now benefits those with more time on against those with less. In other words, it is fop member vs. fop member. Not fop vs. city.
I think the arbitrator is going to look at furlo by watch and realize that it's more practical. Therefore, if the contract is approved its in, and if it goes to arbitration, its coming in.
9/23/2014 10:25:00 AM
Agree 100%. The arbitrator will cite "manpower operational needs" because it's "reasonable" and not an unrealistic request by the city. Im not a big fan of it, but the reality is it will happen anyway.
Hey SCC,
At the general meeting Dean was asked if the Unit Rep's had voted on the agreement. He said he didn't know. Several Unit Rep's in attendance shouted out that they hadn't. I have now learned from talking to several reps that no vote was taken. Per our By-Laws(Article 5 Section 3 -page 8)the Unit Rep's are to vote on this before the Board of Director's does. That didn't happen. Also there was no quorum at the Board meeting when the directors voted on this. How could this go out for a vote?
9/23/2014 07:08:00 AM
Wow thanks for posting this. It's critical info. The vote they are asking for is inappropriately timed. They do not know their job.
#########
For all you slow people try reading some of the highlights from the sgt. Arbitration......first sentence
Tells you they got fucked on wages......don't be so blind people it's a fair contract is it the best no but it's fair far better than what an arbitrator is going to award.
The award did not grant us the 11% wage increase that we argued for. In effect, we were awarded an 8% raise over the life of the contract as follows;
July 1, 2012 2%
January 1, 2013 2%
January 1, 2014 2%
January 1, 2015 1%
January 1, 2016* 1%
*only for the first six months of 2016 - contract expires June 30, 2016
There is a provision for re-opening the contract for wages, if the state legislature enacts increases to our current pension contributions. Additionally, the "me-too" clause with Fire Local 2 Lieutenants and the Fraternal Order of Police Lodge 7 remains intact. If either of these unions is able to gain higher wage increases, we'll get them as well. This means that upon ratification of the contract we will realize an immediate 4% raise in wages; 2% retroactive for the period beginning July 1, 2012, and an additional 2% retroactive for the period beginning January 1, 2013. An additional 2% raise will be realized in a few months on January 1, 2014. The 2015 wage increase awarded is disappointing, but could be affected by the "me-too" or the wage reopener.
The award holds the line on free healthcare for those that retire after reaching the age of 55 for 2013 only, and extends the deadline for submitting a PAR form until October 21, 2013 to enable you to retire in November or December of this year. In 2014 and subsequent years, sergeants that wish to retire upon reaching age 55 will contribute 2% of their annuity towards the healthcare benefit. Also, those sergeants that wish to take advantage of this benefit in 2014 and beyond will be able to retire anytime after May 1 of that year with thirty days notice. Those sergeants that retire after reaching the age of 60 will continue to benefit from the free healthcare as they do currently. In short, sergeants age 55 or above that planned on retiring this year with the free health care will be able to do so. Moving forward, retiring between age 55 and 59 will require a contribution of 2% of your annuity, or about $125 per month for a sergeant that is maxed out. Current retirees remain unaffected and will not be required to make a contribution for their health care benefit. The city fought very hard to force current retirees to contribute as well, and wanted these contributions to increase up to 4%. The arbitrator rejected those proposals.
We had a couple of FOP boys in 017 on days today trying to sell the contract. THEY were not even convinced on what they were preaching! They even related that if we went to arbitration, that we could even get what Boston got! (25.4% over 6 years). Thats a stretch but whats funny there seems to be some of the FOP officers not happy with this garbage of a contract themselves and could not provide answers to most of the questions raised. Especially over the two tier hospital system. VOTE NO!!
This contract is an insult to all of us and the worst proposal in my 27 years. Within five minutes after I received the ballot, it was on its way back with a no vote. I can't believe we're being asked to send future P. O.'s down the river by not paying them thier well deserved duty availability right from the start
P. O. C. Mota 001
I voted Yes even though I didn't feel comfortable with the contract and the reason is my frustration with the lack of unity. The city has shit on us for over 20 yrs but with the advent of VRI it's even worse, people sell their souls for the VRI #'s and in turn usually fuck over the few people who don't hate us. The city then isn't forced to adequately staff it's manpower and further erode people paying into pension. By rights the Union should be calling for Zero Revenue to be raised and use "Work To Rule" to force hiring. I am done in a couple years and finally said screw it. You new guys better start becoming more radical and paying attention to the benefits our old timers fought for.
Everyone is aware that the 55 medical benefit will be gone in the next contract. Right?
You guys are suckers. Rahm WANTS u to vote no. He save retro money AND he gets 2 Tiers, wellness, 2%, all that soda pop. House wins, always.
9/23/2014 06:25:00 PM
I tried telling them that. At least one person gets it. I didn't want to flood SCC with it. He gave them just enough to piss them off for a NO vote. You guys are going to be in big trouble if this doesn't pass...
Cooter says to vote no and that's good enough for me.
A true gauge of how everyone is voting is to monitor the votes coming in early. Those are usually no votes from the voice of dissenters. Two duffle bags delivered already.
Post a Comment
<< Home