IAD Opens a Door?
Reading over the Appellate Court decision regarding compelled administrative evidence being admitted into criminal court, we find this little number:
- The sergeant also explained that an officer has a right to an appeal even if he is terminated and that he was unaware of any rule which stated that any officer who refused a direct order would be unequivocally terminated.
"Unaware of any rule?" A quick perusal of copies of "The Advocate" and the minutes of Police Board meetings reveal a number of firings over the past few years where the entire basis for the firing is a "refusal of a direct order." Has the IAD sergeant inadvertently opened a door for officers who were fired in the past to appeal their dismissals? And we also see this in the Administrative Rights:
- 7. You are further advised that by law any admission or statement made by you during the course of this hearing, interrogation or examination and the fruits thereof cannot be used against you in a subsequent criminal proceeding.”
So which is it? If an officer is given his Administrative Rights, under this current wording, the Appellate Court decision might well be overturned. Furthermore, if an officer took these Rights at face value and subsequently refused to answer questions and was terminated over this refusal, the sergeant's testimony opens up a couple of that need to be addressed by the FOP. Call and let them know you expect this decision to be appealed as soon as possible to a higher court.
Labels: info for the police
posted by SCC at 12:04 AM
112 Comments:
When the heck are we going to get a new contract!!!
If the aldermen get a 6% raise, I think that would be a good starting point for us.
The FOP won't do a thing about it. We're 18 months w/out a contract and nothing's changed. Remember when they said they weren't going to let contract negotiations go for years at a time like the past regime? They were going to use labor lawyers to negotiate?! Same shit, different crew. Let's see how many other people get screwed over by this before they get off of their asses and do something.
Just goes to show what goes around comes around.
Steal big and nothing happens, but take a$1.00 bag of trail mix and your fuk'd!
I still don't fully understand how evidence obtained by a direct order can later become something the state can use against you.
I would go as far as comparing this to going up to an arrestee and "demanding" or "ordering" them to give a statement without giving this offender any criminal rights. Any statements obtained and all physical evidence obtained due to those statements would be non-admissible in any criminal proceeding. But the courts found an exception for law enforcement officers?
Is there any lawyers or persons who understands this ruling please explain it better. And does that mean we no longer have to comply with a direct order that later may be used against us?
sorry that this post is totally unrelated, but both garages open last night at approx 2300 hrs (51st/wentworth and belmont/western) had no tires to replace flats. cameras, gps, ticket printers, but no money for tires? c'mon!!! that can't be the an item to suffer from the budget shortage. kinda puts it all in perspective doesn't it? don't do shit or you may get a flat and be dead in the water. ps...im overserved and goin to bed
Sgts DOnt make Policy !!!!!!!!!!!!!
THE PROBLEM IS THE INVESTIGATORS AT IAD NEED TO BE BE CIVILALLY HELD ACCOUNTABLE.
IF THEY WANT TO CUT CORNERS AND PLAY GAMES WITH THEIR FELLOW OFFICERS MAY BE IT SHOULD COST THEM SUM CASH.
WHY DO U THINK KRUPAS IS STILL AROUND ANY ONE THAT HAS CASH TO FIGHT FOR THEIR RIGHTS.
IF THE CITY CANT FIRE U THEY TRY AND MAKE U MISRABLE.
SO IF THAT GENIUS SGT WANT TO COME UP WITH NEW POINTS OF LAW IT SHOULD COST HIM.
IT CRACKS ME UP HOW THE CITY DOES WHAT IT WANT LIKE GARNISHING ARE CHECKS FOR PARKERS WITHOUT A COURT ORDER?
Ok, In a nutshell, the decision relates that a breathalyzer is not given the same protection as a statement. The court agrees that you can't be physically forced to give it; however, you may be mentally coerced. Now, as far as opening a door; I don't think so, the word unequivocally means, without question, absolutely. The court is saying the officer must beleive there is no chance that he will not be fired. As a LT, I have had the rare occassion to get a number for refusing an order. The PO in question took heavy time, but was not fired. So it is not unequivocal that a PO will be fired (unlike rule 14, now. THe bottom line is the decision, state, in Illinois a warrant is not needed to obtain bac evidence; like when one goes to the hospital and the dr does a medical blood draw in the ER, not voluntary, but admissible. Read the law, use a dictionary to explain the big words, talk to your lawyer. P.S. If you don't blow criminally then don't blow adminsistratively, but be ready to do some time. You will still have a job that way.
They can put whatever they want in administrative rights, it doesn't govern what happens in court. So no matter what some investigator says about some admission, statement, to-from or breath test that supposedly cannot be held against you in court, unless you get it in writing from a state's attorney do not take it as gospel, It is not like a Supreme Court decision, it is just some crap the department writes down or makes up as needed.
The courts admit evidence based on law and rules of evidence, not on Chicago Police Department administrative rules. Do not ever trust some IAD person telling you something can't be held against you. Make sure you have a lawyer next to you advising you and always assume anything you write or say to the Department can somehow find it's way into court.
As far as the trail mix saga is concerned, the officer was warned several times to stop giving himself the five finger discount. Walgreens even called his district to have a boss tell him to stop stealing from the store.When all else failed to stop him,what else do you expect the store to do? Walgreens had him on tape and and IAD was at his bench trial offering him numerious ways to save face and retire without any blemishes on his record-but he refused all. I personally do not know the man but the writing was on the wall. We all will have to live with the decisions we make. I t a shame that if he had a gold star he would have been protected but he didn't. If the man didn't steal,he would still have a job even after being found not guilty in a bench trial. There's more here than meets the eye.
which oversight body will provide you the least amount of justice possible:
A.) The Illinois judicial system
B.) The FOP
?????????
Same shit, different crew. Let's see how many other people get screwed over by this before they get off of their asses and do something.
12/01/2008 01:10:00 AM
Same bribes from the 5th Floor.
O/T- Lt. Ceja is the new 25th District Tact Lt.
Who had a shorter run, Garrido or Berti?
The other night a Mobile Strike force or TRU unit or one of those other new units who constantly strives to make Jody Weis and Richie look good backed me up on a stop I had.
I got to talking to the kid and I asked him why they were more and more bringing in pimpy arrests. His answer was, "they want us to get a head a day, the numbers are down."
I told him the reason the numbers are down are people like me and my partner are sick and tired of busting our asses for Jody Weis. That guy's is one big failed public relations gimic by the Daley administration. He has no concept of what it means to be a member of the CPD and his only goal is to fuck over members of this department under the guise of cleaning up the CPD.
I told this kid I was getting tired of busting my ass for a City whose citizens would rather sue the police than be protected by them. I told him that he shouldn't be frightened by some politician to arrest a person a day just to keep his spot.
I told him what is going on in this department is wrong. He just looked at me an shrugged his shoulders and agreed with me.
Arrests are down and crime is way up because the lowly patrolman is treated like shit by the superintendent, the mayor, the media, the judiciary and a large number of the citizens of Shitcago. I think its sad and I feel sorry for that kid but I guess they always wanted numbers but now it seems like they are getting desparate with these new units.
Sergeants, especially the ones who work in IAD, are so unaware.
WHATEVER IT IS...Get a lawyer.
You union dues pay for it.
Never make a statement without one.
FOP Herbert handled thew case, idiots.
Anonymous said...
sorry that this post is totally unrelated, but both garages open last night at approx 2300 hrs (51st/wentworth and belmont/western) had no tires to replace flats. cameras, gps, ticket printers, but no money for tires? c'mon!!! that can't be the an item to suffer from the budget shortage. kinda puts it all in perspective doesn't it? don't do shit or you may get a flat and be dead in the water. ps...im overserved and goin to bed
12/01/2008 05:23:00 AM
That struck a nerve...
Last week the battery died in the turd brown unmarked beast that bears me.
We jumped it, but it wouldn't charge and was dead when we attempted a re-start.
CW-3 and the R Man arrives two hours later. Puts some gauge on the battery and pronounces it dead.
COD - dead cells.
Gets a battery out of the truck and starts to pull the old one out. I look at the beat-up, dirty battery he brought with him and find a date stamp, showing it is nearly 3 years old. I ask whats with this, R-man says they are short on new batteries and were told to pull them out of the wrecks at the areas. Only "front-line" unmarked cars AKA Boss cars get new ones. I point out to the R-man that it is winter in Chicago and I wouldn't trust a three year old battery in my personal car. He says call him when this one dies and he will bring another, maybe better, used battery.
Nice Fucking Proceedure, wonder how many man hours this will waste?
Off topic: President Obama has love for former Marines. First of all his minister of 20 years the honorable rev. Wright served 6 years in the corp. Now President Obama picked a former Marine general to be head of National security. Semper fi.
HELLO! WE HAVE TO GET RID OF DONOHUE AND HIS USELESS CREW.
anyone know about the ALDERMAN's STAFF getting a 5% raise?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
What part of "admission or statement" do you not understand? Breathalyzer exams are not admissions OR statements. Period. Case closed.
anyone notice the screaming in the gun owner community about the use of an endorsement by one Lon Horiuchi of H-S Precision?
You have to wonder how stupid a company can be to use an endorsement by such a polarizing figure.
I'm gonna take the money I saved and open up an ostrich and alpaca farm in Canada, I'm sick of the city and everything that comes with city living! From now on I will be known as Raul "the king of the animals"!
So what, check\out the rules of the NFL. They can drug test you anytime if you refuse they suspend you. Just remember, don't go out and get trashed.
I think the precident was set bu Sgt Frank from 009 who was dui's on the skyway the night of the 9th District x-mas party a few years back. He refused a direct order and was not fired for it. He went for the "cure" and was in call back for a while but he is still around. Then again he is heavy as whale sh&t
Anonymous said...
When the heck are we going to get a new contract!!!
If the aldermen get a 6% raise, I think that would be a good starting point for us.
12/01/2008 12:34:00 AM
The alderman just gave their staff's a 5% raise for next year. But we get shit on for 17 months now.
No tires at the garages! Hmmmmmmm that never happened when the fleet of department vehicles was controlled by the police department and ran by sworn members. Another situation that the rank and file can blame lover boy Mike Picardi for! What a fuckin jag off.
Just ecause ine Sergeant said he was unaware of an order doesn't mean it does or does not exist. I'm sure the city can bring in "expert witnesses" to testify to any angle they want.
The city HAS TO have ALL contracts settled by November 2009 for the Olympic bullshit bid schtuff. Unfortunately, that would put us at 2-1/2 years without a contract which is plain and simple BULLSHIT!
Cost of living, inflation, taxes - all should be a factor when it comes to getting a decent raise. Damn shame, we can't strike. Everybody else strikes and they get or get close to what they requested and layed on the table. Daley is going to stick it to us as usual. I can't stand working for a Mayor thats hates the police and a superintendant that is an idiot and has absolutely no clue. Pretty tough being the police in Chicago and that doesn't even take into consideration of the "no manpower" and faulty equipment issues.
In response to off the subject Fleet will not spend money on replacement radio batteries, it takes two batteries for a tour of duty, and cars go out of service to make the change, totally unsafe practice on the part of the city. The Union FOP asleep aat the switch again, until someone gets hurt or killed.
This is an indication of the generate climate that will spread throughout the country pretty soon..Watch the news and see the eruption of Liberalism and the abuse of freedom that is displayed throughout the country...From the Wallmart stampede, the Toys R Us shooting and the numerous display of intolerance displayed through the Gay Rights demonstrations...We represent Law and Order and the climate dictates revolution and "payback"...I used to take my job seriously and feel sorry for the jaded and disgruntled old timers for all the things that they have been through, that I didn't understand..Now I am feeling that everytime I am about to do my job that I might end up on the news without a single voice defending me....All you need is an accusation and your life, carreer and psychological well being is at stake...How many more brothers and sisters thrown into the wolves mouth will it take for someone to stand up and defend US for once....
From chicagotribune.com:
Durbin: Commute Ryan sentence
In a letter to President Bush, Democratic Sen. Dick Durbin notes the 74-year-old Ryan "has lost his state pension benefits and a commutation will not restore them. He would emerge from prison facing economic uncertainty at an advanced stage of his life."
---
Fucking scumbag Durbin.
I would go as far as comparing this to going up to an arrestee and "demanding" or "ordering" them to give a statement without giving this offender any criminal rights. Any statements obtained and all physical evidence obtained due to those statements would be non-admissible in any criminal proceeding. But the courts found an exception for law enforcement officers?
--------------
Breath results are not statements. They are physical evidence. So, 5th amendment self-incrimination protections do not apply.
Illinois law states a person does NOT have to consent to Breath/Blood tests to have the results admitted at trial. The main reason for this is the incapacitated drunk driver at the hospital.
Breath/Blood results can NOT be obtained by force, however breath tests are admissible even if the suspect feels compelled to take the test (ie. fears suspension of his license or fears punishment from his employer).
The real question the court tippy-toes around is whether test results be obtained through deceit. The court doesn't give a clear answer.
The officer was told the test results would not be criminally admissible, so he took the test. The court says that since consent isn't required it doesn't matter why he took the test, the results are admissible.
But, what if the police told an arrestee that he would die if he didn't blow into the breath machine? Would those results be admissible?
At what point does deceit cross the line and become force, psycological instead of physical.
There isn't an answer and hopefully the officer will get another appeal to the IL Supreme Court.
Lets not forget to send our beloved Inspector "big Bird" a lil something for the holidays to cheer him up. Next time you are at the pet store stop by the bird section and pick him up a lil something for his cage. Maybe a lil bag of bird seed, new scratch pad for his beek, bird bath, feeding cups, mirror or even a canary to keep him company in his car while he goes out hunting on the working copper. Hey terry dont birds migrate south for the winter? Its time you left town.
It looks like RA 023 Gangs is crying his way off of the team because he is afraid of working in the ghetto. How ironic that his dad, LAPA Merit Sgt of CTA special, always preaches about being the "real police". Yet, his son has never stopped a gangbanger in his life and the daughter in law has worked in the office her entire career. JOKE!!
FORGOT TO MENTION THAT THEY BOTH LEFT THE JOB TO BE BUSINESSMEN IN VEGAS (He was a car hop) They both came back, he went right back on to tact, she went right back into the office GREAT FOR MORALE, REWARD THE PRODIGAL SON Not the one who stayed and worked, read it in the bible.
You cannot be given a unlawful order, period.
Therefore,".. by invoking the Garrity rule, the officer is invoking his or her right against self incrimination. Any statements made after invoking Garrity, may only be used for department investigation purposes and not for criminal prosecution purposes. The Garrity Rule stems from the court case Garrity v. New Jersey, 385 U.S. 493 (1967), which was decided in 1966 by the United States Supreme Court. It was a traffic ticket fixing case of all things.
Officers were advised that they had to answer questions subjecting them to criminal prosecution or lose their jobs. The Court held that this was Unconstitutional.
Technically, there are two prongs under the Garrity rights. First, if an officer is compelled to answer questions as a condition of employment, the officer's answers and the fruits of those answers may not be used against the officer in a subsequent criminal prosecution. Second, the department becomes limited as to what they may ask. Such questions must be specifically, narrowly, and directly tailored to the officer's job.
Thus, the basic thrust of the Garrity Rights or Garrity Rule is that a department member may be compelled to give statements under threat of discipline or discharge but those statements may not be used in the criminal prosecution of the individual officer. This means that the Garrity Rule only protects a department member from criminal prosecution based upon statements he or she might make under threat of discipline or discharge.
Also, the Garrity Rule is not automatically triggered simply because questioning is taking place. The officer must announce that he or she wants the protections under Garrity. The above statement should be prepared in writing, and the officer should obtain a copy of it. If a written statement is being taken from an officer, the officer should insist that the Garrity Warning actually be typed in the statement. Consult your attorney and union delegate for the laws regarding Garrity in your state before providing any statement."
SCC OT Word is circulating that at least 6 coppers have had money taken from their accounts at the credit union. At least one copper had as much as $1800 missing from his account. Spread the word and make sure guys and girls are checking their accounts to make sure you have what you should have. Possibly an inside job obviously, that wouldnt be very stunning. But either way, spread the word so everyone makes sure this isnt happening to them. Im quite sure if there are 6 victims already there wil be many more that simply havent realized it yet. Might be a good topic to have as a main post so guys see this!!!
O/T It seems that A.M. from 009 is telling everyone that her clout related to her that Roy will get the airport today. If thats true hopefully he will take her. It would however be funny if he leaves her behind in 009 to the wolves on the watch.
Anonymous said...
When the heck are we going to get a new contract!!!
If the aldermen get a 6% raise, I think that would be a good starting point for us.
12/01/2008 12:34:00 AM
Soon, by springtime I feel. they are talking money now, that means it is nearly done.
Forget 6%, won't happen, we are not aldermen. think 3% - 4%, likely 3.5%
You will be notified when it occurs, watch your mail, you will get a ballot to vote on it. In the meantime, don't lose any sleep about the contract.
Anonymous said...
Lets not forget to send our beloved Inspector "big Bird" a lil something for the holidays to cheer him up. Next time you are at the pet store stop by the bird section and pick him up a lil something for his cage. Maybe a lil bag of bird seed, new scratch pad for his beek, bird bath, feeding cups, mirror or even a canary to keep him company in his car while he goes out hunting on the working copper. Hey terry dont birds migrate south for the winter? Its time you left town.
12/01/2008 02:55:00 PM
How about a few of Mope-Rah's columns to line the bottom of his cage?
SCC OT Word is circulating that at least 6 coppers have had money taken from their accounts at the credit union. At least one copper had as much as $1800 missing from his account.
-------------------------------
IRS garnishment?
Court ordered payments perhaps?
I agree with the one post of IAD people being held responsible for some of their BS antics. Oh, another thing, don't ever let an IAD Officer say, "By the way, off the record." THERE IS NO OFF THE RECORD, always remember that no matter how much the "Head Hunters" tell you that. They are fishing and can screw you in a heart beat by what they put in their report. Time some of them get their nuts cut off, maybe making that will tame them a bit.
07:09 am
Actually you are wrong.
ANY TIME an "administrator" expresses themselves in their supervisory capacity they are establishing a policy. This is why it is so important to vett and promote qualified persons. The City of Chicago "gets away" with slipshod halfass bosses only because they have the courts and judges in their corrupt pockets.
When your boss tells you to bring in heads, dope, guns et al and indicates that "how" or "where" is not important, they have established a policy and they are responsible...everywhere but here in Chicago!
Look at the police official in India who resigned after the terrorist attack. GOD, if only we had bosses with that sort of character.
OT:
I know stuff really stinks right now in the Dept. but we should look at the good things we have right now. And that is Job Security. The more I hear about layoffs the more I realize this is the time we as police officers should be most thankful. In the 90's when everyone was making bank, this job didn't look as great as it does now. My roommate has a much better education than me, yet he is making $11.00 an hour and still looking for a "real" job.
Anonymous said...
FOP Herbert handled thew case, idiots.
12/01/2008 10:19:00 AM
You are calling someone else an idiot? Look at your post.
Anonymous said...
It looks like RA 023 Gangs is crying his way off of the team because he is afraid of working in the ghetto. How ironic that his dad, LAPA Merit Sgt of CTA special, always preaches about being the "real police". Yet, his son has never stopped a gangbanger in his life and the daughter in law has worked in the office her entire career. JOKE!!
The daughter has always worked inside as a princess. RA keeps his wife close by to keep an eye on her and avoid street work. RA claim to fame is empty war stories. Let him work a beat car.
In response to an O/T remark about the credit union money scenario. We stopped some G/D's at Division and Pulaski and one of them told me his sister worked at the credit union, checked it out and it was true. Remember what Troutman did with a certain list, handing it over to GD's. Probably not the same here but it's something to think about.
Why not just have the scumbag Sen/ Durbin call the Pres. and fix everyithing like he did for his fellow thief, Gov. Ryan?
Anonymous said...
Steal big and nothing happens, but take a$1.00 bag of trail mix and your fuk'd!
12/01/2008 01:30:00 AM
If the officer had "shared" his bag of trail mix with the commander and his secretary then the theft would be seen as acceptable. Similarly to envelopes passed around holidays and after certain incidents.
But NO!, the PO kept the bag of trail mix all to himself.
And does that mean we no longer have to comply with a direct order that later may be used against us?
12/01/2008 03:41:00 AM
1. Do not comply.
2. let them get a CR for refusing a direct order
3. the content of the direct order in most cases will not stand up in court
4. avoid self incrimination - they have nothing.
And does that mean we no longer have to comply with a direct order that later may be used against us?
12/01/2008 03:41:00 AM
you are incriminating yourself if you do. Politely refuse.
IT CRACKS ME UP HOW THE CITY DOES WHAT IT WANT LIKE GARNISHING ARE CHECKS FOR PARKERS WITHOUT A COURT ORDER?
12/01/2008 07:28:00 AM
....and dumping bid officers for bullshit just causes.
Anonymous said...
When the heck are we going to get a new contract!!!
If the aldermen get a 6% raise, I think that would be a good starting point for us.
12/01/2008 12:34:00 AM
Soon, by springtime I feel. they are talking money now, that means it is nearly done.
Forget 6%, won't happen, we are not aldermen. think 3% - 4%, likely 3.5%
You will be notified when it occurs, watch your mail, you will get a ballot to vote on it. In the meantime, don't lose any sleep about the contract.
12/01/2008 04:15:00 PM
F that no way on 3.5% the cost of everthing is going up heating bills electric, property taxs, sales tax, by summer the cost of gas will be $3.50 -4.00 again we need 4-4.5% or vote no.
Thar only thing the FOP can do for you is a new ink pen..Right Cooter
Anonymous said...
The city HAS TO have ALL contracts settled by November 2009 for the Olympic bullshit bid stuff. Unfortunately, that would put us at 2-1/2 years without a contract which is plain and simple BULLSHIT!
If the city wants to wait; fine. But we now better hold out for a hefty 1st year(8%) AND
2nd year(6%) raises.
They can keep the rest but give us the best retro we have already worked for.
The general orders are different from court procedings
there is an administrative obligation to obey lawful directives given by superiors
Also a Sergeant cannot undermine the orders of the Superintendant
Once the rules and regs are made available one cannot use the excuse that he didnt get them or dodnt have time to read them
There were several officers who failed drug screens.
Their firings were overturned because they weren't provided counsel first
However the city won on appeal because having counsel present or not has no bearing on the member's obligation to provide a clean sample
After the dream team of lawyers is assembled, and the huddle on the 40 yd line is over, the member must now provide a clean sample.
The lawyers really have no way to overcome this burden, so said the appelate court
I believe that the same logic applies to blowing the breathalyzer
But what amazes me is why we cant just drive sober
CTA, Teachers, electricans, plumbers, laborers, janitors, streets and san, water dept alderman, aldermans staff all recieved more than 3.5% so to hell with that 4.5% is more like it 5% is decent. No way in Hell 3.5% covers all the increase costs of everything.
Off topic: President Obama has love for former Marines. First of all his minister of 20 years the honorable rev. Wright served 6 years in the corp. Now President Obama picked a former Marine general to be head of National security. Semper fi.
12/01/2008 10:45:00 AM
I have no respect for your simpleminded loyalty, but I will use it to manipulate you. My Caliphate begins soon.
The IAD offficer should be hit with a rule 14 violation
CLTV BREAKING NEWS!!!!!!!!
CHICAGO POLICE MADE AN ARREST TODAY IN THE HUDSON'S MURDERS.
KUDOS TO AREA 1 DETECTIVES.
Off topic if you work any of the overtime initiatives and are going to one of the new d.o.g. (60's, 90's) be aware of scheduling problems for January. The system won't recognize the new groups and problems are definitely going to run rampant!
So if you can be fired for disobeying an order, do you have an out such as the military has to refuse an illegal order?
Some of the more lengthy comments on the Garrity rule are pretty good. However, I do disagree that the officer has to invoke the Garrity protections and have it in writing. It wouldn't hurt but how many coppers would know this? Anyway, the bottom line is that the police sergeant, a government employee, ordered the test. Therefore, it is governmental conduct which cannot be performed absent a warrant. This is a seizure. It is a seizure of the officer's breath. Laugh if you want but this is just one of the arguments that I would make. We need a court order to get a buccal swab from a suspect. A buccal swab is no more evasive than a breathalyzer. This AppCt decision will be overturned by the IL Sup Ct. Bank on it.
Additionally, the officer should turn around and file suit against the city and the arresting officers for civil rights violations. After all, they are acting under the color of law in violating the officer's rights. I would go so far as to sue the State's Attorney as well. He generally has immunity but I would argue that filing charges in bad faith pierces any veil of immunity. The State's Attorney knows that Garrity applies but filed nonetheless. Bad faith is rampant in this prosecution.
P.S. Off-topic: With Jody making command staff changes every few months, how are these fine commanders going to establish shakedowns and find a good bagman?
3.5 over 4 years? Oh gee thanks, whats that like 20 dollars a check after taxes and medical? Keep it I'll vote no
OFF TOPIC
16th District
Central and Higgins area
My car was broken into on the street, the only thing they took was the garage door opener. They broke the passenger wing window and then broke the dome light.
I have a FOP medallion and Chicago Police Memorial stickers on the car.
Take your garage door opener and anything you need out of your car for now and let your neighbors know.
I am not taking my police stuff off the car. I will not live in fear, I will not hide, but beat down any jagoff in my car or garage. I am the police not a citizen.
That is all
Stay safe
Anonymous said...
Anonymous said...
When the heck are we going to get a new contract!!!
If the aldermen get a 6% raise, I think that would be a good starting point for us.
12/01/2008 12:34:00 AM
Soon, by springtime I feel. they are talking money now, that means it is nearly done.
Forget 6%, won't happen, we are not aldermen. think 3% - 4%, likely 3.5%
You will be notified when it occurs, watch your mail, you will get a ballot to vote on it. In the meantime, don't lose any sleep about the contract.
12/01/2008 04:15:00 PM
Rescind that optimistic projection. Can't say why, just isn't as rosy as I thought.
Anonymous said...
You cannot be given a unlawful order, period.
Therefore,".. by invoking the Garrity rule, the officer is invoking his or her right against self incrimination. Any statements made after invoking Garrity, may only be used for department investigation purposes and not for criminal prosecution purposes. The Garrity Rule stems from the court case Garrity v. New Jersey, 385 U.S. 493 (1967), which was decided in 1966 by the United States Supreme Court. It was a traffic ticket fixing case of all things.
Officers were advised that they had to answer questions subjecting them to criminal prosecution or lose their jobs. The Court held that this was Unconstitutional.
Technically, there are two prongs under the Garrity rights. First, if an officer is compelled to answer questions as a condition of employment, the officer's answers and the fruits of those answers may not be used against the officer in a subsequent criminal prosecution. Second, the department becomes limited as to what they may ask. Such questions must be specifically, narrowly, and directly tailored to the officer's job.
Thus, the basic thrust of the Garrity Rights or Garrity Rule is that a department member may be compelled to give statements under threat of discipline or discharge but those statements may not be used in the criminal prosecution of the individual officer. This means that the Garrity Rule only protects a department member from criminal prosecution based upon statements he or she might make under threat of discipline or discharge.
Also, the Garrity Rule is not automatically triggered simply because questioning is taking place. The officer must announce that he or she wants the protections under Garrity. The above statement should be prepared in writing, and the officer should obtain a copy of it. If a written statement is being taken from an officer, the officer should insist that the Garrity Warning actually be typed in the statement. Consult your attorney and union delegate for the laws regarding Garrity in your state before providing any statement."
12/01/2008 03:19:00 PM
No offense but I am not a lawyer and I don't trust the Chicago Police Department or anyone named Garrity. If given an order to make a statement and my lawyer has not arrived yet I think I will be suddenly gripped by huge chest pains and fall to the floor in agony.
Anonymous said...
HELLO! WE HAVE TO GET RID OF DONOHUE AND HIS USELESS CREW.
12/01/2008 10:49:00 AM
HELLO, YOU SHOULD HAVE THOUGHT OF THAT BEFORE THE FOP ELECTION THIS YEAR. YOUR BALLOT WAS DUE PRIOR TO MARCH 14, 2008. TOO LATE TO COMPLAIN NOW.
OT
Who the fuck made 862 a tact sgt.?
He is a joke and an embarrassment to tact and to police everywhere. Mark my words, he will get a p.o. killed one day. Why aren't the powers that be understanding this?
Off Topic:
Just fininshed some online shopping for xmas. No shipping fee. No $hitcago/Crook Co tax.
Feels GREAT!!!!!
off topic:
Ma son is facin' da deaf penalty.
On channel 2 tonight.
"the other night a mobile strike force or TRU unit backed me on a stop".....The kid may have been stupid for bringing in heads to keep his spot, but whats you excuse for doing proactive police work? The kid stops to help you out and you criticize him? Go fuck yourself asshole.
Is every district out there short property bags. 18th district has only the jumbo bags. WTF ?
SCC,
With all due respect, if you had a law degree you'd be dangerous. No offense but how about you venture out from the depths of your basement and get yourself into a law school? Let the department pay for it.
Off topic:
Anybody have the scoop on Sgt. Snake of the "policy group" getting slugged by an irate motorist while playing chicken with slugger while driving along the Kennedy?
Was the report taken by CPD or ISP?
Inquiring minds want to know...
I'm long time CPD and have been blessed - BLESSED - to never have a CR# against me or have needed a lawyer. However, my girlfriend is an attorney and she does a lot of work for the CPD, on OUR side NOT management's I assure you. Her professional advice? ALWAYS LAWYER UP. No matter what, no question about it, ALWAYS lawyer up. Our dues pay for it and if nothing else - it shows them you're taking a strong stand on whatever the issue at hand is. She points out that it is better to be pver prepared than not prepared enough.
SCC,
With all due respect, if you had a law degree you'd be dangerous. No offense but how about you venture out from the depths of your basement and get yourself into a law school? Let the department pay for it.
Take that back! We despise lawyers on general principle.
I guess the whole Obama Birth Certificate mess ISN'T over. Take a look at the full-page ad that's going to run in Tuesday and Wednesday's CHICAGO TRIBUNE:
http://www.wethepeoplefoundation.org/UPDATE/misc2008/ChicagoTribune-ObamaLtr-Nov-2008.pdf
The other night a Mobile Strike force or TRU unit or one of those other new units who constantly strives to make Jody Weis and Richie look good backed me up on a stop I had.
I got to talking to the kid and I asked him why they were more and more bringing in pimpy arrests. His answer was, "they want us to get a head a day, the numbers are down."
I told him the reason the numbers are down are people like me and my partner are sick and tired of busting our asses for Jody Weis. That guy's is one big failed public relations gimic by the Daley administration. He has no concept of what it means to be a member of the CPD and his only goal is to fuck over members of this department under the guise of cleaning up the CPD.
I told this kid I was getting tired of busting my ass for a City whose citizens would rather sue the police than be protected by them. I told him that he shouldn't be frightened by some politician to arrest a person a day just to keep his spot.
I told him what is going on in this department is wrong. He just looked at me an shrugged his shoulders and agreed with me.
Arrests are down and crime is way up because the lowly patrolman is treated like shit by the superintendent, the mayor, the media, the judiciary and a large number of the citizens of Shitcago. I think its sad and I feel sorry for that kid but I guess they always wanted numbers but now it seems like they are getting desparate with these new units.
Then why were you on a stop?
Another Month GONE and STILL NO CONTRACT. 2009 is upon us, and even MORE Tax Increases coming REAL SOON.
So what, check\out the rules of the NFL. They can drug test you anytime if you refuse they suspend you. Just remember, don't go out and get trashed.
They signed a contract agreeing to it, it's a stipulation... big difference.
Durbin should be in prison, along with Geo. Ryan. Both are thieves and con-men.
Time to picket City Hall, maybe even FOP Hall, after the Holidays...
I told him what is going on in this department is wrong. He just looked at me an shrugged his shoulders and agreed with me.
------------------------
That is the problem. The dumb asses on MSF and TRU have no idea how much this department will fuck you because they only have 2 to 4 yrs on and haven't been around to see their buddies get fired and indicted.
"He just looked at me and shrugged his shoulders and agreed with me.."
You young guys really need to wake the fuck up. Patrol in the areas where coppers live, not in the area of the non-paying, cop-hating, beef-filing, hardcore-lying so called citizens live.
Fuck working in 015, 011, 007 and districts of the like. Police the homelands of 022, 016, 017, 019, 008.
No offense but I am not a lawyer and I don't trust the Chicago Police Department or anyone named Garrity. If given an order to make a statement and my lawyer has not arrived yet I think I will be suddenly gripped by huge chest pains and fall to the floor in agony.
I wouldn't do that, they will call you an ambulance, take you to the hospital and have blood drawn due to your incapacitated state, jujst refuse and take the heat..
C'mon SCC - You know that I just funnin' ya!!!
I agree that this will be overturned, I would appeal it to the SCOTUS if needed, you are being ordered to give a breath test under duress, it can't be admissable in a criminal proceeding and yes we have the right to no self-incrimination, whether it be by statement or otherwise. If this wasn't the case we would be walking up to criminals and pulling hair out there heads for dna etc. this will be reversed on appeal, if not, to SCOTUS with it!
Now go fuck yourself! but stay safe while doing so....
Anonymous Anonymous said...
So if you can be fired for disobeying an order, do you have an out such as the military has to refuse an illegal order?
12/01/2008 07:35:00 PM
Of course you idiot! If your supervisor orders you to shoot a 10 year old for jaywalking, are you going to do it?
cannot give blood, because I',m Jehovah Witness religion.
Go to sleep, refuse to blow, unconsous. (sorry) Stay asleep!!!
When at hospital say your jehovah witness. No blood draw allowed! unless life threatening. religious rules
Anonymous said...
OT
Who the fuck made 862 a tact sgt.?
He is a joke and an embarrassment to tact and to police everywhere. Mark my words, he will get a p.o. killed one day. Why aren't the powers that be understanding this?
12/01/2008 09:04:00 PM
***********************************
THANK YOU FOR POSTING THIS!!!!!!!!!
He needs to be launched. He's the most hated man next to Bin Ladin!
Anonymous said...
HELLO! WE HAVE TO GET RID OF DONOHUE AND HIS USELESS CREW.
12/01/2008 10:49:00 AM
HELLO, YOU SHOULD HAVE THOUGHT OF THAT BEFORE THE FOP ELECTION THIS YEAR. YOUR BALLOT WAS DUE PRIOR TO MARCH 14, 2008. TOO LATE TO COMPLAIN NOW.
12/01/2008 08:46:00 PM
I voted against every one of the current FOP members...didn't vote to retain any of them. It didn't matter. Too many people don't take a pro-active stance in our union, and nothing will change until more people get involved. Donahue is out after this term, he's at the limit...but mark my words, Dougherty or Bella will succeed him, and the same assholes will be running the show for another 2 or 3 terms. GET INVOLVED NOW PEOPLE!!!!!!
By the way, I am not a person who ran against them in this past, or any other, election, so it's not sour grapes. I'm just sick and tired of not having my voice be heard.
"how are these fine commanders going to establish shakedowns and find a good bagman?
12/01/2008 07:48:00 PM"
That's their problem.
On (insert date), at (insert time), at (insert location), I was ordered to submit this report (or give this statement) by (insert name and rank). I submit this report (statement) at his/her order as a condition of continued employment. In view of likely job forfeiture if I refuse to cooperate, I have no alternative but to abide by this order.
It is my belief and understanding that the Chicago Police Department requires this report (statement) solely and exclusively for internal purposes and will not release it to any other agency or authority except as is required or compelled by law. It is my further belief that his report (statement) will not be released in any subsequent proceeding other than disciplinary proceedings within the confined of the Chicago Police Department itself.
For any and all other purposes, I hereby reserve my constitutional rights to remain silent under the Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments to the United States Constitution and other rights provided by law including the Uniform Peace Officers' Disciplinary Act. Further, I rely specifically upon the protection afforded to me under the doctrines set forth in Garrity v. State of New Jersey 385 U.S. 493 (1967), Spevack v. Klein 385 U.S. 511 (1967) and Gardener v. Broderick 392 U.S. 273 (1968), should this report (statement) be used for any other purpose of whatsoever kind or description.
Is every district out there short property bags. 18th district has only the jumbo bags. WTF ?
12/01/2008 10:52:00 PM
.................................................we male lil baggies out of em
Don't drink and drive, and you won't have to worry about this bullshit. the same goes for police work. the less you do, the less trouble you can get in.
So what, check\out the rules of the NFL. They can drug test you anytime if you refuse they suspend you. Just remember, don't go out and get trashed.
12/01/2008 01:07:00 PM
You can't be this dumb.
This isn't the Sun Times comments section. Changing the circumstances to fit your argument is not fooling anyone.
CLTV BREAKING NEWS!!!!!!!!
CHICAGO POLICE MADE AN ARREST TODAY IN THE HUDSON'S MURDERS.
KUDOS TO AREA 1 DETECTIVES.
Louie Otero had to do this !!! cause cho no Loouuuiiie ees de only one doing any ting in Area One ....and he ees in touch wit da community ... Box 1
Drug testing, your ordered to take a test in which your presumed guilty before taking the teat.
Anonymous said...
Is every district out there short property bags. 18th district has only the jumbo bags. WTF ?
12/01/2008 10:52:00 PM
I bring my own Glad bags, after I eat the sandwich and pickle inside. Part of the budget gap I guess. It's OK though, I have adjusted my arrest frequency to correspond with available resources so as not to tax the overburdened court system.
Anonymous said...
When the heck are we going to get a new contract!!!
If the aldermen get a 6% raise, I think that would be a good starting point for us.
12/01/2008 12:34:00 AM
From what I heard at the FOP get together last night, the issue now is money, Other things seem to be mostly agreed on, money is the problem.
This might take quite a while longer. Any contract given the membership for a vote that has paltry raises heavily back loaded is sure to be voted down.
Remember, this is not the FOP's doing, it is the city negotiating team with their marching orders coming from Shortshanks.
Our only recourse is to file for arbitration and the arbitrator cannot give us any alternate work schedule or paid health insurance for retirees after age 55.
One thing is certain, if the FOP files for arbitration, as seems more likely the longer the negotiations drag on, it is a certainty the contract will not be in place before the deadline for the Olympic selection in 2009.
With Obama in office, that may not matter as much.
Don't go spending any imagined retro check, this might go on for a while.
The FOP won't do a thing about it. We're 18 months w/out a contract and nothing's changed. Remember when they said they weren't going to let contract negotiations go for years at a time like the past regime? They were going to use labor lawyers to negotiate?! Same shit, different crew. Let's see how many other people get screwed over by this before they get off of their asses and do something.
12/01/2008 01:10:00 AM
Asswipe,
Would you rather the FOP take the first offer given by King Richard or would you rather they fight and argue for every issue to give you, the member, the best contract available. Based on your statement, I would also think you would prefer to rush into arbitration and allow your future to be put into the hands of some liberal who could care less about police officers or their families. I would rather a lenghty fight by FOP for the best contract for us the officers over a quick contract giving into King Richards offers.
WTF!!!!!!!
BIG CELEBRATION GOING ON IN AREA 1
EARLY CHRISTMAS FOR SOME.....
AREA 1 DICKS MUST OF GOTTEN PENCILED IN FOR THE NEXT MERIT SGT PROMOTIONS FOR MAKING THAT GREAT ARREST OF BALFOUR............ WOW. L. O. YOU ARE THE BEST...... I HOPE TO BE AN AREA 1 RANGER DICK SOMEDAY.... ON THE OTHER HAND MAYBE NOT!!!
how is this any different than compelling someone to provide a Breathalyzer sample under pain of losing a driver's license?
Hey SCC,
I have an idea based on post below regarding the Garrity rule.
Post a link of Constitutional rights which can be invoked when officers are subjected to the inconsitencies of law and enforcement.
Officers, know your Constitutional rights. Zealot bosses will take your rights away, using officers who don't know, only if you allow them too.
Hey you guys that are bitching, most of the sgts. at IAD are there to help you and go way out of their way to do so. Maybe some of the people that didn't get it stuck to them can open their mouths and say so. They don't make the policy they just follow it. Bottom line is don't do anything and you can't get in trouble.
...as far as illegal orders go, just thought up this little gem and it seems like it may work like a charm. if your supervisor gives you a clearly illegal order and you point out that said order is illegal and are threatened with sanction for this, try your damndest to ensure there are ear/eye witnesses... never go for the old "step in this room i need to talk to you" bullshit, that's how bosses have gotten away with saying dumbshit to p.o.'s for years... if ya got something to say then man up and say it in front of everyone. next, call iad and obtain a c/r# on yourself and explain that you obeyed an illegal order, name the supervisor that gave you said order then sit back and watch the show... it should be funny to actually see the c/r# you got on yourself roll uphill and get bigger & shittier as the chain of command now is running like hell to keep from being involved/subject to a c/r or having to drop some kind of official document (hint, rule 14 etc). you'll be subjected to harassment, retailiation, threats, having to drop for a week straight and all so be sure you're ready to fight for the long haul and lawyer up with someone who hates the city & f(l)op if you can... just a thought.
...as far as illegal orders go, just thought up this little gem and it seems like it may work like a charm. if your supervisor gives you a clearly illegal order and you point out that said order is illegal and are threatened with sanction for this, try your damndest to ensure there are ear/eye witnesses... never go for the old "step in this room i need to talk to you" bullshit, that's how bosses have gotten away with saying dumbshit to p.o.'s for years... if ya got something to say then man up and say it in front of everyone. next, call iad and obtain a c/r# on yourself and explain that you obeyed an illegal order, name the supervisor that gave you said order then sit back and watch the show... it should be funny to actually see the c/r# you got on yourself roll uphill and get bigger & shittier as the chain of command now is running like hell to keep from being involved/subject to a c/r or having to drop some kind of official document (hint, rule 14 etc). you'll be subjected to harassment, retailiation, threats, having to drop for a week straight and all so be sure you're ready to fight for the long haul and lawyer up with someone who hates the city & f(l)op if you can... just a thought
Great idea, except, you can't get a cr on yourself, and you are asked into the room by yourself to save you the embarrasment of getting disciplined in front of others, you know(criticize in pvt, praise in public).
"...most of the sergeants at IAD are there to help you and will go out of their way to do so..."
Please report to Random Drug Testing, 3510 S. Michigan Ave.
"just a thought.
12/02/2008 02:31:00 PM"
Give it a try yourself.
Keep us posted.
Let us know how it all works out.
Be the bold trailblazer.
You lead, we may follow.
If, that is, you don't shoot yourself in your dick.
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