Detroit Police Shooting
Very disturbing video released by the Detroit PD:
Another version is here with an intro by the Police Chief. Same basic video.
We can't think of any Chicago police station that doesn't have these types of security issues and can actually say that every current police Area desk is built almost exactly the way this Detroit police station is - open lobby, grade level desk that's easy to get over, little to no cover.
Detroit PD is lucky not to be planning half a dozen funerals after this disaster. And we can predict with near certainty that Chicago will do exactly nothing to protect their station desk crews from a similar attack in the future even though J-Fled was hired partly for his anti-terror credentials and spent unknown amounts of money for a Secret Service evaluation of building security following the unauthorized ride-along of the 13-year-old kid.
Another version is here with an intro by the Police Chief. Same basic video.
We can't think of any Chicago police station that doesn't have these types of security issues and can actually say that every current police Area desk is built almost exactly the way this Detroit police station is - open lobby, grade level desk that's easy to get over, little to no cover.
Detroit PD is lucky not to be planning half a dozen funerals after this disaster. And we can predict with near certainty that Chicago will do exactly nothing to protect their station desk crews from a similar attack in the future even though J-Fled was hired partly for his anti-terror credentials and spent unknown amounts of money for a Secret Service evaluation of building security following the unauthorized ride-along of the 13-year-old kid.
Labels: info for the police
posted by SCC at 12:03 AM
72 Comments:
That's not true! When Thor was killed in our TRU parking lot Commander Ryan immediately got 2 blue police line horses from streets and sans to block the parking lot.
We demanded a top to bottom security review and that's the best he could do for us. Two wooden horses. Oh yea and a surveillance system that he uses Not to make sure the building is secure but to make sure nobody sneaks out early the night before.
Shooter's name was Lamar Moore. His brother was sentenced last monday to 40-60 years for a 2010 double homicide.
Moore had kidnapped and sexually assaulted a 13 yr old girl he had been holding in his apartment for a week. On the day of the shootout, the 13 yr old girl escaped while Moore was out.
The police found out about the kidnapping and got a warrant for Moore's apartment. Police executed the search warrant but Moore wasn't home. The shootout at the station happened a couple hours later.
Fox 2 Detroit
Fled and Shanks wont do shit to beef up station security. Its up to Officers to be ready and protect each other. Can you imagine the great big "what if"
(the) Detroit Commander was lazy and carrying a snub ? Carry a real gun at the desk and put the snub in its place...on the ankle as a back-up. Another huge "what if". What if Henny Penny was behind the desk unarmed ?
Not to worry the fop will issue a safety grievance to correct the issue. It will be corrected after the city purchases comfy beds arrestees.
In the 008th district our guns can't be secured in a lock box because they are all broke. How freaking sad is that, we cant properly secure our weapons in a new facility. Hope nobody gets hurt because of this being something so easy to fix.
I can think of at least two times this HAS happened in Chicago when an armed offender approached the desk crew with a firearm intent on killing a p.o. It happened once in 001 (not sure what year but in last ten years) and in 003 in 2007.
Just drove past 007 in the past month. 007 parking lot is still unsecured after a police officer was killed there in 2010 (RIP Thor).
But boy, one cuss word to a hood rat and the heat from IAD will be on you faster than cockroaches in a crackhouse.
Be safe.
It's good to see a boss who goes to the gunfire and fights back . . . unlike some bosses who run the other way when they hear gunfire.
Would someone, on the command staff, be kind enough to show this to Penny Trahanas? If someone walked into the 11th district station, hell-bent on murdering police officers, those officers forced to be in the death trap, known as the POD room, would have no cover and would certainly be fatalities. She has chosen to use a room, by her own design and restructuring, which makes police officers completely vulnerable to attack, to solely satisfy her micro-managing traits and her overall contempt and distrust of police officers in general. She could have chosen a safer room, such as the room which is not utilized in the basement, next to the radio room. But she couldn't care less about the safety and wellbeing of her subordinates, and has said so.
That is a straight convict motherfucker who doesn't give a Shit about death, I hate to be that copper that alway's tell people stop being complacent on this job, this incident should serve notice to superman coppers who think Shit like this wont happen whether working the desk or anywhere at that, there are different types of perps but one stands out the most, that's a a Convict they don't give a fuck. Please be safe out there
I can not imagine if I were killed on duty because of safety issues that are known by the department. If I were killed at the front desk I don't want my children to know that I could have lived if there was some bullet proof glass or a simple lock put on a door.
you said "perps".HA.
I like what the officer said at the end of the presentation. That they want to release the video to show the public what their officers went through and to gather ideas on how to prevent future incidents.
Too bad that would never happen in Chicago. The powers that be would never release the video for fear that they would suffer some blow back.
Our local media would probably edit the shit out of it to make it look like we fired on some helpless citizen.
CPD makes sure that there is no one manning our district desks. Let's use cadets!! Brilliant thinking from a formerly great police department, now just a bastion of political cronyism. Thanks, shortshanks.
It happened in 021 and at least one po died, late 60's or early 70's I think.
Anyway you want to look at it our stations, parking lots, ect are wide open and unsecured. All i can say is be prepared, be proficient with your weapon and make sure it is in excellent condition. When it comes down to it, that's all your going to have. Hate to say it, but true. This could happen to any district at any time.
A safety grievance was written for the lax front desk conditions at a district/area and we got plastic signs that say POLICE ONLY.
The grievance warned of a potential catastrophe if conditions were not improved.
Well, they did get those signs.
This department generally does not act until after a disaster strikes and then only if Federal money is available.
Daley and all of his other cronies could care less about station security. The stations are built to express a friendly inviting enviroment. Piss bums are encouraged to sleep on the floors, deranged lunatics with guns have also found them inviting. I would think the glass front design is something terrorists would consider.
I believe it happened in six some years back,still bullet holes in the old desk when I was a ppo
It's time to post a sentry in front of each district desk.
In BDU's, with a combat helmet and loaded, round chambered, shotgun. No snubs at the desk, with a flash-bang or two ready when the shit meets the fan.
Or, put a couple of orange cones in front of the desk with handwritten signs telling citizens to please leave any weapons outside.
Yea, that's more like the CPD I know. Mustn't offend any voters ya know.
How about the guys who work the desk without a gun.
(the) Detroit Commander was lazy and carrying a snub ? Carry a real gun at the desk and put the snub in its place...on the ankle as a back-up. Another huge "what if". What if Henny Penny was behind the desk unarmed ?
1/30/2011 12:32:00 AM
It looked like a full size revolver to me, not a snubby. Face it, handgun bullets are not always effective. You can shoot someone with a 357 magnum or a 45 acp several times and it just might not kill them. The desk should probably have a taser issued from now on.
Fled and Shanks wont do shit to beef up station security. Its up to Officers to be ready and protect each other. Can you imagine the great big "what if"
(the) Detroit Commander was lazy and carrying a snub ? Carry a real gun at the desk and put the snub in its place...on the ankle as a back-up. Another huge "what if". What if Henny Penny was behind the desk unarmed ?
1/30/2011 12:32:00 AM
Read the account of what happened: the Commander grabbed the gun of the officer on the floor next to him. I'm NOT second guessing him, the guy acted like a Hero, but I don't even think he had a gun on him.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
In the 008th district our guns can't be secured in a lock box because they are all broke. How freaking sad is that, we cant properly secure our weapons in a new facility. Hope nobody gets hurt because of this being something so easy to fix.
1/30/2011 01:21:00 AM
That si true was there the other night,from an outside unit why are most of the gun safes broken? Who made the safes another daley backpocket contractor?
But I thought flower pots are more important than than the safety of our Officers.
O.K., I got another nephew who does this kind of work constructing securing buildings. Its gonna cost triple the amount projected & not come in on time, but shit, it ain't like its my money.
Enjoy the Taste this year, it's gonna be better than last year.
S/
Richard the Last
Why isn't access to every police station not protected like most pawn or jewlrey stores where people do not get in without being buzzed in first????
What is the bullshit, logical fuckery of not doing that city wide?
Buck Naked
(not a cop)
The Academy on friday nights has a bunch of questionable youths playing basketball supervised by a couple of detectives. Can't find another city facility to host this B.S. Secure facility my ass!
Whatever happened to that Secret Service high speed study of the security at CPD stations? Is it buried somewhere with the morale survey?
Why was no action taken on either, since public funds were obviously used on both?
If this ever happens here we won't have it on video. All of our new stations only have cameras that watch the P.O.s. There is not one station that has a camera in the lobby or on the front door. What the f**k kind of security is that. We don't even have cameras that watch our lots or grounds. They are there to watch us! How sad. Take care out there. Watch out for each other.
Don't worry, each new station has some great artwork that will help deflect the bullets and the bomb fragments away from you while you work the desk. I personally bought them at the Vanecko art gallery myself. Don't ever question my intent on keeping my police officers safe. I care about each one of you, I really do.
Love,
Little Dickie
Everytime I go into the 011 dist I expect something like that to happen.
Would someone, on the command staff, be kind enough to show this to Penny Trahanas? If someone walked into the 11th district station, hell-bent on murdering police officers, those officers forced to be in the death trap, known as the POD room, would have no cover and would certainly be fatalities. She has chosen to use a room, by her own design and restructuring, which makes police officers completely vulnerable to attack, to solely satisfy her micro-managing traits and her overall contempt and distrust of police officers in general. She could have chosen a safer room, such as the room which is not utilized in the basement, next to the radio room. But she couldn't care less about the safety and wellbeing of her subordinates, and has said so.
1/30/2011 02:40:00 AM
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Refuse to put yourself in danger, put it on paper. What's she going to do? I know I would tell her to bugger off.
Pray for a speedy recovery for all the wounded.
These new stations could be better designed but you safety anywhere is first up to you. Is your desk crew a well organized team looking out for each other and looking over everyone who walks in.
Are you properly armed?
Do you have radios within reach?
Only in times of special threats have we mandated that desk personal wear body armor.
Stay safe. Don't laugh at anyone who works the desk and wears body armor.
F*ck that pisses me off - that is truly one of the most disturbing things I've ever seen. A real, straight up murder attempt caught on video -- against police officers no less. Unfreakinbelievable. Got to give big congrats and thanks to DPD and their command staff for their full and honest disclosure of this incident/video in the name of transparency, so that the brotherhood of Officers across the nation can learn a thing or two from this. Get well soon officers.
017 has nothing to worry about, mealer says it the desk sgt job and anderson locks himself in his office real men!
You're not going to change the CPD.
You can change your equipment, skill level, fitness and awareness.
We are on our own in a hostle work environment.
Be safe.
That "security" costs money.
Money the City dosent have.
Even if the City had it, we wouldent get it.
Chicago just keeps going with its head in the sand.
The power of prayer shall keep yahoo's like this from coming in in the 011th Dist. So sayeth Penny so sayeth the flock. I remeber in the 014th Dist. there was`a degenarate piss bum who would alway's come in frequently on midnites starting shit His name was M. Jackson this piece of shit had an arrest record of at least 10pages long, he would expose himself to people on the street, one day he walked inside a church harrased the priest and pissed on the Holy water, this is no joke this freakin guy was nuts, anyways a couple of rap sheets later they finally gave this piece of shit time, M. Jackson exposed himself to multiple people at a local bar R/o's arrived on scene and observed him holding his penial. There was a Sgt. on the desk at the time that would get on coppers in 014th for not having there shit on, you would think that some of these coppers would listen to a guy who had 39+ years on the job and had seen just about everything there is, just because your inside the Dist. doesn't mean your safe your just a sitting duck in the pound. Sgt. O if you read the blog. your are missed. they sure as hell don't mak em like you anymore.
P.S still have your gift in my pocket, it sure has come in handy.
I dont see what can be done to make the stations safer against an attack like this short of bullet proof glass enclosed front desks. I'm agains this as I see it as useless. This man was hell bent on murder and if the desk was enclosed with bullet proof glass, he would have ambushed the coppers as they exited the station. Guys, this job is dangerous, period. What we can do is not lower the lights in the lobby of the new stations on midnights which makes it harder to see the small stuff like hidden weapons, lock the doors to the back part of the sation and not prop open doors and stay frosty. Size up everyone that walks throught the front door.
for a Secret Service evaluation of building security following the unauthorized ride-along of the 13-year-old kid.
===================================
Isn't a ride-along when you sit in the car and just observe? Didn't this kid take in calls? Talk on the radio? Drive the car? ANd help with the domestic dispute?
He probably did a better job the the partner he had that day.
I'm just saying.
Unfucking believeable! God bless the Detroit officers in the gun battle and thank you for killing this asshole!
Thank you Detroit for releasing that video.
At times, our law enforcement community can be very private and I think it shows great strength on the Detriot PD to release the video.
Many prayers to u.
ITS UP TO THE DESK CREW.
MANY DESK PERSONS DONT WANT 2 B THE POLICE ANYMORE. THEY FEEL SAFE AND WARM AND LEAVE ON TIME EVERY DAY.
THEIR WEAPONS SHOULD WORK AND A VEST SHOULD BE ON. (I KNOW IT GETS STEAMY INSIDE)
THE TRIB, SUDKO, OR THE LATEST VIRAL VIDEO CAN GET U KILLED.
WATCH THE VIDEO AGAIN AND SEE WHAT THE DESK CREW WAS DOING BEFORE THE SHOTS FIRED DIDNT EVEN LOOK UP AT THE GUY WALKING TO THE DESK!
OF COURSE IF U MAKE I CONTACT U WILL HAVE TO TAKE THE REPORT...
THE UNIFORM IS A TARGET NOT A MAGICAL CAPE.
CPD has had several of its station shot up over the years. There was a group of patrolmen that tried to help the city get better protection for the men, but the brass blew them off, as usual.
These guys were all experts, so you know HQ just ignored them.
Where is that safety and security study that JPWeis commissioned the Feds to do?
And was anyone PAID to do the non-existent study?
Fled and Shanks wont do shit to beef up station security. Its up to Officers to be ready and protect each other. Can you imagine the great big "what if"
(the) Detroit Commander was lazy and carrying a snub ? Carry a real gun at the desk and put the snub in its place...on the ankle as a back-up. Another huge "what if". What if Henny Penny was behind the desk unarmed ?
1/30/2011 12:32:00 AM
--
That's easy; 011 might have an actual police commander by now.
DETROIT POLICE
Starting pay: Chicken Feed
We are next.
Think twice about lifting residency.
We if go .. who will pay taxes and whip the asshole alderman when they need it.
If you move out to Naperville Chicago politicians will tell you to piss off when you complain about local Chicago issues.
Do your time in the city in a GOOD neighborhood with a halfway decent public school for your kids. THEN, when it is time to move, sell your over inflated home to another city employee. Move out of the city and ONLY THEN retire to some place cheaper with all Republicans!!
It gives me chills watching the video, but watching that commander in that gun fight was a sight to see. Godspeed in you recovery officers.
With the shitty station security we have and allowing every diseased asshole to sleep on the lobby floor to keep warm!
It's gonna happen here folks!
Bet on it!
I have commented on this tipic before. I believe that all of the stations should be retrofitted for security. Build a wall on either side of the front entrance and make a narrower corridor that leads to the desk. Add bullet resistant glass on top of the desk and behind the desk to protest the people working there. No more warming centers. I had a good friend who was the desk sergeant in 021 in 1969 shot five times. He survived and killed the shooter. This could easliy happen again. I just do not know why the FOP does not press this issue. You cannot go into any surburban station that is not protected. You guys certainly have more to fear than then most surburban cops. TRhe new buildings are nice looking, but useless for the working police.
Anonymous said...
If this ever happens here we won't have it on video. All of our new stations only have cameras that watch the P.O.s. There is not one station that has a camera in the lobby or on the front door. What the f**k kind of security is that. We don't even have cameras that watch our lots or grounds. They are there to watch us! How sad. Take care out there. Watch out for each other.
1/30/2011 10:13:00 AM
If there are cameras in the desk area, desk crews would have to work more than 6 hours.
How can you complain about station security? They put up bubble mirrors so you can see a distorted, unclear view of a whole group of areas past any reasonable safety zone. How can you beat that??
I can think of at least two times this HAS happened in Chicago when an armed offender approached the desk crew with a firearm intent on killing a p.o. It happened once in 001 (not sure what year but in last ten years) and in 003 in 2007.
Also in 023 when old timer blasted dude with a knife at desk a few years back.
And in 001, a nut-ball did walk up to desk crew but fortunately gun misfired, wasn't shot by desk crew...
Stay safe gentlemen these savages grow bolder by the minute.
But it will probably never happen again...
How about the guys who work the desk without a gun.
1/30/2011 08:23:00 AM
You mean like S.U. who works the desk on 3rd watch in 007. She was actually called out on it and.......she claimed racism.
"In the 008th district our guns can't be secured in a lock box because they are all broke. How freaking sad is that, we cant properly secure our weapons in a new facility. Hope nobody gets hurt because of this being something so easy to fix."
The best place to secure your gun young man is your holster. Fuck the lock boxes.
.357 and .45s don't always stop somebody someone wrote? Nine times out of ten they do. You should all be carrying either .40 cal Glocks or XD's with hi cap mags or the same in .45 with the same mags. Anything less puts you at a disadvantage. No police should be carrying revolvers anymore. Technology has moved past that kind of duty weapon years ago. I guess the S&W M&Ps are good too. But that video just shows the need for hi cap weapons and nothing under .40 will do the job.
1/30/2011 03:51:00 PM:
"We if go .. who will pay taxes and whip the asshole alderman when they need it."
those who remain and nobody, just like it is now.
"If you move out to Naperville Chicago politicians will tell you to piss off when you complain about local Chicago issues."
they already do so.
apparently, you haven't had any contact, whatsoever, with your alderfuck, ever.
The Academy on friday nights has a bunch of questionable youths playing basketball supervised by a couple of detectives. Can't find another city facility to host this B.S. Secure facility my ass!
______________________
Sounds like a few less reports for everybody....
Great post incident newscast by the Chief. I hope all coppers learn something from this. Get well quick Detroit P.O.'s. Our prayers are with you.
It goes to show that you cant be lazy or inept when it comes to maintaining your pistol, or ammo selection. Keep it clean, oiled and filled with the best ammo that you can get. If you have doubts about what is good ammo, talk to a range guy. Speer Gold Dot is accepted as good Police duty ammo by many Depts. This is based on several factors. Shot placement helps too. Above all, do whatever you must to make it home to the wife and kids.
I am wondering why the brand new 023 District Station does not have a working lockup?
Why do all their prisoners still get transported to 019?
FOP, hey, are you all too busy trying to keep your jobs? This sucks! New police station! NO LOCKUP!
WTF!
Anonymous Anonymous said...
.357 and .45s don't always stop somebody someone wrote? Nine times out of ten they do. You should all be carrying either .40 cal Glocks or XD's with hi cap mags or the same in .45 with the same mags. Anything less puts you at a disadvantage. No police should be carrying revolvers anymore. Technology has moved past that kind of duty weapon years ago. I guess the S&W M&Ps are good too. But that video just shows the need for hi cap weapons and nothing under .40 will do the job.
1/30/2011 06:53:00 PM
I have .357 Magnums in my revolver. Any time you want to try and see if I can stop you let me know. Don't get to caught up in high capacity. Hit your target! You may have 15 in the mag but if you miss it don't mean shit.
Whatever happened to that Secret Service high speed study of the security at CPD stations? Is it buried somewhere with the morale survey?
Why was no action taken on either, since public funds were obviously used on both?
1/30/2011 10:06:00 AM
Even he USSS said "Fuck j-fled"!
Anonymous said...
It goes to show that you cant be lazy or inept when it comes to maintaining your pistol, or ammo selection. Keep it clean, oiled and filled with the best ammo that you can get. If you have doubts about what is good ammo, talk to a range guy. Speer Gold Dot is accepted as good Police duty ammo by many Depts. This is based on several factors. Shot placement helps too. Above all, do whatever you must to make it home to the wife and kids.
1/30/2011 09:11:00 PM
Shot placement is EVERYTHING! Fast misses do no good.
The Sig .45 cal P220 was the best police pistol made for our use until the Glock .45 cal was approved.
I have .357 Magnums in my revolver. Any time you want to try and see if I can stop you let me know. Don't get to caught up in high capacity. Hit your target! You may have 15 in the mag but if you miss it don't mean shit.
1/30/2011 10:48:00 PM
You miss the point. In the types of situations presented here, the revolver will not be enough. But you keep sticking to your theory, cowboy. Do you think you could have reloaded under stress with the guy in the video? Oh, that's right. You would have waited for that "perfect shot." Grow up and get with the times. Even the cowboys upgraded when the time came.
We if go .. who will pay taxes and whip the asshole alderman when they need it.
If you move out to Naperville Chicago politicians will tell you to piss off when you complain about local Chicago issues.
Do your time in the city in a GOOD neighborhood with a halfway decent public school for your kids. THEN, when it is time to move, sell your over inflated home to another city employee. Move out of the city and ONLY THEN retire to some place cheaper with all Republicans!!
1/30/2011 03:51:00 PM
You win the biggest idiot award. Congratulations. Do you complain about local issues to your alderman? Does he do anything for you when you do? My God, but you're stupid. I bet you vote democrat and go door to door for them. Moron.
Put a bell on the door and stay awake at the desk.
Anonymous said...
I have .357 Magnums in my revolver. Any time you want to try and see if I can stop you let me know. Don't get to caught up in high capacity. Hit your target! You may have 15 in the mag but if you miss it don't mean shit.
1/30/2011 10:48:00 PM
You miss the point. In the types of situations presented here, the revolver will not be enough. But you keep sticking to your theory, cowboy. Do you think you could have reloaded under stress with the guy in the video? Oh, that's right. You would have waited for that "perfect shot." Grow up and get with the times. Even the cowboys upgraded when the time came.
1/31/2011 06:26:00 AM
Heck, John Wayne had a 52 shot revolver and never had to reload and his bad guys always missed.
In almost every suburban police station I have been in, you have bullet resistant glass, and what I assume are armored walls. Alot of them you cannot even get into what would called a reception area without being buzzed in.
Milwaukee, same thing, with the expection that the one I was in I noticed had a gun hole on a wall offering 100 coverage of the reception area.
I was in Mil to thank a couple of guys for helping my wife when she had an accident and her car was disabled. When they found out she was a police spouse, they took care of her. Offer them the same if you ever get the chance.
Revolver vs. Hi-Cap Semi Auto...
They both have their place...
In this situation, high capacity semi-auto IS THE TICKET!
Ideally, high capacity suppressing fire to keep the mutt's head down until some officers find an opening to close on the offender and kill him.
Service Revolver?
We keep ours stoked with the hottest .357 loads (jhp & fmj)we can find to defeat vehicle borne threats/light cover as the situation may permit.
Snub?
Last ditch defensive with hot loaded soft lead hollow points for eyeball to eyeball (that means shit turned really sour really fast) encounters i.e., tearing your assailant's balls off while pulling the trigger rapidly with the muzzle in his mouth to relieve the pressure of stinkin' thinkin' on his brain.
That's what snubs are designed for... Up close, quick and dirty work.
The very unfortunate City of Chicago reality is that the same scenario WILL BE REPEATED HERE.
Not a matter of "if" anymore...
That video is a fucking nightmare.
Always easy to play MMQB, but everyone really needs to drill into their heads that the way to break an ambush is NOT to flee behind concealment, then start one arm monkey-shooting from behind a desk or trash pail.
You turn into the attack and return as much accurate fire as you can, as quickly possible. In that situation, the only thing that can counteract the element of surprise is what should be your own shooting skills being superior to that of the untrained attacker.
Again, not to mindlessly MMQB, but this is a very common tactical error that isn't adequately hammered into police officers minds, but it is hammered into the minds of overseas combat personnel in hostile areas.
Ambush = immediate return fire before concealment, fleeing, calling in support or anything else. Look at it like this; you're likely dead anyway. That is your only shot to potentially save your friends.
These new stations could be better designed but you safety anywhere is first up to you. Is your desk crew a well organized team looking out for each other and looking over everyone who walks in.
Are you properly armed?
Do you have radios within reach?
Only in times of special threats have we mandated that desk personal wear body armor.
Stay safe. Don't laugh at anyone who works the desk and wears body armor.
1/30/2011 11:45:00 AM
I couldnt agree more...desk crews are sittin ducks for a crazy fuck to carry out his bullshit and make u his victim...dont be a sheep! And I'm sorry brothers n sisters...truth is, ur not gonna be too effective when a crazy fuck storms through those doors hell bent on killing police officers...and ur behind that desk, no vest, packin a S&W Air weight or worse that u shoot once a year if that. I work citywide and see this in ALL districts from 016 to 004. Crazy fucks can be from all walks of life...so it doesnt matter if its 007 or 020!! Wear ur soft body armor people...ditch the bullshit revolvers and small cal autos...arm urself properly like your life depended on it. Shoot often...not just when u qual once a year. Detroit was lucky no officers were killed and God bless those who stood, fought and killed that worthless fuckin beast. Stay safe everyone...
I have .357 Magnums in my revolver. Any time you want to try and see if I can stop you let me know. Don't get to caught up in high capacity. Hit your target! You may have 15 in the mag but if you miss it don't mean shit.
1/30/2011 10:48:00 PM
Hey ole timer...I hear ya. But dont get defensive when a copper puts his positive advice out there for others. I agree w the guy, the threat has changed, so we must adapt as well and not be stuck in the stone age. High capacity large frame semi autos on ur hip and an AR15 and 870 within reach. That should be standard gear.
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