Special Order 06-14-03
From the comments:
- Anyone see
the new order on responding to incidents involving citizenship? The
street deputy will respond, along with…. the wol. Interesting how they
left the commander and captain off of it. Why wouldn’t they respond? Or
be required to respond? Dumping it all on the WOL’s as usual as they
skirt without any responsibility or liability.
And sure enough, hopping over to the online directive site, you find this Order, updated 20 January 2025.
Skimming through, you'll find the usual responsibilities and such listed. But there's a phrase that keeps popping up:
- "civil immigration enforcement"
As far as we know, illegal immigration isn't "civil" at all - it's criminal, 100% of the time. So all this order seems to do is further muddy the waters in an attempt for Chicago politicians to put illegal aliens in front of actual America citizens....you know, the people paying taxes to support the police (and government).
Read it carefully so you know what's what and what's expected or required.
The part about making the WOL's leave the office though....damn.
Labels: national politics
posted by SCC at 12:03 AM
108 Comments:
Hardworking legal immigrant
https://x.com/CitizenFreePres/status/1891311935489978438
Brandon Johnson is a BITCH. Fatass governor too.
It's a "Civil" case if Chicago say so!
Don't get yourself jammed up on an Obstruction charge from the Feds. If the Street Deputy or some dumb ass wants to, let them.
By following the Order you are hindering or obstructing Federal enforcement of our nation’s immigration laws. But the bosses and the fucking democratic pols walk free. Another trick bag for coppers.
Good luck getting a Lt or Sgt to respond to that Lololol
The part about making the WOL's leave the office though....damn.
This should be changed to AWOL based on what merit hack occupies this position...
Crossing the border without authorization is a Federal crime. Overstaying a visa (thereby also being subject to deportation) is a civil violation. Both can get you deported in addition to other penalties (some criminal-like jail time; some civil--like fines, or being denied a new visa). Whether the underlying violation is criminal or civil, most of the "warrants" ICE acts on are administrative warrants, not criminal warrants.
As all the police here certainly know, a criminal warrant is issued to law enforcement (executive branch) by a judge (judicial branch) and meets 4th Amendment standards based on the neutral oversight of a separate branch of government (yes, I know that last part isn't in the text). An administrative warrant or detainer is issued by an immigration judge (administrative law "judge" in the executive branch) to Federal law enforcement (executive branch). They do not meet 4th amendment standards and are civil orders, not criminal.
Not sure that helped. But as murky as the directive is, it's partly because the details get complicated. Not defending the order. Just providing some background that they couldn't be bothered to include.
I can’t wait to move.
The Dems here keeping fighting this and wasting our money doing it. They are going to lose to Tom Homan.
The WOL/ FOL positions are the worst jobs on the department now. Don’t take the promotion unless you’re heavy enough to get to a unit asap, where you’re safe from getting your hands dirty, I.E. approving Arrest Reports and TRRs. The position is a career killer. COPA is openly gunning for you.
Deputy Chief’s will respond huh?
So when Don Jerome shows up and puts his foot in his mouth again and some savy lawyer sues the Police Department are we footing the bill or is he because at that time he won’t just get suspended?
https://chicago.suntimes.com/police-reform/2024/12/10/high-ranking-chicago-cop-suspension-disparaging-gays-leaking-records-deputy-mayor
Lt exodus in 3. 2. Smh
that's why we have XX90, a Field Lt
yeah yeah yeah, try finding one of those !!!
Feds are getting the goods on Johnson. This will all change just like in New York. Adam’s changed his tune, either go to jail or comply with us He complied and now New York is assisting the feds in deportation. Johnson and Chicago will follow the same path once Johnson sees bars in his future.
who will be the 1st white shirt to be arrested by the feds?????
I wonder whether the U.S. Attorney's Office has received a copy of this directive so they can use it in the Immigration Enforcement action filed against the State and City. It may also be useful to the Republican-led House Oversight and Government Reform Committee when Johnson appears before them on March 5, 2025..
Fuck Don Jerome. And twice on Sunday.
lmao!!
Unlawful presence may be a civil offense, but Improper entry by alien is not. It is a criminal offense. Unlawful presence is the government, reasonably, IMO, not wanting the burden of a criminal trial, and just resorting to the simpler deportation.
But did this person just magically appear or did they cross the border where they were not supposed to, or did they provide misleading information to get in? All those people crossing at non designated spots are committing a criminal offense - no question. Please explain to me how someone could possibly get in the U.S. without violating this criminal statute? (EDIT. Overstaying a Visa is probably one way). Even if they are caught and released, and given a court date which they don't show up to, they initially violated the criminal statute. There is no other way.
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Violation of
8 U.S. Code § 1325 - Improper entry by alien is, unequivocally, a criminal offense, more specifically, a misdemeanor, for a first-time offender, punishable by:
A fine, and/or
Up to 6 months of imprisonment.
If someone has been deported before and reenters without permission, or if there are other aggravating factors, the offense could be elevated to a felony, carrying more serious penalties, such as longer imprisonment terms.
The statute does list civil penalties, such as deportation, but specifically states "Civil penalties under this subsection are in addition to, and not in lieu of, any criminal or other civil penalties that may be imposed."
8 U.S. Code § 1325 - Improper entry by alien
F**k Don Jerome?? What am I, a young impressionable F/4 PPO???
If the general public only knew the amount of heinous crime these migrants are committing within out city they would be screaming for Trump to come get them. Well, maybe not; the citizens of Chicago never cease to amaze me
How come the FOP and PBPA attorneys haven't come out with a report with some kind of direction the Officer/Supervisors should take in these incidents. I worked 30 years, my last 12 as a supervisor....I was always taught you don't have to follow AN UNLAWFUL ORDER. Come on FOP/PBPA...do something!!!!
It is interesting though how they would require the wol to respond to this, but the commander and captain don’t can just sit in their office and not get involved at all. Seems like they have zero faith in their decision making.
WOL or SOL?
Wol position sucks. You’re approving everything, which means you’re responsible and liable for everything. Every time a copper gets sued, the wol ends up on that lawsuit also. Trust me, it’s not like it used to be. They put all the liability on the wol’s now. The captains have zero responsibility and zero liability. Same with commanders. They’ve shielded them from everything, as you can see from this order also. It’s always the WOL’s now left holding the bag. When the last time a commander or captain has been sued? And u tell me if u can find a single Lt citywide that has not been on a lawsuit for something they approved.
In a civil manner, I will be ignoring this directive entirely. I will also be reporting any illegal activity and locations anonymously. It's time some common sense prevails here.
Who is with me?
Totally agree if there not going to follow what the feds say, lock them up
Towards the end of my career it wasn't uncommon for one sergeant to have to log the whole watch as well as the tac team. Field lieutenants are long gone.
Yes the feds run this country, local government can either go along with them or face the consequences
Yes as a cop not following federal law you could be going to jail.
The fuck stick lawyers in city hall, CPD Legal Affairs, and Dana O’Malley should be well aware of the Supremacy Clause.
If they aren’ aware they are negligent.
If they are they are then they are criminals themselves and should be arrested, charged, and tried by the Federal government.
Only the clouted will refuse. Those who made it on score have no choice.
Why do we need captains? Can anyone tell me what they actually do? If they don’t even have to respond to things like this what are they there for?
Put Johnson behind bars where he can begin to study US constitutional law...
Entering the United States, or crossing the border without authorization is a crime, a misdemeanor. The key word is entering (or crossing). The crime is complete when the person stops. In San Diego people crossing stop at the first McDonalds to demonstrate that they were no longer in the process of entering, they were here. Being in the United States without permission is a civil crime.
Back in the 70s and 80s I was a California cop. We cooperated with INS, but we would never arrest someone for the “crime” of being illegally in the US. We might detain someone for a few minutes if a INS crew was in the neighborhood, or we might accompany INS agents conducting a raid, but just to keep the peace. Local cops don’t have the authority to enforce federal laws, especially civil violations. Would you arrest someone on view for a bankruptcy, or violation of a EPA civil regulation? Of course not.
The jailers use to cooperate with INS because during the booking process they would identify illegals. INS would come by a couple of times a day and pick up a busload of illegals. Sometimes they would be too busy and the illegals would be released to the street. The illegals from Mexico would be driven to the border and released into Mexico.
When an illegal was arrested for a felony the jail would notify INS which would put a hold on the individual. In those cases the jail would hold the guy for INS. That’s now the rub, those elected sheriffs are refusing to hold anyone while the INS goes through the process of securing an arrest warrant.
Under the state law you can chase people, right? Why are the old timers telling the whiny new coppers not to do it? Because they will get jammed up administratively. This is the same thing. Your bosses are telling you not to it, those who detain or arrest somebody for immigration violations will find themselves on the beach. Will you get sued? Think about this in the context of a vehicle pursuit, maybe where the cop was following, not chasing. The dipshit crashes and the cop get sued. Here the cop detains someone who gets deported and killed in Haiti and his family here ends up on the streets. Tell me why some lawyer isn’t going to sue the cop whose own department disciplined him or her for detaining the person in the first place? I’m not saying they would win, but who in their right mind would think that a cop would be sued for merely following a criminal?
Don’t you folks have lawyers to give you some direction? This is not your fight. Be safe, but be smart. 30 years is not that long to work, get it done, and then enjoy retirement.
DOGE needs to look into Legal Affairs after they are done with City Hall. Thet just make shit up out of their asses.
Don Jerome is maxed out. He should be showing up to Human Resources and the Pension Board to drop his papers. I wouldn’t be showing up to anything.
Send a copy.
President Trump, please withhold all federal money from sanctuary cities. See how long they last.
what do you think the WOL is...its a Lt dumbass
Yes, he’s a douche bag. Another one of Waller’s picks that needs to go.
And you work for him and cash check twice a month signed by him....clown
Policing is a socially constructed environmental hazard and defunding the police is necessary to the creation of a safe environment for minority communities.
Climate Justice' For Convicts.
Biden EPA Cuts Big Check For Pro-Defund The Police Activists To Pursue 'Climate Justice' For Convicts.
This means we must defund police, prisons and fossil fuels and reinvest in systems of care and regeneration led and owned by impacted ...
Sounds like more for 2nd and 3rd watch WOL’s. Having little time in grade can be a good thing.
Yes the Feds will lock you up be careful. If you obstruct you will be on your own.
This is a new nonsense federal government. Don’t cross them they will take you down if you obstruct them. Don’t jam yourself up do what they say.
Hopefully this will be addressed when Brandon goes to DC to get embarrassed I mean to testify.
My take on this is whoever ordered , wrote, sanctioned or signed off on this order should be charged with Obstruction
There is supposed to be a Lts class in March, let's see how many still want it. There's only so many unit spots available and they're usually filled, unless that heavyweight it getting promoted to Captain (the best spot on the job now, they literally do nothing and touch nothing that can hurt them) or higher. The WOL position is now called" the chair of total liability."
The order looked rushed and simple.
Lets start a pool...!
Most immigration warrants are civil. Don’t get your ass in a sling playing games with this.
Anonymous
And you work for him and cash check twice a month signed by him....clown
2/17/2025 09:51:39 AM
nope,,,you wrong,,,,, I get direct deposit,,,,, no checks
Work with ICE until they get done what they need to do. Then wave as they drive off and notify the zone that you need a WOL on scene, no emergency. Then if he does show up, he can tell you not to work with ICE.
Where is the FOP on this very conflicting order?
Enemy of my enemy is my friend. Department stripped many of us for refusing the vax and the tone has been set since then. Federal agents can and will do as they please no one will interfere(partner and I sure won't). If any agent needs help in an emergency, I'm sure CFD and CPD won't hesitate. BJ, Pritzker, Trump, Biden and all other billionaires all SUCK!
Care to elaborate? LT's report your reckless behavior and that's that?
This department is so stupid!! I was reading the part of the order about giving access to the department database... LoL..on time a guy from HSI was in the station and pulled up the CHRIS system on his cellphone... LoL!!!!
These progressive communist Democrats have fucked up everything in this country that they have put their hand on ! Thank you the 170 8 million voters that put a real leader back in office this country was gonna be totally fucked otherwise ! The Trump administration needs to investigate all of these corrupt thieving ass fucking Democrats prosecute and incarcerate these fucking career criminals ! Term limits for all level government, elected positions are absolutely necessary to abate all this political corruption ! 50 fucking years in office sucking a blood of the American taxpayers like the bottom feeding fucking maggots at these Democrats all are !
To bleed the pensions.
I got on this job before you elected those clowns, fool!
Clearly, you failed all promotional exams, have no whack for merit, and cannot get into any coveted unit spot. Keep pushing that late beat car while I conduct few lockup checks and later review your BWC recordings. All my tasks plus my 2 hour workout will take me around 4 hours. Just in time for my partner to take over for the remainder. But the rank of LT/WOL position “sucks” I suppose.
Lt E Sullins is 1990. He loves running around and going over the air to hear his own voice.
He also loves to log on to Nationwide and show everybody his $2 million dollar account.
If he's really feeling a hard on, he'll show you his 7K in comp time as well.
He's so full of himself, he will teach the feds how to do their jobs!
Waiting for the first refusal test case when Trump cuts all Federal Dollars coming into Chicago and possibly Illinois. Since this order was issued by Snelling, he will take the fall. On the plus side, there may not be any Federal oversight as that would be cut also.
Lawyers to give us directions? Our top two lawyers Vaughn and Scott don’t even know how to wipe their ass much less give sound advice. Their 2 attorney directors came from the infamous crook county felony review, nuff said. The obrien brothers have been career house mice and have no clue what enforcement means.
Buffalo butt is only good at leaking information. Gives the copacabana boys and girls a run for their money.
👍🏻👍🏻🇺🇸
100 percent agree, term limits are way overdue.
Wow, a hater on here. DJ does nothing but help coppers.
He did more police work than most bosses here. He speaks his mind, has zero clout, and that’s the only thing he’s been jammed up for. A few don’t care for him, but everyone I know respects him.
Read 8 USC 1325: All illegal entry is a misdemeanor (1st offense) or a felony (2nd offense). There are also civil penalties that do are in addition to to? But which do not replace, the criminal penalties. They just want you to focus on the idea simply being unlawfully present is civil (it’s clearly not) to muddy the waters. -A Fed (Not FBI)
Would someone put together a good team and get those assholes out of lodge?!
Does Hein have the balls to get rid of captains? Or put them back on the watches at the very least where they could actually do… something, anything. He is the chief of patrol right? Shouldn’t he be able to do that.
What is WOL? Oldtimer here
All the retards that were merit Sgts who spent 5 minutes in the district but took Patty Casey’s study group/answer review are shocked that anybody, especially them have to actual be a WOL.
I can name 1, that useless pos F/2 in 002 that leaves everything she can for midnites as she’s afraid of her own shadow! God-forbid you got a trr!
And you work for him and cash check twice a month signed by him....clown
2/17/2025 09:51:39 AM
Your sister's a bitch, but I still cash her checks for my "services." Seriously though, cashing a city check is now supposed to be some endorsement of the shitty mayor? I'm just not sure what your point is. Can one not work for a shitty person and still know that they're a shitty person? I mean, I assume your mom doesn't respect and love her pimp, but she still goes to work every day, and boy does she work hard.
Not actively assisting is not equivalent to hindering or obstructing. Don't say stupid shit. Go against the department's ridiculous policy and see who ends up in the trick bag. Federal law does not require anyone to help ICE do their job. You just can't actively interfere or prevent them from doing it. Bad information like what you're trying to spread will end up getting some poor cop in trouble.
You tried this stupid McDonald's story before, and I told you it was nonsense. It's still nonsense, so stop posting it. Illegally entering the US is a crime, regardless of if you're actively entering or you entered before stopping at McDonald's. If you actually were a cop, you weren't a very good one. Did you only arrest people who were actively committing a crime? If someone stabbed someone 30 times, but stopped before you got there, could you not arrest them because they weren't still stabbing? The crime occurred, regardless of whether it's actively being observed to happen at the time of the arrest. If someone robs a bank, but then spends all the money on happy meals before the cops arrive, are they free to go? Go post on a California cop blog with your stupid stories.
Tell us how many Lts have been fucked over by COPA and then tell us how many below that rank have been fucked over by COPA. COPA isn't gunning for Lts any more than POs or sergeants. Just approve arrest reports and TRRs properly while hiding in your office and you won't have to worry much about COPA. Working for you is probably the worst job on the department if you think you somehow have it worse than the people on the street.
There's no unlawful order. Do what the order says and you'll be fine. It's not your job to be immigration police. It's not unlawful for you to not play immigration police.
This "woe is me" routine by Lts is about as tone deaf as you can be. You clearly have zero clue about what everyone below your rank faces. It just screams that you've never worked the street a day in your life. Resign your position if you're not smart enough to protect yourself from lawsuits or afraid to put your name on anything.
WOW all I can say is the week Trump got in office It was like magic I have been calling the 11th ward office several times about these 15 passenger vans parked on my block. Seems the guy across the street ( just moved in) has some kind of business , his wife and him drive these vans around picking up Chinese workers all over the neighborhood. There were two on my block there was one on the next block. My buddy told me he has two on his block. So being retired cpd I figured I go get coffee, and fallowed this guy around picking workers up. Turns out he took them to a restaurant in Bolingbrook.But mow the vans are gone, you don't see the Chinese waiting on the corners, or hanging out in front of the SRO's on Wentworth. I wonder if the ward office warned these people they may get picked up by ICE. Would it not be funny if All. Lee got pulled in by ICE for questioning.
Watch Operations Lieutenant - fancy name for the old WC
Gee, I hope your not the Police....if you are I'm sure your well liked and respected (sarcasm)
Tell us how many Lts have been fucked over by COPA and then tell us how many below that rank have been fucked over by COPA. COPA isn't gunning for Lts any more than POs or sergeants. Just approve arrest reports and TRRs properly while hiding in your office and you won't have to worry much about COPA. Working for you is probably the worst job on the department if you think you somehow have it worse than the people on the street.
You're a fool. I've sat in that office as you say, in the worst district in the city and tried to sift through the utter nonsense that coppers get themselves into now and tried to straighten it out and make sense of it and try to keep people out of trouble;
All those videos I watch, I could literally pull a SPAR or CL on every one of them, for the myriads of Department Orders that continue to be violated daily. Still, I make them "training issues" to try and help guys and again, keep them out of trouble.
The Arrest Reports and TRR''s you tell me to just sign and hide in the office, I sit there and rack my brain at what people believe is Probable Cause and try to correct and mentor to keep people out of Federal Court; the horrible tactics that are getting cops jammed up and hurt or worse, I sat there and harped on them daily, to try and get through to know-it-alls that have all the answers, who just can't imagine why they're always at COPA giving statements and receiving huge disciplinary recommendations. (keep telling them you were only "holding their neck" not grabbing it.)
The TRR's take the cake; if most saw these videos of what guys do, or actually what they don't or won't do would blow most people's minds. People who use a lot of force and lie and say they used none, only to watch their BWC and see them throwing punches, kicks, choke holds, and the Sgts who let them go home before confirming their involvement, or the guys who stand there and paint everyone with their taser in every incident like it's a flashlight, the "non car chases" that went for miles. I could go on and on. Every penalty a copper receives, it's ten-fold for the Sgt and Lt. We also deal with TRED and their 2 year superstars that want to critique our investigations with all sorts of recommendations on what you did wrong that we should've caught, in their eyes, if they really disagree with something they can refer it to COPA.
Sgts and Lts take huge penalties up to and including termination for their determinations in all these incidents and included on every lawsuit, but I'll take your advice and just do them properly, as you say, from now on.
Captains do the job of commanders. Commanders do photo ops and bang the secretaries. Are you new or something?
Just send T Homan the name and address of the restaurant and he'll sweep em all up at once.
As a WOL I intend to ignore this order and see what they can do about it. If you thinks Lts are gong to respond to this nonsense you clearly don’t know our job. Which is pushing as much off onto the Sgts that we can. “Squad, put me down as notified. Have the Sgt call me in the station when done”. 10-4, Boss
Lt’s job is to log your dog ass, not the P.o.’s. Do your job and quit whining, better yet pass the damn test. Your dismissed, get your ass outta my office.
Doing nothing as usual. Decertify these worthless parasites and get a real union
You are a complete idiot. You are scared, spineless and an asshole. You are new to being a Lieutenant and dont have much time on. Stay in your office and leave your Officers and Sergeant out there to deal with it. Way to lead and take care of your people.
Me, or the idiot "supervisor" I was responding to, who somehow doesn't know what an unlawful order is? I'm not the police anymore, but I did have to explain this misunderstood "unlawful order" bullshit to several dumb cops like yourself when I was a cop. There's nothing unlawful about not helping ICE. Explain which part you don't understand and I'll try to dumb it down for you even further. I don't know how well-liked or respected I am, but I do know how right I am. BTW, it's "you're." I would hope you're not the police, but I'm sure you are. Since it's too late to dodge that bullet, maybe chalk this up as a learning experience, or just a sign that you're not the brightest bulb. It could actually help you avoid screwing yourself over or giving bad advice to some other officer unfortunate enough to listen to you.
Thanks for proving my point. You actively try to get yourself included on lawsuits by ignoring clear issues with probable cause, rules and regs, officer safety issues, use of force, etc. Don't "fix" the probable cause... RWOC. Your job isn't to be everyone's buddy, just looking out for them at all costs, and joining them at COPA and the courthouse. My point still stands that very few Lts end up at COPA, especially in comparison to the POs who end up there. If you actually did your job correctly, fewer cops would try to get away with the dumb shit you mentioned. You facilitate and encourage bad behavior and poor tactics. You preach being smart, but you cover up for stupid. You think the cops you get out of the shit they constantly step in will learn to do better, or do they just learn that daddy will ball them out like last time? How many Lts have been terminated after dealing with COPA? Now how many below that rank? Exactly. Go play savior somewhere else. You're a joke.
And when the street deputy is on scene asking where you are, you'll be scrambling for the keys to your favorite car to rush over there like a good boy. Boss... lol.
Handjob as a sgt. Bigger handjob as an Lt. He's mentally off.
For the tough-guy-cop who posted at 0844. 37 years, 20 as a narcotics officer. I commanded a unit that served over 200 search warrants a year. During my tenure no officer in my unit got jammed up in a federal civil rights suit. During my long career, my first priority was always to lookout for the welfare of the cops.
Your ignorance is illustrate with your nonsensical examples of penal law. It have no bearing on this discussion. None. Yes, the fourth amendment provides for the arrest of an individual without the benefit of a warrant. But for an on-view arrest to be lawful, there must be a violation of a law, and a law that the officer is empowered to enforce.
When an officer arrests a person who they are not empowered to arrest, they potentially violate the Fourth Amendment.. Violations of the Fourth Amendment opens the officer to both criminal and civll prosecution.
So, what happens when you get sued for a Fourth Amendment violation? The case goes before a judge who will review the police reports and depositions and decide if the Fourth Amendment has been violated. If the judge decided that there was no constitutional violation the case is dismissed. If the judge decides there is a constitutional violation, then the judges finds for the plaintiff. If the judge decides that the Fourth Amendment was violated as a matter of law, the case goes to the jury to determine damages.
There is a third option that the judge might elect. The judge may determine that the officer is entitled to qualified immunity. Have you heard of this judicial created rule? I suspect you have focused on the immunity when you should focused on the qualified.
The Court realized that it would be unfair to punish an officer for violating a new interpretation of the constitution that they didn’t know, or even could have known. To solve this problem the Court adopted the rule of Qualified Immunity..
As you may know, ignorance of the law is not a defense . The Supreme Court realized that although cops are expected to know the law, it is an impossible task to know every interpretation of the constitution as decision come down every day by all levels of courts. They decided that officers should only be exposed to liability for only those decisions that a reasonable trained officer would be aware.
So lets circle back to your proposition that entering the United States is, as you allege, a continuing crime, and for some reason you opine that state officers have the authority to arrest people found within the United States without permission of the federal government.
The so called “bullshit” McDonald’s cases, is a ruling by the U.S. 9th Circuit Court. This case addresses an arrest made of an undocumented alien who was arrested within the jurisdiction of the 9th circuit. The question before the court was whether or not entering the United States without permission is a continuing crime. The Court ruled that it was not, the crime was completed when the person stopped after entering the United States. That means that an officer can’t arrest someone for this misdemeanor because it is no longer being committed in their presence, the person is not entering, they are here. This case stands for defining the entering element of the crime. McDonald is a an example, but it could be any other place where a person stops and engages in another activity.
The court recognized that it was the intent of congress to make it a criminal offense to enter, but not to be in the United States absent permission. Congress could have made it a crime to be in the country, but it didn’t.
I never said I ignored anything, it’s just the opposite, i addressed everything I could and corrected and mentored, which we’re supposed to do. I never claimed to be anyone’s buddy, but yes I did try look out for them, and in some instances stopped them from doing stupid things and saved them from themselves, in others I SPARRED or got a number where needed.
I’ve known and worked with amazing street cops over the years who were horrible report writers and couldn’t properly flow from a to z on their reports, not able to write a cogent report explaining their PC etc. and needed help. I helped then and still do now, it’s not “fixing PC”, its helping properly explain PC and composition of their report, so it presents as it should in court, so the officers don’t look foolish. Thats what good supervisors do.
I gave everyone one fuck up, because nobody is perfect(except apparently you), after that I did what needed to be done.
I never said i covered up anything, remember its all on bwc and dash cam so it is what it is, that’s where the mentoring and counseling come in. If you don’t know guys on this job that continue to do the same stupid shit, no matter how many times they’ve been sparred or taken time, you’re either a house mouse or never worked anywhere busy. They don’t listen to veteran officers on their watch or team, or their supervisors, and as a result, callback is full of them.
As far as Lts facing termination? I know 5 personally, 3 resigned/retired and one stayed, beat his case then left in good standing, one is still in limbo; many pos also resign prior to termination, it’s not just for supervisors. Go to 311 and see how many supervisors are there, you’d be surprised.
You sure typed a lot of words just to continue to be wrong, and create new scenarios to be wrong about. I did not say local officers could make an arrest to enforce immigration laws. I simply said that completing the act of crossing the border illegally does not mean you're suddenly and forever free from arrest and prosecution for that CRIME. It is a CRIME, and one that is enforced by federal immigration officials, even years after the illegal crossing occurred. No McDonald's detour will negate the CRIME committed, nor will it have any effect on the federal authorities' ability and duty to detain, arrest, prosecute, deportn etc. that CRIMINAL. Your extensive experience, misunderstanding of my post, misunderstanding of previous cases, refusal to accept that you're wrong, and sense of self-importance, do not change the immigration laws. You are completely, without a doubt, 100% wrong that one can not be prosecuted for illegally crossing the border simply because they're not actively doing it after they've crossed. Don't know how any of my post made you think I was trying to be a "tough-guy-cop," except that you felt challenged in your incorrect and strong opinion, and you're not used to that, because you think you're always the smartest person in the room, so anyone questioning you must be a "tough guy." Whatever the case may be, you are still wrong. I suspect maybe your advanced age has caused you to misremember or misunderstand the McDonald's scenario, or how it applies to anything I've said. It's ok to be wrong, and healthy to admit it when you are. You still have time to learn and grow, even at your age.
You keep patting yourself on the back and making accusations and name-calling, instead of just admitting that the OVERWHELMING MAJORITY of people targeted by COPA are not lieutenants, despite your need to feel persecuted. If you actually do your job correctly, especially as a lieutenant, you have an extremely small chance of ever being targeted by COPA. Stop playing the hero and the victim. Neither suits you. You made a dumb statement, doubled down, added a bunch of stories about how great you are, and pretty much proved my point by refusing to acknowledge that POs are far more at risk of being in the crosshairs of COPA than any Lt. You know 5? How many POs do you know? How many are at call-back? How many have been fired or resigned due to a COPA investigation? You don't need to answer. We all know the numbers are significantly higher for POs. Good luck with your future of "not fixing PC," because we totally believe you didn't offer some creative writing tips to the officers who didn't "explain PC" correctly in their reports. RWOC is the answer, not changing the narrative. You know that though, Lt.
"8 U.S.C. § 1325 - U.S. Code - Unannotated Title 8. Aliens and Nationality § 1325. Improper entry by alien
(a)Improper time or place; avoidance of examination or inspection; misrepresentation and concealment of facts
Any alien who (1) enters or attempts to enter the United States at any time or place other than as designated by immigration officers, or (2) eludes examination or inspection by immigration officers, or (3) attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the willful concealment of a material fact, shall, for the first commission of any such offense, be fined under Title 18 or imprisoned not more than 6 months, or both, and, for a subsequent commission of any such offense, be fined under Title 18, or imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both."
There's the relevant statute. The statute of limitations for violations of this is typically 5 years, not 5 minutes or 5 happy meals. Stopping at McDonald's is not mentioned as an affirmative defense. Please share the many court cases that used this McDonald's exception to avoid facing prosecution and/or deportation for illegal entry. I'm not sure what to Google to find your McDonald's story, so maybe you can share the case or a link to a story. Just share anything besides your opinion and faulty memory that supports your incorrect assertion. Be careful not to backpedal and pretend you were only saying local officers could not make immigration arrests, because you clearly argued that the CRIME itself was unable to be charged due to the fact that the CRIMINALS stopped at McDonald's shortly after committing the CRIME. I'll await your silence and take it a a sign that you've realized your mistakes and now accept reality.
Officer, obviously the majority of people in callback are officers, they are the majority of the department, my point was whatever happens to officers, supervisors penalties are five to ten times that purposely, and if you don’t think COPA doesn’t foam at the mouth to try and jam a Sgt or above you’re delusional, it’s a literal feather in their liberal cap.
If a supervisor isn’t trying to guide and mentor officers to limit their liability, especially the young ones that are most prone to doing reckless things, getting tunnel vision during these incidents, and forgetting and omitting vital components of the incidents, and we aren’t sitting them down, watching their video with them and helping them out, then were not doing our job as supervisors. (That’s not create writing by the way)
As far as creative writing, it’s long gone now, with bwc, dash cam, and every other camera and cellphone video out there now, if anyone is still doing it they’re playing Russian Roulette. I already explained how guys hurt themselves on paper and in court, it doesn’t need re-hashing, working cops know the difference between helping better explain probable cause and writing a concise report, and lying, which I’d never do. I actually encourage officers to watch their bwc before they do their report to catch things they may have missed.
I’m not concerned what you think about me, although I do wish you better understood my rationale, which is to do my best daily to keep my people safe physically, mentally, and legally, which is the least I should do. I have to tell you though, you actually sound more like a COPA investigator than a cop, making assumptions about what I do, how I do it, and my alleged motives, as if I’m sitting in the office all night crafting diabolical narratives for these guys to use in their cases. It actually provided a good laugh; thanks for that.
I didn't read most of your post, but it's nice to see you almost admit I was right. I'm not an officer, lieutenant, nor was I when I retired. Other people have been promoted just as high as you, and some even higher. Other people know things that you know, and some even know more. I'm fully aware that COPA would love to jam up sergeants and lieutenants. That does not mean they're targeting them more, as you've repeatedly and erroneously stated. You're focusing on overall numbers as if it helps your case. Look at percentages then if you want. Even then, the overwhelming majority will be POs. Lieutenants are very rarely targeted by COPA. Your inability to realize or admit this, while continuing to stroke your own ego, shows just what kind of lieutenant you are. Let's have a reality check for a moment, lieutenant. Do you always work a full tour, never splitting a shift with your fellow lieutenant? Do you ever work as a field lieutenant, but actually sit in the station instead of being in the field? Do you pick and choose which body cams you watch in order to avoid seeing things that may need correcting? Do you carry anyone as working when they're not actually there, for any reason? Do you know any lieutenants who do these things and others? Do you report them to COPA or try to correct their behaviors? Do you think COPA would just love to jam up a lieutenant for any of these transgressions? I bet they would, but they don't, despite the fact that this stuff happens citywide, and very obviously so. There are many more egregious acts and omissions by lieutenants and above as well, but they don't get targeted by COPA or anyone else. Isn't it weird? You're not the savior or martyr or hero you think you are. You're also not going to convince me that you are, no matter how much you decide to post about your greatness here. Now, get back to work, as I'm sure you're doing roll call inspections, streaming videos, and actually attending all roll calls. I'm sure you're also physically inspecting the in-car camera systems every week like you're required, right lieutenant? You wouldn't skip any of that or have your sergeants conduct roll call, would you? So many ways to jam up a lieutenant very easily, just in their everyday duties that they pretend to do, yet they're not being targeted for those easy wins. So weird. We all know lieutenants are the best and brightest, the backbone of the department, the leaders we all look up to, so they must be the standard for excellence. You'd think COPA and others would weed out the ones shirking their duties or falsifying their performance of those duties. I mean, you wouldn't do things like that, but surely you've heard of one lieutenant who does, yet hasn't been jammed up for any of it.
The fact that you didn't read most of my post, as you say, speaks volumes as to your motives, and character in general, and leaves your opinions rather hollow and meaningless.
You say you're retired, congratulations, go enjoy it, and don't worry about the department anymore, it stopped worrying about you the minute you turned in your creds and walked out the door, it's a sad reality, but it's the truth, we are all just employee numbers that are replaced and forgotten as soon as we leave, the objective is to make it to the finish line. I'm glad you did.
I didn't read it because you type long paragraphs stroking your own ego, while ignoring the fact that I'm still right and you're wrong. I'm not worried about the department at all, but I still read the blog and post here to call out bullshit. Suggesting that my opinion is meaningless because I didn't want to read your autobiography for a third time is just a cop-out. How does my opinion, or FACTS that I've posted, rely on my willingness to read your nonsense over and over? I hope you're able to reach retirement without big bad COPA taking you down like they do to all the lieutenants in your fantasy.
I noticed you didn't respond to any of the questions I asked in my other post, lieutenant. I find that very telling.
I decided not to entertain your ego in believing how right you think you are, so again, enjoy your retirement. As I said, when you form assumptions and make statements without any basis (not reading others' comments or positions) absolutely makes your opinions hollow and baseless, and just exists to feed YOUR ego, and you're unwavering want to believe you're right.
I will say though, I did at least read what you wrote, I'm not so ignorant and self-absorbed, as to comment or opine without doing so, that would've been very shallow and self-aggrandizing of me.
I may not agree with your assessment whatsoever, especially when they're made without reading my responses, as you said, but I have enough respect for your opinion to at least entertain it. I hope you have a long, healthy retirement.
You can have the last word, as I won't be responding any further. I'm sure it's needed for you to feel you've won the argument, champ.
Your avoidance of the questions I asked, while patting yourself on the back once again just for reading, is enough to show that I've won. You're dodging simple questions and ignoring factual numbers in order to avoid admitting you're completely wrong. And now you're running away while claiming to somehow be the bigger man for avoiding a discussion. I read what you wrote, except when you went off on your "self-aggrandizing" tangents. Using my little jab about not reading your ego stroke session as an excuse to avoid facts and the questions I asked doesn't make you the bigger man. And saying you'll let me have the last word so I can feel like I've won doesn't mean you won. Your ego won't let you admit you're wrong or that you don't actually do your job the way you're required to, and here you are not getting jammed up by COPA at all. Isn't that crazy?
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