Monday, August 08, 2016

Video Review - The Law

Lots of ignorant comments going on. The family and their "spokes-asshole" who is facing numerous felony counts himself, along with their bottom-feeding lawyer, who is looking to pollute a potential jury pool and provoke some sort of racial incident to scare the city into settling, are throwing a lot of brickbats around without any regard for actual law.

So let's read the actual relevant portion of the Illinois Compiled Statute:
  • (720 ILCS 5/7-5)(from Ch. 38, par. 7-5)

    Sec. 7-5. Peace officer's use of force in making arrest.

    (a) A peace officer, or any person whom he has summoned or directed to assist him, need not retreat or desist from efforts to make a lawful arrest because of resistance or threatened resistance to the arrest. He is justified in the use of any force which he reasonably believes to be necessary to effect the arrest and of any force which he reasonably believes to be necessary to defend himself or another from bodily harm while making the arrest. However, he is justified in using force likely to cause death or great bodily harm only when he reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or such other person, or when he reasonably believes both that:

    (1) Such force is necessary to prevent the arrest from being defeated by resistance or escape; and

    (2) The person to be arrested has committed or attempted a forcible felony which involves the infliction or threatened infliction of great bodily harm or is attempting to escape by use of a deadly weapon, or otherwise indicates that he will endanger human life or inflict great bodily harm unless arrested without delay.
Notice, there are two parts to the law. This is an important distinction. They are separated by the word "or." The first part is pretty straightforward:
  • he is justified in using force likely to cause death or great bodily harm only when he reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or such other person
This is what we would refer to as "defense of self or another." Someone points a gun at you, you can shoot them. Someone points a gun at someone else, you can shoot them, regardless (and this is important) of where you are standing. This part alone justifies the initial shots. He was defending his partner in the path of danger (we're discussing State Law)

The second part of the law is a bit more complicated, because the situation has to fulfill two separate distinctions (we have highlighted the words "both" and "and"):
  • he reasonably believes both that:

    (1) Such force is necessary to prevent the arrest from being defeated by resistance or escape; and

    (2) The person to be arrested has committed or attempted a forcible felony which involves the infliction or threatened infliction of great bodily harm or is attempting to escape by use of a deadly weapon, or otherwise indicates that he will endanger human life or inflict great bodily harm unless arrested without delay.
This is a freeze frame of what the first two officers saw (driver body camera):



So the question becomes, "Does this fulfill the requirements of State Law?"
  • Is the car thief attempting to defeat the arrest by resistance or escape?
Sure looks like it. He's in a 3,000 pound hunk of metal, plastic and rubber moving at a speed that will defeat any attempt at arrest.
  • Is the person committing or attempting to commit a forcible felony which involves the infliction or threatened infliction of great bodily harm or attempting to escape by use of a deadly weapon, or otherwise indicates that he will endanger human life or inflict great bodily harm unless arrested without delay?
That's a big "yes." A car is a deadly weapon. He's using it as a ram. He just missed hitting the driver. That's Aggravated Assault. See all that underlining we did there? That's where the actions of the car thief meet or exceed the threshold for the use of deadly force per State Law to a reasonable person. The thief had already been taunting the officers in Area South by pulling over, fleeing, then returning to be chased again. There's no reason to think he'd stop before he ran into someone - maybe a cyclist riding a Divvy bike, a grandmother walking home from grocery shopping, a child crossing the street.

Again, it was his actions that provoked the response.

Tomorrow, we'll go over Department Policy.

Labels:

151 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

If these guys hire Dan Herbert, I hope they show this to him. That guy never seems to win.

8/08/2016 12:09:00 AM  
Anonymous IN THE KNOW said...

.....he is justified in using force likely to cause death or great bodily harm only when he reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or such other person, or when he reasonably believes both that:......
------------------------------------------------------------

What difference does it make? (borrowing a phrase from one of our Presidential Candidates)

People are so wild and blind with hatred, you cannot shove the law in their face and expect them to read it.

Paul has become "Travonitized" - no matter what you say or show, he is the victim who needs "justice".

And "justice" is a big, fat paycheck.




8/08/2016 12:20:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

They say change the policy , how about stop commiting crimes that's the most important policy criminals need to change themselves!!!

8/08/2016 12:20:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This may keep them out of jail as I fist stated , but they will lose their jobs for violating numerous department policies ,,,,,,end of story. That and their tactics wer garbage

8/08/2016 12:27:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

So this upstanding citizen engaged in several chases with police in residential areas in a stolen car attempts to hit police officers with car , the actually strikes police vehicle head on and flees leading to his demise. I can't wait for the toxicology report to come on this p.o.s. to come out showing he had drugs in his system. Then the community can allege character assassination, instead of seeing the danger this p.o.s was to society. It is unbelievable the lack of perspective, logic , and reasoning these people have

8/08/2016 12:33:00 AM  
Anonymous Father Rich said...

BRAVO!!! Well said and thank you! These kids need to read and hear stuff like this! Thank u scc for breaking down what Nobody, including the department brass will say to the media. The support needs to swing back in their direction. Thank you.

8/08/2016 12:34:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

While they may stay out of prison. Their jobs are all toast. They violated numerous department policies. And quite frankly after watching that video and it being released........anyone in their right mind would drop a slip the minute the were assigned the passenger of the 1st vehicle. Most unsfafe officer I have seen in a while. Riding with drawn pistol to a stolen car. And any drive whe wants to put me in harms way and go head on with a stolen car needs to be slapped. Let's up that stupidity by getting out of the car and stand in the oncoming stolen vehicles path.



Do us all a favor and fire em

8/08/2016 12:57:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The legality of the shots fired in the street is clear. The PO was within the law when he fired. That fact is indisputable in my opinion. This changes nothing however when discussing if he should have fired. It is just as clear that he should not have fired. The lack of proper training is PROBABLY what lead to such a poor decision. Regardless of this, does any PO want to be in his line of fire the next time deadly force is legally allowed?

8/08/2016 01:15:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

C'mon. you know that the law has nothing to do with this. If they had any regard for the law whatsoever, they wouldn't be on the wrong side of it in the first place.

8/08/2016 01:16:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I wonder when the state is gonna take the use of any force of at all to secure an arrest or defeat the ability of one attempting to flee an arrest by a peace officer--- stay tuned, it coming in 5 or 10 years

8/08/2016 01:32:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Bravo, sirs. God bless CPD. - a citizen.

8/08/2016 01:38:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Department policy IS NOT state law.

Department policy DOES NOT care about officer safety or fighting crime.

Department policy IS all about civil liability for the city.

You ARE expendable.

Remember that the next time you want to be proactive.

Stay safe stay employed stay out of jail
STAY FETAL

8/08/2016 01:39:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Good law review scc. Why aren't our leaders and or fop making statements regarding the above. First thing out of their mouths p.o.'s are stripped pending investigation. Then they wonder why moral is at a ALL TIME LOW. I've never seen it this bad.

8/08/2016 01:42:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Squad,the Asshole just went flying by us! Squad put us down going to our Lunch Location"

8/08/2016 02:03:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

SCC, I do not know who you people are, but I have
seen the future, and this is it! After Chareleston thug
Life folded, I realized the resources it takes, my hats
Off to you guys/gals at SCC!!

http://upstream-ideas.com/upstream-ideas/ideas/faisal-khan-expects-forthcoming-criminal-prosecutions-of-current-city-pols

Not to take away from the subject, but if some thug evading police would
have crashed head on into me, I would have started shooting
While inside the car, right thru the windshield. But I digress....

Have any of you guys seen this link I am posting?

Watch the video at the bottom and tell me Im full
Of shit, but does this not make sense?

Stay safe, God Bless!!!!!

8/08/2016 02:06:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

O'Neal looks like he's in the Tribune photo of Green punching Devereux

8/08/2016 02:30:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

All 100% correct SCC and very well written. The question always becomes in this modern age of policing, does any of it really matter? We're damned if we do and damned if we don't. Screw the law because the mob wants "justice" for this piece of shit car thief. To hell with the facts and the truth because the mob wants blood. I for one am glad I'm in the last third of my career and not just starting out in this circus. If I could retire tomorrow I most definitely would.

It's a shame that a blogger has to point out the law and the facts while the FOP remains silent and the CPD brass quotes department policy and helps drive the bus over every officer involved.

If you haven't gone "fetal" yet, now would be a good time.

8/08/2016 03:57:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Nice analysis.

8/08/2016 05:01:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thank you SCC for the clarification. You're still appreciated.

8/08/2016 05:02:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This was more than just a hot car boys and girls. They've been using high end cars in shootings citywide, all stolen from the burbs and brought back to the southeast side. They ride in tandem, one car with the guns and shooters, the other is the bait car. These po's probably thought this was one of them, my guess is they were right for the most part, but they chased the bait car instead of the shooters.

That's why Jr. Had his rod out.

8/08/2016 05:15:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

SCC, how can department water down a state law already on the books? where does it start. who enacts it. and why is it not challenged in courts. i know it is chicago and most crap the city council pulls nowadays barely raises an eyebrow around here. help the class out. not a cop.

8/08/2016 05:19:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Tom Epach is the lawyer these guys should contact

8/08/2016 05:44:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yea, and if you would have remained F E T A L You wouldnt be in this FUCKED UP situation would you ????? This aint no joke boys and girls, P.O.s are being indited and put in jail because of Black Lies Matter and this joke of a mayor is pandering to these assholes to keep his own job . So listen up and stay fetal or else. You hve been warned for months now but ????????

8/08/2016 06:18:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The City of Chicago does not care about state laws

8/08/2016 06:18:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Just remember we will have a new states attorney [police hater] come november,stay fetal my friends!

8/08/2016 06:29:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Finally!!!!! Thank You

8/08/2016 06:45:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Seems like the media nowadays conditions the public to be numbed by the criminal behavior and button-pressed to be 'outraged' by the justified actions. Every headline begins; Police shoot black male trying to pass by them in a car! Every attempt is shrunk to leave out specifics, like, 'run them over in a stolen car.' No, the facts must be searched. All criminal behavior is expected of the blacks, yet the media wants the outrage directed instead at the targets. I stopped turning on the news today and I don't mean a thing. Perhaps 'news' stations will get the message when their ratings are invisible.

8/08/2016 06:47:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Good luck explaining all of this to Lori Lightfoot and the Police Board....

8/08/2016 06:52:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Nice touch you break the law down well.

But sadly the Clouted and RAHM-a-GHOUL have a boat load of tax money to throw people under the bus. Most officers have NO CASH on hand for a high end lawyer to fight the City.

FOP is OK but do you want OK when some ass hat state attorneys will be coming into office trying to make a name for herself.

Chasing cars , firing a weapon are really a high end gambles on your freedom and your families financial well being.

And special ED really needs to put that lazy exempt in Media affairs to work. I would be damned to be made a fools of by a bunch of clowns who are paid to protest.

8/08/2016 07:06:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thank you SCC. Well written and said again. Thankfully you are speaking the truth when nobody else in the media is doing it.

While I'm at it...

To RAHM and EDDIE: a You guys are looser assholes. We know you are reading the SCC blog. Resign. Both of you please.

8/08/2016 07:11:00 AM  
Blogger 19thWardBoy said...

Its beyond me why anyone would want the job of a Chicago Cop.
You would have to be absolutely nuts to sign up for it.
If your already on the job, I agree with the previous posts, stay fetal and go home to your family.
A stolen car is not worth your life or freedom !!

8/08/2016 07:14:00 AM  
Blogger The Keesing Bandit said...

Deano has been strangely silent, hasn't he?

8/08/2016 07:18:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Where was the forcible felony? Aggravated assault isn't a forcible felony. Aggravated battery is but when they shot at him did he commit agg batt yet? PSMV is not a forcible felony. The Illinois General Assembly created a list of what precisely is a forcible felony and I don't think ONeal committed one to satisfy that element of the statute. Sorry

8/08/2016 07:20:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

SCC you would make a great Lawyer. Job well done.

8/08/2016 07:26:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Our superintendent told Lamon Reccord that he wanted to put all black officers In black neighborhoods. Hey superintendent is that a racist remark. Do you hate whites, Hispanics, Asians, etc? What if McCarthy or Weis said they wanted only white officers in white neighborhoods? Why isn't the EEOC looking into this? This is discrimination against whites, Hispanics, Asians,etc. Is this who is leading our department? What is your response to this Rahm? You hired this bigot.

8/08/2016 07:45:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Your analysis of the law is correct and a fair judge [if indictments come down] would agree, but we aren't dealing with a fair judge when it comes to public perception and and media persecution.

I've been retired ten years now so I can't speak for what is taught in the Academy now but we were taught not to argue with a drunk or a nutcase. Why? Because it would just plain and simple, be a case of futility. They'll talk in circles with you for hours. You either roust the ghetto gouster drunk from in front of the store or you just lock him up. The nutjob you take to Jackson Park Hospital and he/she is in their care then. But don't argue;it's pointless.

Well, the public perception and media bias that is so oblivious to the law are the equivalents of drunks and nutjobs. The difference? Our hands are tied since talking is meaningless and we can't cart them off to jail or Jackson Park.

The moral of the story is to STAY FETAL!

8/08/2016 07:54:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sure glad you posted the law SCC..

They will lose the job but not their freedom, based on the politically correct.

Now how far do the Democrats go to let these protestors keep kicking the police in the face and disrupting traffic, trespassing, verbal assaults' and other crimes in their quest for Justice ?

Bring the busses to the next rally, and lock these fucks up as soon as one foot goes in the street !

By the way Paulie the felon, acted out so he could get Ed-Jmal. cell phone number !

8/08/2016 07:59:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Although this shooting may technically be within state law guidelines and even Dept. guidelines when you consider the affirmation of life policy but any decent copper could point out a dozen issues with this shooting. The offender's actions and poor life choices ultimately caused his death but this shooting was reckless, probably unnecessary and certainly was not good police work. This shooting highlights the Department's lack of proper firearm training and poor recruit / FTO training. I hope the DOJ is paying attention.

8/08/2016 08:02:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This country has taken a turn to justifying crime. It's ok to steal, attempt to kill police officers, if you die because of your own actions you are now a symbol and we pay your family millions because you chose a life of crime. This country use to be about work hard to get ahead, now it's about ; become a criminal and your family will be taken care of, like terrorists. The liberals attitude is commit crimes ,we will stand behind you. When has it become ok to glorify criminals in this country? We are doomed. We do need a change, a republican change. We need an over haul of the justice system and attorneys need to be held to higher standards and not bottom feeder status. They need to be held accountable for their words and their lies they tell everyday in court and to the media.

8/08/2016 08:07:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

How many officers have been stripped lately......uh, we are a little short on manpower.
Can they at least put them in the front office of trade with someone at 35th street....we need police on the STREET!

8/08/2016 08:09:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Attempt Murder not Aggravated Assault

8/08/2016 08:14:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And the offender made absolutely no effort or attempt to stop, slow down or redirect the path of the vehicle when the officer was directly in front of him. The only skid marks on this crime scene were in special Ed's adult diaper.

8/08/2016 08:19:00 AM  
Blogger MTS said...

I'm so sick of this fucking job. I am so glad I'm under the 12 month mark. Why people are still lining up for this job simply amazes me especially after the passage of CCW here.

8/08/2016 08:22:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

ot -
I hope someone monitors the activists fb pages. The march last night Glo Boy Lo-Lo was fb live and he's got one broad ( Anne Marie Knisely All they are talking about on the scanner is trying to contain you guys from moving east to west.) that listens to the scanner and lets him know what the police are doing as the march is going along.

8/08/2016 08:26:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Oh Great - Now you have to put the law in front of the community's feelings?

Next thing you know, you'll expect the community members to follow the law


8/08/2016 08:26:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And here is where Anne Marie Knisely says on fb she works: Federal Defender Program United States District Court for the Northern District of Illinois

8/08/2016 08:27:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

These Officers more than likely will not go to jail, but their Police Jobs are done, turn in your stars!

In hindsight, this will turn out to be a good thing for them and their families because this job and this liberal city really SUCKS! It is NOT like it used to be!

Chicago is going to have a real hard time to find people to take Police Jobs, for sure! For what happens out here, the pay SUCKS, and the city is eliminating benefits where possible, i.e. retire health insurance for starters, cut backs in tuition!

I tell everyone I know, don't take any Police tests and find something else to make a living at! I would NOT allow my son to take the Chicago Police test!

I can't wait to retire myself, so until then everything is a 19-Paul to me!

KMA Da Pelon 20+ years!

8/08/2016 08:33:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

While they may stay out of prison. Their jobs are all toast. They violated numerous department policies. And quite frankly after watching that video and it being released........anyone in their right mind would drop a slip the minute the were assigned the passenger of the 1st vehicle. Most unsfafe officer I have seen in a while. Riding with drawn pistol to a stolen car. And any drive whe wants to put me in harms way and go head on with a stolen car needs to be slapped. Let's up that stupidity by getting out of the car and stand in the oncoming stolen vehicles path.



Do us all a favor and fire em

8/08/2016 12:57:00 AM

You might get flamed for your comments, but I am in complete agreement with you. I waa once headed straight at a car the tact team was "following" after its occupants let a few rounds go. Long story short the car drove right past me after I moved out of the cars way after I realized its driver wasn't going to stop. Tact guys were asking why I didn't hit the car to stop him. Who in their right mind would intentionally cause a head-on accident?

8/08/2016 08:33:00 AM  
Blogger Cuthbert J. Twillie said...

But..but..but...that law is *Unfair*.
And---it's Racist :-)

8/08/2016 08:35:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I've said this a couple of times and its worth saying it again. I'm retired and seeing what is going on during shooting incidents, tells this old ranger if involved in a justified shooting you might think about just leaving the scene.

8/08/2016 08:46:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anyone still doing this kind of shit is a fool. I'd say go past being "fetal" and look for work elsewhere if your young enough. Go live in a nice suburb, on a nice suburban Dept., with a pension that will actually still be around when you retire. GTFOH! Chicago is a gangster ran shit hole.

8/08/2016 08:51:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Oppenheimer is the lowest of the low.
All of the bullshit that he spews is designed to inflame and enrage the low information, BLM types he's catering to.
All with the hopes of enhancing the payout in the ghetto lottery that he's playing.

8/08/2016 08:53:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The law? Common sense? Your training guided by experience? What difference does it make? All that matters is that these coppers shot a black youth running away and they are fucked, whether they eventually get off or not. All this explanation justifying it is just what is technically called a 'circle-jerk.'

It is totally and completely clear what the City wants and how you should be working the job. The only running you should be doing is away from the crime scene. The only General Orders and Statutes you need to study are those involving your Medical Roll procedures and benefits, days off, holidays and vacations, and the requirements for getting a disability pension hopefully leading to a retirement pension. The Real Reverend Al has psychic ability and knows what is good for you.

8/08/2016 08:59:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Not in any way trying to justify the actions of the asshole, SCC, but this whole thing about the PO's being lethally threatened by the oncoming car confuses me a bit and wondering if you can clarify? The PO on the passenger side did not appear to be in the path of the stolen car, correct? So the only thing that justified his use of lethal force were the actions of the PO driver? If the driver had remained in the vehicle, would lethal force have been justified? What constitutes the beginning of a lethal threat? Was it a lethal threat when the oncoming car was a half block away? If not, when did it become one?

Crashing head-on into the second car seems clearly a lethal threat, especially since the asshole seemed to hesitate before aiming for the patrol car.

8/08/2016 09:01:00 AM  
Anonymous The Neanderthal said...

"The thief had already been taunting the officers in Area South by pulling over, fleeing, then returning to be chased again."

Crime As Sport -- which, if the BLM crowd gets its way, will have no consequences whatsoever.

"We need to get away from the "punitive paradigm,'" they say.

Maybe we need a Running Of The Bulls here, as part of some colorful city festival. Give them room to work off some of these Basic Impulse Control problems. "We jus' clownin" until they get mashed against a brick wall, trampled, tossed thirty feet in the air, or gored in-one-side-and-out-the-other.

Ole'!

8/08/2016 09:05:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Under certain circumstances I would also be thinking about leaving after a justified type shooting incident. If your the victim and that's the point, the victim leaves the scene, what law are you breaking. I've heard obstruction of justice and so on. This is not a traffic accident where you are required to identify the driver and produce an insurance card etc.... There are no such rules in an act of self defense. If I read this correctly, it states, you are justified in the use of deadly force and the reasons. There's nothing stating you most stay on the scene or anything about identifying yourself. Nothing stating after the exercise of the use of deadly force and you remaining on the scene.

8/08/2016 09:06:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

As I said, these cameras are mounted with a wider-angle lens that introduces some distortion -- close objects look larger and farther-away objects look smaller -- and, crucially, they often do not show the ofc.'s actual line of sight -- the sight picture that he is seeing and the presence of others in his peripheral vision, of whom he very well may be aware.

This must be considered.

8/08/2016 09:17:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

If this guy had been pointing a gun at people, taunting people with a gun, firing a shot at an officer in his way, would another officer have the right to use deadly force?

The fact that this maniac was using a car, with the potential to cause multiple deaths over a wide area, changes the argument how?

Guns are bad. Cars are good? A gun is nothing but a piece of metal till you put it under the control of an maniac

Perhaps we should just say that car theft is no longer a crime. Perhaps the reckless destruction of property should no longer be a crime. Perhaps the root of all are troubles is that officers try to protect lifes and property in a society that no longer values either

8/08/2016 09:23:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

HONOR CULTURE – respond to insult, slight, violations of right by self-help violence. Honor cultures exist where the rule of law is weak. In honor cultures, people protect themselves through a reputation for swift violence.

DIGNITY CULTURE – persons, property & rights are defended by recourse to third parties, usually courts, that, if necessary, wield violence on their behalf. Dignity cultures practice tolerance and are much more peaceful than honor cultures.

VICTIM-HOOD CULTURE – people are encouraged to respond (swiftly and violently) as in honor culture but they must appeal for help to powerful others, including administrative bodies, to whom they must make the case that they have been victimized. This gives rise to an intense effort to identify oneself as a fragile and aggrieved victim. Many ways of attracting the attention emphasize or exacerbate the low status of the aggrieved. Frequently the response of the accused is to assert that they are victims as well. It is common for felons to proclaim their victimization contributed to their illegal actions. Victims can be excused for victimizing others when the harm is done in service of their own victimization.

- Campbell & Manning “Microaggression & Moral Cultures”, as summarized by Black Pigeon Speaks via YouTube channel

8/08/2016 09:36:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

No sympathy for the asshole car thief!! NONE!! At the sametime, the po's chasing cars, shooting in residential areas like it's dodge city, they get what they get! No sympathy for them either! They placed as many people in danger as the idiot criminal did! Don't steal cars & bad things won't happen to you! Don't violate a ton of go's, chase cars, or fire shots that can strike other po's or the general public and bad things won't happen to you.

8/08/2016 09:40:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

What the law says and how it applies to Chicago/Cook County and the rest of the state is two different horses. If this case were to go to trial in a criminal or civil court the officer(s) could never find a jury that is not tainted.

Problem with state law and department orders/policy, is when state law sets you free and department orders/policy finds you culpritble, resulting in the department suspending you and moving to fire you, thus setting the stage for a civil suit.

Justice for the black community is code for revenge. Even when the justice system plays out fairly as we have seen with Brown and Gardner, the community still wants justice, I mean revenge, as the community wants nothing less than to see the cops, any cop, behind bars. Even the DOJ could find nothing wrong in the Brown and Gardner cases, yet the community still wants revenge, I mean justice.

Training? When was the last time at a roll call any sergeant, lieutenant, or watch commander conducted training on these shootings or other incidents so officers better understand where they stand regarding state law, city ordinances, department policy/orders and the relevancy of applicable case law? Training videos cannot answer questions or carry on a robust debate.

God save this nation and those officers because you know for damn sure the politicians and department won't.

8/08/2016 09:43:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This ought to be a no-brainer.

sad that this is being debated.

The CPD acted in a manner that any normal thinking person would agree with.

Best wishes, support and prayers go out to the CPD.

-citizen

8/08/2016 09:50:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The silence of the F.O.P. for years has been deafening. This goes back to a department severely understaffed,under trained and without support from our Union PAID to guide and represent us. It's time for us to radically change our course and that starts this Saturday. You can't be abused if you don't show up, and collectively it could shut the whole day down. Bud Billiken is going to be an Anti Police hate fest designed to create conflict to further the Anit Police rhetoric. Watch it live on T.V. as they try and scramble to open the streets without police and T.M.A'S. Watch the bottles and shots fly as an out of control tribe eats itself and is forced to ask for intervention from those it hates. Now is the time to make a statement. We are being scapegoated as a cause of a whole cultures woes when in effect we are a just a biproduct.

8/08/2016 09:50:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Department Rules and Regulations are more restrictive than State Law. You knew that, right?

8/08/2016 10:01:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Retraining the police....

Now let me see if I have this right.

There's no guidance or discipline in the home.
The family situation is so unstable; 'Junior' doesn't even know where to send a Father's Day card.
Junior gets dumped into the education system where he is socially promoted because the overwhelmed school district can't deal with the undisciplined whelp.
Junior's major formative influences are 'gangsta' rap videos and a corresponding peer group of gangsta wannabes.
At age 18, Junior is turned loose on society carrying a bad attitude, a broken compass and no respect for authority.
Junior gets himself in big trouble with the law because he is illiterate, unskilled, unemployable and his only source of income other than Government assistance is illegal and meets dire consequences.

Then, the situation diagnosis is that the police need more training, compassion, sensitivity and understanding?

Pardon me for asking, but do you really believe this BULLSHIT?

8/08/2016 10:06:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"FUCK Y'AWLS LAW!"

>SCREEECH!<
"HAAA! Bitch-Ass Po-leece can't catch us man!
WHOOOOO!"
>Bang! Crunch!<
"WHOOOOO! Dis shit FUUUNN!"
>SCREEE-BAM!<
"WHOOOOO!"
>Sound of Running Feet<

Please feel free to dub in the usual
and normally expected incoming/outgoing
gunfire and the metallic ping of bullets
perforating car bodies per the usual
stupidity that plays out on the West and
South sides.

Said stupidity now gratuitously spilling over
into neighborhoods where people have never
had to entertain such.

It's by Rahm's design...
Who would've thought "Sticking It In The Cops Ear"
would have such sustained and far reaching
consquences?

Rahm, for all his alleged "acumen,"
surely did not...

No worries, some low level propeller-head whiz kid
shit-stirrer/provocateur P/R flack - Rahm Youth will
bite the cyanide capsule for Rahm's greater glory
and triumph over the angry rabble at CPD.

Meanwhile, he continues to fleece the motherloving
shit out of taxpaying areas that have had much
taken from them and given to Rahm's campaign
contributors and the noisy West and South side
shit-birds.

"Give US more of y'all money or we gon'
be mad at y'all an' shit..."

What's the score now?
An undercover sissy sociopath as mayor.

A thick-headed, inarticulate, intellectually
disinterested, morally bereft buffoon as
Police Siuperintendent.

A scolding, prissy & repressed, broom-riding,
perennial top cop job chasing crone whose
only claim to "police administrator" fame is
illegally/unjustifiably screwing Policemen in
the clay-pipe because she thinks that will get
her to her goal that much faster?

Yeah... This "thing" is in charge of training
and accountability. The fates are cruel. No?

She needs a diversion...
Is j-fled available?


A coddled and taken care of exempt echelon that's
devoid of any common sense or any real Police experience.

Desperately trying their damndest to be seen as doing
"something" to "make" the blue-shirted rabble "do something"
other than common sense, survival oriented, legitimate and
legal, mandatory minimum Policing.

Respond.
Report.
Relocate.

Anything in addition is just plain foolish
and flies in the face of common sense.

Unless it's for the working and taxpaying areas
of this city and they're giving less of a fuck about
the fate of Policing and Policemen because Rahm's
effort to separate Policemen from the good will of
these people has more or less been successful.

Everything jacked through the roof then point
the finger of blame at The Police instead of
having Corp. Council gin up a strategem to
have Crime King Shorty's ass sitting in the
defendant's chair and giving compelled
testimony under oath.

8/08/2016 10:06:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Attention. attention: do not chase stolen cars!!

8/08/2016 10:08:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why hasn't the FOP made a single statement? Why is Dean the president if he won't stand up for the members?

8/08/2016 10:22:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

If the poor youth in the stolen car would have struck a black woman with a baby stroller crossing the street killing them both, does anyone think the "community" would care? Protests downtown? Political fallout? We all know the answer. BLM only sometimes.

8/08/2016 10:29:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

All in all, the result was Civic Improvement.

8/08/2016 10:35:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

A reasonable non-affiliated judge would agree.
But a pandering mayor and racist superintendent are not reasonable folks.
Taking everything into a reasonable account, who started the whole incident, reacted violently to the entire escape and contributed to his own demise without any regard for others?
All he had to do is stop the car and get his ticket, sit 3 hrs. in a cell (a place he's been before), and then go free with an I-Bond (as he's done before). But your big mouth bass political hacks think otherwise.
Jugg Head Ed stated at his news conference that he "will hold all those responsible" for their actions.
I don't believe he was speaking of Jaguar Oneel.

Who wants to work for this butt plug?

8/08/2016 10:37:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

What happened to "Broken Windows Crime Fighting" where stopping the car theft prevents the much larger shooting/crash/personal injuries from happening..

Oh wait that's right CPD policy is to not chase stolen cars. Broken Windows sending a message that laws matter does not apply in this case.

Broken Windows is only for things like ANOV's and parking tickets on the poor saps living paycheck to paycheck. Suckers. Where the easy money is.

Police are just strong arm revenue collectors for the politicians in the eye's of many of the citizens. Report takers, crime scene tape hangers.

Don't play that car stereo too loud they'll impound your ride to work!

I digress.

If you take this situation and replace the man with the badge with a concealed carry holder he gets 20 years hands down.

However in this day and age of intent matters even the President with count after count of laws being broken with regards to national security she has impunity.

He/She didn't intend to do it they made him/her (fill in the blank)

Let's not put the blame on someone else or wait for someone in a position of power to do something. It's up to the individual to create the world they want to live in. There is no one else there's us.

Tolerate the incompetent merit hires and promotions, the lack of training. Look the other way to just get along to collect a paycheck and everyone pays the price in the long run.

Want the respect and trust of the people?

Up the ethics, morals, standards get rid of the good ol' boy network with disparate rules.

8/08/2016 10:40:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

scc;

When a protestor is in the face of the police shouting, is this a violation of law and if so, what one ?

Thanks

8/08/2016 10:41:00 AM  
Blogger Caribbean Chic said...

Great law review!!!!!! SCC should do a news channel on you tube.

8/08/2016 10:58:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

We are being portrayed as the main problem in the Black Community and need a complete 360 degree pivot. This Sat will offer a platform for every Politician,Activist,Rapper and other assorted scumbags to bash us for their 5 mins of fame on the 10 o'clock news. To change the argument you need to refocus the attention back to where it belongs which is the absolute terrible behavior being exhibited in the Black Community by its young men and how Black America condones the slow motion genocide by them in its own neighborhoods. As a Sgt the safety of my men is most important and why I am in complete agreement with the movement to give away Bud Billiken to its own devices and watch the ensuing chaos and pick up the pieces on Mon or Tues.

8/08/2016 11:06:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

if this is how we treat criminals in our society

how is the CHICAGO POLICE DEPARTMENT going to treat ISIS participants committing a crime or just committed a crime?

this is why we had to people shot and killed both head shots at two different locations 1300 block W. Hastings St and 800 block N. Cambridge St both in the presence of security cameras and police presence in the immediate area-go figure!

8/08/2016 11:07:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

when shit hits the fan I wonder how many super cops are 100% remember we are human-room for error!

8/08/2016 11:10:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I disagree with cynics out there, the law is very clear in this case, the shooting was justified, I don't see this going to trial...if somehow it does, we might as well let Chicago go the way Detroit did...and worse.
The press/tv coverage of this is total garbage, looking from the outside you might think that an upstanding, model citizen was hunted down and killed by cops.

8/08/2016 11:19:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

OT

Aug 8, still no direction from the department on what to do with cannabis arrests. This is what you get when the unqualified get jobs in positions where knowing what you are doing is a requirement. Hello to the ladies that are in well over their heads in research and development and legal affairs!

8/08/2016 11:29:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Has anyone tried to have a legit conversation with any of these morons at protests? These idiots don't care about state law or consequences of actions. Don't Forget alot of this inept crowd still think Tupac was a CIA hit.

8/08/2016 11:45:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

officers actions were justified and in compliance with State Staute,Only problem is this is CHICAGO the most corrupt city in America.It will be in a Chicago court packed by political hacks and dummycrats.

8/08/2016 11:47:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Being a criminal is a dangerous business.

8/08/2016 11:53:00 AM  
Blogger Patrick Aherne said...

In regards to Federal Case law, as set forth by the US Supreme Court, the officers are justified in using deadly force to stop a fleeing felon using a vehicle in a manner that endangers the public. See Scott v. Harris and Plumhoff v. Ryckard. They are entitled to qualified immunity, due to a recent ruling in Mullinix v. Luna.

8/08/2016 11:55:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Time to give the asshats at "Freedom Square" what they want - for Labor Day Weekend - Pull out all CPD from North Lawndale, Austin, Englewood, Gresham, Garlfield Park, Grand Crossing, Lower West Side, Little Village, Washing Park, Jackson Park, Archer Heights. Let those people police their own. Let the CPD concentrate on the areas that want their service, appreciate their service, and respect them.

8/08/2016 11:57:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

SCC, don't go bringing stupid things like the law or reasoning into the mix here! We need to just defund the police right now and let the community police itself. They can and will do a much better job anyway! Of course there's around 400 people so far this year that might have disagreed with that!

8/08/2016 12:00:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Keep this in mind. For about a year now, the ideology of the Chicago Police Department has been that depatment policy trumps any law or supreme court decision. We know of course that's not true. But even if you are correct and follow the law, you will still be terminated (or hidden in a b.s. unit if you are clouted).

I dont believe in staying fetal. The silent majority that loves us in Englewood, Harrison, etc., but until we get real leadership in this department and at city hall...stay fetal.

We are not subject any more of what right, but now a tool for votes. And that is getting people killed.

8/08/2016 12:07:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

So how is any of this any different than the clouted deadly shooting involving a certain Little Village Commander and his "very very close and personal" young female assistant (and now newly minted merit Sgt). Oh that's right the deceased(one of 3 in the car) was Hispanic. Double clouted standard, surprised this has not been brought up to defend these kids(it should) The vehicle was the weapon in both cases as far as meeting the threshold for deadly force because regardless of what occurred prior further investigation showed no shots were fired at the police... weapon was the vehicle. But McCarthy heralded 2 as a "couple" of heroes and Special Ed is going to murder these 3 brave officers' lives. There is smoke here...CLOUT LIVES MATTER!!!!!

8/08/2016 12:09:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

As far as training and tactics go:

Tell me, I'll forget

Show me, I'll remember

Involve me, I'll understand

Chinese Proverb.

8/08/2016 12:37:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The question always becomes in this modern age of policing, does any of it really matter? We're damned if we do and damned if we don't. Screw the law because the mob wants "justice" for this piece of shit car thief.
-----------
On the money my brother. The kids are going through living hell, and the Fat Man sings the songs of the ghetto. He lost his soul to Rahm.
These good men should all file a law suit against the estate of this fool. He taunting the police riding around all day in a hot ride got his stupid ass killed. Chill out and listen to a health professional.
Take it for what it is worth. Good Lawyers and Law firms are hungry for business. Fuck what FOP says, reach out to some of the old guys with years otj or retired. They will lead you to the right law firm. That fool lawyer copper' used that never won a case is just like I said, a fool.
You guys suffered big time from this thugs actions, PTSD will jump up at you in a second. You guys went into to hell that day and then after Fat Ed threw you guys under the bus. Get help from the good doctors at major hospitals.
The chaplain unit is there for you guys. EAP people are good people and you will have to speak to them if you had not already. They will not hurt you. Don't play the I am OK act, you are not. This is a major shock to your mental and physical health.
God bless you and your families, you will survive and have a life again. Fuck the media and the alleged bosses of CPD.
Thanks SCC for the real facts you give these street copper'. In the old day' things were so different, bosses watched our asses, the elders of the CPD had your back with sound advise.

8/08/2016 12:38:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

does anyone believe that the mutts actually follow the law?....from dope slinging, to car jackings, it's everyone for themselves in certain areas..they vote Democratic because the liberals give them stuff...there are two separate societies in America...

8/08/2016 12:48:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

BLM and Rahm seem to always forget that these are criminals fleeing or resisting arrest.

8/08/2016 12:51:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Exempt meeting Friday night almost turned into an all out brawl. Special Ed and Kermit was trying to sell the policy about shooting at cars while another side of exempts said the policy is nothing but political B.S. and screamed about the state law. This is going to get really ugly.

8/08/2016 12:52:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Not a cop here, just that damn Guy on a Bike...

Question:

If the GO violates City Ordinance and/or State Law, can the municipal employee LEGALLY ignore it and avoid administrative action?

As I see this incident, Tactics aside, the PO's that fired at the vehicle can not legally be charged with anything. I'm not going to QB what happened after the shithead bailed out of the Jag. Nor will I QB the large potential for Friendly Fire injury at that scene. Never dealt with PSMV when I was a Volunteer cop back in Michigan in the 90's, so I don't know jack.

As always, stay safe; go home alive. And for the Mayors PS Unit.. Mark your cars this week. I'm in Ravenswood.

8/08/2016 01:01:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The law regarding CRIMINAL charges is much different than the policies outlined in the General Orders. While you may not be charged criminally you will still get hung on department policy and the shithead will win civilly

8/08/2016 01:11:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Your analysis of the law is spot on.

8/08/2016 01:17:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

No one is questioning if the officers acted outside the scope of Illinois law. The problem is they acted outside of department policy and guidelines. They along with the offender placed other officers and citizens in harms way. You can't allow yourself to get caught up in the moment. Easier said than done. This is where training and time on the job is helpful.

8/08/2016 01:30:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Don't worry mayor along with his pandering to thugs crew has your back. The question is how far does the knife go and which way does he twist it?:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-mayor-rahm-emanuel-met-0809-20160809-story.html

Excerpts and comments:

"Look, any time there's a loss of life, it's a tragedy in the city of Chicago, regardless of how that happened," Emanuel said of the fatal July 28 shooting of Paul O'Neal, 18. "So fundamentally, my heartfelt feeling is, if there's a loss of life, it's a loss for Chicago, and it's a tragedy."
(Its a loss for chicago mayor? no sir its a win for taxpayers this is another example of extremely poor parenting and pandering to thugs)

"I don't want to make any further judgment until they are concluded with their investigation, and I support the superintendent's decision he made, on both getting the material out and the decision he's made, and then we'll all have the conclusion when the report's done on whatever judgments," Emanuel told reporters Monday while leaving a morning business conference in the Loop.
(Mayor goofnuts you will make a conclusion at that time? you already opened your mouth)

The mayor is trying to convince rank-and-file police officers who feel under siege that he's supporting them so they can try to combat Chicago's rampant street violence. But he's also working to prevent Chicago from becoming the latest flash point in the ongoing nationwide furor over police shootings of African-Americans.
(He is supporting police by letting his superintendent allow punk thug gang banger scum to be escorted into headquarters by clown exempt rank morons to meet with eddie, and seems thugs get eddies direct cell phone while a 9161 street copper cannot even talk to him. What about allowing the eddie to usher in his main squeeze cheating on test along with "sleepy als" former first deputies wife and her crew?)

8/08/2016 02:02:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

So does the statute supersede departmental policy?

Because if departmental policy is in conflict with state law, It's probably safe to say that, at least from a legal standpoint, the officers were justified in firing at the vehicle. Notwithstanding the poor judgement of the one officer who fired in the direction of his partner.

I'm pretty sure also that the cop who already had his weapon unholstered in the vehicle and who got the ball rolling with his shots is the same officer who was seen later pushing one of the officers over that narrow fence with the gun still in his hand.

I'd be a little leery of relying on this guy, but I have a feeling his days as a member of the CPD are numbered anyway.

8/08/2016 02:14:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

So they had a gold star daily event at Brookfield zoo yesterday and the Department didn't send ONE SINGLE Representative there?? Are you ducking kidding me??? Yeah they have your back. So fucking pathetic... And the reason given?? An event to support the family of those that have given their lives and we can't send one single exempt member... I didn't have much respect left for the superintendent but it's all gone now. Fuck this city, fuck this department Don't ask me for a single mother fucking thing ever again.

8/08/2016 02:47:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

May God protect the men and women of all police dept. as they protect us.

8/08/2016 02:48:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


I hope our guys are being taught this; Tell the Detectives what happened, what really happened.

Talk to your Sgt., talk to your Lt,. whatever, what counts is the Detectives.

I hope the guys in the acaedmy are telling you to trust the D-unit. Nobody assigned to a Police involved shooting is an a-hole or a dildo looking for merit. WE know who jerkoffs are and they would never get the assignment.

The current minimum ammount of time a Detective can have on the job is around 16yrs.

Fellas, "WE" send out our best.

Remeber that, everyone is against you except....

Same team blue
-----------------------
This comment shouldn't be missed. Couldn't be more true.
One day all the critical thinkers and knowledge they have will be gone.
There is a void or gap in this Dept.
The lessons, experience and knowledge of seasoned Policemen isn't trickling down to newer Officers.
It's almost as if the powers that be design it that way.
The most damaging aspect of Policing will come when We are missing the most important component.

Knowledge.


8/08/2016 03:00:00 PM  
Blogger SCC said...

Anonymous said...

Where was the forcible felony? Aggravated assault isn't a forcible felony. Aggravated battery is but when they shot at him did he commit agg batt yet? PSMV is not a forcible felony. The Illinois General Assembly created a list of what precisely is a forcible felony and I don't think ONeal committed one to satisfy that element of the statute. Sorry

=======

If you read the entire section of the law, you find the following at the very end of 720 ILCS 5/2-8:

"....and any other felony which involves the use or threat of physical force or violence against any individual."

Aggravated Assault is a felony. He's using a 3,000 car as a threat physical force, ergo, that qualifies as a Forcible Felony.

You aren't the police, are you?

8/08/2016 03:06:00 PM  
Blogger SCC said...

Anonymous said...

Department Rules and Regulations are more restrictive than State Law. You knew that, right?

8/08/2016 10:01:00 AM Delete

========

You did read the title where is says "The Law"?

And the part about halfway through were we state in parenthesis, "We're discussing State Law

And the last line where we said we'll discuss Department Policy tomorrow, right?

Asshat

8/08/2016 03:25:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous Anonymous said...
Department Rules and Regulations are more restrictive than State Law. You knew that, right?

8/08/2016 10:01:00 AM

And in the original topic (the one you're commenting on), scc clearly said this was about the law and tonight's posting would be about the orders.
But you knew that right?

8/08/2016 03:28:00 PM  
Blogger SCC said...

To the unpublished:

Which incidents are you speaking of? MPD? And who shot a church? You aren't making sense.

And if you read Rule #2 on the right hand side, you dare us to publish or not, we delete it out of hand. It's been that way for years. You don't dictate our content.

8/08/2016 03:33:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The big question here is simple,

Does a written CPD department order out rule the state of Illinois law?

Remember a bad order is just bad paper.

A dead officer is the point here

8/08/2016 03:38:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Lol. U said dictate.

8/08/2016 03:57:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

commander of 010 lit up a car and killed offender..not a word huh? what a joke this world is

8/08/2016 04:07:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

From the "They Still Don't Get It" tunnel visioned Hard Charger mailbag :

Anonymous said...
"... OT, Aug 8, still no direction from the department on what to do with cannabis arrests..."
8/08/2016 11:29:00 AM

What directions does one need?
Was it a pallet or a joint of cannabis? Nobody cares, it's not a 'real' crime anymore. (try and figure the conundrum out)
What part of Stay Fetal or Slow Down is not understood?
Stick to writing parking tickets and getting bus checks until further notice.
God Almighty, what is happened to this Department ?

8/08/2016 04:15:00 PM  
Blogger Old School said...

If you think Angelo is silent your name is Helen Keller. Google his name.

8/08/2016 04:22:00 PM  
Blogger james wallace said...

Hey SCC I know you also follow police use of force incidents around the country ... Have one that might turn into a burner and looter ... Harrisburg Pa up at Penn Live ..911 called police respond usual suspect knife to mothers neck gets shot mother now calling for Sharpton and jackson

8/08/2016 04:28:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Question-

What was the co-offender charged with, since during the commission of a felony his partner in crime was killed? Also they have been linked to a chain of stolen autos.

8/08/2016 04:52:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous Anonymous said...
Our superintendent told Lamon Reccord that he wanted to put all black officers In black neighborhoods. Hey superintendent is that a racist remark. Do you hate whites, Hispanics, Asians, etc? What if McCarthy or Weis said they wanted only white officers in white neighborhoods? Why isn't the EEOC looking into this? This is discrimination against whites, Hispanics, Asians,etc. Is this who is leading our department? What is your response to this Rahm? You hired this bigot.

8/08/2016 07:45:00 AM

His lying, cheating fiancé also has no time for white officers but if you're black, sworn or civilian, she'll chat with you for hours.

8/08/2016 05:06:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous Anonymous said...
If the poor youth in the stolen car would have struck a black woman with a baby stroller crossing the street killing them both, does anyone think the "community" would care? Protests downtown? Political fallout? We all know the answer. BLM only sometimes.

8/08/2016 10:29:00 AM

If that would've happened you know damn well "the community" wouldn't see it as Paul O'Neal's fault it would be the police's fault!!

8/08/2016 05:09:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

OT kind of - http://chicago.suntimes.com/news/cpd-says-three-west-side-gangs-plotting-to-shoot-cops/

8/08/2016 05:20:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...

Exempt meeting Friday night almost turned into an all out brawl. Special Ed and Kermit was trying to sell the policy about shooting at cars while another side of exempts said the policy is nothing but political B.S. and screamed about the state law. This is going to get really ugly.

8/08/2016 12:52:00 PM
Exempts nothing but clouted morons wearing our uniform just like they do every Halloween! At 1 time many respected the scrambled egg hat crew, now they are laughable! Then you have eddie "What exam who cheated its ok they gits clout" eddie you moved in but never rearranged the furniture (the pathetic exempts) now without removing the same people that have done nothing the smell of ignorance rises to your level, eddie they are making a fool of you all of them accomplished nothing and continue to do nothing waste of a spot,huge waste of a paycheck!

8/08/2016 05:38:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Follow Department policy and remain FETAL. Remember fleeing felons have right of way. If a stolen garbage truck is bearing down the street at an unsafe speed toward the Bud parade, fleeing felons have the right of way, stay FETAL.

8/08/2016 05:38:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

If only the driver of the first squad pulled up a few more feet and totally blocked the street, the bad guy would not of been able to drive through the open space. The entire situation would have been a different outcome. The driver of the Jag would not have went head on with the car. The only reason the driver of the Jag hit the second squad is because he was ducking from the shots being fired at the Jag. Oneal is a complete pos and because of his negligence many peoples lives have been destroyed.

8/08/2016 05:45:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Deano has been strangely silent, hasn't he?

What would you expect Dean to say (or any other FOP leader, for that matter), when the actions of the officers involved are
just totally unsupported by the CPD's own general orders? It's hard to go on tv and defend the stupid.

8/08/2016 06:21:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
As far as training and tactics go:

Tell me, I'll forget

Show me, I'll remember

Involve me, I'll understand

Chinese Proverb.

8/08/2016 12:37:00 PM

If only the academy followed this proverb. Stay fetal my friends

8/08/2016 06:41:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The rules of the department regarding force are way to complicated to enforce.

Watch as The City tries to explain the incident to any attorney who will then ask can an officer fire on a moving car!
The moving car rule was added after the last bullshit lawsuit.

At least you are encouraging people to read the actual law and think.









8/08/2016 06:45:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

We're in the United States of Chicago, outside laws don't apply.

8/08/2016 06:47:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

As a retired cop, I can easily sit back and judge and make comments all day long, if I wanted to. I lost count of the times that I was in a shit storm and by the grace of God got out of it. It is easy to judge, hard to live these events that often happen so fast that there is no time to think. Only training and experience saves you. It looks like some of these officers lacked both through no fault of their own. My prayers are with them. These are perilous times for the police in this country. Everybody is judging you and it seems everyone knows how to be the police and know what to do. I have met many defense attorneys and not one of them would know a Terry Stop if it was right in front of them, but they sure can criticize you. There are police actions that may be legal and may be within department guidelines ( for now) but the public does not understand and will not be on your side. The mayor is not on your side and it seems the superintendent is not on your side. After more then 30 years of working in black areas I know for sure that there are more good then bad hiding behind their doors. They might not like you as much as you want them to, but they sure call and they want protections. Is this ever going to get better?

8/08/2016 06:57:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
No one is questioning if the officers acted outside the scope of Illinois law. The problem is they acted outside of department policy and guidelines. They along with the offender placed other officers and citizens in harms way. You can't allow yourself to get caught up in the moment. Easier said than done. This is where training and time on the job is helpful.

8/08/2016 01:30:00 PM

Oh, I think that you are wrong on this. No one who knows what they are doing is questioning the legality of what happened. But, the progressives, the agitators and the bottom feeding lawyers are calling this murder, an execution etc etc. Will the department leadership stand behind these officers? Will the city administration stand behind them? Time will tell.

8/08/2016 07:00:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...




You nailed it again, SCC!
Your efforts should be mirrored by those in doubt.
Again, keep that fire burning!


Retired, 30+

8/08/2016 07:10:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

How about Rahm wear a body camera too...to restore trust of course.

8/08/2016 07:22:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...



Keep those personal responses coming, SCC. It's about time and I like what you do!

Also, I like what this poster sent, I've only included the last sentence:
"...In the old day' things were so different, bosses watched our asses, the elders of the CPD had your back with sound advise."

So thanks to him/her, too.

Retired, 30+

8/08/2016 07:31:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

West side gangs targets police:

http://www.fox32chicago.com/news/crime/186842491-story

Watch your six,eyes looking,head on swivel stop acting like school girls always looking down texting on internet oblivious to everything around you, crack windows listen back each other up,if you follow a pattern driving immediately change it, situational tactical awareness. Is your weapon clean ready do you and your partner communicate well? Fresh good ammo, flashlight charged not scared be ready always think look for cover take your hands out of your vest! If the media has this information let's be sure we know everything we can about the enemy. If you have your rifle be ready we go home same way we started our tour #bluelivesalwaysmatter May God please bless all police everywhere and bless the "spirits of the air"
For this informative blog.

8/08/2016 07:41:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Good document to read regarding body cams...

http://www.forcescience.org/bodycams.pdf

Excerpt;..."..Rushing to condemn an officer for inappropriate behavior based solely on body-camera evidence can be a dicey proposition,” cautions Dr. Bill Lewinski, executive director of the Force Science Institute. “Certainly, a camera can provide more information about what happened on the street. But it can’t necessarily provide all the information needed to make a fair and impartial final judgment. There still may be influential human factors involved, apart from what the camera sees.” 

 A camera doesn’t follow your eyes or see as they see.  

Some important danger cues can’t be recorded. “Tactile cues that are often important to officers in deciding to use force are difficult for cameras to capture,” Lewinski says. “Resistive tension is a prime example.   “You can usually tell when you touch a suspect whether he or she is going to resist. You may quickly apply force as a preemptive measure, but on camera it may look like you made an unprovoked attack, because the sensory cue you felt doesn’t record visually.”  

 Camera speed differs from the speed of life. 

A camera encourages second-guessing.
“According to the U. S. Supreme Court in Graham v. Connor, an officer’s decisions in tense, uncertain, and rapidly evolving situations are not to be judged with the ‘20/20 vision of hindsight,’ ” Lewinski notes. “But in the real-world aftermath of a shooting, camera footage provides an almost irresistible temptation for reviewers to play the coulda-shoulda game........"  


Prince Valium

8/08/2016 07:47:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I hope you young coppers out there read this. They can't fire you for doing nothing. The worst that can happen to you is you work midnites.

8/08/2016 07:47:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hello SCC, Our brother was killed in the line of the duty. I have brothers and sisters that are still members of the Chicago Police Department and Fire Department. We attended the Family Day for the 100 Club of Chicago this past weekend at the Brookfield Zoo. Commisioner Jose Santiago, The Fire Commisssioner, was in attendece and spoke on how AWESOME it is to be a FIREMEN. I was there for the Fire side and saw ZERO, I mean ZERO representation from the brass of the Chicago Police Depaartment for the FALLEN FAMILIES of the Chicago Police Department. If it was a protester against POLICE the brass would be there for them. I just want to let the Chicago Police Brass know that we now for sure know you DO NOT have our families backs. Thanks Rahm.

8/08/2016 07:57:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I got on the job in 1983 and retired in 2013. Like most cops in that era, I believe that the major turning point in the perception of the police happened during the Rodney King incident. From that point on, my department along with countless others began systematically documenting any and all complaints against officers by the general public. The news media, even back then, fanned the flames with their biased commentaries by making the hardest of criminals appear to be victims of the big bad police. The public bought into this B.S. to the point where we were guilty until proven innocent, even on the most minor of beefs. The municipalities became less inclined to fight lawsuits against officers with the excuse that "it was cheaper to settle cases rather than fighting them in court". The pendulum that began swinging against fair treatment for police officers is still moving in the wrong direction. Like anything else, it will someday swing back the other way when people realize that police are needed if for nothing more than to prevent anarchy. I hope that that day comes sooner rather than later

8/08/2016 07:59:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

They violated department policy. The video doesn't lie and were reckless. The officer that killed the offender I can understand why he shot him because hearing gunfire upon approach then the offender hitting his squad car head on. I can understand the confusion of believing it was coming from the offender.

8/08/2016 08:00:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anyone that calls their gun a rod sounds like a real moron.

8/08/2016 08:02:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Department policy is for disciplining officers. The state of Illinois certifies all police officers across the state who swear to uphold the constitution and laws of the state. Only in chicago can department policy be written that is in direct conflict with state law. Does anyone see a problem here? Any attorney would have a field day with this chicago's nonsense. Last time I checked chicago was still in the state of illinois.

8/08/2016 08:08:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous Anonymous said...
I hope you young coppers out there read this. They can't fire you for doing nothing. The worst that can happen to you is you work midnites.

8/08/2016 07:47:00 PM

====================

Back when we rotated shifts [hated it but realistically had the most fun] while working the 2nd district, we had the saying, " what are they gonna do to us? Put us on midnights in the deuce?"

The worst is probably happening to most of them already. Listen to that guy above me.

STAY FETAL!

8/08/2016 09:03:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

People are outraged by the O'Neal video? I'll show you a real rage inducing video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDqIZqhcS-E

8/08/2016 09:47:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think we may need a follow-up lesson on statue vs regulation vs ordinance vs job rule...

Looking forward to the next installment....

OT- 10-1 (re: off duty PO battery) in backlogged 014 this afternoon. No 014 cars responded at first (most down / not available). 1215 was first on scene 5 min later.

8/08/2016 10:03:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why isn't the F.O.P. encouraging its membership to put in for a Day Off this Sat and force the city to explain why Days Off aren't limited for any other parades and why it isn't forced to hire its own security detail like others.

8/08/2016 10:26:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Only one thing needs to be said to criminals or their whiny famblies claiming their Community College Graduate cum Future Brain Surgeon didn do nuffin:

"Criminal Activity comes with certain risks, including, but not limited to arrest, prosecution, incarceration, injury, maiming, or even death. If any of this bothers you, your loved ones, or heirs: DON'T ENGAGE IN CRIMINAL ACTIVITY"

The sooner the politicians, sheriffs, talking heads on the MSM, and the Revrun's in the "Community" start telling this to the wanna-be's and actual thugs, the better.

8/08/2016 10:48:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Q: Since when does "Departmental Policy" trump State law?

A: Never.

8/08/2016 10:50:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I wonder what would happen to a Mayors Bodyguard Detail that decides to leave the unit in the middle of an event? That would be terrible and you'd almost think they remembered their real loyalties lie to their brothers.

8/08/2016 10:56:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

CPD alerts cops that 3 West Side gangs plotting to shoot officers:

According to police sources, department members have also been advised to “limit interactions and visibility.”




Don't have to advise me ever again.

8/08/2016 11:32:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

While the officers firing at the vehicle that had been used as an object of deadly force may not had been a good idea, less than 2weeks early a AH used a vehicle to kill 84 people.

8/08/2016 11:43:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


Oh, I think that you are wrong on this. No one who knows what they are doing is questioning the legality of what happened. But, the progressives, the agitators and the bottom feeding lawyers are calling this murder, an execution etc etc. Will the department leadership stand behind these officers? Will the city administration stand behind them? Time will tell.

8/08/2016 07:00:00 PM

They'll stand behind them,alright. It's easier to slip the knife in.

8/09/2016 08:30:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...

I hope our guys are being taught this; Tell the Detectives what happened, what really happened.

Talk to your Sgt., talk to your Lt,. whatever, what counts is the Detectives.

I hope the guys in the acaedmy are telling you to trust the D-unit. Nobody assigned to a Police involved shooting is an a-hole or a dildo looking for merit. WE know who jerkoffs are and they would never get the assignment.

The current minimum ammount of time a Detective can have on the job is around 16yrs.

Fellas, "WE" send out our best.

Remeber that, everyone is against you except....

Same team blue
-----------------

Well said.

8/09/2016 08:31:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You won't get in trouble if you just back off. Get him tomorrow. You step in shit if asshole runs down an innocent person or if a copper kills the miscreant. Why put yourself out on the line? For what? To make an arrest? Hot car? Forget it, the car is insured. What is really important here? Only that no one is hurt or dies. Nothing else really matters. Asshole will get arrested for something else in a day or week or so, not to worry.

8/09/2016 09:53:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...

Anyone that calls their gun a rod sounds like a real moron.


I am the police, in Chicago.... And if you are too, pot calling the kettle black....

8/09/2016 11:22:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


OT- 10-1 (re: off duty PO battery) in backlogged 014 this afternoon. No 014 cars responded at first (most down / not available). 1215 was first on scene 5 min later.

8/08/2016 10:03:00 PM
++++++++
For a 10-1 you make yourself available.

8/09/2016 12:10:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon said:

"Problem with state law and department orders/policy, is when state law sets you free and department orders/policy finds you culpritble, resulting in the department suspending you and moving to fire you, thus setting the stage for a civil suit. "

No matter what, - precedent in these type of incidents has long ago been set, --termination of the employee does not get the Department off the hook for Civil suit claims for actions of the employee while in the employ of said Department.

8/09/2016 12:50:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...

Anyone that calls their gun a rod sounds like a real moron.


I am the police, in Chicago.... And if you are too, pot calling the kettle black....

8/09/2016 11:22:00 AM

Are you sure he was talking about his gun?

8/09/2016 11:22:00 PM  

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