D.O.A. to be DOA?
- Viral video of a bloodied man being dragged off a United Airlines flight underscores why the city’s aviation security officers should not be armed, Mayor Rahm Emanuel maintained Monday, saying he would await the outcome of a broader review to determine whether the city force should exist at all.
In his first public comment about the embarrassing fiasco, Emanuel branded the incident involving Dr. David Dao as “totally, all-around unacceptable.”
And with United revealing none of their employees will face termination, that leaves only one group to face the hangman alone. That "private security" rumor that's been percolating for a few months here is looking more likely all of the sudden, even if it isn't the McCarthy group.
Labels: general
posted by SCC at 12:04 AM
112 Comments:
How about firing the head of aviation security. Isn't that the one responsible for the policies that were carried out. Also isn't that a Rahm appointee.
Are aviation officers the Poleec???? Lol, my wife's uncle is a captain with them... looks like he is toast, but he will make a phone call and be driving a dump truck for streets and sanz. By the way, he is related to an alderman, chubacca Garcia, and a state senator. It's pretty interesting how many tools are in my wife's family.
Good riddance! Useless political patronage job, we already have officers stationed at the airports- what purpose do the aviation police serve? From my understanding, CPD processes arrests at airports, Aviation police can only detain.
Interesting point of the article was that Rahm wasn't looking into United behavior. It couldn't be they donated almost $138k to him of course. He's all about transparency. And those 2 seats by United big whigs on world business chicago? Only cause they the best. Transparency again. Ginger Evans? She's Rahms girl. How was she to know even though bosses with zero clout have to know every move of thousands of officers on and off duty. It's the chicago way
Pay attention to the names of everyone who works for aviation police--- and check back a few month later to see which city department they are working for after aviation security department is disbanded. You will see who has clout. Baby G
They're clearly being unjustly made the scapegoat.
They're being sized up for the noose under Rahm's orders.
Fly the friedly skies!
They cant privatise, FFA rules and regulations state the airports have to be manned by sworn law enforcement personal.
http://mikerowe.com/2017/04/otw-unitedairlinesceo/
Why is it that the generation of jagoffs that is all about me me me get a free pass on the accountability train but the coppers who have a job to do get run over by said train? Furthermore, when are we going to see that list of laws certain people or folks exempt from?
These guys remind me of the security at Daley center. CCSP there witb a security firm.
Baby G,
They all had clout to get there in the first place. Check back in a few months and you will see who are the heaviest hitters..
01/16/29+1
Several groups are pushing for the officers to be charged with a hate crime for going after an Asian. No mention that the airline directed them to the specific seat/individual.
United = No suspensions/firings
D.O.A.bosses = no suspension/firings
Who ya gonna blame?
Off Topic/CTA VSWO related.
It has been brought to my attention that a 4th watch sgt (MV) has been Sparring people left and right for anything and everything. On Monday she did not like the fact that 2 PO's went down on lunch approx. 2.5 miles from their post and, made them do a To-From explaining their lunch location decision. Ok MV, at 95th and the redline you tell me a location where to eat, where my lunch will not be spit on or jizzed on? Next time, you join me for lunch and I will watch you eat your meal first. Last year she was a fill in on the watch that I normally worked, so after one shift with her I cancelled the 2 other days to avoid her nonsense.
Cindy, watch how many less PO's sign up for the 4th watch with sgt MV. I can bet after this last incident of hers, less and less will sign up for this watch.
A-TEAM
Some sweet contracts coming soon. Watch the Aldercritters smell the bacon cooking.
It's the Chicago way $50,000 for working security no gun and run and hide if something happens
The head of the aviation police is a Rahm appointee? Hmmmm...can't hold him responsible, it might look like the mighty liberal democrat was,...gasp,...wrong!
J.J.
Stupid ass-clowns. Either don't know or weren't trained in the difference between a lawful order and not.
Between police and not.
Between criminal and civil.
And speaking of ass-clowns.....Munoz.
Who's responsible for the whole culture of corporate 'Fuck you and your ticket. We do whatever we want. It's our plane."
.....why it's Oscar Munoz! He put the whole mess on the doctor less than 24 hours after the incident.
That United F-wit deserves a BIG chunk of the blame. Deserves to get canned, and have several 10s of millions of bonus money clawed back.
Point fingers at the mall cops on that plane? Sure.
But point fingers at the lying thug in the C suite too.
Just what was needed. McCarthy given the security contract in exchange for not running for mayor.
I'll be the first to agree that the Aviation Police could use more training, but what on earth do guns have to do with this incident? They didn't shoot the guy. They didn't beat him with a pistol. They didn't threaten him with a gun.
Rahm is an arrogant fukin idiot (but everybody already knows that).
I wouldn't want anyone to work as an unarmed police officer anywhere. I especially wouldn't want them to have to do that job at one of the busiest airports in the World. We all know ORD is a target. Let the Aviation cops protect it. Give them the training and the weapons necessary to do the job already.
Private security is going to be better? lol
Special Ed is pissed because he has not striped anyone in weeks....
Anonymous Anonymous said...
They're clearly being unjustly made the scapegoat.
They're being sized up for the noose under Rahm's orders.
4/19/2017 03:01:00 AM
----------------------------------------------
No, they screwed themselves by crying the "gimme a gun" crap, feeding false shit to news stations, and "We're the real police," shit. Should have kicked back and enjoyed the best paying security gig ever, that sends you to the Police Academy so you can play part time Police in a suburb, or leave and lateral somewhere. After the shit last week, no PD will touch any of these guys, except maybe Robbins, Dixmoor, Cal Park, or Harvey, the homes for broken toys.
No, they brought in on themselves. Now maybe a parking book, dog noose, or lockup in a ghetto District is your fate.
Tiny Dancer will use this to put in a connected private security firm which will give kick backs to him and his cronies. He will then raise the taxes and fees at the airports claiming the money is needed to pay for the "upgrade" in service that the new firm will provide. So the costs of flying out of shitcago will be going up. Maybe an airport in Peatone just got some life blown into it. Remember, "you never let a serious crises go to waste"!
They're clearly being unjustly made the scapegoat.
Actually, it is their fault - they're not scapegoats. They should have been returned to their original status as soon as that mush Maurer left.
The aviation police did not need to batter the old asian doctor and drag him off the plane. He was not armed or hurting anyone so there was no public safety issue. This was a civil matter, not a criminal matter. United could have threatened to sue the old asian doctor if he did not leave.
The people in charge should be fired, Ginger and the rest.
Oh, you have some great guys there, but they are shunted aside and left to rot.
Also, over a 25 of the kids are on the list for CPD and other agencies, let them get hired. This was just a stepping stone for them.
Do some of these people have clout, hell yes. But then again, look at the CPD, I hate to say it, but its even worse!
Beat and release.
I spoke with a friend who is an A.S.O.. He said that they don't have a procedure in place that deals with passengers that refuse to leave the plane when requested to do so by flight staff. They didn't receive any training to deal with situations like that.
Whats the big deal Doctors overbook all the time and not one of them offered me more then an apology or an old magazine to read for my delay.
"Never let a crisis go to waste."
Well we have a Mayor who is responsible for nothing, we have a states attorney that represents the interests of the defendants, we have a sheriff who puts the lives of the guards at risk and releases "non violent offenders" back into the already murderous streets and expressways of Chicago, and lets not forget our forever raising taxes and creating more and more unnecessary or no work jobs cook county board president.
I would say this is a win win win win for all Chicago.......LMFAO......BIG JOKE!
Now all we need to do is elect a new democratic governor and we are toast!!!! You can't make this shit up.
KEEP VOTING DEMOCRAT...IT'S WORKING,IT SHOWS...SHIT HAPPENS ESPECIALLY IN SHITCAGO!
The new people in charge of aviation out there create3d a plain clothed UNARMED tactical team that thought they had to respond and "do something" THEY should be fired
Here come Jan and the kids.
about time , barney fife and retired dinosaurs
They'll get rid of them. And low and behold a private company will emerge to take their place. Of course paying a fraction of pay and benefits to employees and a boat load to the, connected, CEO.
Aviation could be the first security company to be put under a consent decree.
Lets face it....If they are not going to give them guns, then we really don't need them. However you think the United incident was handled...Good or Bad, They are going to be sacrificed on the Altar of Political correctness. United, and the mayor have killed their future...
AVPD would likely be downsized before it ever were to be disbanded. Shaky DOA Chief won't speak out or they'll Mauer him.
The AVPD duties will probably be refined, but they'll survive and the 3 that were suspended should get their jobs back without reprisal like the United employees. If United did their customer service properly, they wouldn't need security involvement.
A simple matter that got out of hand and mostly because of an impatient United flight schedule and then there's the FAA, imposing steep fines for late departures.
CPD bit the bullet on the whole seating incident. The SunTrib media is a bit disappointed, many of the reporters hoped to make 3 months worth of columns on it.
No Monday QB'ing, but that stubborn old crank was going to get launched from the plane no matter who pulled him out by his lips and ears..because that's what UNITED wanted, and wanted it done quickly.
Then there's the frequent Rahm Family outings, always flying United.
They get the red carpet and avoid TSA checkpoint bag and pat down screening.
Just coincidently, little Rahm Jr. was robbed, beat down for his weed money and cellphone, days before their vacation flight to Chile for the high holidays.
The AVPD is a economic engine for the patronage and it stays. Sweep this under the rug. Nothing to see. Just a hiccup.
Ohare is safe and free of gangs, drugs, terror suspects and vagrants.
Plenty of eagle eyed officers and security always on duty.
And God forbid, you see how airports are a major target. How will the overweight, revolver carrying 30 year veteran officer respond? The Airport CPD detail should not be based on seniority and DOA should stop hiring retired CPD. If you properly train and arm DOA PD as well as remove the retired CPD from its ranks you might just get the airports properly secured. That is the last thing on Rahm's mind. Until CNN does an expose on the World's Most Unsecured Airport.
They will be thrown under the bus. Sad.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
Good riddance! Useless political patronage job, we already have officers stationed at the airports- what purpose do the aviation police serve? From my understanding, CPD processes arrests at airports, Aviation police can only detain.
4/19/2017 01:55:00 AM
Would that then mean superbid over 300 Cpd to airports gee Wally where do we get the people? If Cpd is at the airport watch the crying begin "I don't want to do this or do that" Cpd coppers are no better and would add millions to the budget as doa works cheaper!
Here is some info that I have not heard the news say. That airplane said "United" but it was a United Express Flight. None of the flight crew are United Airlines Employees. The Pilot, First Officers and Flight Attendants are employees of Republic Airlines. Republic is the contractor for a lot of the United Express Flights. There is another company that provides the crews for other United Express flights.
Dont do shit, dont worry about shit.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
They're clearly being unjustly made the scapegoat.
They're being sized up for the noose under Rahm's orders.
4/19/2017 03:01:00 AM
Care to share what's "unjust" about being called to account for
- failure to understand the basic limitations of your role (you aren't a cop)
- failure to behave with reasonable care & caution
- failure to comprehend the difference between 'criminal' and 'civil' actions
- and (bonus) throw in 'ass-hat behavior in public, in front of cell phone video cams'
WTF. You'd come to that same unjust / scapegoat conclusion if mall cops yanked your dad out of his seat at the Olive Garden....busted his head to make room for some VIPs?
Jeezus.
An embarassment and a danger to anyone who is a real cop. A clear and present danger.
They will face the same fate as the CTA Police back in the early 80's. Jayne Byrne did away with them with the stroke of a pen. Guys came to work at 1500 hours to find the doors locked and some "boss type" standing there collecting badges and ID cards.
How exactly do you get a person off an airplane that doesn't want to go? The policy might be stupid but if they say you got to go then you got to go. If they dump aviation police then guess who's going to be on the next viral video dragging a passenger who refuses to leave, yep CPD.
About a week ago the City website opened for Aviation Security. Right after the incident it closed. One more thing apparently they have a couple sergeants pumping into the heads of these guys that they are police and to go out and do work. More Idiots in a leadership role. Morons were told months ago to STOP wearing jackets labelled police.
If d o a police is disbanded does this mean we would have a few hundred opening bids by seniority now ?
The DOA officers should have had the airlines sign a complaint, then arrested him had he not exited the plane. Hands on without an arrest is a big no no.
(OT) how about funding CPD pension which is now under 25% funding nope this:
Can Legal Marijuana Fund CPS? Lawmakers Learn How It's Done In Colorado
https://www.dnainfo.com/chicago/20170419/downtown/can-legal-weed-help-fund-cps-lawmakers-learn-how-its-done-colorado?utm_source=Afternoon+News&utm_campaign=96ffe109ae-Mailchimp-CHI&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_5cf48fa38c-96ffe109ae-177427829
ay attention to the names of everyone who works for aviation police--- and check back a few month later to see which city department they are working for after aviation security department is disbanded. You will see who has clout. Baby G
^that is so fucking true. Those are untouchable.
Oh don't worry. I agree with most of what you said, EXCEPT it probably will be the McCarthy group.
He will give the contract to the McCarthy group so that come next election G-Mac will keep quite and
Endorse Rahm for re-election. I also seeing A LOT of the new hires for the new security firm will be
coming from the minority areas of the city so that their Black Caucus & Hispanic Caucus will both stay quite too
"Anonymous said: How will the overweight, revolver carrying 30 year veteran officer respond?"
- Fast and Furious, if you prepare him for a surgical strike and tactical response.
First, while he's nodding in and out, tie a Big Mac to a string on a pole and attach it so it hangs in front of him.
Then get him to answer the radio with a nudge or knock on the skull.
Finally and most important, stand aside and watch the verbal judo magic on a full belly, kid.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
How exactly do you get a person off an airplane that doesn't want to go? The policy might be stupid but if they say you got to go then you got to go. If they dump aviation police then guess who's going to be on the next viral video dragging a passenger who refuses to leave, yep CPD.
4/19/2017 02:09:00 PM
Recently retired Cpd airport we did same things to remove from planes you don't want to go you go, now though since DOA coppers took the heat no more hey commander tommy o b anything to say? How about some leadership! Boss yea ok sure!! Guess the overtime you took away is coming back "big time brother!" Thanks for the ,memories what does ginger say?
Aviation Police is another patronage job like the idiots over at the water filtration plants all political hacks that double as precinct captains and vote counters for the twerp mayor and his city council minions...
A Dept. that was created as a patronage baby after the Feds offered the city money. Let's create another Dept. and hire retired political hacks to run this fiasco. Don't blame the DOA guys they're just pawns in this corrupt political regime. ♠️
Just like the Daley Center and Federal Building, ninety percent of law enforcement age sixty and over.
Care to share what's "unjust" about being called to account for
- failure to understand the basic limitations of your role (you aren't a cop)
- failure to behave with reasonable care & caution
- failure to comprehend the difference between 'criminal' and 'civil' actions
- and (bonus) throw in 'ass-hat behavior in public, in front of cell phone video cams'
WTF. You'd come to that same unjust / scapegoat conclusion if mall cops yanked your dad out of his seat at the Olive Garden....busted his head to make room for some VIPs?
Jeezus.
An embarassment and a danger to anyone who is a real cop. A clear and present danger.
4/19/2017 01:53:00 PM
I completely agree except... would you care to share where being a cop would have made it O/K ?
It is obvious you also fail to understand the basic limitations of your role Officer. "But I'm the REAL POLICE" is not an affirmative defense.
I suggest that all airlines equip their planes with passenger ejections seats in the future to avoid all this nonsense...next
Rham Cant Decide........ Why Do We Need Rham
Go Away RhamBo youre a political hack
Dump D.O.A. and Staff with CPD
Isn't there a Terrorism Threat?
Anonymous said...
They cant privatise, FFA rules and regulations state the airports have to be manned by sworn law enforcement personal.
4/19/2017 05:27:00 AM
I think that your statement is probably correct, but the airports do have sworn law enforcement personnel, the CPD. DOA is just a supplement and probably can be eliminated, but most likely will not be. There are security personnel already working checkpoints at the airport and TSA screeners are not sworn . I think the city will work around if if they want to. The mayor promised a full report by the end of the month. And, once a passenger is boarded they should not be removed absent a criminal offense or disturbance. Let the airline figure it out. Let them sign a complaint for trespassing.
Anonymous said...
How exactly do you get a person off an airplane that doesn't want to go? The policy might be stupid but if they say you got to go then you got to go. If they dump aviation police then guess who's going to be on the next viral video dragging a passenger who refuses to leave, yep CPD.
4/19/2017 02:09:00 PM
Anonymous said...
Hows this sound over a loud speaker. "Ladies and gentleman, due to federal regulations we will have to de-plane while a new flight crew takes over this flight. Please take all carry-ons and personal property with you and we will conduct our new pre-flight inspection as quickly as possible." And then we do a do-over with re-entry and problem resolved.
To the guy beating on Aviation and calling this a civil matter, you are an arrogant prick or a scumbag lawyer. Someone refusing to leave when asked to do so is criminal trespassing. We can argue how it could've been handled better all you want but don't claim that it was a civil matter when at it's very core it's very easily a criminal matter.
Just an FYI. There are rules and regulations related to this incident that fall under FAAregulations. This means federal law! The 4 crew members were classified as "must fly". That means, by whatever means necessary, these crew members must be given seats. If United didn't comply, they would be in violation of Federal rules. Secondly, this doctor,when advised he would be given a new flight and $$$$. Agreed and left the plane. Thirdly, he changed his mind after leaving the plane and ran back onto the plane, another federal violation. This guy became combative and spit on the aviation officers flailing his arms like a petulant child. I don't know one person, regardless if you are a sworn police officer,an aviation security officer, or Joe blow citizen who would be ok with this "doctors" behavior. Forget about the fact that he was a doctor. Is he more important than any other passenger on board? Hardly. If you read and understand the small print on every ticket issued by the airlines, there is small print known as "contract of carriage". This plane is the property of united airlines and their rules apply! The united airline crew members are in total and legal control of their plane. Don't like their rules? Drive yourself or hire a private plane. Do I think this was handled well? 'It really but this doctor caused his own problems. And, I've never flown united airlines so I am not saying this because I have any concern for a corporation but because that is the law. Once this man ran back onto the plane, he needed to be removed. The choice was his as to how he went. Like a man, like a little butch, or dragged like an asshole
It was a civil matter just like an eviction. Is there something in the criminal code that it maybe a crime?
The aviation police did not need to batter the old asian doctor and drag him off the plane. He was not armed or hurting anyone so there was no public safety issue. This was a civil matter, not a criminal matter. United could have threatened to sue the old asian doctor if he did not leave.
4/19/2017 09:14:00 AM
Jesus, they could have driven their crew to Louisville in 3 hours. How long was the delay?
Blogger MTS said...
These guys remind me of the security at Daley center. CCSP there witb a security firm.
*****
The Sheriff's Police are not assigned to the Daley Center.
That's Court Services.
OT.
Police Inspector General?
Laura Kunard?
WTF?
Another big money job. For what?
With IPRA/COPA and IAD, what is the necessity of having a Police Inspector General?
Anonymous said...
And God forbid, you see how airports are a major target. How will the overweight, revolver carrying 30 year veteran officer respond? The Airport CPD detail should not be based on seniority and DOA should stop hiring retired CPD. If you properly train and arm DOA PD as well as remove the retired CPD from its ranks you might just get the airports properly secured. That is the last thing on Rahm's mind. Until CNN does an expose on the World's Most Unsecured Airport.
4/19/2017 12:22:00 PM
"And God forbid, you see how airports are a major target. How will the overweight, revolver carrying 30 year veteran officer respond?"
Properly, and with a cool, level head.
Harry Baltz said...
I spoke with a friend who is an A.S.O.. He said that they don't have a procedure in place that deals with passengers that refuse to leave the plane when requested to do so by flight staff. They didn't receive any training to deal with situations like that.
4/19/2017 09:34:00 AM
They need to get their Union Field Rep to make that statement to the Media then.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
Baby G,
They all had clout to get there in the first place. Check back in a few months and you will see who are the heaviest hitters..
01/16/29+1
4/19/2017 06:28:00 AM
Bullshit on the Clout to Get into DOA APD/SO.
They offered me a Job...and I have Zero Clout.
I'm glad I turned it down though.
Finance Guy on a Bike.
If Rhams brother doesn't run a security company he will when the airport goes private.
To respond to the snide 12:22 comment about a 30 yr veteran. Give me him any day because of multiple factors (a) He's EARNED the right to slow down by working 25+ years in a beat car (b) In 30 yrs he's learned to deal with all kinds of people and would have handled it with force being the LAST resort. (c) Why the hell was Aviation even on board? (d) If Aviation wasn't so stupid they'd realize they have a great gig. (e) Why again was Aviation on board again? To say you need to arm Aviation and train them is true but the BEST training is to work that beat car for 25 yrs and when it's time to slow down BID to O'Hare. P.S. Nice crew cut by the way fruit loop.
4/19/2017 09:31:00 AM
Anonymous Harry Baltz said...
I spoke with a friend who is an A.S.O.. He said that they don't have a procedure in place that deals with passengers that refuse to leave the plane when requested to do so by flight staff. They didn't receive any training to deal with situations like that.
4/19/2017 09:34:00 AM
What does "training" have to do with speaking in a civilzed manner and communicating the issues to an individual. How was it these Officers thought escalating the situation was a good idea.
How exactly do you get a person off an airplane that doesn't want to go? The policy might be stupid but if they say you got to go then you got to go. If they dump aviation police then guess who's going to be on the next viral video dragging a passenger who refuses to leave, yep CPD.
4/19/2017 02:09:00 PM
A flight attendant uses the public address system and announces to the passengers in the cabin that the plane cannot and will not leave the airport until Mr/Mrs X disembarks. If the person does not immediately disembark, they will eventually leave the plane as a result of gentle persuasion provided by the other passengers. No muss, no fuss, no police involvement unless Mr/Mrs X becomes the victim of a battery initiated by a fellow passenger.
""No, they screwed themselves by crying the "gimme a gun" crap, feeding false shit to news stations, and "We're the real police," shit. Should have kicked back and enjoyed the best paying security gig ever, that sends you to the Police Academy so you can play part time Police in a suburb, or leave and lateral somewhere. After the shit last week, no PD will touch any of these guys, except maybe Robbins, Dixmoor, Cal Park, or Harvey, the homes for broken toys.
No, they brought in on themselves. Now maybe a parking book, dog noose, or lockup in a ghetto District is your fate.""
Yeah sorry to say this has all been building for a few years. "Most" of the APS guys are good guys who know they have a good gig but they have a small cadre who just kept pushing it. They and their Union Rep, with no knowledge of the union, went on CNN and made people look bad, the Union Reps all got fired for it, and then they kept pushing it by showing up at Jobs first, trying to handle them. Making fun of us and being assholes, doing traffic stops, calling out 10-1s, seeing crime all over the place...ect
Only 50% of the airport is there on juice. The rest of us did enough Policing in our time to deserve to take our last year or two not creating crime where it doesnt exist. Some of these guys really thought they were the real deal. Then you had their supervisors who stayed hidden cause they didnt want to step on any toes down there and ruin THEIR sweet gig. Every other day they would have a new SOP for them, show up, dont show up, handle it, dont handle it, do this, dont do that.
I sincerely hope they dont lose their jobs. Being out of work is a serious thing and why would anyone wish it on them? Clout or not who cares. And once again it shows the pecking order and who the pawns are at the airport. It wouldnt have been all that different had it been CPD involved when the beef went down. The airlines and the shit bags holding the phone cams would be screaming for our jobs too.
Some racist/Muslim terrorist kills 4 in CA. and it hardly makes the news. Meanwhile this nonsense has been getting printed for over a week? What a bunch of shit. Maybe we should all "run away".
"How exactly do you get a person off an airplane that doesn't want to go? The policy might be stupid but if they say you got to go then you got to go. If they dump aviation police then guess who's going to be on the next viral video dragging a passenger who refuses to leave, yep CPD."
How about private security goons? Nightclubs don't call the cops when someone isn't acting according to house rules, they have their own bouncers. Or maybe the local air marshal, since AFAIK part of the pre-takeoff safety spiel is something to the effect of "federal law requires compliance with all crew instructions" which would suggest that this is a federal matter.
Re: the Mike Rowe article, as usual he nailed it. Classic case of all involved behaving badly with expected results. That said, prospective unruly passengers would be wise to note that if we start selectively following said federally-backed instructions the other passengers can selectively ignore the part about not clobbering an obstruction to takeoff into submission and throwing him out the hatch themselves. Good for the goose and all that...
With this discussion being overplayed now for over a week, and all the Burke questions about DOA procedures and SOPs, has there been any investigation into the type of training flight crews get with regard to incidents like this. Are United employees aware that the contractual relationship between airline/passenger or vender/customer is a civil matter, not one of broken laws or civil disobedience. Where is it in United's training and procedures that says security or law enforcement are called to eject or remove a paying customer? Who is it that instructs flight attendants to call the police or security to remove a passenger who refuses to give up his paid for seat?
From here it looks like a situation that occurs on a weekend, when most supervisors are regular day off and decisions on the best course to follow are left to the responding officers.
How exactly do you get a person off an airplane that doesn't want to go? The policy might be stupid but if they say you got to go then you got to go. If they dump aviation police then guess who's going to be on the next viral video dragging a passenger who refuses to leave, yep CPD.
Since its a federal crime to refuse, tell the airline to request a TSA or FBI agent to remove them.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
To the guy beating on Aviation and calling this a civil matter, you are an arrogant prick or a scumbag lawyer. Someone refusing to leave when asked to do so is criminal trespassing. We can argue how it could've been handled better all you want but don't claim that it was a civil matter when at it's very core it's very easily a criminal matter.
God, I hope you're not the police.
Hows this sound over a loud speaker. "Ladies and gentleman, due to federal regulations we will have to de-plane while a new flight crew takes over this flight. Please take all carry-ons and personal property with you and we will conduct our new pre-flight inspection as quickly as possible." And then we do a do-over with re-entry and problem resolved.
4/19/2017 06:07:00 PM
Idea #1 Above: An excellent idea to be used before anything has been revealed to the passengers.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A flight attendant uses the public address system and announces to the passengers in the cabin that the plane cannot and will not leave the airport until Mr/Mrs X disembarks. If the person does not immediately disembark, they will eventually leave the plane as a result of gentle persuasion provided by the other passengers. No muss, no fuss, no police involvement unless Mr/Mrs X becomes the victim of a battery initiated by a fellow passenger.
4/19/2017 07:59:00 PM
Idea #2 Above: This is the idea to be used once the passengers are all aware of the circumstances, however, the best route is not revealing anything to the passengers and utilizing Idea #1.
Have I earned my four merit promotions?
Anonymous Anonymous said...
Why is it that the generation of jagoffs that is all about me me me get a free pass on the accountability train but the coppers who have a job to do get run over by said train? Furthermore, when are we going to see that list of laws certain people or folks exempt from?
4/19/2017 05:48:00 AM
------------------------------------------------------
AGAIN, THEYRE NOT "COPPERS". Will you DOA security guards please stop saying you're cops?!
There training was to run & hide. Shame on them...
Why don't we get the United CEO to be the next Supt.? At least he has some balls! Amongst all the media pressure he still said no one will be fired. Eddie would have them stripped and already indicted.
4/19/2017 06:28:00 AM
Bullshit on the Clout to Get into DOA APD/SO.
They offered me a Job...and I have Zero Clout.
I'm glad I turned it down though.
Finance Guy on a Bike.
---------------------------------------------------------
Oh please. I was offered a job too, and it was because an SEIU guy thought I was able to do something for him. I told him no thanks and took a test and got on an actual police department, like a normal person.
And thank god you turned it down so you can pedal around and fuck working class people. One of the true travesties, among many in this city, is that they give you tools a badge. You're not law enforcement, you're another guy that couldn't pass a test and a background.
Increase & improve major airports' security and decrease local costs by making it a federal responsibility. (Think Israel.) Don't use an expanded TSA for that either. There would be issues to overcome, but consider having it be a U.S. military responsibility for any U.S. airport w international flights.
Off Topic/CTA VSWO related.
It has been brought to my attention that a 4th watch sgt (MV) has been Sparring people left and right for anything and everything. On Monday she did not like the fact that 2 PO's went down on lunch approx. 2.5 miles from their post and, made them do a To-From explaining their lunch location decision. Ok MV, at 95th and the redline you tell me a location where to eat, where my lunch will not be spit on or jizzed on?
----------
Listen Kid,
EVERY restaurant has at LEAST 1 clown that will spit or "jizz" on coppers food.
This IS a democrat city and MANY people absolutely HATE the police.
Smarten up everyone.
DO NOT EAT OUT when you are on the job.
Bring your lunch to work and eat it at the station or in the car.
And YES, that was the sound of a zipper opening in the kitchen the last time you went to your favorite spot.
YUCK.
Increase & improve major airports' security and decrease local costs by making it a federal responsibility. (Think Israel.) Don't use an expanded TSA for it either. There would be issues to overcome, but consider having it be a U.S. military responsibility for any U.S. airport w international flights.
" Anonymous Anonymous said...
It was a civil matter just like an eviction. Is there something in the criminal code that it maybe a crime?
4/19/2017 06:16:00 PM"
Yes. It's trespassing. It goes from civil to criminal the moment the owner or agent on private property tells you to get out and you don't.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-animal-cruelty-dog-rescued-met-20170418-story.html#nt=oft13a-18gp1
Off Topic/CTA VSWO related.
It has been brought to my attention that a 4th watch sgt (MV) has been Sparring people left and right for anything and everything. On Monday she did not like the fact that 2 PO's went down on lunch approx. 2.5 miles from their post and, made them do a To-From explaining their lunch location decision. Ok MV, at 95th and the redline you tell me a location where to eat, where my lunch will not be spit on or jizzed on? Next time, you join me for lunch and I will watch you eat your meal first. Last year she was a fill in on the watch that I normally worked, so after one shift with her I cancelled the 2 other days to avoid her nonsense.
Cindy, watch how many less PO's sign up for the 4th watch with sgt MV. I can bet after this last incident of hers, less and less will sign up for this watch.
A-TEAM
4/19/2017 06:38:00 AM
Explain why in the fuck you would work straight time in the first place?
Then explain why in the fuck you feel the need to work 4th watch?
Then tell me why you aren't complete hand job?
Then maybe someone will give a fuck
Anonymous said...
Explain why in the fuck you would work straight time in the first place?
Then explain why in the fuck you feel the need to work 4th watch?
Then tell me why you aren't complete hand job?
Then maybe someone will give a fuck
4/20/2017 02:40:00 AM
________________________________________
For One Social Security Credits. Can't explain 4th Watch, but looks like you are the hand job!
Grau and Roy are now at Monterrey Security. I'll bet that firm gets the airport gig.
First of all, as a "Sergeant" in the CHICAGO POLICE DEPT. If I was "on scene" would have asked the following question: "Did the man violate the law in at anytime?" and "If this is "your" policy to remove him from the flight, then it is a "policy" decision and now is a "civil" matter. However, we will standby at the gate if you happen to violate his "civil Rights." Have a nice day.
You saw the incident, over and over and over...
Airport (clouted) manager, UA employees NOT one of them disciplined or fired.
Think that would happen in a CPD related incident.
"" Anonymous said...
How exactly do you get a person off an airplane that doesn't want to go? The policy might be stupid but if they say you got to go then you got to go. If they dump aviation police then guess who's going to be on the next viral video dragging a passenger who refuses to leave, yep CPD.
Since its a federal crime to refuse, tell the airline to request a TSA or FBI agent to remove them. ""
Federal crime?? GTFOH! First off the FBI wouldnt even show up, second when the plane is on the ground its ours, third it wasnt a fucking crime. That airplane could still be sitting on the tarmac for all I give a shit.
Cindy Sammy is way over her head in mass transit with her clique of girlfriends, the CTA red line is the death train!!
Now that we've seen this so called doctor being rightfully dragged out of the plane video so many times, it's time to make it an official preflight video onboard all airlines. This is what happens to you when you refuse a lawful order to deplane. Just say in'.
Oh please. I was offered a job too, and it was because an SEIU guy thought I was able to do something for him. I told him no thanks and took a test and got on an actual police department, like a normal person.
And thank god you turned it down so you can pedal around and fuck working class people. One of the true travesties, among many in this city, is that they give you tools a badge. You're not law enforcement, you're another guy that couldn't pass a test and a background.
4/19/2017 10:52:00 PM
*cracks knuckles and wades in*
There are so many hand jobs OTJ with CPD right now that you need to keep your pie hole firmly closed.
Speaking as someone that has met that dude...he'd surprise you in person. Polite and humble...but yes...you don't want him rolling down the block if you suddenly decided to park in the bus stop for the dry cleaners or on a hydrant to grab a quick coffee.
Let me say that again: Doing His Job.
You kids here (regardless of age or time OTJ) need to wrap your head around that fact.
Its a JOB. Its a Pension plan. Its Health Care. It is a Damn Pay Check on the 1st and the 16th.
And giving him shit for Not being a Cop...in this country in the current climate? When large numbers of cops around the country are going Fetal?
Moron I say you are....reproduce I say you should not.
" Anonymous Anonymous said...
It was a civil matter just like an eviction. Is there something in the criminal code that it maybe a crime?
4/19/2017 06:16:00 PM"
Yes. It's trespassing. It goes from civil to criminal the moment the owner or agent on private property tells you to get out and you don't.
Not to sure about that. Especially when you say eviction. Say you don't pay the rent, can the landlord, owner of the property come over and tell you to leave his property and if you don't have you charged with trespassing
Can't say you have a lease because you violated the lease by not paying your rent and even if you don't have a lease the landlord can't sign a complaint for trespassing. Dr had a ticket if that makes a difference. Just asking
All united has to do was increase the offer to leave the plane. Get to $1,000 or over and someone will take the offer
6:12 PM you are a tool
try removing a dead beat tenant from an apartment building that hasn't paid rent in two months , Dr. paid for his seat , was allowed entry , random selection my ass
this is a civil matter 19-p
Grau and Roy just cannot give it up!
They both have a bloated gold-braid pension, but it must not be enough.
Nothing, but two pompous, womanizers.
Grau was just able to keep it quiet. Roy got busted-out.
How exactly do you get a person off an airplane that doesn't want to go? The policy might be stupid but if they say you got to go then you got to go. If they dump aviation police then guess who's going to be on the next viral video dragging a passenger who refuses to leave, yep CPD.
4/19/2017 02:09:00 PM
A flight attendant uses the public address system and announces to the passengers in the cabin that the plane cannot and will not leave the airport until Mr/Mrs X disembarks. If the person does not immediately disembark, they will eventually leave the plane as a result of gentle persuasion provided by the other passengers. No muss, no fuss, no police involvement unless Mr/Mrs X becomes the victim of a battery initiated by a fellow passenger.
4/19/2017 07:59:00 PM
Congratulations. That is the stupidest thing I have read on here in a long time.
And the guys complaining about mass transit, agreed. I quit working it a couple of months ago.
Oh please. I was offered a job too, and it was because an SEIU guy thought I was able to do something for him. I told him no thanks and took a test and got on an actual police department, like a normal person.
And thank god you turned it down so you can pedal around and fuck working class people. One of the true travesties, among many in this city, is that they give you tools a badge. You're not law enforcement, you're another guy that couldn't pass a test and a background.
4/19/2017 10:52:00 PM
*cracks knuckles and wades in*
There are so many hand jobs OTJ with CPD right now that you need to keep your pie hole firmly closed.
Speaking as someone that has met that dude...he'd surprise you in person. Polite and humble...but yes...you don't want him rolling down the block if you suddenly decided to park in the bus stop for the dry cleaners or on a hydrant to grab a quick coffee.
Let me say that again: Doing His Job.
You kids here (regardless of age or time OTJ) need to wrap your head around that fact.
Its a JOB. Its a Pension plan. Its Health Care. It is a Damn Pay Check on the 1st and the 16th.
And giving him shit for Not being a Cop...in this country in the current climate? When large numbers of cops around the country are going Fetal?
Moron I say you are....reproduce I say you should not.
---------------------------
Thank you for making me spit my coffee all over with laughter. Thanks also for cracking your knuckles and wading in, big shot.
No one cares that he does his job, just like I do mine. The difference is, I earned my star, because I am a police officer. Not a revenue agent. They have not earned a star. Not one day will they ever have seen and done what I have to earn it.
You can get off the finance guy on a bike's sweaty balls now. I hope they were delicious.
Turn your fucking star in while you're at it, and get a job writing people tickets for bullshit. Don't worry, they'll give you a new star.
Congratulations. That is the stupidest thing I have read on here in a long time.
4/20/2017 06:29:00 PM
Oh, I am so sorry you failed to offer a solution to the problem. I am sure I would be in awe of your genius. Pompous ass.
Aviation Police or Special Police will not be disbanded. They are covered under a Federal mandate which outlines the requirements of that department, one of which they are certified State peace officers. They also are trained in TSA policies covering airport safety and security. They have to meet all these standards to be funded by the airlines, which covers their salary and expenses. A security firm would not meet these standards. Neither would CPD becasuse CPD are not a force that is strictly assigned to the airports. So neither would meet TSA and Homeland requirements. In turn Chicago would be in violation and the airlines would not be liable to pay the funding for salaries for either private security or CPD. It is sad that people start rumors without knowing any facts or policies regading Aviation Police.
Scc, the comments on this page are a joke. CPD think the city revolves around them and there is no one close to being as superior as them. During my CPD career, I worked with other departments that kicked ass. APD may have a few idiots, but CPD has a bunch of nitwits who run the other way when all hell breaks loose. All the comments based on rumors. I do know quite a few APD officers who I would feel great backing me up. Then there is the rumor that they were told months ago to take police off their uniforms. The order that was allegely mentioned by Ginger Evans is total bullshit. There was never anything put out regarding uniform changes. The brain dead bitch who has no clue lied through her teeth about that. I know there is some truthful information that comes through here, but there is some, as is this one, which is based on all rumors and they just pile up in the comments. Believe me, I have many people who know the facts of this situation and there are a multitude of facts that have not been brought out publicly. If they did come out it would make those who are chastising APD look like true idiots. Believe me this will go away soon and no heas will roll of the officers involved. It was more than a civil matter. Rahm has been told to shut his mouth and Ginger Evans thhe same thing.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
Now that we've seen this so called doctor being rightfully dragged out of the plane video so many times, it's time to make it an official preflight video onboard all airlines. This is what happens to you when you refuse a lawful order to deplane. Just say in'.
4/20/2017 09:31:00 AM
--------------------
Good plan there Benito. Look here -
Telling the doctor to get out was NOT a lawful order. NOT LAWFUL. Not rightful to touch or bother, much less drag him.
The guy had every contractual and legal right to be in his seat minding his own business. So STFU.
It - was - not - lawful. Write that backwards on your forehead so you can see it in the mirror.
Laws are important. It's what real cops deal with. It's not an easy job, which is why you should keep away.
Instead of Just say in' shit, you should try Just knowin' shit instead.
Thank you for making me spit my coffee all over with laughter. Thanks also for cracking your knuckles and wading in, big shot.
No one cares that he does his job, just like I do mine. The difference is, I earned my star, because I am a police officer. Not a revenue agent. They have not earned a star. Not one day will they ever have seen and done what I have to earn it.
You can get off the finance guy on a bike's sweaty balls now. I hope they were delicious.
Turn your fucking star in while you're at it, and get a job writing people tickets for bullshit. Don't worry, they'll give you a new star.
4/20/2017 10:51:00 PM
Screw you. I will not say the Finance guy that posts here from time to time is a fabulous person...but I have to agree with the prior poster...he isn't a Dick if you act like a person and don't go all "do you know who I am' all over him. I've heard from co-workers in 016 that if you get to him before the computer is printing...he is cool if it isn't a hydrant or HCP parking.
Anonymous said...
Anonymous Anonymous said...
Now that we've seen this so called doctor being rightfully dragged out of the plane video so many times, it's time to make it an official preflight video onboard all airlines. This is what happens to you when you refuse a lawful order to deplane. Just say in'.
4/20/2017 09:31:00 AM
--------------------
First, thanks to all the real cops who posted here and who understand the law.
As for the above: Good plan there Benito. Look -
Telling the doctor to get off the plane was NOT a lawful order. NOT LAWFUL. Not rightful to touch or bother, much less drag him.
The guy had every contractual and legal right to be in his seat minding his own business. So STFU.
It - was - not - lawful. Write that backwards on your forehead so you can see it in the mirror.
Laws are important. It's what real cops deal with. And it's not an easy job. That's why you should keep away.
Instead of Just say in' shit, you should try Just knowin' shit instead.
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