Dealbreaker?
Someone want to address this?
- For officers getting ready to vote on the new contract, please be aware of the 2-tier provision RE hospitals. Certain hospitals are listed as tier 1 hospitals. Costs for treatment at these hospitals will be paid at 90/10%. Hospitals NOT on the list will be considered tier 2 hospitals. Costs for treatment at these hospitals will be paid at 75/25%. I am told there are NO Advocate hospitals on the tier 1 list. That means Christ, Illinois Masonic, Lutheran General and Trinity (among others) will cost you 25% of the bill instead of 10%. This means that any hospital services incurred while traveling will cost you 25% of the bill instead of 10%. I am not asking anyone to vote 'yes' or 'no' on the contract. I just want everyone to be aware of one of the lesser talked about provisions of the new contract.
We don't know about anyone else, but this is going to end up having an impact on more than a few health care decisions we make in the future - St. Roger isn't an option we were even remotely considering.
Is there a full list floating around? That "death panel" rhetoric in the last election isn't looking so far-fetched anymore, is it?
Is there a full list floating around? That "death panel" rhetoric in the last election isn't looking so far-fetched anymore, is it?
Labels: contract stuff
posted by SCC at 12:07 AM
84 Comments:
Vote no, this plus opening the door to the 2% pension, yeah it might be 2% now, but what will it be 3 contracts from now!?!
Does this affect PPO, HMO or both?
come on? This is geographic class warfar. There is no way the union pres is going to put out a video on record with a huge hidden secret like this. Doesn't seem real.
Was it Time magazine that pointed out that by killing grandma you can hire 10 teachers ?
Welcome to your future.
What the FUCK?
How much are co-pays going up in HMO plans then??
I bet the alderman and mayor don't have the same restrictions.
My understanding is that we are now getting charged (the hospital bill) less for treatment. So 25% of the lower bill is about the same as 10% of the same higher bill under the old system. The city has been actually paying these negotiated lower treatment costs and keeping the difference. Some treatments would actually cost less out of pocket and some will be more than before. At the end it's a wash.
Anyway something like that.
So I have to travel to a shit nieghborhood when I get sick? um FUCK YOU!!
Nice goin Dean? You Suck!
Everyone vote "NO".
My understanding is that we are now getting charged (the hospital bill) less for treatment. So 25% of the lower bill is about the same as 10% of the same higher bill under the old system. The city has been actually paying these negotiated lower treatment costs and keeping the difference. Some treatments would actually cost less out of pocket and some will be more than before. At the end it's a wash.
Anyway something like that.
9/15/2014 02:26:00 AM
So vague information with no facts to substantiate it is good enough for you? It's not good enough for me, not by a long shot.
I'm a no just on this one.
Man! Did i make a mistake working for this city! This city would rather give the best care to illegal immigrants rather than to their front line employees! Fuck this city!
I don't know why that include advocate hospitals.. Advocate has special deal with bcbs of il to provide care at discounted cost for getting primary preference and helping bcbs manage care effectively.
Those hospitals should be upset with the city for steering business away from those hospitals! Why did they invest in this city, when business steers people away from them!
And the FOP will look you in the eyes and say your medical is not going up! Please tell me we did not pay for labor attorney's two of them to get us this great contract!
New Advocate policy... Retired PO's NOT allowed to carry on Advocate property...
So no protection if we do enter one of those hospitals...
While pokey and the illegals go to any hospital they choose we are forced into a ghetto crap hospital! Nice going dean, and to think you gave McDonough a position in the sidecar at fop hall! Dean what deal did you and Tom connive whoever wins gives the other a 6 figure salary paid for by fop members? Nice really nice! Guess the kid mike shields (miss me yet) was 100% correct you sold us out for a few dollars in first year retro! Billy Doherty you dean and your crew lied on him also! What's Greg Bella former man with balls saying? He's been awfully quiet, what did you throw him?
Sorry 28 years on looking at this contract feel like I went 10 rounds with mike Tyson and then he bit my ears off! At first glance it was a yes but now wow you really really screwed us! My kids a are raised could not imagine not taking myself or spouse to a good hospital like Christ! You should really along with your crew resign and hang your head!
Dean your pushing way to hard on this contract, videos, town hall meetings, etc! Why were we not allowed to put in suggestions and a side by side comparison of what we wanted and what the city agreed to? Nope just slam this all the way at us, like a freight train full of oil full speed ahead into a brick wall, boom shell shocked after this is voted yes!
Voting no 28 year dinosaur retiring soon but not leaving younger coppers in the mist of destruction, I still back my brothers and sisters in blue and that's forever dean crew forever, you can abandon them with nonsense like this contract bad health care more out if pocket dean but we are not like you! Send the ballot got pen ready NO NO NO!
Thanks SCC for keeping this on a front burner your the real police crew! SCC spirits of the air should be the elected representatives of the Chicago police that would be "change we could believe in"!
The medical alone is a non-starter for me.
Add to that...negotiating for cars, are you kidding me, I could care less, give me a fucking bus pass.
Either give me retro for all of my hours worked or keep it.
Select furloughs by watch, that just supports the city's policy of hiring fewer officers. I didn't work 25 years to lose that. Everyone has had to wait for senority, let's keep it that way. Next contract the city will have you bid to districts by watch, like the sgts. and lts. do now.
Duty availability for the new guys is BS. Most of them will be stuck working shit hours and districts for years.
What about having furlough days and BFDs equal actual days, not converted to hours, or needing to add hours in order to take off. While were at it, if your giving us a horse shit raise, 11%, give us more time off with it. Like 4 additional PDs.
Welcome to the real world boys!
"That "death panel" rhetoric in the last election isn't looking so far-fetched anymore, is it?" -- SCC
It never was "far-fetched." Always been in plain view.
Obama's Health Rationer-in-Chief -- White House health-care adviser Ezekiel Emanuel blames the Hippocratic Oath for the 'overuse' of medical care
Wall Street Journal
By Betsy McCaughey
Updated Aug. 27, 2009 12:52 p.m. ET
"Dr. Ezekiel Emanuel, health adviser to President Barack Obama, is under scrutiny. As a bioethicist, he has written extensively about who should get medical care, who should decide, and whose life is worth saving. Dr. Emanuel is part of a school of thought that redefines a physician’s duty, insisting that it includes working for the greater good of society instead of focusing only on a patient’s needs. Many physicians find that view dangerous, and most Americans are likely to agree.
"The Reaper Curve: Ezekiel Emanuel used the above chart in a Lancet article to illustrate the ages on which health spending should be focused. "Principles for Allocation of Scarce Medical Interventions" The Lancet, January 31, 2009"
[Note -- This chart shows "No medical care once you reach 60."]
"Dr. Emanuel says that health reform will not be pain free, and that the usual recommendations for cutting medical spending...are mere window dressing. As he wrote in the Feb. 27, 2008, issue of the Journal of the American Medical Association (JAMA): "Vague promises of savings from cutting waste, enhancing prevention and wellness, installing electronic medical records and improving quality of care are merely 'lipstick' cost control, more for show and public relations than for true change."
"True reform, he argues, must include redefining doctors' ethical obligations. In the June 18, 2008, issue of JAMA, Dr. Emanuel blames the Hippocratic Oath for the "overuse" of medical care....
"He proposes adding the communitarian perspective to ensure that medical resources will be allocated in a way that keeps society going: "Substantively, it suggests services that promote the continuation of the polity—those that ensure healthy future generations, ensure development of practical reasoning skills, and ensure full and active participation by citizens in public deliberations—are to be socially guaranteed as basic. Covering services provided to individuals who are irreversibly prevented from being or becoming participating citizens are not basic, and should not be guaranteed. An obvious example is not guaranteeing health services to patients with dementia."
(Hastings Center Report, November-December, 1996)
http://tinyurl.com/msjyfgl
Why exclude Advocate?
one of the WORST contracts EVER, flop you really fucked up you assholes. The door for obamacare is upon us. what a fucking joke, DO NOT LIFT A FINGER FOR THIS FUCKING CITY, hit Costco for that 55 gallon drum of anal lube..if you vote yes for this contract you are a fucking brainless joke!!!
Dean= snake
Hey, you can always get a sidejob at McDonalds flipping burgers for $15 an hour. (coming soon)
While the cops pay 25% at Christ, you can bet all the south side bangers with GSW's to the head will still go to Christ and get taken care of for free. Nice that the scum of the earth gets better medical treatment than the cops.
When I go to see my doctor at Rush I get billed by the hospital just for entering their building and then I get the doctor's bill, which is less. Oh ya, I also have to pay to park. The Rush bill seems to go up each visit. Like buying lobster, it's the market rate? And insurance allows this!
What I want to know is why don't the alderman renegotiate their pensions? Why are they not mentioning themselves?
That's crazy! I have 3 boys that play sports nonstop. I'm at Lutheran's ER between 5-10 times a year just for sport injuries!
Everyone will be forced onto Obamacare. Your insurance costs will become a % of income +deductible, + % of the bill. Meanwhile, politicians have their own seperate healthcare plan.
Its only FAIR.
Had enough?
The previous FOP administrations all stated that the city is self insured and just pays 5-8% to Blue Cross Blue Shield to administer to program?
If you read the contract you will see that you can go to a veterinarian of your choosing for your health care.
This is what you get for staying out of the wellness plan.
what about St. Anthony??
HMO Co-pay will increase by January 2017. Co-pay for visiting your primary care doctor will rise from $20 to $25. Co-pay for seeing a specialist will be raised to $35 from $20. Co-pay for an emergency room visit will also be hiked to $150 from $100
My vote is NO. The problem with this department is no one is looking at the big picture and what is going to happen to them 10-15 yrs down the road. With them screwing the new guys coming in and saving all that money , we should have got something in return for that big money saver. For our co pay going up, we should have got something in return. For the money the city is saving on tuition, we should have got something in return. 11% isn't really a raise, it doesn't even cover cost of living. The mayor just passed a ordinance that says any city contract employer must pay the worker $13/hr, but he doesn't want to give a decent raise for the cost of living rising. We are losing way too much on this contract for us to approve it. Most of the stuff added in there wasn't even what the membership was asking for. All the new stuff in there, insurance co pays going up, certain hospital only being allowed to treat you, and 2% 55-60yo if retiring screws us big time long term. Stop think "but right now this helps me out," in 10yo ur going to be bitching about what we had and what we lost. If we go to arb most of the things in the contract a arb can't touch. F@ck my 2% raise without the overtime, they can keep it. They are making their money back on they stupid raise from everything else we are giving up. We might not get a 2% raise the first year, but I could see the arb adding .5% to each of the other years to make up for it. Also, keep your new cars. Your suppose to supply us with that anyway. If we were allowed to take them home then I could see it in the contract. I can't believe this is even being considerd by our union.
Sorry for the long comment but Please Vote No!
what happens when i retired and move out of state do i have to return to Chicago for health care at a TIER 1 hospital?
Members will now see the cost savings of the "negotiated rate" when previously, the City saw those savings. Tier 1 or tier 2.
That's a win for the membership.
One other thing, why is no on talking about NOT being in the Wellness Program??
That's a HUGE win for the membership. The city rakes in $1.5mil a year from the other unions in the City for fees and penalties. Taken strait from the workers!
Very happy there is no wellness program, I am voting Yes.
FOP should have the list posted on tier 1 and tier 2 hospitals. How can they expect members to vote on this issues if the dont have that info
Shouldnt be hard to get for FOP
Besides this bathroom wall is there anywhere else that has truthful information that this cane be read?
This is the truth!!! My claims are all denied even while Medicare makes their payments on time. BCBS sends emails citing why they dont pay! We have the substandard insurance policy
This made my no decision easy.
By -Laws will also be voted on tomorrow by us, the members, Tues, Sep 16, be there at 12 noon! The By Laws posted in the FLOP newsletter were not the ones that were submitted and petitioned by dozens of members. They were all rewritten by Dean which is improper. Gentlemen and ladies, we have another Shields on our hands.
I live close to Advocate health network centers. They have parking for free. Should I go to Northwestern now? I just want to know so I can plan and save money.
Gotta go to one of the informational meetings and get the details on that. I read it and did not understand it AT ALL! Maybe they'll explain it in info with ballot?
The devil in is the details. Northwest siders go to Lutheran General and for that to not be a Tier 1 is shameful.
Vote NO/NO/Hell No
I 'm a new PPO , how do I become an HMO?
The kids from south of the border will get better medical treatment than our own citizens that work for this shitty city!
I made a huge mistake working for Chicago Police and this City!
If I had to do it all over, I would move out of town!
This is the main reason we need to vote this down. PBPA and all the other unions avoided "tiered" medical care by agreeing to the stupid wellness program. They were correct in doing so.
Rahm's illegal alien children will be getting gold plated healthcare, while we get Mogadishu style triage.
Retirees just got a 40% increase in healthcare cocts.
We need to realize that we are in a death struggle with this prick.
Vote no on this contract, and then vote no again.
Hurt his re-election bid anyway you can.
Vote against his buddy Rauner in November.
Vote for his strongest challenger in the February mayoral primary.
The big fight coming is about the pension and this cocksucker only understands resistance.
I'm dropping the BCBS and stick with Medicare. Closing my savings and taking my name off assets! If I incur medical bills, file CHAPTER 7 and stick to everyone!
30 years and voting NO. Keep for retro ballerina , deangelow , I get all the vri I want and staying until I'm 63.
Would have been a sgt years ago if not for Merit
End that merit promotion
Union needs to better explain tier. 1-2-3 just called blue cross have HMO can keep same hospital same network, now dean explain ppo!
Is Henrotin on the Tier One list?
Anonymous said...
I 'm a new PPO , how do I become an HMO?
9/15/2014 02:41:00 PM
Hang around the bar at Roscoe and Halsted.
Members will now see the cost savings of the "negotiated rate" when previously, the City saw those savings. Tier 1 or tier 2.
That's a win for the membership.
One other thing, why is no on talking about NOT being in the Wellness Program??
That's a HUGE win for the membership. The city rakes in $1.5mil a year from the other unions in the City for fees and penalties. Taken strait from the workers!
Very happy there is no wellness program, I am voting Yes.
The wellness issue was won by the Fop in the last contract. Check FOP website. We can't be forced into LMCC per arbitrator.
Anonymous said...
While the cops pay 25% at Christ, you can bet all the south side bangers with GSW's to the head will still go to Christ and get taken care of for free. Nice that the scum of the earth gets better medical treatment than the cops.
9/15/2014 07:57:00 AM
______________________
Christ hospital already went down the drain. You should look for better hospitals.
Anonymous said...
My understanding is that we are now getting charged (the hospital bill) less for treatment. So 25% of the lower bill is about the same as 10% of the same higher bill under the old system. The city has been actually paying these negotiated lower treatment costs and keeping the difference. Some treatments would actually cost less out of pocket and some will be more than before. At the end it's a wash.
Anyway something like that.
9/15/2014 02:26:00 AM
A couple if years ago I has an IOD that went to arbitration, I won. Well of course the bill were on the rears and nasty letters were arriving every week.
I called the city finance committee and they told me they paid the bills and had the cancelled check. Well the bills were about $1500.00, the city negotiated down to $130.00 bucks. ER and doctor combined.
So if that's the new system it sounds good. If only someone would spell it out clearly.
Hell, I would have paid the $130.00 myself at the time of services just to skip the hassle of dealing with the city.
This is what happens when 47% of the population do not pay taxes. Where beezzzz my gubment aid?!?!?!
To all those who post comments saying I should have never took a job in this city fuck this city blah blah blah. Quit your job and move to where you think paradise is no one is forcing you to be a Chicago police officer quit crying and leave already who cares
The Sgt and all the other unions didn't give shit up and YES they all have it, we won't have it until 2017, all these other unions will be the guinea pigs for us....
You people need to learn what you are panicking about
Single retiree coverage now $653.00.
That's more than Obamacare and more than most mortgages.
VOTE NO!!!!! This is a horrible contract in so many ways. It eliminates a whole bunch of surgeons and specialists who do their surgeries and admittings at Advocate and other hospitals. It's going to be a nightmare when your GP or kids GP needs to refer you to someone that's in their network if that Dr is not in one of the selected for favor hospitals.
In addition this is the first little crack in a divide and conquer scheme with screwing the new hires on the Duty Availability It will eventually create 2 groups of before 2015 and after hires and eventually the new guys will outnumber us and screw us over like the city wants us to do to those not yet hired now.
This contract is all about fucking us over in the future by introducing stuff like cars and time due in an innocuous way that does us no good anyway and that they will eventually use against us VOTE NO!!!!!!!!
Anonymous said...
FOP should have the list posted on tier 1 and tier 2 hospitals. How can they expect members to vote on this issues if the dont have that info
Shouldnt be hard to get for FOP
9/15/2014 11:42:00 AM
$$$$$$$$$$
This provision does not take effect unit 2017. The lists are not complete as this is a new provision. I called I called a friend at St. Margaret's (a PPO hospital) in Hammond IN who made contact with BCBS and they said they expect all of the current PPO hospital to become Tier 1. The list that is floating around was a tentative list from 1/1/2014.
Many hospitals not on the Blue Choice list still offer these same PPO rate because they want the business.
Example:
Palos Community is a PPO hospital and is on the list.
Christ is a PPO hospital and is not on the list but bill exactly like Palos community because the need to keep their market share to pay for the edition.
Voting No!! The retro check is the bait to vote yes,Plus your Vri, CTA, Cha will not be counted, but you have to count it when you file your income tax!!!!
Off topic- Love the Quinn tv commercial, cutting the grass in dress slacks and polo shirt, you could tell the guy never broke a sweat and did manual labor in his life, always been a political hack, the lawn is covered in creeping crawling weeds just like our state funds a disaster!!! Plus he is being investigated by the Feds for giving state funds to shitheads!! A Police Hater!!!
This is the truth!!! My claims are all denied even while Medicare makes their payments on time. BCBS sends emails citing why they dont pay! We have the substandard insurance policy
9/15/2014 12:26:00 PM
If medicare paid, my city supplemental insurance also paid all of the time.
FOP should have the list posted on tier 1 and tier 2 hospitals. How can they expect members to vote on this issues if the dont have that info
Shouldnt be hard to get for FOP
Hope Christ hospital is on the list. They will be getting more patients after this article. Maybe they will send her to call back at full pay for a few years while they decide the punishment.
http://voices.suntimes.com/news/breaking-news/suit-nurse-had-unsolicited-sex-with-man-waiting-for-heart-transplant/
All this stems from Obamacare, aka Socialized Healthcare. All the more reason to vote straight Republican and hope to get it de-funded and repealed, before everyone ends up like the Retiree's.
The city wants you to go to Roseland and St Barnyards to get treated when you get ill. Dean Angelo is an idiot for putting this horseshit contract to a vote.
FOP can't even come up with a current list of Tier 1,2,3, hospitals. Fuck these idiots. They need to get voted out the next time around.
Anonymous said...
That's crazy! I have 3 boys that play sports nonstop. I'm at Lutheran's ER between 5-10 times a year just for sport injuries!
9/15/2014 08:36:00 AM
Maybe you should have them join the chess club, it's much safer. Growing kids shouldn't be getting injured that often.
Everybody is complaining about the increase in copay. While you're waiting in line at your Dr's office or walgreens listen up to what other people are paying for there copay. Be very grateful for what we pay.
We will get the 2% raise the first year , we just won't get the retro . Don't ya get it , he's saying screw every new Chicago police officer , no duty availability for 3 1/2 years , screw the retired police officers by raising insurance cost .
What kind do union agrees to that ? No e unless they are a big ballerina dancer fan . We will all retire one day and costs will go up or insurance taken away .
Our raise over 5 years is less than the $6.00 an hour raise for minimum wage that he is demanding foe every company with a city contract . Guess who pays that , not the contractor the tax payer .
Please Vote NO , protect yourself and future police officers .
How about only 10%. Management for second watch
How about opening bids to units every 6 months and rebidding districts once a year , some coppers never worked any place but 16. Time to bump them to a ghetto . Vote no
Vote NO.
City saves on medical, duty availability, education, etc.
And we salivate on MAYBE getting a fucking car.
Are we INSANE!!!
Who cares I'll fucking walk to my jobs.
Oh and we get ONLY 11% over 5 years.
VOTE NO!
VOTE NO!
Man, I just hate seeing people get screwed out of even less than they deserve. F'ing pure politics, will never change, sad. Running out of other peoples money has always been a problem with communists. I ask, who does the FOP put YOUR money behind during an election process?
How much of your money goes into the campaign coffers of openly blatant communist and Laraza party leaders who infest America directly out of the infectious boil cyst Chicago? Sanctuary city Chicago, when will the law abiding citizens, and more important, the front line cops say hey, enough is enough.
NEVER!
As always, a few will literally live life happy after, but the majority, as my experience can attest, will go to their grave bitterly cussing pols. After paying to help these fucks get realected.
Sad.
"Is Henrotin on the Tier One list?"
9/15/2014 06:00:00 PM
Yeah, right in there with Edgewater and Bethesda.
..and...and...
http://www.ihatoday.org/uploadDocs/1/closedhospyear.pdf
I watched the fop videos. They misspelled "copyright" as "copywrite" in the closing credits. Did you see that???
Anonymous said...
Single retiree coverage now $653.00.
That's more than Obamacare and more than most mortgages.
9/15/2014 07:02:00 PM
My mortgage was $653.00 in 1990 when I bought my house in Edison Park for $132,000
What have you been smoking?
New Advocate policy... Retired PO's NOT allowed to carry on Advocate property...
So no protection if we do enter one of those hospitals...
9/15/2014 07:02:00 AM
If you can't carry protection in a Catholic-affiliated hospital, use the condom in the parking lot.
Anonymous said...
That's crazy! I have 3 boys that play sports nonstop. I'm at Lutheran's ER between 5-10 times a year just for sport injuries!
9/15/2014 08:36:00 AM
Maybe you should have them join the chess club, it's much safer. Growing kids shouldn't be getting injured that often.
And some wonder why the city is trying to cut down on the cost of healthcare.
Anonymous said...
I 'm a new PPO , how do I become an HMO?
9/15/2014 02:41:00 PM
Hang around the bar at Roscoe and Halsted.
9/15/2014 06:05:00 PM
You made my day. I needed that laugh
Anonymous said...
I watched the fop videos. They misspelled "copyright" as "copywrite" in the closing credits. Did you see that???
9/15/2014 11:29:00 PM
Yea ok I'm worried about that! More concerned with everything else, voting yes to contract we are dealing with rahm a very evil man! Arbitrator will gut this more, a wise man votes yes,a fool votes no and watches as rahm tears us up more. Think citizens don't like the police? Headline "greedy police offered this and did not take it" watch the citizens reactions! The public are not on our side! Vote yes!
Anonymous Anonymous said...
FOP can't even come up with a current list of Tier 1,2,3, hospitals. Fuck these idiots. They need to get voted out the next time around.
9/15/2014 09:17:00 PM
***********************
The list they have is an older one. The newer list will be be out shortly for open enrolment.
1. Even if you hospital is on the list there are no guarantees they wouldn't opted out by 2017. Advocate Hospitals are honoring the BCBS PPO rate now. No way Christ would let Palos Community have the whole south side to themselves. Informative meeting today.
If you were unable to attend the meeting today they said there would be an town hall open house meeting tomorrow at Biagio's 4242 N. Central. South side location to be determined.
Holy Cross Hospital has been voted Number 1 in the nation for hang nail bitter infections. Also best for fyngus of the eye lid.
Finest ER on the South side. Most MD' went to medical school in the Harvard of Moscow, "PAVDA".
All staff speak foreign lanfuages other then English.
St. Anthony on the West side was number two.
Both are tier one hospitals.
Christ and Luthern general did not make the cut. All the Fellow MD" went to the above. Better clients with free medical coverage. Most there have never seen a hospital since hiking across our boarders.
Remember vote QUINN and DURBIN back in to save the poor folks.
Thanks you,
UNION FAMILY HOME
You know who will get the goodies, for now anyway, illegals, the bottom feeders, FREE healthcare for them and their offspring. Divide and conquer. A millennium strategy. Works just as well today, as it did 2000 years ago.
Sooner than later everyone will be wide awake and they will see what has been right in front of them, for a very long time.
Everyone except the self-chosen will be taken down to the lowest common denominator. All are equally unequal. Welcome to the future. Want to know who rules over you? Just ask yourself who it is you are not allowed to criticize.
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