Violation of Eavesdropping Law?
Hey J-Fed, get your crack legal team working on this one. See if you can win back the hearts and minds of some of the people you purportedly have the backs of:
- (720 ILCS 5/14‑2) (from Ch. 38, par. 14‑2)
Sec. 14‑2. Elements of the offense; affirmative defense.
(a) A person commits eavesdropping when he:
(1) Knowingly and intentionally uses an
eavesdropping device for the purpose of hearing or recording all or any part of any conversation or intercepts, retains, or transcribes electronic communication unless he does so with the consent of all of the parties to such conversation or electronic communication
Now, we noticed someone in another comment section say, "On the public way. Fair game."
But it's not.
It's on CTA property. A bus is not the public way because to have access to it, you have to pay a fare. And the CTA already monitors it's property via closed circuit cameras. So it would appear that what we have here is evidence of an Officer doing his job by removing a non-compliant subject from a public conveyance AND a violation of Illinois Eavesdropping Law.
Anyone want to bet which way J-Fed, the Department legal team and the Cook County State's Attorney go?
But it's not.
It's on CTA property. A bus is not the public way because to have access to it, you have to pay a fare. And the CTA already monitors it's property via closed circuit cameras. So it would appear that what we have here is evidence of an Officer doing his job by removing a non-compliant subject from a public conveyance AND a violation of Illinois Eavesdropping Law.
Anyone want to bet which way J-Fed, the Department legal team and the Cook County State's Attorney go?
Labels: from the comments
posted by SCC at 7:14 AM
117 Comments:
I understand that the offender kicked the P.O. Prior to any use of force.
ohhh hellll noooo!
There have been issues about the CTA and recording devices before. Last year the CTA Tattler, which usually is in direct communications with the CTA, posted the CTA rules regarding such devices. Using a handheld device (my only interest was a digital camera since I blog) is allowed, using a set up where you have a tripod is not.
mute the sound and its fine! eavesdropping really! don't waste your time on this. direct it at the media who imply that the officer did something wrong. i can't imagine any other way to handle that situation.
Looks like early retirement for the poor officer just doing his job.
ALMOST SEEMS LIKE THIS WAS INTENTIONALLY DONE. I MEAN WHY IS THE M/2 SITTING ON THE BACK OF THE BUS, WAITING TO VIDEO THE POLICE.HHMMMM. DID THE CTA DRIVER MAKE AN ANNOUNCEMENT WERE NOT MOVING TILL THE POLICE SHOW UP.SEEMS ODD THAT THIS GUY VIDEOING AND THE BUM ARE ON THE SAME BUS.
forget j-fed he'll never have our backs,but why dose'nt the fop make a statment on our behalf ,ever!!!!!!!!
If he is a no clout blue shirt he will be thrown under the bus.
If the bus does not do a good enough job the first time he will be thrown once more.
I didn't make the initial comment but I'm going to jump in on side of the writer who stated that there was no violation. CTA may be "private property" but it is still accessible to the public for a minimal fee - more importantly, the officer had no expectation of privacy while in the performance of his duty. Anything a police officer does while on-duty is open to public scrutiny including the recording of his statements. A citizen holding up a cellphone or camera is not hiding their actions so the recording is not being made secretly hence no violation of the evesdropping statutes. Furthermore the officer is not involved in private conduct, he is doing the public's business. Case out of Calumet City more than 20 years ago involving a secret recording by an offender in the backseat of a police squadrol made this finding, just can't remember the name of the case right now.
I am ashamed to admit it but if Jody does do the right thing here and go after this moron, I very well may just start being a little proactive again. If he does not and decides it's best to go after this officer I will infact feel sick and have to go on the medical with that pesky bug that will be going around. I believe it's called the "blue flu." Be very careful on this one Jody cause I don't think I'll be the only one coming down with something and you know what'll happen to this city in just one day if the only one's that show up to work are the kiss ass house mouse. Just imagine day two when the word gets out.
Lots of car crashes last night due to ICE and city refused to salt!
Tell us about yr district!
That is just petty and would end up causing another lawsuit award against the city. Because it was publicly broadcast immediately and obviously intended for journalistic purposes, the case would get nowhere. Take a look at the Champaign case from a few years ago.
could this be the worst case of to trying to accuse a P.O. of misconduct yet?
I don't think the officer did anything wrong and handled the situation properly. However, we must wake up to the fact that the "public" and media don't want the police to talk roughly to anyone, let alone put their hands on anyone. Its always going to be portrayed as excessive. The handwriting is on the wall, don't do anything. Look at the number one priority for our wonderful new US Attorney General. Civil Rights investigations and prosecutions are his number one priority. How many more Cozzi's must there be, before you wake up. Collect your paycheck do what you can to avoid interactions with scum that will put your and your families financial well being in jeporady.
What a piece of crap this guy is from ChicagoCopWatch! How soon we forget what happened to Officer Richard Francis. Same district same circumstances. How come the Slum Times doesn't link this video to their article (http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=news/local&id=6240518)
Lets see...the officer showed great restraint waiting 42 seconds before even laying hands on dude....kudos!!!!!! j-fed and the aldercreatures will want him fired for cursing at the drunkin a#^hole.
Breaking new on Yahoo. Illinois House to consider concealed carry.
First time you watch the bus video you find it interesting . As you analyze it you find that it appears to be a set up all the way. Good point about the eavesdropping law. However, do you think the Dept will pursue this as dilligently as it does the deception and lies associated with the sworn avadavit? Cop Watch needs to be put in their place. This would be an excellent case to pursue. How about it Jody, do you have our back on this one?
OT-
February 19, 2009 (WLS) -- An Illinois House panel is recommending bills that would give residents the right to carry concealed weapons.
The proposal is expected to draw fire from Chicago-area lawmakers, who have expressed concern about increased gun violence.
Last summer, the U.S. Supreme Court overturned a handgun ban in Washington D.C.
Chicago is fighting the ruling.
SCC,
that's a stretch. Cameras are everywhere. Get freakin used to it. Public conveyance=public way.
If you want to be a defense lawyer be a lawyer. Otherwise stick to sarcasm. At least it's more honest.
That being said I didn't see anything horrible on the CTA bus tape. It's hardly Abbate in the bar or the Jefferson Tap Rangers ruining their careers.
To quote that great Irishman Liam Shakespeare "it's much ado about nothing, belch".
Anyone that has been to the in car camera training will tell you that you have to turn off the sound (but you can still record video) for non-IVC related stops to prevent the Department from getting sued.
An example of this would be getting a hand waver for a domestic on the side of the road and turning on the mars lights which activates the video, but you have to shut off the audio to prevent you from recording sound.
Roe Conn is on Mancows show almost everyday. Roe Conn is afraid. Mancow is the best local radio show on.
Expectation of privacy. I was part of a few wires before I retired and that was always a primary consideration. They used to sell tricked out surveillance vans with microphones on the outside. Cannot be used in the state because of our wire tap laws.
In fact, there is an expectation of privacy extends to those walkie talkies that the local drug dealers use. Intercepting those conversations is illegal, this came up at a meeting and I was trying to tell some hard headed exempt that his officers were in violation of the law and at least do not put it on paper. He did not believe me until an asa called him. It came to my attention after reading a tact
report.
be careful out there
The public way in Illinois does not matter. You still have to have all parties involved give their consent. I does not specify anything about the public way.
Interesting last name on the "Copwatch" kid - Thayer. There is another Thayer (Andy) who works for one of the most prevalent cop-suing firms in town (Loevy & Loevy). Relatives, perhaps?
Watch out citizens of Chicago - they are coming for your hard-earned tax $$$ with this nonsense. What a bunch of BS.
Not to play devil's advocate, but I believe the courts have many times stated that privacy is determined by reasonable expectation. Being on a bus that is open to the public, does one reasonably have an expectation of privacy. This is a bus with windows, other people, and closed circuit video. Probably not. Reasonably, I don't think it is privacy.
This, however, does not mean that the police officer did anything wrong and the fact that we as a society are bringing up an officer's lawful actions says something else about society.
Sorry, SCC, but your statute reading skills are off. The statute requires the use of an eavesdropping device to access the conversion. That wasn't required or used here.
I believe that there was a case where an offender tape recorded a conversation between two officers or the officers and himself when he was in the back of a squad car. He was charged with eavesdropping but the court ruled that it was not eavesdropping because a tape recorder is not an eavesdropping device.
So, folks, if you are speaking load enough to be heard without the use of a device, you're fair game. Always keep in mind that anything you do in public could end up on YouTube and act accordingly.
When does this madness stop. I am a former CPD Officer now working in an outside agency. I still live in the City and weep for the CPD.
This City is getting more and more dangerous by the day with criminals brazenly now committing acts in areas that used to be veiwed as safe havens.
All the liberals out there should keep up the good work in the de-powering of our City's Police.
Just remember to sign the "Held Harmless" waiver releasing the Police of any responsibility when you fall vicitm to the same people who's rights you are trying to protect.
There are no more real-police because the cowards in the Administation (City/CPD) are too busy placating the special interest, and discouraging working Cops from being proactive.
A frustrated PO/Resident, CPD Class 91-8
Unfortuneately, I believe there has to be an expectation of privacy as well. And when you are in public, having an interaction with another individual, there goes the expectation of privacy.
I will never forget one of our instructors in the academy (27 years ago)use an example of two people communicating with flags - one standing on top of the Hancock Building, the other on the Sears Tower - because it is in public, there is no expectation of privacy. His symbolism worked as I've never forgotten it as a general rule.
So, as much as it is disgusting what people do with their phones when we're in public, i don't think it's eavesdropping. But I'm not a lawyer, and I may be wrong.
You guys really like to have it both ways, don't you? The poor wittle police officer was removing a criminal from a "public conveyance", but the big, bad cameraman was illegally taping on PRIVATE PROPERTY. Get real guys!
Courts and civil liberties lawyers consider public transportation the "public way." Even police reports consider them public way: http://chicago.everyblock.com/crime/by-date/2008/11/29/1651953/
What if the cameraman had been off the bus taping the incident through the window? THEN it would have been legal, but not if the guy was on the bus?
And what is with the knee-jerk reaction to cops being taped by civilians? Especially in this case: just about every comment I've seen on the subject indicates the public has the cop's back here. From looking at the video, it is sure clear to me that the cop acted appropriately. If the cops are following the law and acting appropriately, why are you so afraid of being taped while performing your duty?
Filming, taping audio or taking a picture of a cop on public property is NOT a crime, no matter how much you guys might like it to be. Further, public modes of transportation are largely considered the public way. You guys are just very, very wrong on this one.
Finally, I get your MO here: protect your own. But do you have any idea about how your knee jerk reaction to simply being filmed hurts public perception of the police force? It gives the impression that you have something to hide, that you can't do your job unless you do it in a secretive manner. It makes the public distrust you. It is, plain and simple, bad PR for you. In the long run, such moves make it much harder for you to do your jobs. IOW, it is just stupid.
But by all means, keep trying to fight the public and constitution. I'm sure that'll work out REAL well for you. :rolleyes:
I'm the 'public way, fair game', person. I was responding to a post that half-described the incident, and hadn't seen the video. I'm still going to say that, if the scene is visible/audible from the public way, it's admissable. If it ended outside the bus, on the street, even more so.
I'm not on the side of the video-goof. I'm just thinking this is the way it'll be decided. (I bet he really gets off on seeing he's become the topic of an SCC post, too.)
I can't WAIT for Video-goof to become a victim. I hope someone videos the entire incident and, like he does, fails to go to his assistance. What a mush.
Barry O and Jfed boyh came to power with great fan fair. Both are lessons in failure. Both are in way over there heads.
hay all you yuppie haters. 35% of sickcagos population pays over 50% of taxes. if they leave and move to burbs who is going to pay the bills. some cops hate the rich just like our new messiah. you hate the rich because your whole life has been an abject failure. so bring in this two movers a week hero.
Who cares nothing is going to happen to po. Copper did his job according to use of force. Here OPS heres your fuckin to-from.....
First of all, legal or not, as a matter of public policy, not being able to record public employees doing their job on the public dime is bullshit.
Second, there's no expectation of privacy on a public bus. The criminal code may not say anything about this, but it matters in court.
Third, there's freedom of the press. Photography has long been a protected right, and video along with it. Consequently, as perverse as it sounds, court decisions tend to give more First Amendment protection to video with audio than to audio alone.
As for the incident itself, I think the media coverage boils down to "Oooh! We got video! Let's roll with it!"
Meh.
My bet? The poor po goes to callback while IPRA or IAD take 6 months to investigate a log #. Then they file an extension and take another 6 months. Then they turn it into a cr #. Another 6 months later it is unfounded. PO issued fast-food hat and dumped to 3. Then again, I'm cynical....
The wrong way, of course!
But Brain Trust the CTA may not be a public way.... But it is a public accomodation which kills your theory... US Supreme Court has already ruled that you have NO EXPECTATION of privacy in public.
SCC....
YOU ARE THE MAN!!! You've just handed out much food for thought.
I would love to see this geek-squad, with their liberal arts degrees and no REAL jobs, get their just deserves!
These men and women have enough to contend with without having to deal with these media-wannabe whores! My guess would be they are up to their eyeballs in student loans due to be paid! If their intentions were sincere, I might have a tendency to look at this in a little different light. This country thrives on sensationalism, and the media is the generator of all this crap. These people are lying in wait in an attempt to grab that one video that might generate some bucks and their 15 minutes of fame! Leave these officers ALONE, and let them do the job that they were hired to do. Instead of trying to destroy their careers, how about using that camera to MAKE THEIR JOB A LITTEL EASIER, film a rape or robbery in progress! Position yourself where there is NO obvious police presence, you cowards! See what you can catch on film there! OH... and don't forget, at the end of your taping... ask the "person in question" for his NAME AND SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER, in the same manner you asked the Officer for his badge number. I'm sure he will be more than willing to comply with your request!
This whole fiasco is infuriating!!! What a bunch of loser a**h***s!!!
The issue is the recording of AUDIO conversations. That is why the vast majority of security cameras (including the ones on CTA buses) only show video.
The guy who recorded the officer will argue that the cop wasn't being "secretly" recorded.
My feeling is that this was all a setup. The recorder and arrestee were working together to secretly record an officer's response to a staged incident.
If that's the case, then the officer was secretly recorded (audio) and that violates the law.
The law has a civil provision. That is the way this law is usually enforced anyway, so the officer can go ahead and sue the recorder.
If you are talking about the incident on the bus then the area dets should be notified and arrest the person recording the audio and vocal.
British Government makes it a criminal offence - punishable with a jail term of up to 10 years - to take a picture of a policeman
Hmmmmm. Lets see. The bum's gonna sue the City and win. The copper's gonna take some time and take a refresher course at the academy for Verbal Judo. JFed will apologize to the public for the officers conduct. AND IT GOES ON AND ON AND ON!!! That's how I think it'll pan out. reality sucks doesn't it.
I know a set up when I see one. This guy just happens to be on the bus when this bustout get on and refuses to pay? A blind man can see it, but will J-Fed.
Come on let us keep dreaming. A better idea is to have the FOP take up the officer's case and file a las siut agains this guy for false statements posted on the video that could have resulted in the loss of the officer's job and status in his profession. The asswipe gives his name and website address in the tribune article. Go after this fuck civilly and then let's see how funny he thinks it is to post lies.
The best we can hope from Wies is the officer gets a five day suspension and re-training . Remember the video, Wies and Dugan have our back. Time to show it. I dont want anything other then a press conference with those two tools standing up in front of the cameras defending the officer.
If J-Fed has a set he will come on TV and stand up for his officer's actions.....My guess is he will not do this.
He should also scold the media for not playing the entire clip which was posted on the tribune site.
FOX starts their clip right as the officer puts hands on...leaving out the repeated verbal commands to get off the bus
Why is it that when the African American officers came on the bus the vagrant calmed down? Was he looking for some $$$$$$$$$$$$ off of the next white boy in blue he can find. Does he know the guy with the camera? Maybe they should examine footage from the moment the camera guy and the offender got on the bus. The whole thing seems a little suspicious. The Officer was unproffesional but he never hurt the offender. It appeared that at one point the Offender was trying to put his hands on the officer.
OH YEAH! BUT WHO'S GONNA MAKE IT STICK THOUGH?
CAMERA PHONES ARE NICE BUT USERS
CAN BE IDIOTS TOO,AS SEEN.
I HEARD THIS CAMERA PHONE USER HAS
A POLICE WATCH BLOG OR SOME ANTI-POLICE ORG.....
IT SEEMS THE EAVESDROPPER AND THE
OFFENDER WERE LUCKILY BROUGHT
TOGETHER BY THE FORCES OF THE EVER
REACHING UNIVERSE TO THAT VERY SPOT ON THE BUS ON THAT VERY DAY,AT
THAT VERY MOMENT TO SHOW THE WORLD A,
(CHICAGO POLICE OFFICER)
DOING HIS JOB.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I WONDER WHAT THE ODDS WOULD HAVE
BEEN OF THIS EVER HAPPENING.
SMELLS LIKE A "GOTCHA COPPPER"!!!
AND THE BEAT GOES ON>>>>>>>>
JUST SAYIN
The arrest on the Division St. bus was much ado about nothing. The deadbeat could have got off as a 5-Paul, compliments of 1892A--a fine officer. But nooooooooooooooo. 5-Robert it is.
For the squeamish who enjoy eating sausage, they probably would not want to watch how that sausage was made.
RIP, PO Rick Francis, 019th Dist.
"public way fair game" is bullshit anyway. the law is extremely complex, but that wouldn't matter in any administrative capacity.
10 hr days rock by the way. just finished my weekends 12 out 20 days off. Who that fucking idiot who types anti-ten hour day propaganda is a jag off. Most likely an obese Lt from a A2(005 3rd watch) district that use to dye his hair black in a feeble attempt to recapture his youth for the ladies. His only problem is that he is 5'8" weigh 400lbs and is ugly as the genital wart that lives on my nutz.
The COP was just doing great until he pushed the dummy head against the bus.....should have just grabbed his ass and pulled him from the bus and saved the verbal judo.. When will Chicago cop's learn that drunks are beligerent, loud, stupid and smelly.....arguing with one is a waste of time. The Officer clearly had control of the siuation, but allowed it to regress to childish taunting....just take the guy by the scruff of the nape and eject him....this cop was more then bigger enough
There are specific laws pertaining to Public Vehicles called the Omnibus act. Clearly this officer acted in accordance with that. The offender should at very least get a smack and a contact card. Sounds like a 5-F to me. I mean what elses could ACTUALLY apply here? an actually crime? Shortshanks would never tollerate ACTUAL EVENT REPORTING GOD FOR BID!
The CTA expressly allows photos and videos to be taken in all public areas on CTA property:
http://www.transitchicago.com/business/photopolicy.aspx
Note the word "public" above. Individuals in public places on CTA property cannot be reasonably assume privacy. You are just wrong.
Please update with any discipline this officer receives. If he even gets one day, I'm done!
Notice this asshole didn't put his movie set in 011 or 002 district.This pansy-assed little prick knows he'd have a gun shoved up a nostril and would be handing over his camera while he's pissing and shitting his pants. I'm surprised he didn't do it in front of a police station.
He just wanted his 15 minutes of fame. I think as punishment he should be sentenced to walk through 011, up and down every street, on a hot July night for a month. If he's still alive, I'll bet he'd become a Republican.
Now he's gonna confront the police, commit a crime, and then file a civil rights beef that he was arrested because of his video. Now the ghetto lottery is for liberal-assed yuppies too.
What a city. We're doomed.
An off-duty Chicago police exchanged gunfire this afternoon with at least one person who broke into the officer's Southwest Side home.
No injuries were reported.
Police said "armed offenders" broke into the officer's home about 12:35 p.m. near 57th Street and Homan Avenue. The suspects fled the scene.
Anyone want to bet which way J-Fed, the Department legal team and the Cook County State's Attorney go?
Ummm...they'll do absolutely nothing?
High drama on Channel 7 News just this moment -- lead story! The city's multi-zillion-dollar network of surveillance cameras linked to 911 dispatch swung into action and was used to apprehend a bum taking change out of a Salvation Army kettle in front of Marshall Field's! Actual on-the-spot, moment-by-moment footage!
I need my nitroglycerin pills! (gasp)
This footage accompanied a press conference in which Daley reiterated his "Camera On Every Corner" ideas.
I have the most awful feeling that this was the best piece of film they had to show us...
Spencer Thayer, I wish some street bum would just steal your camera so the public would not be subjected to your mental paranoia on you tube.
watch this for all you dummy bus riders
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTBskrO9nV8
WE ALREADY LOST ONE OFFICER TO ONE OF THESE HOMELESS NUT JOBS ON A BUS THIS YEAR. I COMMEND THIS COPPER FOR TAKING THIS POS OFF THE BUS BYHIM SELF. NOTHING HE DID ON THE VIDEO DEVIATED FROM DEPARTMENT PROTOCALL OR ANY OF THE GO'S OR USE OF FORCE MODEL. AS FOR THE COWARD ON THE BUS WITH THE VIDEO CAMERA, HE IS THE FIRST PERSON TO COMPLAIN WHEN HE DOES NOT GET THE SERVICE THAT HE DEEMS PROPER WHEN HE NEEDS THE POLICE. WOULD BE INTERESTING TO SEE HIS REACTION WHEN ONE OF THESE HYPE S PULL A KNIFE ON HIS LIBERAL BLEEDING HEART FAMILY OR LOVED ONES. I FOR ONE HAVE THIS COPPERS BACK. REMEMBER THIS GUY (THE BUM) WAS THE OFFENDER WHO WAS RESISTING THE ARREST. I HOPE HE WAS ALSO CHARGED WITH THAT, AND IF OPS TRIES TO PUT THE SCREWS TO THIS GUY IT WILL BE A REAL SHAME. JODY SHOULD COME FOWARD AND PUBLICLY SUPPORT THIS GUY IF HE WANTS TO MAKE HEADWAY WITH THE BLUE SHIRTS.
RIP OFFICER FRANCIS
STAY SAFE OUT THERE AND BACK EACH OTHER UP
We need to followup on this. If this Officer takes so much as one second in punishment, then I say it's time put on the blinders and do no more. And I will lead the charge. SCC, can you, without publicly identifying him, keep this thing alive? As they say in the CAPS Office, can you track this?
OK folks, here"s my comment that will certainly cause a stir. Talked to my galpal who's got a legal background and is pro-police. She says that most CTA buses have it posted on there nowadays that they are under surveillance. If it's posted that is notfication enought to all entering or on the bus for any reason - working it or just riding it - that they are being recorded and it doesn't have to specify video or audio in order to be clean surveillance.
Just maybe the filmer of this incident was a 14 year old boy posing as an undercover FBI agent who was doing a video surviellance.
Now that would be a classic!
DE-POLICIONG ON THE CTA UNTIL OUR BROTHER IS vindicated!
“CTA Photo & Video Policy
The general public is permitted to use hand-held cameras to take photographs, capture digital images, and videotape within public areas of CTA stations and transit vehicles for personal, non-commercial use. Large cameras, photo or video equipment, or ancillary equipment such as lighting, tripods, cables, etc. are prohibited (except in instances where commercial and professional photographers enter into contractual agreements with CTA). All photographers and videographers are prohibited from entering, photographing, or videotaping non-public areas of the CTA’s transit system. All photographers and videographers are prohibited from impeding customer traffic flow, obstructing transit operations, interfering with customers, blocking doors or stairs, and affecting the safety of CTA, its employees, or customers. All photographers and videographers must fully and immediately comply with any requests, directions, or instructions of CTA personnel related to safety concerns.”
From, http://www.transitchicago.com/business/photopolicy.aspx
forget j-fed he'll never have our backs,but why dose'nt the fop make a statment on our behalf ,ever!!!!!!!!
2/19/2009 08:14:00 AM
Because Daley won't let him!
i seen better beatings on the tv show COPS.
good job officer.
i would have tasered his ass.
Hey 11:34 and 12:02, Please do us all a favor and stay the fuck off this blog. I realize the thread is headed about the legality of the tape, but I don't think that is either here nor there! It's more about the public and jagoffs like you who play monday morning policemen and second guess our every move.
I don't know if you're the police, but god I hope not, b/c I would rather have backup from that 14 year old than have a fucking liberal, no working ,asshole like you on my side.
It's the going to work and seeing and handling situations day in and day out that the public has no idea how dangerous, disgusting or challenging they are and then being scrutinized and persecuted for not doing them the way the public or some worthless fucking pastor deems right.
Now, I imagine you are going to say yes this is our job and this is what we are supposed to do, but we didn't sign up to have some liberal asshole split hairs over how it should have been handled when he wasn't there.
Like i said , I truly hope you guys aren't the police b/c you're both garbage. You seem more like the worthless, liberal fuck media who poach stories from this blog. Either way, FUCK YOU and stay off the blog.
But by all means, keep trying to fight the public and constitution. I'm sure that'll work out REAL well for you. :rolleyes:
2/19/2009 11:34:00 AM
Get off this blog you stump-headed moron!
This M/1 piss bum was an offender! The second he failed to pay his fare, thats why he was being kicked off. The officer used too much restraint the second the guy refused to leave the bus. Place him under arrest and if he uses use all necessary force. 1892 did a good job but he was givng that piss bum too much opportunity to comply.
THE problem with the brass of this department is none of them will stand up and say that they did nothing wrong. They will happily jump and defend Bea Cuello but I have not seen Jody say anything about this lowly PO just doing his job. If they want respect they will "have our backs." This administration is so clueless.
That is called "POLICE"...FED will never understand.
If any disciplinary action is taken against this officer we will never be able to do our job again.
Hey J-Fed take a look at one of the use of force posters on the wall in every police facility...better yet take a field trip to 1300 W. Jackson and talk to a gym instructor and have them explain it to you. This officer did nothing wrong. We wear a uniform, not a suit. Citizens need to have a little respect for a POLICE order. The very basic would be "Get off the buss".
Det. Shaved Longcock said...
Just maybe the filmer of this incident was a 14 year old boy posing as an undercover FBI agent who was doing a video surviellance.
Now that would be a classic!
-----
I LOVE SHAVED!!!!!!!! I THINK WE NOW KNOW THE AUTHOR OF THE CERTIFICATE:)
Dear Mr./Mrs "ROLL MY EYES". I saw the news cast of this incident and I can tell you with all certainity,it was definitely a set up,you and the gentleman (rolling my eyes) that headed the news cast are exactly what's wrong with this too liberal city.What you don't know and understand you make the most amazing assumptions about.Take P.O.'s.I can't speak for all policeman,but through my own experiences the reason why we are so guarded is when you work in a busy district where i work nearly everyone you encounter hates/dislikes the police.I have been on domestic disturbances where you walk into the residence and the male offender is beating the female to a pulp and when you as a police officer see this you instantly spring into action,example: #1you pull the offender off the female,or #2you pull the victim away from the offender,can you guess what happens next (you might be thinking that the victim says thank you officer,you may have saved my life).Well can you really guess what happens next,well here it is: The victim turns on you and says AND I QUOTE "TAKE YOUR HANDS OFF OF HIM,YOU DON'T PUT YOUR HANDS ON HIM LIKE THAT YOU M/F'ING PUNK-A@@ COP," I'AM GONNA CALL O.P.S.,I HAVE THEM ON SPEED DAIL".The officer stands there with the stunned look disbelief on his face. So how about this Mr."ROLL MY EYES" you don't have to take my word for it,you can see it for your self,how about you doing a ride along,but not in one of the slower districts,how about a ride along in 002,004,005,006,007,010,011,015,025 here's the kicker: No cheating you have to wear civilain clothing or a uniform.It's so easy being a Monday morning quarterback,there's nothing like seeing it up close and personal,it makes your stomach all a qiver (not)too see someone lying there bleeding from a driveby enduced bullet wound,and you being the first emergency vehicle to arrive on secene and the family members of the victim are outraged and the scene is in total choas take a guess as to who they take that very same rage out on first: That's right the police.If you decide to do a ride along make sure you are wearing some extra strength depends because I can promise you,you will need them!!!!!!!
I wouldn't be surprised if there is some connection between the cop watch guy and the "offender".
"Hey, I got an idea. Instead of waiting for something to happen, which can be so tedious and time consuming, let's stir up some shit. I'll get on the bus 2200 N. Whatever, and you get on at 2400 North and don't pay your fare.
When the cops come, just ignore their directives, and I'll get it all on tape..."
I'm seeing more and more civil rights type violations being inflicted on American Cops and Citizens by organizations that do not understand the scope of their boundaries by dreaming up stupid "Security" Related Steps and Checks, without checking them out by Legal Experts, hat are not Constitutional. I ask the U.S. Attorney and any of its investigative wings to please check out complaints by average law-abiding Citizens of Our Country, who are being deprived of their Freedom of Movement for no reason, and without probable cause, by Security outfits, law Enforcement Agencies, etc; forced by their Liberal Policy makers who are Ignorant of Civil Rights Laws, unless a Minority is involved, etc. We still have due process and Constitutional Rights here, even though they are being trampled on by Lib-DemocRAT-Communists who are taking over our Government. What about the Bill of Rights? Does it not apply to ALL races, and genders?
I'm seeing more and more civil rights type violations being inflicted on American Cops and Citizens by organizations that do not understand the scope of their boundaries by dreaming up stupid "Security" Related Steps and Checks, without checking them out by Legal Experts, hat are not Constitutional. I ask the U.S. Attorney and any of its investigative wings to please check out complaints by average law-abiding Citizens of Our Country, who are being deprived of their Freedom of Movement for no reason, and without probable cause, by Security outfits, law Enforcement Agencies, etc; forced by their Liberal Policy makers who are Ignorant of Civil Rights Laws, unless a Minority is involved, etc. We still have due process and Constitutional Rights here, even though they are being trampled on by Lib-DemocRAT-Communists who are taking over our Government. What about the Bill of Rights? Does it not apply to ALL races, and genders?
Better yet SCC, I think the vast majority of police and citizens alike feel the officer's actions were proper. Therefore, should they try and discipline the officer for anything force related were SHOULD MARCH!!!!!!!!! Don't wait on FOP, you'll be waiting a long time, start the march here. You make it known SCC that they feel this officer used excessive force, based on what we all see and all know was proper then I will take the lead on forming a march..Just keep us updated on this one...Brothers and Sisters, it's time to get off our asses, step away from the computer and do something real in defense of all of us...
Let the Liberal Rat-Boys and Girls fend for themselves.
Don't loose your job or freedom for some B.S. Look at what happened to Mike Mette and Cozzi. Don't step in if off-duty, call 911. If you are unarmed, or if you have been drinking, it's the safest way to keep yourself safe from prosecution. Help yourself, fellow officers, family, loved ones, friends ONLY. Don't be a CHUMP, the "Victim" you are going to risk your life to help can very well turn on you if you use any force, and blame YOU, and say it wasn't necessary, and guess who will get indicted,
Y-O-U....
Lots of car crashes last night due to ICE and city refused to salt!
Tell us about yr district!
2/19/2009 09:07:00 AM
ICE WAS SO BAD AT HQ I SLID INTO TRAFFIC. THIS CITY IS A JOKE AND THE ASS MAYOR IS A JERK OFF. FBI CIA, DIA,DEA,ANYONE PLEASE SAVE US.
Barely a "BITCH SLAP" at most, but the Police Hating News Media will make it into worse than a multiple shooting, cause of headlines, politics, and the almighty Headlines. Don't buy Newspapers, BOYCOTT them, also ignore and boycott liberal News Networks and their SPONSORS. Getting hit in their wallets is all they understand. FUCK ALL OF THESE SOCIALISTS..
"...most CTA buses have it posted on there nowadays that they are under surveillance. If it's posted that is notification enough to all entering or on the bus for any reason - working it or just riding it - that they are being recorded and it doesn't have to specify video or audio in order to be clean surveillance."
--2/19/2009 06:01:00 PM
But what if the notice is not in my language? What if I am illiterate or dyslexic -- or blind? Is this "equal protection under the law?"
A doctor, social worker, and lawyer should obviously be provided on each bus -- in seats next to the driver -- to examine and interview each boarding passenger and advise him/her/he-she/it of their/its rights -- summoning an interpreter if need be.
There is no end to this.
Don't get me going about "No Trespassing" signs -- and what about the ones that say "STOP?"
Celebrate diversity!
Can onyone remember back in the day when the animal rights groups would observed someone wearing a mink or a another type of fur coat they would walk up behind them and spray paint words on the back of the coat thereby ruining it,this is a prime example of that,they would spray the paint on the back of the coat like a cowards because thet knew that if they got caught the husband or whoever spent all that money for the coat would kick there ass from one end of the street to the other end of the of the street then walk that ass across the entersection wait for the green light then kick that ass onto the next block and then wait for the police to srape what's left of that ass while using a vacuum cleaner off the pavement
Listen up Officers the shit head who was filming the whole incident belongs to a group called Chicago Cop Watch.org. It is a group that heavily resembles an anarchist group. They say they are for the rights of all people but what they are really preaching is civil unrest and chaos. Watch your backs, if you encounter them, lock them up for interfering with police business, essentially that is what they are doing.
Does anyone know how high off the ground that bus is??Because JFed is gonna throw the P.O. under it.
Stay safe!
OT --
Well, you can tell Huberman's gotten his desk cleaned out at the CTA. All the shit is stating to come out from under the rug now.
CTA shuts down hundreds of buses, lengthening commutes
BY ADRIAN G. URIBARRI
February 19, 2009 | 8:30 PM
Rush hours will move markedly slower for Chicago Transit Authority bus riders starting this evening.
Agency officials say they found a crack in one of the fleet’s 60-foot, accordion-like buses, and that they pulled all similar models off the streets. Ninety operated near the lakefront during rush hours, officials say.
http://www.chitowndailynews.org/
Chicago_news/CTA_shuts_down_
hundreds_of_buses_lengthening_
commutes,22791
Crain's Chicago Business reports that this is a total of at least 226 buses.
...and by way of welcoming Huberman to his new post...
Chicago school board president to resign Friday
February 19, 2009 8:29 PM
Rufus Williams, the president of the Chicago Board of Education, told the Tribune late tonight that he plans to tender his resignation to Mayor Richard Daley on Friday.
"The mayor wants to go in a different direction...I'm stepping down for him to do that,'' Williams told the Tribune...
http://www.chicagobreakingnews.
com/2009/02/rufus-williams-chicago
-board-education.html
Huberman, Huberman, fly away home...
I s anyone watching tonights episode of ER looks like they are going to perpetuate the idea that Cops use excessive force with tonights story.
I am a law abiding tax payer here in the city and wish you guys had the tools, support, and respect you need in order to keep me safe.
I am pissed and helpless as a citizen.
Thank you for what you do and I wish your hands were not tied.
"Interesting last name on the "Copwatch" kid - Thayer. There is another Thayer (Andy) who works for one of the most prevalent cop-suing firms in town (Loevy & Loevy). Relatives, perhaps? "
No, I think you are talking about Andy Dick.....looks just like him.
Instead of crying like a bunch of bitches about some jailhouse lawyer eavesdropping nonsense, we should all spend as much energy on the Scum-Times and Trib Comments section defending the actions of our brother on that bus. My wife (not the police AND a democrat) watched it and thought 10677 used a lot of restraint. Not everyone hates us, but we do get that paranoid attitude jerking off on this blog about cockameemee legal theories like "eavesdropping."
"I have the most awful feeling that this was the best piece of film they had to show us...
2/19/2009 05:08:00 PM"
It was.
"It gives the impression that you have something to hide, that you can't do your job unless you do it in a secretive manner."
I have nothing to hide, but being filmed shows one angle of an incident. I have seen footage of police officer shootings and felt the officer should do time for his actions. But when I saw footage from another angle, I felt really bad for throwing the officer under the bus. The other angle showed a complete different story.
We dislike being filmed mostly because we know that dumb ass liberals like yourself will use one angle to try and tell the entire story. Or like, Rodney King just show the end of the tape.
a minor correction to the spot about eavesdropping on the walkie talkies the drug dealers use. If the equipment is NON licensed(IE does not need FCC License) then the General Public (including the dirtbag dealers) can use it. The conversation is in Public Airwaves and may be listened to HOWEVER you cannot relay this info to another party. Nextel Chirp Walkie Talkies( a dope mans favorite) Can with court order be intercepted.These are Encrypted systems. Systems that operate "in the clear" like Police channels,can be monitored by anyone. The key is what you do with what you have heard.
I looked at the tape and I truly dont see what this officer did wrong. There was a bust down on the bus (M-1 Imagine that) that resisted and argued with the Officer.The officer removed him. Done deal. Remember Rich Fransis? Same thing. Different outcome. I had occasion to go to the cop watch site and Im telling you ALL. Flood this guys phone 1 312 402 7949. I called and he sounds like a typical liberal smooch. Im sorry but that site should be closed. They encourage resistance to the Police and will "help youu file a complaint". God let me catch this guy in the projects PLEASE let me catch this guy in the projects.
It wasn't too long ago we once stood tall, and would not let one of our brothers fall. When Terry, and Phil were our our Supt's we looked out for each other, like we should! We don't have the luxury of going to sit in a desk job and know what our day has in store for us. We are faced with the worst that this city has to offer.(OUTRAGEOUS MURDER RATE, NUMEROUS RAPINGS IN BUCKTOWN AND OTHER "SAFE" NEIGHBORHOODS, SHOOTINGS EVERYDAY, HIGHSCHOOL KIDS MURDERED EVERY WEEKEND, THOUSANDS OF CAR BREAK-INS, GAFFITI EVERYWHERE, AND ON TOP OF THAT EVERYDAY STRESSORS. People wonder why Chicago's Finest are at their breaking point. Well take a look at what we are up against. It honestly breaks our hearts when the public, who we miss family dinners for, family birthdays, holiday vacations, and sacrifice our lives for, can't stand by our side. This job is not easy, and never has been. Dealing with the worst society has to offer can take it's toll on any man after a certain point. Here is a quote by a man who many respected. He is one of our own. John Thomas. "WHEN YOU BEGIN TO DOUBT THE NOBILITY OF YOU MISSION OR THE SANCTITY OF YOUR PROFESSION BECAUSE YOUR HEART IS HEAVY, OR YOU FEEL ANGER, DISILLUSIONMENT, DISENFRACHISEMENT, BETRYAED OR CONFUSED - STOP AND LISTEN TO THE VOICES RISING FROM THOSE SACRED STARS THAT ARE ENSHRINED AT 35TH STREET; THE VOICES THAT RISE UP FROM THE FOLDED CITY FLAGS THAT ARE ENCASED AND AT REST IN HOMES THROUGHOUT THIS CITY; LISTEN TO THE VOICES RISING FROM A FIELD IN PENNSYLVANIA, FROM A WALL AT THE PENTAGON, AND FROM THE SPOT OF EARTH THE WORLD HAS COME TO KNOW AS GROUND ZERO. BECAUSE IF YOU LISTEN, YOU WILL HEAR THOSE SOULS TELL YOU "THANK YOU" FOR WHAT YOU DO AS THE POLICE, HEAR THEM CHEERING YOU ON. LET THEM CARRY YOU THROUGH THIS DIFFICULT MOMENT, ALLOW THEM TO NOURISH YOU AND ENCOURAGE YOU - AND DOUBT NO MORE - FOR YOU ARE WARRIORS AND CHAMPIONS FOR THOSE WHO HAVE GONE BEFORE AND TO THOSE MOST VULNERABLE NOW. YOU ARE ADMIRED AND RESPECTED, FOR YOU ARE THE BEST AT WHAT YOU DO. GOD BLESS AND GOD BLESS AMERICA!
-Future Supt.
Remember that we are the glue that keeps this city together. Let the politicians bribe each other and scam the taxpayers out of their money. Our job is to watch each others backs, make it home to the ones we love, and to protect Chicago's citizens. They deserve the best that we have to offer. Remember, our own Brothers in Blue have lost blood on Chicago's streets. Don't forget why we are here, and always stick together, because we are all that we have!!!!!!
This officer did nothing wrong at all! so what if he used obscenities WHO GIVE A FLYING FUCK! This is Chicago, a major city and sometimes we have to get tuff. This is the nature of our job. Sometimes people call 911 simply because they want us to get tuff with some a-hole. Anyone who makes a big deal about this is a ball-less wonder. J-Fed should do the right thing and make a press release saying "SO FUCKING WHAT!" If not he should direct IAD to drop the CR because it's a huge waste of time and bad for morale.
I like the idea of getting a lawyer and suing the Scum-Times and jagoff for libel. Not only would he get a nice payoff, but he could shut down the communist/socialist/anarchist organization known as copwatch also.
The copper should be just fine. Remember J-Fed, the screaming skull, Dugan, Etc. Etc. said so in the video. If we act reasonably they said they got our backs and we will be ok. I feel a lot better now for that officer since their video. Now lets go be the police for this joke of a department.
Andy Thayer. Office Manager at Loevy & Loevy Attorneys at Law
---------
Not an attorney there but it can't be a coincidence........
Anyone that has been to the in car camera training will tell you that you have to turn off the sound (but you can still record video) for non-IVC related stops to prevent the Department from getting sued.
An example of this would be getting a hand waver for a domestic on the side of the road and turning on the mars lights which activates the video, but you have to shut off the audio to prevent you from recording sound.
2/19/2009 10:11:00 AM
SCC this is b.s. there is a section in this law that permits law enforcement to record vidio and audio. Basicaly states the public should reasonably know that they are being recorded when dealing with police.
Someone should talk to the idiot doing in-car camera training. He's the one going around informing the officers that video taping in public is ok since we have no expectation of privacy.
eff that mofo with the camera. great job officer! when you don't obey the law, disrespect others, violate other's civil rights, YOU HAVE NO RIGHTS. The guy with the camera needs to get a girlfriend.
public way doesn't matter .... you have to have consent ....
but I always thought there was an exception if you supected something criminal was going to happen ... like you could record if you though the other guy was going to attempt to hire you for a murder-for-hire or something
just throwing that out there - i could be wrong .... AND even with that the do-gooder could not reasonably have expected something criminal to happen ... there's no way he could verablize that he expected something criminal to happen
I can honestly say ... no bullshit ... I am PROUD of how that officer handled that. He was the nicest guy in the world for the first seven commands to get off the bus - he even told the drunk he could maybe get the next bus ... then he started swearing like Patti Blagojevich ... like a freakin' drunken sailor with turrets syndrome he was ...
good job office ... no problem's here
this is over ....
8:30 AM, Odds are too great that the POS with the camera and the Jag off offender happen to be on the same bus. sounds like a set up to me.Officer did the right thing. except if the Dept. goes after him for the profanity.
Anonymous said...
What a piece of crap this guy is from ChicagoCopWatch! How soon we forget what happened to Officer Richard Francis. Same district same circumstances. How come the Slum Times doesn't link this video to their article (http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=news/local&id=6240518)
2/19/2009 09:37:00 AM
Not the same district, this happened in 018, Rick Francis was killed in 019. This happened completely on the bus, Rick was shot as a scuffle broke out off the bus in view of the driver but definitely off the bus.
SCC - I luv ya but sometimes even you get it wrong. Your post says that the CTA isn't a public place because a fee is charged to access it. That's not an accurate statement. An entity can still be a public one despite a fee being charged. For example, we now pay fees to enter National Parks, for example, but they are still public entities. Fees are applied for the maintenance and upkeep. Further to the point, a place can be a public one in terms of access but privately owned or held. You're a good cop but not such a good lawyer. No Offense.
mute the sound and its fine! eavesdropping really! don't waste your time on this. direct it at the media who imply that the officer did something wrong. i can't imagine any other way to handle that situation.
2/19/2009 07:44:00 AM
While I agree with the media thing you are saying, I really think that if this happens to one of us in the future and there is sound the guy should be locked up. Why you say well because it would stop this if they took a pinch for eavesdropping. If the video has audio, you and everybody else need a court order to do so. Why should we let them get away with that. I say lock em up and then see what they have to say when you inventory there camera that their hippie flower parents bought them for Christmas.
I just don't see that any reasonable person would object to what the copper did, other than some unnecessarily aggressive and foul language.
But remember, 1 aw-shit wipes out about 20 attaboys. Just the way the world works.
hmm civil rights and "rights of movement" well heres one for you. I 'violated' at least 503 peoples 'movement rights' in 2006 and 493 of them GOT CONVICTED for it. Now,go wipe the blood from your bleeding heart. The time has come to take back this Street. I know of ONE property in Chicago that was SAFER because of how many people I locked up. And i enjoyed every court slip i turned in for them too. In no way shape or form should a prohibited subject be allowed to "visit" the area(s) that he/she/it was barred from. Sure youu can walk on the sidewalk all you want. One STEP off that youre ass is mine.
Project Pitbull
Brother and Sister Officers, please refrain from doing anything that puts you at risk of a lawsuit or criminal charge. We are bound to enforce the Law, but can do so in a less-aggressive, smart , safe , and beef free way. Just use your heads out there. Until the citizens that we protect come out in Mass to Support US, and the lemming politicians then are forced to reconsider things, this is the way it has to be. We have ourselves and our families to take care of in rough and unstable times. Without backing, there is no sense in you being the next one fired for some minor shoving, tussling, slapping incident recorded on a bus camera or otherwise. When I was young, if you even mouthed off to a Chicago Cop, he'd put his foot so far up your ass you would need a shovel to dig it out. Now if you look at someone cross-eyed, it's BRUTALITY. No support Mayor, No support Supt, no Support Supervisors, No Support public, OK fine. This incident is in NO WAY excessive force, only to the liberal police-hating panseys and sensationalist socialist News-Media. Just please remain cool, soon the Taxpayers will be forced to get off their lazy butts and stand up in tremendous force for us, It is just a matter of time. Win by waiting and playing it safe. We are smarter than they, the Animals, and the police-hating sissy liberal opportunists are. Keep your cool. It's going to be a long, violent summer. Chicken-Shit leadership does not have the balls to call this incident as it really is, an officer doing his job, and not taking shit from one of the thousands of punk-ass losers who try to challenge and incite us daily. This is the shakey, non-real police leadership we currently have. Stand up in front of a microphone you phony blow-hards, and show some balls and leadership. I'd rather be fired by that pansey Daley than to sit back like a candy-ass and be afraid to stand up for any of my officers who are obviously trying to do their job, and using an overly cautious amount of restraint on a punk who needs that old CPD shoe up his ass and a trip to the Lockup, so decent people can ride the CTA withhout intimidation and being afraid of these pimp-thug pussys..
If this copper takes a day, let us run a benifit for him and he will make it up a 100 times over.
Anybody remember now retired detective Roland P. He taped conversation with bosses in the D unit.
I s anyone watching tonights episode of ER looks like they are going to perpetuate the idea that Cops use excessive force with tonights story.
WHY DID EVERYONE LOVE WHEN SIPOWICZ ON NYPD BLUE BEAT CONFESSIONS OUT OF PEOPLE? NO ONE EVER COMPLAINED ABOUT THAT SHOW AND LOVED ANDY S FOR IT....
SCC - I luv ya but sometimes even you get it wrong. Your post says that the CTA isn't a public place because a fee is charged to access it. That's not an accurate statement. An entity can still be a public one despite a fee being charged. For example, we now pay fees to enter National Parks, for example, but they are still public entities. Fees are applied for the maintenance and upkeep. Further to the point, a place can be a public one in terms of access but privately owned or held. You're a good cop but not such a good lawyer. No Offense.
2/20/2009 06:17:00 AM
Go ahead record another cop on the bus you stand up guy! But please be a man and put your name under your posted video so we may test you statement in front of a JUDGE! Hey bring your check book YOU WILL NEED IT!
"WHY DID EVERYONE LOVE WHEN SIPOWICZ ON NYPD BLUE BEAT CONFESSIONS OUT OF PEOPLE? NO ONE EVER COMPLAINED ABOUT THAT SHOW AND LOVED ANDY S FOR IT....
2/21/2009 10:03:00 AM"
Because he did so with such verve, style and enthusiasm?
The other night i had occasion to be coming home from 006 and encountered 2 Englewood officers stopping a CTA bus. I naturally pulled up behind the beat car and got out and went to check on the Officer's well being. They were removing an M-1 from the bus that was refusing to pay or leave. At this point several other 007 cars arrivred to offer assistance. One of the P.O's looked down at my Blue handled Beretta and smiled and said"Lathrop One!"(I cant IMAGINE how he KNEW THAT lol) and I got a "thanks Brother" from the Engle wood guy. Any time y'all. Any time.POint is we're all in this together. Be safe and watch eachothers backs at all times.
Kiss my Ass J-FED
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