Section 28.1 Letter
We've gotten this something like 20 times in the past two days. Can someone explain it to us? (scroll through all 3 pages):
It would appear that all the rumors about the FOP dropping the ball on the timely notification are on the money. It would also appear that the City is looking at blowing us off for at least a year should circumstances make it possible for them to do so.
That could be good. It could also be very very bad, especially if Rahm wins at the negotiating table with every other union because he'll use their concessions to negotiate or force (via arbitration) some major changes to our Contract.
It would appear that all the rumors about the FOP dropping the ball on the timely notification are on the money. It would also appear that the City is looking at blowing us off for at least a year should circumstances make it possible for them to do so.
That could be good. It could also be very very bad, especially if Rahm wins at the negotiating table with every other union because he'll use their concessions to negotiate or force (via arbitration) some major changes to our Contract.
Labels: contract stuff
posted by SCC at 12:05 AM
238 Comments:
The next FOP election can't come fast enough. Shields is OUT !
i hope that the FOP picnic will not be cancelled. i love the warm flat beer! enjoy your retro.
Shields fucked up and that is all. We have to accept the fuck up and eventually, when his term is up, vote him out of office. That being said, we should not negotiate with our backs against the wall. Hold off on negotiations. Send a letter of intent to terminate the contract at the appropriate time next year and start negotiating from that point forward. The city appears to not give up this contract for the next year, essentially freezing wages. Well, we are not going to get a raise for the next year and not back pay for it. Such is life and Shields will have answer for that. However, we need to negotiate from a point of strength and right now we are negotiating from a point of weakness and ineptitude. Start over next year.
Little mikey shields. Nothing but a lying weasel. Him and his useless lawyers.
The contract is only 57 pages long!
They really didnt read it?
And if they did, are they really that incompetent?
They should resign. What are they going to do for the next year if we are no longer negotiating?
It looks like the current leadership of FOP is out. One election time
I've got chunks of guys like you in my stool!
If this is true then this entire board needs to be dumped!
Thanks Mike! This would also screw us out of any retro money due us from now 'til 2013! I think a vote of no confidence would be held in this situation, furthermore.....you, Mike, were elected to protect our interest and are paid to do so.....you have failed! I really was a true believer in that you would be smart enough to handle the job! I didn't listen to the people that said you were too young and naïve for such a job.....obviously I was wrong. I guess it goes to show that no matter what, assholes always end up in office!
Well, our contract has been extended for one year. And the city is saying that it may or may not enforce section 28.1. In other words, the city can refuse to negotiate until next year; the contract terminates next year. assuming that the FOP provides proper notice. (This analysis is from a qualified person.)
When was the FOP suppose to have had this letter in by?
Anonymous said...
I have two revolvers out there that were stolen out of my locker in my old district.
Nice reward to whoever finds either one of them.
Colt Trooper, .38 cal. 4 inch barrel, blue steel serial #914270
S&W Model 66, .357 Mag., 4 inch Magnaported barrel, stainless steel, serial# 9K97579
Both HOT LEADS and NCIC.
Stay safe, I will feel better about retireing if I get those back.
6/24/2012 05:46:00 PM
wow, this is insane. Out of your work locker? Is this some janitor job or fellow copper? After reading this, this disgusts me. I can't wait until I RETIRE.
Here is what that letter means in plain english;
FOP screwed up big time, and for the next 12 months, everything remains the same (except no wage increases or retro, or even negotiations if the city does not feel like talking right now, and they don't have to because we failed to send a letter on time).
Yea it appears that the president not only lied to the members but also his board. Wtf was 1st vp Dougherty doing or 2nd vp dimaria doing, or donahough, shields and Gorman take blame for lying to us after the fact!!! U other incompetent fools what is your story.
I do think that it isn't a bad thing that we go last. Christ for years we have been doing all the leg work for the other unions.
". . . especially if Rahm wins at the negotiating table with every other union because he'll use their concessions to negotiate or force (via arbitration) . . "
=============
"force . . via arbitration" ? ?
Are you saying the arbitration is FIXED ?!?
I find it hard to believe that this is an oversight.
Good job Mike Shields. You really are a hustler. Vote of No Confidence brothers and sisters. Time to get rid of this asshat. He is getting Commanders pay to fuck us over. He's an idiot. We are going to get screwed.
Sounds to me that the lodge did nothing wrong? Why would the lodge terminate our contract (Agreement)? We negotiate a replacement agreement while the old one remains in force. Am I wrong?
What does it say can't bring it up sorry?
Sheilds Should Step Down!! If you can't do something as Easy as meet a Deadline to begin discussing a new contract than you need to let someone else step up to the plate!
It appears Spanky and the boys clearly dropped the ball.
Rahm is not the sympathetic, understanding type and will absolutely stick it in our ass any chance he can get.
Hey Mikey thanks for leaving the door wide open.
If you're in way over your head, as it certainly appears, don't be too proud to seek advice/help. Afterall this is some pretty important stuff you're dealing with. Also you're dealing with a psychopath of a mayor who would love nothing more than weakening/ busting our union.
I'll be the first to say I voted for shields and wow what a mistake that was. Do the right thing and just resign. You have been and continue to be in way over your head. Also the law firm who is advising the fop and anyone else involved should never receive another dime of our dues. They are clearly incompetent if something like this was missed. Mike, leave NOW.
Are you surprised? Nope.
it may help us,especially what rahm wants to do to the firemen!
I am not a labor attorney. I am a blue shirt dog shit police officer. I don't know what it means. It seems to mean that here is another article that does not mean what it seems to mean on it's face. Lawyer talk. It says "terminate" but seems to not actually mean "terminate."
You mean with all the old guard still in their elected positions, Dougherty, DiMaria, Aguilar, Capparelli and the Immediate Past President Mark Donahue in a paid position with the new administration, they all could not get this thing right???
Shields is not down there in a vacuum, he is surrounded by the above people plus has easy access to a small army of lawyers.
Still, they could not get this right?
Shameful. If this is as true as it seems to be, someone needs to resign. And soon. And I supported Shields. But if he fucked this up right out of the gate, well that cannot be forgiven. We don't need to be giving Rahm any additional resources with which to shove it up our ass.
What the fuck Mike! Time for an honest answer to the membership. Might be time for Mike Shields to go back to a squad car if this is as big a fuck up as it seems.
Anonymous said...
Little mikey shields. Nothing but a lying weasel. Him and his useless lawyers.
The contract is only 57 pages long!
They really didnt read it?
And if they did, are they really that incompetent?
They should resign. What are they going to do for the next year if we are no longer negotiating?
Wasn't he coming around to all the rollcalls saying how we needed to hold classes on the contract because we didn't understand it? He doesn't even understand it and he was going to have classes?
Shields and the new crew are over their heads.
Donahue is only looking out for himself and taking care of his financial security.
Geiger is a world class goof.
Shields should of retained Plienes as he had dealings with past contract negotiaitions!
"Section 2. Any member may be disciplined for committing any one or more of the following offenses:
(l) In the case of any officer or representative of this Lodge, failing to faithfully perform the duties of his
or her office or position or accepting dual compensation or expenses for the performance of duties
related to his or her office or position. "
After reading a few times on here things such as.... I admit I voted for Shields, guess I was wrong' etc etc.
This is an unfortunate example of why some of the newer guys should check their ego and listen a little to the guys with time on the job. I'm sure you heard over and over... If this guy gets in, we're screwed. But again the hair gels know it all, another big problem with us. When I came on, there was enormous respect for the guys with time on, that's non existent now
What this means is Rahm can't try to take away anything for another year, which is truly the trend based on what he's already done to the CTU and what he's threatening to do to us and CFD. We are locked-in, which to me, is an excellent strategy.
Let the other unions go first in contract negotiations/arbitrations for once...they, Fire Department in particular, ride our coattails with their Me-Too bullshit. Let them do the heavy lifting and spend the money on the process, which will probably take some time.
This contract and process will be like none other based on the asshole of a mayor we have and the overall state of the economy. We need to think outside the box and not go with the same old, beaten down strategies used for the past umpteen contracts - they know what to expect when you stick to the same old play book. This is gonna work out better than anyone of the business law and contract attorney "specialists" pretending to know what they're talking about here are chiming in about.
EXCELLENT MOVE, FOP !!!
Wrong wrong wrong. This is just to start a "bashing shields" ........Shields has our best interest and I'd doing a GREAT job.
enjoy your day, shields haters. once you read the law, you will understand that shields did the right thing. idiots.
Well we could all also lay down and do jack shit for the next year as well. I'm so sick of Rahm, McCarthy, the FOP, and all the bullshit surrounding them. I'm just tired of all this shit. They want to cheat us out of our pensions, fuck us on the contract, take away our summer furloughs, take away our uniform and duty availability, make us stay on the job until we're 65, deny our time due. Did I miss anything? This is the worst city job in the city and if that wasn't bad enough they just keep trying to stick it to us every chance they get. I'm fucking tired of it all. I just don't give a fuck about this job anymore. I have to force myself to get dressed and drive down to it every day but I'm stuck now because I'm too old and have too much time vested in this crappy job. I've got a family to feed and bills to pay. Anyone that signs up to be the police in this day and age is either totally insane or fucking stupid.
Someone let mcdrunko no he looks like an idiot with long sleeves in the summer and his idea for 80/20 and crown cap for the ot is as dumb as his comstat they want u to be on foot and have ticket books where u supposed to put them hers a bright idea mcdrunko ur cargo pants pockets go back to ny and fix ur broken family cpd don't need u
If the 15% pay cuts being proposed for Fire are for real, then it appears that Shields is a very crafty player. cCity cannot have its cake and eat it too.
BTW- how much do those guys at FOP really make?
We need an investigation by the State Lodge. Let's demand this from FOP!
http://www.guidestar.org/FinDocuments/2010/362/467/2010-362467755-07b529a7-9O.pdf
If the next fop meeting isn't packed full to get some answers, we are all fools.
What you guys are failing to see is the city is clearly pulling the divide and conquer routine. The letter I read from shields probably mirrors just about every letter sent to suburban pds to commence negotiations. The difference is rahm wants to fuck you guys over. My opinion is rahm wants to put you guys against shields and co in order to install another new inexperienced group to fuck with next time around.
If you guys were smart you would back your guys and live and learn. Also your attorney should be the one sending the correspondence to the city. You may want to consider hiring a better attorney.
- a suburban copper who sat through a few years of negotiations
Debt Balloons For Chicago-Area Pension Plans
Funds accrue $27.4 billion shortfall between 2001 and 2010
"While they're debating what to do about the state funds, these local funds are continuing to decline," said Laurence Msall, Civic Federation president. "Inaction during the past 10 years means it's not just politically more difficult to fix this problem but also mathematically more difficult."
The report bolsters the urgency for pension reform expressed by Mayor Rahm Emanuel and Gov. Pat Quinn in recent months. In May, the mayor traveled to Springfield to testify before a House pension panel, saying essential city services and education reforms would suffer if dramatic changes aren't made to the city's pension system.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/ct-met-pension-civic-fed-20120625,0,4616272.story
I'll be the first to say I voted for shields and wow what a mistake that was. Do the right thing and just resign. You have been and continue to be in way over your head. Also the law firm who is advising the fop and anyone else involved should never receive another dime of our dues. They are clearly incompetent if something like this was missed. Mike, leave NOW.
6/25/2012 03:52:00 AM
There is no law firm, just in house counsel Paul Gieger, who is the best attorney in the world just ask him. I say class action malpractice suit in behalf of the members. Pleines would have never let this happen.
My wife is even smarter that that! Shields your a jerkoff
How much do you pay in union dues?
ZERO ACTIVITY!
Is the order of the day!
Anyone who goes out and generate any numbers is a damn fool!
Da Pelon
It would appear that we are f*cked!
Shields fired the real lawyers, so he could give jobs to his incompetent friends. He also forgot to look in the files to copy the letter that has been sent EVERY FUCKING CONTRACT!!!
Yes, kids, you picked him over Greg Bella because he and his buddies were slick, younger and full of shit. You knew they were, but you didn't care. Now you're stuck.
No pay raise for a year. No retro for 2012-2013. That money is gone every year from now until forever. You idiots.
Can we impeach this fuckup?
If FOP does not respond to this, it is his admission that he fucked up.
WTF?????
Rahm must have giggled like a schoolgirl when he found this out.
I knew Shields was a useless hack when the first things he did was get a new car and new furniture.
Like an emporer.
If true, do you know how much money you just took out of the pockets of every single copper on the job!? As far as im concerned, being voted out should be the least of his concerns. I know it would be if it was me in his shoes. How can you look the PO's in the eyes after letting them down in such a way? How can you sleep at night?
The stupidity of one is going to make all of us suffer in Area 1. Letting one guy work whatever hours he wanted and not even on his assigned shift in his made up spot (homicide paperwork?) is not good for the morale of the workers.
This might not be a bad a idea. This gives our union a year to plan negotiations and hopefully by then the economy will turn around.
Fuck Franczyk and the City!
Sounds to me that the lodge did nothing wrong? Why would the lodge terminate our contract (Agreement)? We negotiate a replacement agreement while the old one remains in force. Am I wrong?
6/25/2012 02:04:00 AM
Why is it so hard for you to understand?
The CONTRACT is set up to automatically renew for a year if neither side submits a letter to terminate; YES TERMINATE.
Our rights under this contract remain in full force until after the new contract takes over, BUT WE NEED TO TERMINATE THIS ONE BEFORE THAT CAN HAPPEN.
This will really bite in the ass anyone who was planning on retiring in the next four years. A year without a raise will impact the average of your last four. And since next June should see a lot of retirements...thanks FOP.
Anonymous said...
When was the FOP suppose to have had this letter in by?
6/25/2012 12:57:00 AM
Hey asshole read the reply letter. How the hell did you get on this job?
I was wondering why we were hearing about what the city was offering the fireman and nothing about what we were offered. The city has always negotiated with the FOP first. Well, this explains it!
First, DO NOT TERMINATE THE CURRENT CONTRACT! If that were to happen, we would have NO protections - NONE. We would have to start from scratch and everything we fought for in the last thirty years would be gone – EVERYTHING!
Second, what is done is done, time to move on and deal with the situation. Let the contract go another year and then start negations. Granted we will get no back pay and no raises, but that is a lot better then losing everything we now have.
FOP screwed up big time, and for the next 12 months, everything remains the same (except no wage increases or retro, or even negotiations if the city does not feel like talking right now, and they don't have to because we failed to send a letter on time).
Now if we had any balls, or even maybe stuck together. We would have a massive BLUE FLU just to show them we wont be fucked with. But we dont stick to gether so forget it!
Guys, read the letters. Mikey wrote a "to/from". The contract requires a letter with specific wording that no one at FOP used. That's why we are in this mess. And trust me, a mess it can be. Proff of the inexperience and callous way he dealt with the institutional knowledge that was there when he took over. Thanks asswipe, for nothing.
The sad thing - Shield will still deny the existence of this letter and not even inform the membership. I think FOP needs to have a meeting on this one, or will they wait till September.
Shields! Do the right thing and resign!
You have no excuse to have missed this deadline.
You are focusing on billboards and helmets when you obviously don't know the contract.
Could this be because, with less coppers on the payroll there is less money from dues coming into to FOP coffers?
But hey, at least we have the FLOP golf outing and breakfast with Santa to look forward to.
All part of the plan. FOP supports Madigan and the others, Donahue gets nominated for Sheriff, Shields takes care of Rahm with the contract and his little crew get nice City Hall spots in 3 years. Mikey's ego is too big for just being a blue shirt. This was a stepping stone for him and we all just got stepped on. The plan is working perfectly-just too bad for him this got out so soon!
Like Obama a President was voted in with no real experience.And like Obama he was way over his head in important matters and made sure he took care of himself.
Experience is a great thing to have during tough times...like Bella had......just saying
let the city negotiate with the other unions first. Let them show their hand.
Vote of No Confidence!!!!
Is there a RECALL clause in our bylaws; how could they miss this deadline when Donahue is still there working with the little troll?
Mikey, I suspected you were in bed with the administration when you wouldn't support concealed carry last year, now I know the truth.
"That could be good. It could also be very very bad, especially if Rahm wins at the negotiating table with every other union because he'll use their concessions to negotiate or force (via arbitration) some major changes to our Contract."
1- it'll be good because all the clout in the supervisory ranks wont be made to suffer, and that'll set precedent for us. If anything, they'll lose their 45 extra minutes a day and daily differential pay, two things that we don't get now or will ever get
And just as important...
2- it's a nice big "FUCK YOU" to the Lts and Cpts union that have sold out us blue shirts time and time again. Look no further than their last vote that fucked us. They won't be able to ride the waves of any successes that FOP might be able to pull off this time around.
I don't see a fuck-up on FOPs part, I see a brilliant tactical move.
I just sent letter to Andy shaw I was curios why the mayors valets /bodyguards get srg pay and he is complaint about fireman getting extra pay to get training to be a better fireman there is no reason for any valet to get an extra pay grade especially the sup or the mayor
This letter shows that the FOP did exactly what it is supposed to do, request the beginning of negotiations for a new contract. The old contract is extended until a new contract is in place. Some on this blog want to terminate the old contract, which the city would love. That means, start over from scratch. We would lose everythiing that we already have. The FOP and the city have already met twice in negotiation, with more meetings scheduled. If the people who post this garbage went to the meetings, they would know this. It is my guess, SCC, that you received this letter from 5on O'neill's people. Don't let yourself be used by the city to divide and conquer.
My non-lawyer reading of the letter is that the city isn't honoring the letter dated 20 Mar to the Commander as proper and sufficient notice. The city is saying basically that they MAY decide to negotiate with the FOP after they finish negotiations with the other unions first or they MAY choose to let the current contract stand until next year.
So basically the city will talk if the officers want to take it in the shorts, otherwise wait til next year.
If this is true and we dont get a years worth of retro pay ill be sueing your creampuff bitch ass shields. Hope u get paid ot for court time u halfwit
OT- OFFICER KILLED IN DENVER- GOD REST HER SOUL.
http://news.yahoo.com/denver-officer-shot-killed-near-park-concert-041600768.html
Thank you for publishing.
IF Greece blows up and the stock market tanks, Shields is going to come off looking like a genius.
Does anyone here really think that the City won'r negotiate? SEriously? Garry wants to be loved and respected so badly. He wants to move up in the world. Destroying what was left of morale and trying to screw us will leave him with a department he cannot manage. And he already has a zillion clouted bosses that he can't manage or get rid of. The City does not have the usual array of surrender hacks to deal with at FOP. Why do you think they want us to go last? They know FOP will be the toughest to deal with. Hang in there, Mikey, we are not all stupid.
It looks like Area 1 is hosting the newest scandal. Certain "softballs" were watched by IAD doing things other than work while on the clock. I wish we would have never merged with Area 4
Well, if the current contract remains in force, then it appears everyone can still be on the medical for up to one year.
Next meeting if anyone is unhappy about this, anyone can call for an impeachment against this fool. So quit your bitching and do something about it!
Shields sold us out. He works for Rahm. You watch, Mikey will quit and run for office
So sad, so sad,Sorry seems to be the hardest word,Elton John!
Listen to this shit:
My Catholic parish had a carnival. Did not do so well. After it was over, Rahm sent them a $5000 bill! For what I don't know.
Do we ever stop bitching?? Every FOP election we want a new crew put in. Why? Because you can't keep anyone happy on this job. Even if this was a mistake does it really affect what the city does? Did anyone expect anything to be resolved in the next 2 years anyway? It's the same all the time. Look at it this way it's a year more of not paying more into our pensions and medical which I GUARANTEE Will happen this contract
I voted Bella, old school doesnt miss deadlines.
Shields too young and inexperienced to be effective.
Hopefully I'm wrong...
But it sounds like no retro period..... For the upcoming year we operate under the existing contract, consequently there is a contract in force so we're not entitled to retro.
After that we operate without a contract in place. It was the contract that called for retro. No contract in force, no retro. Seems to me tha the city could drag this out for it's typical 21/2 to 3 yrs and not include any retro. Don't look for any public sympathy. By then the city will have the citizens despising anyone holding a public sector job.
I'm sure Rahm's stance to the unions is "that was Daley's contract, now your dealing with me and my contract - everything is on the table."
Iif they settle with sgts, lts, and capts first, we're screwed, they will sell us down the river. No arbitrator will give us more then they get.
The capts and lts are totally out for themselves, we're screwed,,,,,,
I'm not entirely sure this oversight was an "accident". For all you who are dreaming about retro-pay, that is exactly what that is - a dream. It was mentioned over a year ago that retro-pay will not be forthcoming in any contract negotiations. And, you talk about pay increases? I don't think so. With unemployment going up, increasing police wages with all the "extras" that the City will point to sounds unlikely. This is a wake up call to start living a little more selectively and with greater thought. In this next year, you won't have lost anything. Since we are probably the weakest union, we will probably piggy-back on another union and see what the lay of the land is. Perhaps a better economy? More favorable perception? Maybe even the acknowledgement of the work we do and the pain and sacrifice we make every day. So, take those duty-availability checks and uniform checks and use them wisely. They won't be around much longer. And, we will probably lose 2 holidays.
As we await the decision of the SCOTUS on "Obamacare", we are not in a strong position to bargain our way anywhere. Perhaps "tiny dancer" won't be around to have a psychotic episode for our negotiations, perhaps we will have a change in leadership. There is a lot to consider, and I think the thought was to save what we have rather than risk losing it at this point. I'm not a Shields fan, but a patient attitude might be called for. Our position can probably only get better with time, although our working conditions continue to crumble as we "do less with more" and catching the bad guy is thought to be more expensive than to let him walk.
We still haven't worked through all the kinks in the reorganization of the districts/areas. I think it is time to hunker down and get organized for perhaps one of the most important negotiations in decades.
OT -- sort of....
Mr. Msall of Civic Federation has noted the lack of monies in Chicago Pension Funds. The Teacher's fund was where the biggest chunk of change went. Rahm has said that it was the city who didn't hold up their contractual end of our pension, yet he insists on using "new" money for new projects rather than pay his bills. Don't try to use the same logic when it comes to YOUR water bill or property tax.
It pisses me off that he is risking our future because of what he acknowledges as misappropriation of funds.
Well all I can say is Shields is listening to HISSING SOUNDS OF THE SNAKES AROUND HIM. FOP still paying Donahue $75,000 a year for lobbing, for what, fuck anyone knows) He never listens to anyone else but the corrupt snakes, HISS HISS HISSS!
And to the idiot who tried to argue in the firefighter thread - nothing to say now?
We. Are. Fucked.
Maybe that will be shields campaign promise next time if he is dumb enough to try another term? He can hand out condoms at roll calls. You know, all the roll calls he promised he would go to in non election times that he hasn't.
the other story is that the old timers wanted to see Shields fail, so they let him. Demaria Dougherty Agilar didnt think/care about the membership,they planned on Shields failing. I voted for Shields and yes I will say it may have been a mistake but if the old timers arent helping him then the mistake was keeping the old guys.
Is Little Mikey Shields any relation to the corrupt Cook County Judge David G. Shields that got nailed in the Operation Gambat/Greylord investigation by the FBI? Also arrested and convicted with Judge Shields was Chicago Outfit member Pasquale "Pat" De Leo. Is he related to retired Illinois State Senator James De Leo who is very tight with Mayor Rahm Emanuel? This screw up was intentional to the benefit of Mayor Emanuel.
I'm not a lawyer but did it not say if you want to terminate submit by those dates, why would we terminate, keep everything the same until new contract. Before were ready to hang everyone lets have someone with a law degree look this over.
Both sides are pointing fingers at each other. What it comes down to is that Clueless Mikey will use our dues money to fight this in court. Oh by the way expect a dues increase for Clueless Mikey F-up
Challenge it in court. Do NOT agree with their new conditions.
1). This is a "magic words" attack. The contract says that you have to notify the City that the Game is on - meaning, you have to tell the City that the cops are electing to terminate rather than merely continue under the terms of the existing contract.
2). But, the City's letter would normally quote the exact language that the contract requires - if the contract contains exact and specific words that you need to recite to trigger termination.
3). Since the City's letter doesn't contain a quoted section of "magic words", then the contract provision probably only requires that you inform the City that you are terminating the contract, using normal language in such a way that a reasonable person of normal intelligence can tell what it is that you're saying.
4). Shields' letter says "the contract expires on June 30th. We want to begin negotiations on May 1." It would be hard NOT to read this as saying "it's expiring because we're terminating it. If we weren't terminating it, then, by the terms of the contract itself, it wouldn't be expiring. And we want to start the negotiations that are only needed for a new contract - keeping the old contract terms wouldn't require any negotiations."
5). Franczek's letter back to Shields doesn't say "huh? I don't understand what you're telling me." Clearly, he knows exactly what Shields was saying. He's laughing at him specifically because he thinks he said it wrong. This is good, because the City can't claim that your supposed lack of notice caused the City to assume you wanted to continue the old contract, and thus maybe caused them to do something or not do something that puts them at a disadvantage. In other words, no damage or prejudice. No real justice-oriented reason why a judge couldn't tell the City to get real and start negotiating.
6). As for the "you sent the letter to the wrong place" argument the City makes, I have to ask - does the contract say that you need to send the termination notice to a specific person or address? I'm guessing it doesn't, because they would have quoted that language in Franczek's letter if it did. This is good for you.
You can't talk to a city. You can't send the city a letter. Cities and towns and states operate through People. And, if the contract doesn't tell you which person is "the City" for purposes of termination notice, you get some leeway in guessing.
If Shield's letter went to someone to whom you normally address things when you want to be speaking to "the City", you stand a good chance of prevailing on this point, too. If your department talks to "Commander O'Neil" when it needs to communicate something to "the City", or when negotiation with the City, then you arguably DID notify "The City" with your letter.
- - - -
A judge could go either way with these arguments. The honest reading is in favor of you guys - the law is supposed to disfavor "contract by trick" - a/k/a The Sporting Theory of Justice. So, if you get a judge that likes you guys, or is neutral, you should prevail. If you get a judge that hates cops or loves the city, it could go the other way.
"Looks like I picked a bad day to stop sniffing glue."
I don's think it's a good idea to put this shit out on the internets for everyone to read. The city said they will negotiate, so where is the issue? Also, if everthing goes in the shitter, can we remain status quo for a year? /that might be a great thing. It is going to be a bumpy ride, for sure. But the hating and the monday A.M. quarterbacking don';t help.
Read the law mentioned in Shields letter. We are A-OK.
2:04am reading comprehension is clearly not your strong suit.
Lodge sent letter on March 20th which needed to be in by March 1st stating current contract should be terminated on June 30th. Smug lawyer is extending current contract for another year due to incompetence on FOP's part.
Clear and unambiguous: blow me!
Look at what a great job he did at the pension board. How could he not be a great president. Lol.
20 times in the past two days? Seriously? Don't you guys get it yet? THE CITY WANTS US TO FIGHT EACH OTHER! Don't fall for it, fellas. Shields is about the only guy out there in the labor world that has the balls to tell City Hall to shove it. They don't want to negotiate with Shields b/c he won't surrender like FOP always did in the past. We were always first cuz we were easy to deal with. Not any more. Think about it.
Civic Federation and Tribune team up again to stir up anti-police, anti-fire, anti-teacher pension sentiment among the public
A lifetime of service for a hard earned and promised pension only to be stolen by the elites in this town.
Lets think about this. I believe we are going to get screwed on the next contract, so lets keep this current one for as long as possible, think about it, what are we losing, 1.5 % retro check for a year, big deal . Think about how much we can lose.
To my fellow Officers,
I think we should withhold judgment until after this plays out. We don't know if this is FOP's strategy or incompetence. In the end it might work or it might not. We will just have to wait and see. Stay safe my Brothers and Sisters. -008
this makes me sick like in blue flu if the city wants fuck us
SCC,
Good looking out for us. I know Shields comes and reads this. Mike you are an asshat.
Im retiring in 2014. It's a pleasure to know that one of my last acts will be to vote against Shields and the entire FOP board and committee. (oh yeah and to hit the medical for a couple of months)
You youngsters should have voted forGreg Bella.
Time to clean house, this contract will be the worst screwing we have ever received.
It's funny, I didn't vote for Shields and I remember the people who were saying they wanted change. Now I can't find anyone who admitted voting for this new team. Thanks for falling for their bs. Look what we have now. It's horrible.
Maybe our FOP president has his hands full.
He Runs the General Iron Security and continues to make the schedule and run the day shift for all off duty police officers working there.
He continues to work for Heneghan (sp?) Demolition and provides the off duty police for security gigs.
He still sits on the Pension Board.
He continues to wear several hats while still ATTEMPTING to run the FOP.
This letter shows he cannot keep doing everything. Maybe he should go be a professional SECURITY CONTRACTOR and leave the FOP business to real professionals.
Enjoy that nice vehicle the FOP got for you MR. President…….you and those seated next to you at the FOP meetings will soon be replaced.
Oh and if you think he's such a good guy maybe we should re-publish that EMAIL he sent to a lot of the FOP members saying he didn't forget the deadline. Typical of a person speaking out both sides of his mouth.
Typical of a politician from SHIT-ago.
lets look at this,the fire union for example will be going through a buzz saw,maybe just maybe this could be a good thing! At least we are not losing anything yet! Including on medical days,duty pay etc...
If anything,it shows division in our Union. You can't tell me someone in our Union hasn't negotiated a contract before and didn't catch this. To me it shows someone trying to make the new administration look bad, or the arrogant new administration not listening. Either way,it's unacceptable and will effect the members bottom line.
Anonymous said...
When was the FOP suppose to have had this letter in by?
6/25/2012 12:57:00 AM
Hey Mikey ! There you are! You should've asked this a year ago
might be good move on FOP part, delay negotiations and try to wait out the bad economy
I dislike that Shields went to a State College. This is the result...Nevertheless, I stand by Shields in that the the opposing parties (all of them ie.Commander,City, and Law firm) are being cute.
Negotiate the terms already and be done with it.
America
You should call the FOP, or go to the next meeting in September and ask about it then!
The City said it WILL negotiate. It has NEVER said that it would not. Where then is the problem?
Methinks this is all the doing of a down and out lietenant who cannot get himself or anyone else elected.
Does this mean we can strike?
I don't follow the logic. How could it be "very very bad" if Rahm beats down every union in front of us. If that happens, they will all be getting less pay for 2012-2013 and we would remain at the same level of pay. Right? And of course that will only happen IF the City changes course and says it will NOT negotiate. The City has already said that it WILL negotiate. Duh!
Launch A CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION into the lapse or apparent lapse by the union president..
Denver police officer murdered trying to break up an animal fight at a concert on duty detail. Condolences to denver P D for thier loss.
It looks like flop dropped the ball and we'll receive no pay raise from june 30 2012 through July 1 , 2013 . At least we'll keep medical , duty availability ,personal days etc.
Stupervisors may give up duty availabity to keep the 45 min a day free comp time and their quarterly overtime checks.
OT Arizona should transport all illegals to Washington DC , provide a free greyhound bus ticket and $100 cash
I did not vote for mike shields for 1 reason only! That reason was lack of experience in FOP and time on the job! Well a lot of you bought into his grandstanding at the pension board and hubberman, well looks like I was right. I blame a lot of people besides shields for this mistake. The second person I blame the most is commander Bob Oneal. He knew the letter should have not gone to him but directly to the city but instead he said nothing to shields and forwarded it to the city where it was held on to until the expiration date had surpassed and to late for the mistake to be rectified. I don't blame the city, it was a smart move on their behalf. Now getting back to the commander, he started his job as a blue shirit and should have some loyalty to us not the city. This action he took or lack there of, shows he had all intentions on playing the game for the city. So to you commander Bob oneal, don't ever call yourself a Chicago policemen ever again, you may call yourself a city of Chicago employee nothing else. Thanks for nothing, people who make it to the big leagues need to remember where they came from, but few do!
Explanation? Real simple, WE'RE FUCKED!
20X? From 20 different people? Do you think that there are 20 people who care? Why couldn't 20 people who care have run for FOP office?
Instead we have 20 board members who collect $600 per month to kiss the asses of the 8 guys who collect $12,000 per month.
I recall Mike Shields showing up to give his speech when he was running. He pulled his wallet out as a prop and it looked so stupid and rehearsed. Then he kept showing people that he was going to be on the news that evening. I thought he was too immature for the position, but I voted for him anyway because I liked how he handled Huberman. I completely regret that decision. Now every time I see him on the news looking like a wet behind the ears kid, I think how Rahm must be laughing.
Mike, you said when you were running to read the contract and understand it. Sounds like pretty good advice, kid. You should take your own advice and then find someone to explain to you what you read so you don't screw us all when you represent us.
My head is clear. I voted for Paschke.
Anonymous said...
What does it say can't bring it up sorry?
6/25/2012 02:14:00 AM
It says Mike fucked up and now we have to pay for it!
That Union arbitration is why the place I worked at closed.. they sent in an arbitrator end of company.. sold out to a non union company.. about 1,000 people lost their jobs.. while they can't close/sell the CPD wonder if it could be just as bad with ROM at the helm..
No need to rush anyway, it usually takes 3 years. Now this puts more pressure on them to pass the casino bill, then they can't cry broke.
That's pretty bad and the response from the City is understandably patronizing.
A secretary could have written a better letter.
---not a cop
On top of that, Garry had a initiated a check of all the useless spots in the Detective division. In Area 1 , IAD found out quickly some of the useless dogs are abusing the system. Now Garry can justify no promotions
What is going on in Area 1? I hear certain guys are going to be stripped.
No mention of the Pride melee and the accompanying wildings?
019 was a mess all night!
OK, to all of you who NOW are crying about Shields, I have one question:
DID YOU VOTE?
This a big problem for us, complacency, disinterest, and laziness. I'd be willing to bet that if they broke down the numbers we would find that the percentage of retired members that voted was far higher than the percentage of active members. And, no offense to my retired brothers and sisters, but the election should only be decided by active members.
Get off your butts and vote, whether it is the FOP election or the City, County, State and Presidential elections. When you don't vote, you go from being a "sheepdog" to being a sheep.
I voted for Bella. I would've voted for Shields in a lesser role, but I didn't feel he was qualified to be President. And, after hearing the "inside stuff" that I've been hearing from The Lodge, I believe I was correct in voting for Bella.
Too bad so many of my brothers and sisters didn't take 5 minutes to vote, we might be in a better situation right now.
I hope all you little 5-11 year wonders are happy with your choice of Shields ~ we old timers tried to tell you to go with experience and vote for Bella but you idiots wanted change & new blood...hope your happy, DUMMIES!
*** READ THIS *** READ THIS *** READ THIS ***
All you geniuses must be too smart to know how to pick up a fucking contract. SPECIFICALLY page #48, where it states: "It (that'd be the existing contract) shall continue in effect from year to year thereafter UNLESS NOTICE OF TERMINATION is given, in writing, by certified mail...".
FOP ain't terminating the contract. In the letter that the lawyers for the city cite, it spells out that FOP wishes to go to contract talks. Now all the other unions get to go to the table while we watch and learn where the enemy is coming from and his plans for the department are.
This is strategy, folks. We maintain our current perks (Duty Availability, Uniform Allowance, etc.) while the rest of the unions fight for theirs (Rahm clearly stated on numerous occasions that he wants to bleed us). All you anonymous cowards ripping on the union, specifically Shields should be ashamed of yourselves. Do you really think the VPs that have been through contract talks in he past would purposely throw the entire FOP membership under the bus? Not likely, regardless of how you might feel about them personally.
Get your heads out of your asses and stand behind your union before Rahm's Divide & Conquer works itself thru to completion.
Recent Retiree
I get a kick out of the responses. Many concerned with the retro check, no mention of the impending doom of the pension fund. Sometimes the police get what they deserve. Worry about non-existent retro checks while the pension fund is going down the tube.
contract, what contract? do you mean the one he continues to violate? a contract should be between men of honor. would you say hes as good as his word? even with his signature on a piece of paper it means what he wants to mean. REMEMBER IN NOVEMBER
impeach shields
I think people should give Sheilds a break. He's got a lot to focus on, like the silly lawsuit he filed againts Greg Bella, and the security company that he runs. He can't do everything.
Take my dues that's all they do
supervisors will have a contract before FOP , no pay raise for 2012 -2013
What a nice bone they tossed the city eh?
Right out of the negotiation box. The mayor being such a nice and caring guy can tell you how cooperative he is being because he really doesn't have to offer anything at all because a deadline was blown. So see. Now what are you guys going to give back in "good faith".
You're coming out of the box with lowered expectation now because of this.
Forcing the contract for another year is the best thing for us.
Fireman will see no raises and no retro.
If calculated by the union great thinkers or maybe just dumb luck.
The MLB practice this tactic everytime and usually win concesssions from the team owners.
City contracts are meaningless. Did the city pay into the pension plans over the last ten years like it was supposed to?
What's the consequences?
The rank and file should take less benefits or contribute more into the pensions because the money was stolen and used to fund things like Daley's and Burks security detail of retired cops instead.
What's the alternative?
The taxpayers are tapped out.
Funny how the politicians look at everyone but themselves when it comes to a solution to the thefts.
Unfuckinbelievable that the political powers should stand there like they are the victims, seeking to help save something that was caused by their own neglect and actions.
The taxpayers were lied too telling us the money was going to pensions and it went to clouted city contractors.
The police were lied to when the city agreed to make pension contributions and then failed to do so.
WHERE'S THE MONEY!?
This social contract is fucked up!
Geez, you guys read this shady lawyers letter as if it is the word of God! The city is doing the same shit that they did with renaming W/C's as X/O's and desk sgt's as station supervisors, any sneaky snake oil trick to get past contractual rights. Sending a legal letter to the city asking for our contact to be terminated, yeah that's a great idea idiots! The FOP did exactly what it has done for years, but now these new shady lawyers are going to try a mislead and incorrectly interpret the contact that's all a dog and pony show for future arbitrators, and you goofs fell for it hook line and sinker.
In plain English it sounds like the FOP did nothing wrong. I believe that if we wanted to TERMINATE the contract a letter needed to be sent by March 1st. I don't think that the FOP, or any of us, want to terminate the current contract.
Everyone knows that legal speak is different than plain English, but terminate means terminate. We don't want to terminate the current contract. We want to negotiate a new one leaving the current one in force until that time when a new one is agreed upon.
Anyone care to explain?
This is way the old school didn't vote for them. the old team got us the benefits and insurance. If you had more that 15yrs on the job you would have known not to vote for the new kids..you asked for it, now live with it..just an old school cop talking out loud..I/F
uh oh As Bugs Bunny Or the Road Runner would say in the cartoons,
YIKES!!
What does this really mean? There may not be any retro? Think about it folks do you really believe that the "Rahmshiester" was going to allow us a raise anyway? Current provisions will stay in affect. Medical, Duty Availability, Uniform Allowance. All of the things the little queen wants to take away are still in effect.
Idoits if you fail to see thru Rahm and his lying co-horts you will see they want us to terminate the present contract so they DO NOT have to honor any retro or provisions after it expires at the end of JUNE 2012. We in essence will be working WITHOUT a contract and thats what Rahm wants you without any protection.
Unfortunately, with Shields making the decisions I fear the FOP will be eaten alive by the City's negotiators. The City does not employ newcomers to do these contracts.
I cannot believe that the elected people down there at FOP Hall who worked on several previous contracts purposely sat on their hands and allowed Shields to screw the pooch so badly on this one. Mark Donahue too. Donahue is on the FOP payroll too. One would think that one of them would say hey, pay attention.
And we all get fucked, not by Rahm or the City but by our own union president.
Too fucking much.
This is wrong on a number of levels. The President should be held responsible for this for not knowing his job and for lying to the membership about filing the decision. It is not a bad thing to extend our contract a year, we don't know what the climate will be in a year. Regardless, I hold every single officer at the FOP responsible. We pay a ton of money for large salaries for a president, multiple vice presidents, and useless other employees. We also pay a lot for attorneys, consultants, ex president salaries, etc. This is a godsend that this happened. We as the membership need to step up to the plate and demand a new way of operating for our union that we pay for.
Apparently multiple vice presidents are unnecessary and do not serve a purpose since they too do not know anything about when to file THE MOST IMPORTANT notice of intent that they are hired for. Get rid of these positions. Have ONE vice president. Save our money and reduce our contributions which are only financing ineptitude.
Eliminate salaries for past presidents if this is sell in force. No past president deserves a salary off of my dues. What for. Get rid of it.
Eliminate the language in our contract that provides for an automatic increase to our dues with each contract negotiation. Evaluation should be made to see if its necessary. I do not wish to or agree to pay for cadillacs for any FOP member.
We need to use this crisis to demand change at our FOP. The waste and ineptitude did not start with Shields but it should definitely end with him.
shields.... what a fucking mistake, curse all of you that that put this incompetent idiot at the helm.
Shields sounds like Michael Keaton in Gung Ho, negotiating with the Japanese car mfr. Lies and then will try to cover his own ass while the union does the heavy lifting. Maybe you guys should drop him off in Englewood with a sandwich board like bruce willis in Die Hard 3.
Whats the FOP website say:
NOTHING
Off Topic: Lawrence Msall wants to reduce our pension, can someone please find out what his state pension and benefits are, and if he receives any other benefits. Very appreciated. Any news agency tuning in that would like to help?
Divide and conquer. That little 9 fingered hobgoblin must laugh his ass off when he reads this blog. Relax.
Our contract has have never been settled in a year and it doesn't put us at a disadvantage in negotiations. If anything, a delay will give the market time to improve and Rahms friend will be out of the White House.
Half of these posts are put on by the same guy that hates Shields and the other by guys that aren't smart enough to look at the big picture. Take a breath and stay together. Don't panic.
Here is an explanation: the FOP was supposed to submit this letter by March 20. They didn't. All the other unions did it on time. Then, it was sent to the wrong person. So now the city has a huge advantage over us, for no other reason than the people who get our union dues to take care of our business do not know what they are doing. That is the explanation.
Off Topic Again: Lawrence Msall, due YOU receive a C.O.L.A. from the STATE OF ILLINOIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This is an attempt by the Human Root Canal, Don O'Neill , to create friction between the FOP Board and the rank and file members. Don't fall for it!
Why don't all you haters wait for Shields' response before you throw him under the bus. You are acting like the left wing police hating media which always blows things out of proportion. Have you forgotten that there is always more to the story? In fact, this is probably part of the raccoon's plan to undermine our confidence in our leadership. I'm witholding judgement until I get all the facts and so should those of you who love to anonymously destroy someone's character!
If this, the city playing as hardball as it can, doesn't bring you guys together, nothing will.
You can reopen, and you can negotiate. there is no advantage to waiting. Pick a date, notify, and show up. If the city doesn't, record it, pick another and show up. Etc. Assume that if you end up in interest arbitration you will not receive retro pay for the first year. The abritrator will not have authority to award because of the late filing. That said, demand backpay in negotiations and hold to it. You are in a shittier spot than if you timely filed, but only if the city openly declares war. Don't sell your soul for a year retro pay, keep your heads.
-ex labor negotiator-
Status quo is not a bad thing....for now
all I have to say is.... WOW! Just so you all know, we are also NOT eligible now for RETRO pay from the dates of 01 Jul 2012 - 30 Jun 2013. Oh little mike shields, your finished. what a joke.
Sounds to me that the lodge did nothing wrong? Why would the lodge terminate our contract (Agreement)? We negotiate a replacement agreement while the old one remains in force. Am I wrong?
*******************
Yes you are wrong. The lodge must give adequate notice that it intends to terminate the current contract on 20 jun 2012. In giving notice to the city it is requesting a new contract to replace the current contract. Its a technicality but its basic contract law. And when I say basic, I mean like day one in law school stuff. Its not a huge thing. Its just a one paragraph notice to the city that gets put in the file for the negotiations. In the legal world there are a million things you have to remember to do to keep it all legal and documented. I guess the lodge missed that......
The SILENCE from FOP speaks Volumes!
Next FOP meeting we need to call for the President to step down. Demand it
God PLEASE!!! I want my VOTE BACK!!!!!
Mike I have to say I believed in you and voted for you but when I was at T/C today that was the talk of the day and in the district. Everyone I talk to is ready to do a "no confidence vote". I hope you enjoyed your tenure my friend. And for the ASSHAT comment from above: LMFAO!
How many times do we have to go through this? PUUHHHLLLEEEZZEEE!! Enough, already. If the letter was not in compliance with the state law it cites to, the City would have told us to F___ off. But they didn't . So give it a rest.
Here are some salaries of top lawyers in Chicago:
US Attorney - $156,000
State's Attorney - $172,000
Corporation Counsel - $173,000
Federal judges - $174,000
Cook County judges - $195,000
Illinois Attorney general - $153,000
Now someone should go ask the FOP what the salary is for the genius who is the "general counsel" there. You'll be surprised, and not in a good way.
can the union sue the law firm for malpractice????
Anonymous said...
Listen to this shit:
My Catholic parish had a carnival. Did not do so well. After it was over, Rahm sent them a $5000 bill! For what I don't know.
6/25/2012 09:12:00 AM
Which parish??
After reading a few times on here things such as.... I admit I voted for Shields, guess I was wrong' etc etc. This is an unfortunate example of why some of the newer guys should check their ego and listen a little to the guys with time on the job. I'm sure you heard over and over... If this guy gets in, we're screwed. But again the hair gels know it all, another big problem with us. When I came on, there was enormous respect for the guys with time on, that's non existent now..............................maybe if bella had one ounce of people skills he could have won that election. He entered roll calls and spoke to people like they were complete idiots. I wish Greg well on his retirement and hopefully Shields will follow.
They didn't mess up. FOP doesn't intend on terminating the contract. They intend to modify it under the Illinois Public Labor Relations Act, 5 ILCS 315/7. Stop freaking out.
NEWS FEED
From FOP website
Contract Negotiations Clarification
March 28, 2012
No matter what you read in the Sun Times quoting “off the record” sources, there is no dispute between the FOP and the City regarding upcoming contract negotiations. Our agreement was timely re-opened on March 20, 2012, well within the time limits that apply for modifications that would improve your labor agreement, address the critical issue of manpower, the safety of the public and of police officers, increase your wages and improve officers’ welfare. Under the Illinois Public Labor Relations Act, 5 ILCS 315/7, a party to a collective bargaining agreement must terminate or modify the agreement by giving the other side notice of the intent to terminate or modify the agreement 60 days before the expiration date. Our contract expires June 30. Therefore, any notice before May 1 would have been timely notice. The IPLRA does not require us to give the City notice by March 1.
However, the labor agreement, Section 28.1, is anything but clear and unambiguous. The agreement provides that “notice of termination” must be given by March 1, 2012. FOP never intended to send a notice of termination. Our labor agreement needs modifications, not termination.
Your core negotiating committee has already solicited your ideas for improving our contract and the committee will be representing your interests in the negotiations no matter when the City comes to the table. Any further recommendations to the committee should be submitted via email to bdougherty@chicagofop.org or dgorman@chicagofop.org
I didnt vote for mike and am not thrilled with his tenure thus far... HOWEVER- will reserve judgement until AFTER I see how this plays out. Ok, so mike wrote a letter, and the city disagrees. No surprise there. Let's see what fop's response is before going apeshit....
Maybe MIke Shields was working on SECURITY gigs instead of reading the contract…….hmmmmmmm
Anonymous said...
*** READ THIS *** READ THIS *** READ THIS ***
All you geniuses must be too smart to know how to pick up a fucking contract. SPECIFICALLY page #48, where it states: "It (that'd be the existing contract) shall continue in effect from year to year thereafter UNLESS NOTICE OF TERMINATION is given, in writing, by certified mail...".
FOP ain't terminating the contract. In the letter that the lawyers for the city cite, it spells out that FOP wishes to go to contract talks. Now all the other unions get to go to the table while we watch and learn where the enemy is coming from and his plans for the department are.
This is strategy, folks. We maintain our current perks (Duty Availability, Uniform Allowance, etc.) while the rest of the unions fight for theirs (Rahm clearly stated on numerous occasions that he wants to bleed us). All you anonymous cowards ripping on the union, specifically Shields should be ashamed of yourselves. Do you really think the VPs that have been through contract talks in he past would purposely throw the entire FOP membership under the bus? Not likely, regardless of how you might feel about them personally.
Get your heads out of your asses and stand behind your union before Rahm's Divide & Conquer works itself thru to completion.
Recent Retiree
6/25/2012 03:01:00 PM
you are an idiot. learn how to read. you have to terminate to renegotiate. however, the contract stays ineffect after termination until the new contract is done.
go back in your hole old timer.
Anonymous said...
I get a kick out of the responses. Many concerned with the retro check, no mention of the impending doom of the pension fund. Sometimes the police get what they deserve. Worry about non-existent retro checks while the pension fund is going down the tube.
6/25/2012 03:28:00 PM
they are 2 separate issues. of course we are worried about the pension u asshat.
the contract isnt gonna save our pension. it is being legislated downstate
Wow. JJJ taking leave of absence because of 'exhaustion'? Who is he, Lindsay Lohan??? How much you want to bet lil Jessie is about to be indicted??? We can only hope.
I hope everyone who voted for shields realizes what a huge mistake they made. Not only is he incompetent as a leader he is also all about himself. I hope things don't get worse. Thankfully the city didn't screw us as they could have!
I hope all you little 5-11 year wonders are happy with your choice of Shields ~ we old timers tried to tell you to go with experience and vote for Bella but you idiots wanted change & new blood...hope your happy, DUMMIES!
6/25/2012 03:00:00 PM
I am getting so sick of the number of years going up as I go up. When I had 3 years it was you 3 year wonders. Now that I have 7 years, I am a 7 year wonder. I know the city is not hiring so you cannot try to ridicule new guys but come on. Just because you were born a few years earlier than me doesn't really guarantee you are wiser than I.
"Anonymous said... Idoits if you fail to see thru Rahm and his lying co-horts you will see they want us to terminate the present contract so they DO NOT have to honor any retro or provisions after it expires at the end of JUNE 2012. We in essence will be working WITHOUT a contract and thats what Rahm wants you without any protection.
6/25/2012 06:02:00 PM"
I have met the idiot, and the idiot is you.
Is this your first contract?
Anonymous said...
Yea it appears that the president not only lied to the members but also his board. Wtf was 1st vp Dougherty doing or 2nd vp dimaria doing, or donahough, shields and Gorman take blame for lying to us after the fact!!! U other incompetent fools what is your story.
I do think that it isn't a bad thing that we go last. Christ for years we have been doing all the leg work for the other unions.
6/25/2012 01:30:00 AM
They all got to go! Complete incompetence!
Why would you want to terminate the contract?
Would you like to be making 10/hr with no furloughs?
Because that is what "terminate" means. If you terminate the contract you would not be working under the contract, you would not have a contract. You would terminate the contract and the provision in Article 28.2 titled "Continuing Effect." Lot of people in this thread who have a lot of knowledge about "first day of law school," but obviously never finished. It's pretty apparent they have not had enough high school based on the inability to comprehend the term "terminate."
Section 28.2 — Continuing Effect.
Notwithstanding any provision of this Article or Agreement to the contrary, this
Agreement shall remain in full force and effect after any expiration date while
negotiations or Resolution of Impasse Procedure are continuing for a new
Agreement or part thereof between the Parties.
Shields, Bella, Gorman Resign!!!!! You Stinky Guys You!!!
The post written by "recent retiree" is actually someone down at the FOP. When I called about this very same thing months ago, that's the bull shit I was fed. It's a strategy. The spin is that the FOP wanted to let the others do the initial negotiating. It's bull shit. I told all of you guys that this entire team was a mistake and now the ignorance of an uneducated voter had doomed us all.
Nice job rookies
SCC:
Even if the FOP did, as you say, 'drop the ball,' it wasn't intentional. Shields is a new President of that union, and few if any of the Old Guard are around, other than Sid Davis, whom, as we all know, was pretty much tossed out of the building by Shields and Co.
Apparently, those in the old guard who could have squared this parcel of pertinent info with the new regime decided not to. Let's hope that oversight doesn't mess over the FOP active members of Lodge 7, who deserve so much better.
My Catholic parish had a carnival. Did not do so well. After it was over, Rahm sent them a $5000 bill! For what I don't know.
6/25/2012 09:12:00 AM
Too bad so sad. The Catholic church is the most liberal group of traitors in this country. They lost my $$ the day my kid had his Christening. They provide free education to the illegals on our dime, but no more. Hopefully the days of church not paying taxes will be over too.
Anonymous said...
Divide and conquer. That little 9 fingered hobgoblin must laugh his ass off when he reads this blog. Relax.
Our contract has have never been settled in a year and it doesn't put us at a disadvantage in negotiations. If anything, a delay will give the market time to improve and Rahms friend will be out of the White House.
Half of these posts are put on by the same guy that hates Shields and the other by guys that aren't smart enough to look at the big picture. Take a breath and stay together. Don't panic.
6/25/2012 07:33:00 PM
_________________________________
There are many incredibly smart people on the job and on this blog. So, you are smart because you can throw out the cliche "big picture." I am willing to bet that you do not have the life or academic achievements of some of the people who (yes, notice that the word "who" is used when referring to people and not the word "that") are really smart. But aptitude and intelligence are not requirements for this job.
Shields was the Obama of the FOP. young inexperienced and rode a wave of all hopey changie; and all the young cops voted for that over experience (like McCain) and the outcome is a similar disaster.
Anonymous said...
Why don't all you haters wait for Shields' response before you throw him under the bus. You are acting like the left wing police hating media which always blows things out of proportion. Have you forgotten that there is always more to the story? In fact, this is probably part of the raccoon's plan to undermine our confidence in our leadership. I'm witholding judgement until I get all the facts and so should those of you who love to anonymously destroy someone's character!
6/25/2012 07:55:00 PM
You're the same type of goof that probably said the same thing about Mc501 and we all know how that worked out.
Do you work for the predictive analysis unit? It would explain why they couldn't find cheese in Wisconsin.
To everybody freaking out...
Rahm has his minions posting on the blog just like he has them hijacking comment threads to derail and misdirect from the important discussion at hand.
The Patrolman has to keep his head while lesser people lose theirs...
We've collectively fought and ARE FIGHTING all manner of powers, principalities, devils, demons, imps, sprites, ill "humours" and bad ju-ju in general.
Rahm just happens to be an imp of a curious sort.
Viciousness, skulduggery and goonery are things he understands.
Perhaps if our elected representation graciously declined to play nice?
The Marquis of Queensbury would get his ass whooped in this brawl.
Hmmm... Kinda like dealing with a bad boss who picks on people he figures won't fight back and take his hide off?
Just like dude on the corner... Until the one day you catch him flat-footed, drawers down and dirty like a motherfucker.
"Ha ha... I was just jokin'..."
And with that, the initiative is yours...
SCC getting multiples regarding 28.1?
How much of it is bonafide?
How much of it is planted misdirection from 111 North LaSalle?
It isn't 30 June.
Yet...
"maybe if bella had one ounce of people skills he could have won that election. He entered roll calls and spoke to people like they were complete idiots. I wish Greg well on his retirement and hopefully Shields will follow.
6/25/2012 09:57:00 P"
Well you numbskulls voted for Shields,so I guess Bella was right all along, You are an IDIOT.
Good or bad? Did he fvck up or played dumb tactically? I dont know, but does anyone actually think there would be a retro check in the first place? I was guessing 0% for the first increase anyway. Now that Rahm will have his speed camera's and revenue will be generating by the time we're eligible for negotiations, I'm thinking that we will have a better chance. Shields better come in strong and hard "early" next year.
Why don't all you haters wait for Shields' response before you throw him under the bus. You are acting like the left wing police hating media which always blows things out of proportion. Have you forgotten that there is always more to the story? In fact, this is probably part of the raccoon's plan to undermine our confidence in our leadership. I'm witholding judgement until I get all the facts and so should those of you who love to anonymously destroy someone's character!
6/25/2012 07:55:00 PM
Not sure where you have been but Shields did respond to this allegation in a mass email from the FOP a few months ago. His response was that he filed with the Illinois Labor Relations Board. He also said the City was aware of his intent to begin negotiations but....that wasn't exactly true was it? What about Rich, Dan and all the other folks up in that office? Some of which have been with FOP previously. They didn't know either? It's not exclusively about whether we will suffer or not, we will be ok with our benefits through 2013 it's more of a sore spot they all dropped the ball in communicating with the City and with us. Therein lies the disappointment.
How will the me too clause work with the firefighters?
Unfortunately, with Shields making the decisions I fear the FOP will be eaten alive by the City's negotiators. The City does not employ newcomers to do these contracts.
I cannot believe that the elected people down there at FOP Hall who worked on several previous contracts purposely sat on their hands and allowed Shields to screw the pooch so badly on this one. Mark Donahue too. Donahue is on the FOP payroll too. One would think that one of them would say hey, pay attention.
And we all get fucked, not by Rahm or the City but by our own union president.
Too fucking much.
6/25/2012 06:03:00 PM
I agree. The President is responsible but I believe others let the deadline go just to prove a selfish and jealous point. Well you guys succeeded and you showed your pettiness in the process. The membership is the only thing any of you need be concerned with. Don't run again. The whole gang is getting out!!
Anonymous said...
How many times do we have to go through this? PUUHHHLLLEEEZZEEE!! Enough, already. If the letter was not in compliance with the state law it cites to, the City would have told us to F___ off. But they didn't . So give it a rest.
6/25/2012 09:04:00 PM
Enough.
Enough of what already?
Hell, these fools at the FOP did not even send their letter to the correct city location!
Time for Shields and his entire board to resign.
the other story is that the old timers wanted to see Shields fail, so they let him. Demaria Dougherty Agilar didnt think/care about the membership,they planned on Shields failing. I voted for Shields and yes I will say it may have been a mistake but if the old timers arent helping him then the mistake was keeping the old guys.
6/25/2012 09:39:00 AM
AMEN!
Anonymous said...
They didn't mess up. FOP doesn't intend on terminating the contract. They intend to modify it under the Illinois Public Labor Relations Act, 5 ILCS 315/7. Stop freaking out.
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ehh... since I'm not sure the city has to negotiate contracts in the order in which they are received, let's just assume they can start with whatever union they want to, although they attempt to insinuate they would have HAD to negotiate with US first if only little Mikey would have bothered to ensure the proper people were notified with the proper legal terminology to cut off exactly this kind of fuckover.
In this case, they've clearly signalled their intent to start with the smallest unions first to appeal to their collective greed in order that they give up things that mean little to them but have large impact upon the rank and file. It's pretty clear that the Captains are sellouts, they just proved it less than a year ago so it's no surprise that they'll likely start there with the greediest few and move on down the numbers game, giving away little bullshit perks and cash giveaways that will only apply to them, such as shitting on raises for a higher supervisor's quarterly which we do not get, maybe upping the Sgts pay by giving the out of grade for DSS functions which they don't get now. All those little bullshit items that cost the city little, but will make the white shirts drool because they see dollar signs and will give up the things that matter little to them for a few non-pensionable, non-salary related items.
Consider this as well: The fuckstick racoonboy will surely atttempt to add language in this contract that will allow him to renegotiate DOWN the financial aspects of the contract within 2 years. That's a fact, and that WILL be given up by an arbiter if it gets that far.
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