Apologize if Warranted
If the facts of the investigation, which is no where near done, bear out that the 55-year-old woman was accidentally killed by a round that passed through or by the assailant with the baseball bat, then the Department and City should apologize profusely to the family and engage in talks of a settlement. It's the only proper thing to do. (And to those about to go off half-cocked, we make no judgement, assess no blame, have no knowledge of the investigation - read what we wrote, not what you think you heard.....are you back already? Go back and read it again.)
That these things happen is no comfort to anyone involved. We strive to do our job well as almost every person does. No one who is sane goes to work hoping to:
That these things happen is no comfort to anyone involved. We strive to do our job well as almost every person does. No one who is sane goes to work hoping to:
- shut down an assembly line,
- destroy a set of office files,
- flood a subterranean set of tunnels that no one remembered existed,
- kill someone.
The thing is, with those first three examples, it can be fixed most of the time. Not so much with the last, but so much of what we roll up on is already out of our control. The location is where we were called to, tactical options are few, response options are limited, and decision time is infinitesimal.
For these reasons, training should be a priority for any police department. But the fact is, Chicago has been getting by on the cheap for years, decades even. Too many cops fire a mere 30 qualifying rounds a year. Training is slapdash or non-existent (we're only now running any sort of drill for a mass casualty event with the Fire Department, and from what we've heard, it runs against any existing SWAT protocol). And was either Charlie Williams, Masters Masters Masters or some other brainiac who declared it wasn't "feasible" to train every copper in the most basic anti-terror tactics. That's what passes for "leadership" nowadays.
Media people wonder about the lack of video and audio from in-car systems? Look no further than the money CPD doesn't spend on equipment, training and maintenance. Garbage in, garbage out and you have to look a lot higher than the blue shirts for that.
For these reasons, training should be a priority for any police department. But the fact is, Chicago has been getting by on the cheap for years, decades even. Too many cops fire a mere 30 qualifying rounds a year. Training is slapdash or non-existent (we're only now running any sort of drill for a mass casualty event with the Fire Department, and from what we've heard, it runs against any existing SWAT protocol). And was either Charlie Williams, Masters Masters Masters or some other brainiac who declared it wasn't "feasible" to train every copper in the most basic anti-terror tactics. That's what passes for "leadership" nowadays.
Media people wonder about the lack of video and audio from in-car systems? Look no further than the money CPD doesn't spend on equipment, training and maintenance. Garbage in, garbage out and you have to look a lot higher than the blue shirts for that.
Labels: shooting
posted by SCC at 12:03 AM
36 Comments:
Everyone to be cut trained like it or not
You mention CPD doesn't spend the money on its police. I'm wondering how much money, local and federal is allocated to police and never actually gets used for its intended purpose.
I think you hit the nail on the head. 30 rounds is hardly enough to be proficient with your firearm. I think as a result we should slow things down and not rush to go in. I know it is against our mindset but these are the time we live in. They want us shifting from a warrior to gurdian mindset. Why not give them what they want. Call swat for everything let them use their toys to deescalte a potential leathal force situation.
Training on this Department has long been a joke. City figures it is too costly to really train people. That is why they write a lot of big checks. Their idea of "training" which consists of watching a video (or having your sergeant logging you as having watched it) would be laughed out of court.
False economy.
Bur it is all worth it because of the gauranteed pension?
This makes me feel all so reassured and so safe.
Complaints about lack of money for CPD training, equipment etc, yet complain when taxes are raised in order to generate money to pay for expensive training and equipment. The pie is only so big and can only be cut so many ways. The City, County and State are for all practical purposes broke. Maybe the union could suggest to ways to solve the job related problems.
Do you know why the Navy Seals, Army Delta, Marine Corps Recon are the best? Because these bad mothrf*ckrs TRAIN their asses off!
You hit the f*ckn nail on the head again SCC, per the usual.
"...That these things happen is no comfort to anyone involved. We strive to do our job well as almost every person does. No one who is sane goes to work hoping to:
•shut down an assembly line,
•destroy a set of office files,
•flood a subterranean set of tunnels that no one remembered existed,
•kill someone
or.
•announce the wrong winner in the Miss Universe contest.
>>> And was either Charlie Williams, Masters Masters Masters or some other brainiac who declared it wasn't "feasible" to train every copper in the most basic anti-terror tactics. That's what passes for "leadership" nowadays.<<<
I don't know what Masters x3 might have said but it was Dep. Chief Charlie Williams who endeared himself at a staff meeting by saying, "It is not practical to train individual officers to respond to a terrorist attack."
Fair is fair, SCC. Yes, the city is notorious in purchasing soon-to-be obsolete equipment, but you cannot discount the active participation by some officers in destroying the equipment or otherwise making it inoperable. Those who can be found liable for such actions should face termination.
Why are there no training classes at night, for midnight officers? We work at night, so wouldn't it be sensible to have our training at night?
Well said.
It is a tragedy any way you look at it. Imagine if it were your family with a mentally challenged member and you called us. We respond and both the mental and another member of the family end up dead. Now I would be horrified, but understand that the officer had to defend himself from attack. It still wouldn't bring back the dead. Tragic. What is disgusting, however, is the way the vultures exploit this tragedy for their own gain. My family would point that out and publicly ridicule them for their disgusting behavior. These families seek to collect. There lies the difference.
About 10 years ago or so the Academy bought a interactive shoot don't shoot mobile trailer.It had numerous different scenarios which the officer would respond to. They included both armed and unarmed situations.
The training simulator also had he capability of "shooting" back at the officer with soft rubber bullets. The setup would record (video and audio) the officers response time, time between shots and other statistical information. After the session it could be visually reviewed by the staff with the officer. This was at a cost of over $250,000. Where is it, did anyone every have the opportunity to use it?
I heard it was being used for storage.....
And SWAT drives an old repainted "Brinks" truck.
The thing is, with those first three examples, it can be fixed most of the time. Not so much with the last, but so much of what we roll up on is already out of our control. The location is where we were called to, tactical options are few, response options are limited, and decision time is infinitesimal.
#########
Right on point too bad the fucking Union isn't pointing any of this out....
It was Charlie Williams who said it wasn't "feasible" to train every copper in the most basic anti-terror tactics at a 10th District staff meeting.
The little Napoleon was A4 Deputy Chief. LT SC asked about officer safety and training. CW blew up and charged at the LT. They were nose to nose, eyeball to eyeball. LT SC was sitting. That's when CW shouted those famous words into LT SC's face.
OT I'm betting a dollar that CW will be the next Soupy
The department won't pay for practice ammo How silly is that?
12/28/2015 07:26:00 AM
The trailer you are talking about was reposed due to missed payments. No joke. I did use it once and it was exactly as you described it. It was parked near the north entrance of the Academy.
Speaking about the active shooter training (I took it) it was woefully inadequate. By their own demonstrated statistics 80% of all active shooter assailants use a long gun / assault weapon. Our training dictates we confront said assailant with handguns. HELLO !!!!!
Don't forget when we recently ran out of ammunition to even shoot the yearly course! The "vendor" was not shipping because of non-payment, guess some elected friend got a contract now all is well, the envelope please!
About 10 years ago or so the Academy bought a interactive shoot don't shoot mobile trailer.It had numerous different scenarios which the officer would respond to. They included both armed and unarmed situations.
The training simulator also had he capability of "shooting" back at the officer with soft rubber bullets. The setup would record (video and audio) the officers response time, time between shots and other statistical information. After the session it could be visually reviewed by the staff with the officer. This was at a cost of over $250,000. Where is it, did anyone every have the opportunity to use it?
I heard it was being used for storage.....
That thing was great.
We need more training. You're right, the city has done everything on the cheap including trying to pass off streaming videos as a form of training. We don't need more shooting training. Obviously we are pretty good at shooting. We need the Dept to invest in a shoot-don't shoot simulator and run coppers through it on all 3 watches every 3 months. The money invested in the simulator would be nothing compared to the checks they are writing for police shootings.
12/28/2015 07:26:00 AM
Regarding that shooting training trailer.
I used it. I seem to remember a lot of IOD's with people getting hit by the rubber bullets. Maybe that's why it was gone. I thought it was a great training tool.
Retired
"...so much of what we roll up on is already out of our control. The location is where we were called to, tactical options are few, response options are limited, and decision time is infinitesimal." -- SCC
I've never heard it put better.
...and it's astonishing that it goes as well as it does in a city this size.
You really ought to put a little sidebar up near the right-hand top of the page as a constant reminder of this, and update it every now and then.
REALITY CHECK --
Year To Date --
Shot & Killed: 441
Shot & Wounded: 2529
Total Shot: 2970
Total Homicides: 498
Police-involved shootings, year to date
Shot & killed: 9
Shot & wounded: 16
Keep the simple truth constantly in front of everyone who visits here. Best thing you could do to help counteract the rumors, the mass hysteria that has gone far beyond any rational discussion of issues, the anti-police bias, and the constant twisting, distorting, and re-writing of the whole dialogue.
"Just the facts, Ma'am."
How about it?
How come mentals on dope get so aggressive?
ALL the mentals in my family act pretty calm.
I used the trailer in training once. It was good. I saw it parked and unused near the academy.
" Maybe the union could suggest to ways to solve the job related problems."
Already did Einstein, when they negotiated the purchase of 500 Police Cars and you guys voted for it. The precedent has be set.Dummies.
Why not farm out domestic related calls to mental health professionals. They can respond to calls and resolve them. In fact hire community members. Can you imagine the freed up time to solve real crimes vs my babys mamma wont leave my house or my son is causing a ruckus. Create jobs in poor communities and have the very people protesting the police resolve these issue peacefully like they think we should.
It's so simple a concept that escapes so many hard charging, real police blowhards. When you screw up, say you screwed up. We just want our "kiss the ring", juice drinking bosses to be that human but we don't want to ourselves. It goes a long way just saying "I was wrong."
Anonymous said...
Complaints about lack of money for CPD training, equipment etc, yet complain when taxes are raised in order to generate money to pay for expensive training and equipment. The pie is only so big and can only be cut so many ways. The City, County and State are for all practical purposes broke. Maybe the union could suggest to ways to solve the job related problems.
12/28/2015 01:09:00 AM
Taxes are raised to continue the graft and support the welfare class.
The pie is plenty big enough.
"I think you hit the nail on the head. 30 rounds is hardly enough to be proficient with your firearm"
If that is true it is a crime.My daughter is in Federal law enforcement,she never
fired a round until she began training.Guns were never part of her civilian life and she had trouble passing the shooting test.Prevailing, when she came home it was necessary to show proficiency here.We went to a local range and fired off 100
rounds,I remember because 40mm ammo was expensive,around 50 bucks as I remember.
I shot 5 rounds and shocked her with my 4 inch group.She fired the other 95 rounds.
She passed with flying colors.I will ask her about how many rounds she fired at training.I cannot fathom sending an officer out on the street who fired less than two clips of ammo.
About 10 years ago or so the Academy bought a interactive shoot don't shoot mobile trailer.It had numerous different scenarios which the officer would respond to. They included both armed and unarmed situations.
The training simulator also had he capability of "shooting" back at the officer with soft rubber bullets. The setup would record (video and audio) the officers response time, time between shots and other statistical information. After the session it could be visually reviewed by the staff with the officer. This was at a cost of over $250,000. Where is it, did anyone every have the opportunity to use it?
I heard it was being used for storage.....
12/28/2015 07:26:00 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha
That thing broke.
The city did not have any maintainence agreement on it.
So it never got fixed.
It was moved to the lot behind the training buildings on Troop St.
It then became a graffiti training trailer for the gang bangers.
Ultimately it was junked.
Yeah, we don't shoot enough. Thirty rounds a year is nowhere near enough. The department has been half stepping on training for years, and we all know it. I am not a "gun guy" but take some of your uniform allowance money, buy some ammo and go to a private range and practice. I do, and you should too. I have bills, kids, tuitions, a wife who was a stay at home mom, elderly parents to care for and side jobs to work also, so don't cry about how busy you are. Some practice might save your career or even your life.
Update:
My daughter told me she fired over 1,000 rounds during training.
even now they fire about 400.
Post a Comment
<< Home