One of the Stupider Headlines
In the slum times today, the FBI is being criticized for waiting almost 24 hours to go into a farmhouse in Puerto Rico after a shootout with a subject wanted for an armored car heist in Connecticut. The subject opened fire on the agents as they arrived to arrest him for the 1983 robbery.
Boo Hoo. So a fugitive lay bleeding to death after HE SHOT at the feebs. Big freaking deal. If he's willing to buy chips in the game, he's going to suffer the consequence should he lose. Give us a break. So the FBI didn't rush in and heroically disarm a violent suspect without using any force. They're wrong? C'mon people - either we're allowed to enforce the law to the utmost (which would include returning deadly force with better aimed deadly force) or we might as well disarm and let the law of the jungle prevail. Sure, if they had a robot to go in and check the jagoff's pulse and blood pressure, maybe the media would have a point, but it doesn't appear this was the case. Why throw good people (yes, some feebs are good people) into harms way to preserve the life of a scumbag? The scene was secure; he couldn't escape; wait him out.
If it was up to us, EVERY SUSPECT who shot at the police would be REQUIRED to bleed out on the street corner as a warning to others.
Boo Hoo. So a fugitive lay bleeding to death after HE SHOT at the feebs. Big freaking deal. If he's willing to buy chips in the game, he's going to suffer the consequence should he lose. Give us a break. So the FBI didn't rush in and heroically disarm a violent suspect without using any force. They're wrong? C'mon people - either we're allowed to enforce the law to the utmost (which would include returning deadly force with better aimed deadly force) or we might as well disarm and let the law of the jungle prevail. Sure, if they had a robot to go in and check the jagoff's pulse and blood pressure, maybe the media would have a point, but it doesn't appear this was the case. Why throw good people (yes, some feebs are good people) into harms way to preserve the life of a scumbag? The scene was secure; he couldn't escape; wait him out.
If it was up to us, EVERY SUSPECT who shot at the police would be REQUIRED to bleed out on the street corner as a warning to others.
posted by SCC at 6:45 PM
24 Comments:
Funny, I don't remember anyone publicly criticizing them when they let Airhart lay there.
Nor did they say anything when the officers heroically pulled Marquez out of the line of fire, risking their own survival.
SLUM-TIMES SUCKS.
No one bellyached when the G left Joe Airhart bleeding on the floor at 1307 S. Wabash. My biggest regret is that I didn't punch the stupid cunt who was the case agent. She was lamenting her missed dinner date while we sat in the old county with Daniel Salley getting medical treatment. Fuck the G and fuck the media.
WHO SHOT FIRST? THE 72 YR OLD PERP? YEAH RIGHT! A POLITICAL ASSASINATION PURE + SIMPLE, HE WAS A P.R. SEPARATIST! THE FEDERALES STARTED BY POUNDING HIS CASA WITH 100 ROUNDS. HIS WIDOW WITNESSED IT ALL- HE PUT ON HIS UNIFORM AND EMPTIED HIS GUN OF 10 ROUNDS BACK AT THE DIRECTION OF THE ONSLAUGHT. FEEB SNIPER ERASED HIM WITH ONE TO THE CABESA- FORCED HIM TO BLEED OUT LIKE AN ANIMAL FOR A WHOLE DAY. HE WAS ON THE LAM FOR 22 YEARS, AND NOW THERES A RUSH TO TAKE HIM DOWN? THIS AINT THE WAY REAL BRAVE LAWMEN DO THINGS! SOUNDS JUST LIKE WACO + RUBY RIDGE TO ME! SAME CRAP FROM THE MORONS WHO COULDN'T STOP 9/11, ZODIAC, BTK, YOU NAME IT- PROFILE MY ASS FBI! WHEN THE LAW BREAK IN, HOW YOU GONNA GO, WITH YOUR HANDS ON YOUR HEAD OR ON THE TRIGGER OF YOUR GUN?
Save the drama for your mama, pendejo
"A POLITICAL ASSASINATION PURE + SIMPLE, HE WAS A P.R. SEPARATIST"
Do you really believe we are using the FBI to carry out political assasinations? While serving a Federal warrant? Why wouldn't the CIA just snipe the guy under the cover of darkness? They obviously knew where he was. And the FBI put over a hundred rounds into his house and the first thing this guy thought to do was put on his uniform? Did his wife tell you that? Better yet, the FBI is so vindictive that although they "know" he is mortally wounded, they're going to sit outside and let him suffer. Or could it be that they didn't know the extent of his injuries or the firepower he possessed and it was more tactically sound to wait him out?
Time to go back to your farm and clean your guns, they may be coming for you next.
Or better yet, get back to studying so you can get that worthless jounalism degree on daddy's dime so you can start changing the world while you look for a job. Eihter way, when it comes to real world experience, you a drastically overmatched on this site. If you are CPD, I'm counting the days to retirement.
P.S. You are probably on board with the "truth" that the current administration orchestrated 9/11 to give the U.S. a reason to go to war. I can't wait to read the book.
On an unrelated note, does anyone know if SIU or any P.D. was notified by the Archdiocese about the 11 child rapists they had on the payroll? They are mandatory reporters after all. It would be nice to know who they are now that they all have to find new hunting grounds. Dont put names on here unless you can link to the source.
Re: 7:28 PM
FBI "Profilers"???
Don't get me started!
Most big-city homicide detectives know that Madame Shaniqua's Psychic HotLine surpasses the FBI's BSU (Behavioral Science Unit aka the BullShit Unit) at Quantico in "profiling" serial killers.
The BSU has been on a free hyperbole trip with the American public ever since the FICTITIOUS Hannibal Lecter and "The Silence of the Lambs". People actually believe their bullshit.
Even if and when the "profilers" prove accurate, they merely winnow the suspect pool down from a million to 10,000.
Aside from NYC's "Mad Bomber" circa 50 years ago, I defy anyone to document any SUBSTANTIVE success by FBI "profilers" which actually resulted in identifying an unknown serial murderer.
Aside from the 1957 arrest of George Metesky, skepticism in FBI profilers is appropriate.
In all fairness, Quantico does serve a useful purpose as a clearinghouse in connecting homicides that cross jurisdictional and state boundaries.
All l/e agencies submit their responses to a lengthy VICAP questionnaire which can link separate interstate homicides based on modus operandi, body disposal, "trophies" or souvenirs, staging, etc.
Does the CPD participate in VICAP reporting? I don't think so!
Well, its not directly related, but in terms of "information" that can be used to identify offenders, I've thought for a long time that it was funny how few Chicago POs fill out contact cards that are entered into the system. Until recent years that is.
You catch a gangbanger in a car with 3 associates, you are providing useful information for later as to the 3 acquaintances when the gangbanger is arrested for something. If this was done consistently, and entered into the system, it would provide valuable leads... but nooooo, too many of our own couldn't be bothered.
In the 90's, you ran a name check on a hard-core gangbanger, and you might get 5 or 15 contact stops listing vehicles, locations, affiliations, acquaintances etc. And they'd all be from the ISP or some suburban or distant jurisdictions. And this is for Chicago gangbangers.
Which is and was a shame. We are the best source of information and leads for these savages, and we just couldn't be bothered to write it down and enter it into the system. And God forbid one of our brainless bosses in any of the ivory tower positions saw the actual usefulness in making this mandatory back then.
Which ties into profiling in a way. Profiling can be done by regression analysis, where you take known quantities from the past and find the closest correlations. Put in 500 characteristics of 100 serial or spree killers, and 500 characteristics of 100 regular Joes, and you'll find the most predictable characteristics (leads, indicators) of the serial or spree killers.
Boston did it to identify and intervene with the youth most likely to commit murders, and it worked wonders. I think they actually went several years in the 90s without a single homicide committed by anyone under 18.
Which is to say, if any of our test-taking geniuses had the sense they were born with, they would have found solutions to a lot of our problems a long time ago.
Laugh awhile you can at the FBI monkey-boys, but there is some use to collecting and analyzing information from known quantities. Attempts at profiling are just one of em. Some like the FBI's don't produce too many great results. Some like Boston's do.
Come to think of it, isn't this how states are justifying keeping certain sex offenders behind bars beyond their sentences?
Mmmm hmmm
GOOD COMEBACKS ALL U MODIFIED THREAD-WEAVERZ- AH WUZ JUST TILTING AT S.C.C.'S WINDMILLS! I LOVE A GOOD FUGGIN ARGUMINT! NICE INFORMATIVE + INTEREZTIN POSTS- AH JUST WANNA ENTER DA DOGGZ DAMM NAME + INFO O-N-C-E AND GET E-V-E-R-Y-T-H-I-N' KNOWN ABOUT HIM BAKK SIMPLY + QUICKLY + E-Z 2 D'CIPH-R! IZ DAT 2 MUCH 2 ASKK?
COME OUT WITCHER HANDZ UPPPP! ;-P WHADDA GR8 DAY 2 B A CHEEGAHGAH PO-LEECE ORFISER! DUWAY JAKK!- STAY SAFE! ----"NOT "FULL" NELSON"! ;->
The lack of gang databases had to do with the 1st Amendment consent decree. Now that its been revised we can start collecting data.
I realize the implications of the 1st amendments cases resulting from the old Red Squad activities. But contact cards were out there. If the city realized their value, they could have brought it up with the judge. Hell, they could have limited the input to information from district POs and SOS (i.e., no specialized units) and it would have been 3/4 of they way there.
They did bring it up, several times. The courts agreeing to change the decree came down to a "generational" turnover on the CPD. Yes the cards were out there, but a list would have been a violation. To say that a cop from this unit can look at the data and one from that can't is impractical and unbelievable. What is district law enforcement going to do with a list of GD's anyway? Lock them up for gang loitering? Units that conduct long term investigations need that info a lot more than I did cruising around BT 2535. If the courts perceived a violation of the agreement then the data would have been gone anyway and you run the risk of having a binding consent decree like L.A. and Cincinnati. Do you want the G to oversee everything we do?
With respect to the collection of information, if they set an outright ban on activities, some of which hinder our ability to operate, than I'd rather bang that the city bang its head against the wall at least onece a day until the ban is lifted.
You sound like you are familiar with this issue, but I gotta ask... are you sure that this information would have been a violation? The information from other agencies was constantly coming up. Should I have averted my eyes? That is, of course, a rhetorical question.
The actual question becomes, did they actually prohibit Chicago from entering data? Because data from Chicago came up sometimes. Just nowhere near as often as data from other places, particularly the Illinois State Police gang units.
If Chicago was banned from entering or retrieving this data, I think it would have been quite easy to throw right back at the judge that he was preventing us from doing what numerous other jurisdictions were doing.
And I hope you aren't saying that, e.g., Chicago gang investigators were prohibited from creating organizational charts.
The fact that other departments were doing this was also part of the city's challenge to the decree. I would have to say that 9/11 was the real cornerstone in getting the thing changed.
Organizational charts on gangs could be kept as part of an ongoing investigation but not for intelligence gathering. I'm not saying it didn't go on below the radar, but the department was enjoined to prohibit it. The old 1st amendment decree was based on the right to free association and all the stuff from the red squad.
The modification of the decree is what has allowed us to push things like ICLEAR forward. Intelligence was pushed out of its traditional role of driving around behind Joey Lombardo. Gang Intelligence is a direct outgrowth of the modification. I'm sure the People's Law Office and First Defense Legal Aid are intensely monitoring our efforts to gather information on gangs. I wouldn't be surprised to see them back in court claiming we've violated the modified decree.
Check out this story about how the President has allowed the nation's deficit to spiral out of control. Please read before slamming.
http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticleSearch.aspx?storyID=14556+25-Sep-2005+RTRS&srch=Greenspan
You sound like you know what you are talking about, so I'll leave it with the honest assessment that I have no retort worth writing.
Its interesting though that your answer shows other problems with Chicago's handling of the situation. The Red Squads went overboard... but that's what happens in a city run like Chicago. The lawyers and the (Federal) judge botched the response, as shown by the burdensome prohibitions which (as you note) have now been withdrawn.
In terms of the 1st amendment (and this even relates to Sullivan), there are two specific incidents to note that others might find useful information. In the '96 DNC, there were allegations (largely substantiated) that a bunch of peaceful marchers and protesters were rounded up and arrested. Not positive, but I think an exempt actually showed up at court for a bunch of d/cs. Yes your honor, these 50 people were really, really disorderly in their political protest. Not sure, but I don't think it went to a federal judge. If it did, the city would have had a lot of egg on its face.
Meantime, a year or two ago, Ramsey's people in DC surrounded a park with 1000 or so protesters, bums, passers-by and what have you. They refused to let anyone leave for an hour, and then arrested everyone for refusing a lawful order to disperse. Except no lawful order to disperse was ever given, nor was any opportunity provided.
Supposedly, a senior officer of the National Park Service police instructed his contingent to take no part in the unlawful roundup.
At the time, the mayor and our boy Ramsey both loudly proclaimed how validated the action was. Turns out they were arresting, among others, one or two Justice Department lawyers etc. Total fiasco. DC actually had to promise never to do this again.
Anyway, I'm not sure what POs are supposed to do if some political exempt orders us to round up a bunch of peaceful protesters/marchers etc. But man is that ever a scene I don't ever want my name being associated with.
I'm a Republican, and these roundups were both roundups by Democrats of Democrats. Regardless of who does it to who, its still something that is so far over the top that I can't believe we are ever put into position to do this.
Next time there are massive rallies or protests here (DNC or whatever), the FOP oughtta get a few volunteer lawyers (i.e., not POs who are subject to retaliation) and ask them to monitor and ensure that we aren't being ordered to engage in unlawful/unconstitutional acts.
Just saying, the whole culture of this department is to screw things up as much as possible.
TO 7:28 PM ...U AIN'T CPD...WE DON'T SAY PERP, JAGOFF...
TO LEFTISBEST: GET OFF OF YOUR HATRED W/ GEORGE BUSH. THIS INNER SEETHING HATRED U HAVE FOR GW IS GONNA BURN U OUT. FEDERALL DEFECIT? DO U HAVE A MORTGAGE? IF SO U HAVE A DEFECIT! WHAT ABOUT DALEY AND THE CITY DEFECIT? WHAT SAY U? OH I FORGOT, HE'S A DEMOCRAT SO IT'S OK. YOU MUST LET GO OF YOUR HATRED. TAKE A BREATH AND GET SOME SELF CONTROL OF YOUR EMOTIONS OR GET SOME MEDS. THE HATRED U DISPLAY IS NOT HEALTHY.
7:04:28 PM
Having served most of my career in the CPD Detective Division, you are misinformed. In conversations, many dicks use the monosyllables "perp" and "vic". However, the report will read "offender" and "victim".
Aren't you being a bit harsh on the person you summarily described as a "jagoff"? Perhaps you are passive-aggressive with personal issues. Your inane nitpicking no doubt elevates your low self-esteem.
To Northside:
What detectives say "Perp" except the actors on NYPD Blue?
I only hear "offender" or "shithead" being used. Go buy another $1000 suit while I hunt "perps" in my $24 Dockers.
HEY CYBER-WORLD LINGO POLICE (12:26) - YOU'RE a TWERP- ON YOUR KNEES + SLURP! (BURPPP!)
JOHNNY NORTHSIDE IS THE M-A-N!
If what happened in Puerto Rico, happened in Chicago Chicago Police Offices would be Indicted for Violation of Civil Rights and go to jail BUT since its our Clorious FBI nothing will happen it will swept under carpet.
<< Home