Rumor #1
Who was it who warned years ago that LEMART Training would open up the Police Department to all sorts of liability, not to mention obligations (real or imagined) to treat persons injured? Was it something "insignificant" along with hundreds of their readers?
- Just found out this little nugget for all the hard working and caring P.O.’S that transported victims to the hospital in that chaos Wed. My neighbor is a paralegal for a Law Firm that is already drafting up Law Suits against CPD for not waiting for CFD and BLAMING CPD for deaths and injuries…disgusting!
We'll confess, we don't really believe this one. The lawyers would have to prove transporting someone resulted in further injury, along with negligence and intent. We're told the ones who died weren't the ones transported, mostly because of the nature of the wounds (massive trauma).
The City and Department could solve the entire issue by using the LEMART training for what it was originally instituted for - saving an injured Officer's life.
Or by stopping training for chest seals, tourniquets, quick-clot and bandages and leave everything to the paramedics....who are understaffed, overworked and wasted on tummy-aches in certain neighborhoods.
Labels: rumors
posted by SCC at 12:01 AM
72 Comments:
The 4 DOAs were transported by CFD ambulances.
Years ago, on the southeast side, far from any trauma centers, a CPD officer was shot in the neck and was in pretty bad shape. While waiting for the ambulance, which were pretty long in responding due to the distances to the SE side, the officers decided to drive the wounded officer themselves to the hospital. They did save his life. Now it seems more and more officers want to drive the wounded to the hospital themselves. It really is a case by case decision to make, but I would never drive a citizen to the hospital as a rule, because of the liability. Plaintiff's estate will never say, "at least you tried" if the citizen doesn't survive 100 percent.
LEMART has saved lives, but the better you get at something, the better you are expected to be. "Why did you save this person's life but not someone else's life?"
Police are not and should not be expected to be paramedics.
About 100 yrs ago, in 1973 I was a rookie on midnights in a bad neighborhood. We were sent on an ambulance assist. Naturally, we arrived before the ambulance. Young girl was crying and screaming in pain. I thought she was shot or stabbed. My partner said wait for ambulance. The paramedics looked at the patient and demanded, “give her a Kotex” to the family and walked out. My partner said this is bs but we took to the hospital with a 19-P.
You omit considering the standard for proof of culpability is determined by the capacity for mutual duplicity.
Aka, one sticky fingered hand strokes the other.
A lot of these young kids, they’ll do anything for that highly coveted life saving award. Don’t throw gang banging mutts into your car to rush them to a hospital. Do what you have to on scene as to not get jammed up, outside of that, let them lie in their life’s decisions.
There will absolutely be lawsuits, whether they lived or not. The lawyers know the city will settle and cut a check. It’ll happen.
Fake and lame, we’re protected under the Good Samaritan Act.
No good deed goes unpunished! Keep on giving extra and see where that gets you.
“ Dying in Style: Chicago’s Cadillac Fire Ambulances”
Chicago and Cook County Cemeteries.com
CFD Commissioner Quinn, in old man Daley’s inner circle was something else! Find a photo of him in his old helmet, looks like he got run over by a steam locomotive.
You want me to treat citizens…PAY ME!
Otherwise no treatment for John Q Public.
I’m a paramedic on a southside ambulance east of the Dan Ryan I suggest police learn as much medical training as they can because we aren’t a available we are busy transporting adults under the age of 25 for std checks, needing pregnancy tests, injured fingers, period cramps and even sneezing from pollen allergies that’s half my day but that’s what the city wants we have to cater and pander to these helpless fools that’s what they want which is why the tax paying neighbor hoods are usually without EMS protection I’d say call your alderman and demand better but that’s a joke too.
Let em find their own way to the trauma center
Nah, not true. We have a duty to act. In fact, administering care, treatment or cpr in good faith keeps you safe under the law criminally and civilly. Even a piss poor law firm would know this… absolute fake news with this one.
1 week after my LEMART training, I was hit by a truck on my motorcycle. I had a bad injury, causing a tib/fib fracture. I applied my own dressing. I think LEMART really helped me. I sure hope it isn't cancelled. You just never know when or where.
Thats because these dumb newbies want to be heros and shove a person who just sustain massive trauma in a car crash in the back of a squad where they themselves wouldnt sit if needed a ride.. and rush them to the hospital at speeds prohibited in most situations causing more trauma to the hurt individual from bouncing around on a hard plastic seat. Blunt trauma 101 morons ... dont move them if not really necessary.. fire uses neck braces, and other specialized equipment to stabilize the person's injuries from sustaining further injury while being moved. This is why just anyone shouldn't be a cop, certain commonsense arent commonsenses for all.
These coppers transporting victims to hospitals are asking for problems. Maybe not this time or next time but it will eventually bite them real hard and I will sit back and say I told you so. I read a commenter in a previous post on this topic write that wearing a body cam prohibits them from waiting for an ambulance if a victim demands the police transport them to the hospital. Really, how so? The Police are not required to transport injured citizens to a hospital via squad car.
If CFD didn't have to respond to every minor boo-boo that's called into 9-1-1, we would have more ambulance available and shorter response times. Here's an idea. If you think you need an ambulance call. CFD will respond, treat, and if not life threatening give you a card with numbers of cabs, Uber, private ambulance, etc to get yourself to the hospital. May not be the best idea, but downtime would surely be reduced, and eventually, actual calls for CFD ambos in the first place.
Hey mister lawyer dude, good samaritan laws. Go f**k yourself.
Either way, the City does NOT have enough full equipped level 1 trauma ambulances across the city..at least those operational and not sitting in a parking lot waiting for r-service. Wait times for CFD are becoming ridiculous..nothing and I mean NOTHING in the General Orders does it say we (police) need to transport, period, let them wait.
In this Dept your damned if you do and damned if you dont. No matter what we do, certain citizens will never be happy. Instead of going after the shitballs that did the shooting, they want to go after police that try and help their community..just further proof that a certain groups DO NOT want to build any relationship with police. Its all about money.
I thought the same thing when I read about the coppers transporting. HUGE mistake accepting liability removing someone from the scene. Tourniquet on anyone other than a PO..insane especially on some shit bird (possibly not in the case of this shooting)but still. Let the medica do their thing when they show up.
They will file the suit and the city will settle. Ghetto payout wins again.
I said this years ago... no one listened.
Not mentioning names. This was explained as the outcome of Lemart. Enjoy it idiots, this was envisioned as a last ditch life saving measure for your partner. You are the police, act like it. Go to the fire department if you want to administer first aid.
I’ll give you a real life example. Do you repair your work car? Fix the rough idle, recharge your AC? No you don’t, so stop trying to get a lifesaving award.
Cops look like shit. Absolute slobs, zero pride in looking professional, trying to Gen Z it.
Believe it or not, your appearance commands respect.
Why would anyone transport an injured person in a squad ? Doesn’t anyone understand that’s what ambulances are for ? Unless it’s a co worker or family, they wait like everyone else . Now your “ good deed” will cost you in a court battle - fuckin stupid !
It’s only certain “communities” wasting and abusing all of CFD’s resources.
I was assigned a "man shot"call when I was in 007 many, many years ago. We got there and Young Thug was holding his neck which had a bullet hole that was squirting blood. He promptly mothrfucked us, motherfucked the EMTs, took a swing at them and said his boy would take him to the hospital. The Sgt. finally arrived and said we had to force him into the ambulance. I said we're going to have to beat him into cuffs to do that and we that were all going to be arrested and charged with beating a shooting victim, in addition to causing a riot with the gathering spectators. I suggested that I pull a RD#, complete a case report with what little info I had. Everything else was " Unknown" since he wouldn't tell us anything anyway. I called Cook County, gave them the guys name and case report number and told them to expect him. He scribbled his name on the " refused treatment " form and CFD were happy to get the fuck outta there. The Sgt. looked at me like I was nuts but finally said " good plan". We got the hell out before the riot started and I called A1 for the notification...
No one cares what happened to you in 1973
Oh my, how we can deceive ourselves. Good faith is not going to save you from civil prosecution. That’s maybe a defense, but up the jury to determine if your actions were reasonable. These juries come from a community that expects that the police be perfect every time. Good faith is not going to save you when the plaintiff’s whore expert takes the stand, after telling the jury they are a Harvard trained trauma surgeon, and explains the boy would have lived a full and productive life “if the officer had just waited for ……”. Doesn’t sound like the city wants you do police work, so maybe it can take a page out of the rural sheriff’s playbook, and train all the cops to be EMTs. Only do medical treatment to your certification level, leave everything else to the people who have the higher level of training.
I would argue that the police are paid professional trained first responders and should know what to do in a critical medical situation.
Stop it!
Saying shit-bird is worse than hearing chalk screech on a chalk board. Nobody-other than YOU-says shit-bird. That’s a Hollywood movie thing, not Chicago..
Just like “perp”.is a New York thing!
Shithead however, is a definite Chicago thing.
Driving a seriously injured citizen or a seriously injured P.O. to the hospital is too risky. Driving crazy to a hospital risks getting in a wreck (already happened) and risks causing further injury especially if there is a neck or spine injury. CFD is coming pedal to metal on an officer down and they can properly treat on scene and during transport while patient is safe and secure. They carry lifesaving fluids and meds and equipment and can communicate directly with the ER. They are highly trained and have tons of experience. The risks of us transporting outweighs the benefit. The national standards are "First responder equipped for basic life support should arrive within 4 minutes, and advanced life support (paramedic) personnel should arrive within 8 minutes". Unless you can apply proper LEMART and get them to the ER in under 4 minutes, I say let the pros handle it.
I was in LEMART when it first started and these clowns called it Partner first aid. A ton of us asked what happens when a defense attorney finds out you have specialized training in tactical first aid and you failed to use it on side shot in the leg on the street. These instructors had no clue what they were talking about back then. If you have the training, you can’t pick and choose who you’re going to use it on. Hence, it changes to nowadays to use it on everyone. Morons.
Police will get more medical training when paramedics put on a vest, gun belt and run into a domestic situation or chase a guy with a gun.
How about STOP picking up piss bums and drunks that only leave the hospital after being transported..what a waste of time and taxpayer money. Of course you have the ghetto that abuse the system as well. Afterall, they never pay their ambo bills anyway...taxpayers do!
I see these crazy videos of Chicago coppers jumping in to render aid and as they’re doing it the coppers are surrounded by screaming shit heads. You must render aid … WHEN SAFE TO DO SO. Do not risk your own safety and well being to save some shit head.
This very well may be, but these bottom feeder lawyers know the city will pay out to avoid a trial.
The business end of a night stick is what gets the respect in the ghetto.
The city could double the number of ambulances and still not have enough available for the demand.
Hahaha you believe that??!?? Yeah, putting citizens in police cars is a BAD idea all around. You must be new on the job kid, and never faced a lawsuit. Let the ambulance paramedics do their job. Our job is not to save every Tom, Dick and Harry. We're policemen
Understaffed and overworked paramedics and not enough ambulances to go around sounds like a CFD problem and not a problem to be taken on by understaffed and overworked CPD personned. If baby boy needs an ambulance and one is not on scene then wait for one to arrive. Do not put baby boy in the back of a squad car and open yourself up to liability. If you think a good samaratin law is going to save you from liability if baby boy gets further injured or dies in the backseat of your squad you are a fool. What if you get in an accident on the way to the hospital? I'm sure baby boy's momma will say thank you Officer instead of call herself a nice lawyer.
Reason 1,000,001 never to sit in the back of a squad car and always keep the partition closed.
Never thought I’d miss Jody Weis but when the city fought these ghetto lottery beefs they dropped to next to nothing. I was unfortunately there at Northwestern Hospital and witnessed the 3rd World Barbarism by the “Victims” and their families against the CPD,CFD and the Northwestern Security and wonder when those videos will be released. People have no idea how far this once great city has fallen. We are a ball-hair away from being the Congo…horrifying.
So we'll get fired for not doing anything and get sued when we do something. Perfect combo.
That’s how Philly and a couple other east coast cities have done it for awhile now. Scoop and run, saves more lives than waiting for ems.
If you have a duty to act you are not covered under the law and can be liable. I’m also not sure how officers are trained medically in lemart and narcan but have no IDPH credentials. That’s called practicing medicine without a license
Here is another doozy, there are undercover agents working at call back and have been for years!
Next time give them a bus token.
That means nothing; the city will still cut them a check, and the shysters know it. We are also covered under Qualified Immunity while acting under the color of law, and you see where that gets us.
Don't transport civilians, play the game, throw on a tourniquet and leave it at that.
Sooooo… you can’t yell, “ LOOK INTO THE LIGHT” anymore? Whoops!
I believe that the NYPD slang for ambulance is "bus." Sounds right.
Sounds like a commendable idea till you get those punitive damages slapped on you! No good deed goes unpunished
You dont do my job so dont expect me to do yours
"Hahaha you believe that??!?? Yeah, putting citizens in police cars is a BAD idea all around. You must be new on the job kid, and never faced a lawsuit. Let the ambulance paramedics do their job. Our job is not to save every Tom, Dick and Harry. We're policemen"
Hate to break it to you but we get sued even if we do everything right. I never said you need to save everyone either, this is specific to mass casualty incidents and based off your comment you got a serious case of Uvalde syndrome. If there is a mass casualty incident with more casualties than ambulances and you opt to wait for someone else to handle it you're either inept, a pussy, or both. Put their seatbelt on, don't crash, or drive like an idiot on the way to the hospital and you'll be fine. Take advantage of the tuition reimbursement and take some classes on tort law.
Surprised no one mentioned the precedent being set by these "over achievers"
The training started out as a 40 hours training session now it’s 6 hours! You be the judge on how effective it is
yep
I love it when retirees or veterans comment and the newbies jump all over them and trash talk. These newbies who fail to listen to the wisdom of the experienced will soon find themselves jammed up. Now, I'll say it for the newbies to understand: No one cares, bro. So, keep speeding to work, rapidly changing lanes and cutting others off with your lifted Jeep with unnecessary tires (even for off-roading). Apply your beard oil and make sure everyone sees your new tattoo. Ask the W/C if you can work OT to pay for all of your idiocy and tight pants. Oh, and before I forget, make sure to clean up your mess so your parents don't kick you out of their basement.
Never said I wanted to do your jobs you douche I’m saying we cannot be relied on at all anymore we are too tied up coddling the “communities” for their bed but bites and cat scratches. We aren’t available anymore.
Hope you and all other retired veterans don’t pay any attention to ignorant, disrespectful Pieces of Shit like “Anonymous 7/05/2025 08:44:28 AM“.
Many of us appreciate hearing the wisdom and learning about the history of this dept. The comments trying to discourage Retired CPD Veterans from contributing to the conversation and remaining part of the LEO community are only from the self-absorbed, tiktok coppers that are soft as baby shit !!!
Yeah, put your seatbelt on and drive safe so you don’t crash, meanwhile your victim bleeds out in the backseat cuz your shitty tourniquet didn’t stop the bleeding. They’re not gonna say “thanks for trying,” their lawyer is gonna say you weren’t properly trained and should’ve waited for an ambulance. It goes way past tort law. All the tuition reimbursement in the world can’t teach common sense, but by all means go get another degree.
Better than in the districts.
Would it have killed you to keep the "no one cares" comment to yourself?
Duty to ACT not Transport!
once again you can't fix stupid it's forever teeeeeeeee heeeeeeeee
Knew a guy who took a day for that at Mt. Sinai Hospital 30 yrs ago….. the Dr. who got the CR did not have a sense of humor
So essentially "douche" you did say I need to do your job cuz you're too busy and arent available. Isn't that what your "suggestion" police learn medical training cuz you wont be around comment means? Stay in your lane and we will stay in ours.
Booo hooo hooo CFD is short staffed. Stop crying to people that have been constantly shit on for the last 5 years.
What a great synopisis of the modern day CPD 2 year "veteran"
A rat is a rat is a rat 🐀
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