Sue the City?
Serious question.
Is there any reason that a concerned member, perhaps even a concerned Board Member, can't file a lawsuit against the City of Chicago for failing to live up to its pension obligations as per state law?
We recall a few months ago that an actual Pension Board (perhaps in New York?) either sued or won a judgment against a municipality that said the Defendant was in violation of a contract and the law by not fully funding its obligations.
We don't see how the City keeps getting away with underfunding all these pensions for years, even decades, in violation of who knows how many rules that exist to prevent such an occurrence.
We'd happily kick in to fund that lawsuit. So would a bunch of almost-retirees who are nervous about whether or not the pension will exist in under 10 years. So would a bunch of retirees who aren't looking forward to eating cat food the rest of their lives.
Is there any reason that a concerned member, perhaps even a concerned Board Member, can't file a lawsuit against the City of Chicago for failing to live up to its pension obligations as per state law?
We recall a few months ago that an actual Pension Board (perhaps in New York?) either sued or won a judgment against a municipality that said the Defendant was in violation of a contract and the law by not fully funding its obligations.
We don't see how the City keeps getting away with underfunding all these pensions for years, even decades, in violation of who knows how many rules that exist to prevent such an occurrence.
We'd happily kick in to fund that lawsuit. So would a bunch of almost-retirees who are nervous about whether or not the pension will exist in under 10 years. So would a bunch of retirees who aren't looking forward to eating cat food the rest of their lives.
Labels: pension
posted by SCC at 12:01 AM
32 Comments:
SUIT THE BASTARDS
IOVINELLI vs. FRANKLIN PARK, which ruled that the municipality is required to fund the firefighters pension according to the funding statute (section 4-118). It means we can at long last enforce funding.
Well since our union only seems to be interested in the interest of retirees Im sure all will be fine.... The actual working members will suffer... we will certainly get fucked good to make sure some 3 times divorced widow of a cop 3 times removed will get benefits, but the WORKING members will take it in the ass... but thats fair, right? This union is a joke and has too many friends in weird places... we need Mike Shields in office to see to it this bull shit ends! We need someone to stand up for the WORKING guy... Im so tired of this place I want to PUKE!!!
Sounds like the job for Mike Shields! If anyone's got the balls, brains, intestinal fortitude and utmost comtempt for Daley and his machine, it's Mike.
Count me in on being both a plaintiff in a class action and a monetary contributor for whoever may step-up and get the ball rolling. It's time to get serious against this establishment.
Whenever you're ready, Mike, we got your back 100 percent.
I would like to know who allowed the funds for the pension to be taken. Was their a vote on it and if so who voted which way? Did they gamble and put the funds in a risky investment and lost OR was it a scheme for some crooks to fill their pockets with the money/kickbacks????? The truth to why the pension is so under funded should be demanded!!!!
Maybe Ken Hauser could file a lawsuit against the City of Chicago for failing to live up to it's pension obligations as per state law?
in chicago...we make the rules for ''others'' to follow. do as i say...not as i do.
Shouldn't have to kick into a lawsuit. The Attorney General of Illinois could do it for free.
Anonymous said...
Shouldn't have to kick into a lawsuit. The Attorney General of Illinois could do it for free.
5/24/2009 08:10:00 AM
Then perhaps we need to sue the Attorney General as well to force her to do her job?
OR MAYBE WE SHOULD ELECT OFFICIALS INTO THESE OFFICES WHO ARE NOT ALL IN THE DALEY CRIME FAMILY !!!!!!!
The city and state will have bankruptcy protection by the time it gets to appeals court.
Any lawyers out there willing to give it a try?
Two weeks ago there was a three day seminar in Springfield about municipal pensions. Subjects included funding and training for trustees amongst many others. Not a single person from Chicago was in attendance! That tells me a whole lot about the screwing we are getting from our elected representatives, they don't care enough about their positions to even stay current with proceedures.
I am somewhat puzzled, and perhaps I missed something, but whan did the city not live up to its pension fund obligations? The last pension fund r eport was issued about this time last year, and it clearly states that the city made its required contributions to the fund. The report for the period ending December 31, 2008 is not out yet, but should be soon. It, as always, will show the contributions by mebers and the city, as well as total number of annuitints, contributing members and a wealth of other information. I suspect that many of you are confusing the actuarial under funding of the fund with city contributions or lack thereof. If the fund is actuarially underfunded it is likely because there is too much going out, too much investment loss and some other reasons, not because of faialure to make contributions. Remember too that the auditors of the fund do not simply take the word of the people that run it. They actually do an audit.
All of this is just anther way of saying that no entity, not the Pension Board or the FOP or anyone else can excuse the city from making its legally required contributions. There was a time when the city was lagging behind in its contributions and they were in fact sued over it. The city made their contrributions as a result of the suit, but, as I recall, that is when the city decided to stop paying health care costs for retirees, which of course resulted in another suit.
It is the city's obligation to double the total dollar amount of contributions of members of the Police Department. I am pretty sure, because of delay in arriving at totals, that the city contributions for 2008 will be basec on member contributions from 2007, 2009 will be for 2008, etc.
FOP should have studied this and done it decades ago, but they are in bed with the City Hall Crime Cabal, instead of looking out for their officers best interests. It's time to broom out the current FLOP Administration. They should be in full planning for the next picketing at Grant Park, in timing with the Taste, but won't, cause they're chicken-shits.
Ken Hauser is just a talk in circles politician who also should have been launched decades ago.
Pensions are guaranteed by the IL State Constitution and on top of that they have Federal Laws that mandate payments.
Illinois can't get around this without changing the state constitution. Some people think other states might be able to get around the federal laws by declaring bankrupcy, but under the US Constitution, the federal government is on the hook for all state debts.
Realistically, state's can't even declare bankrupcy because people holding state bonds would get cleaned out and the state's bond rating would go down to 0. That would mean that it would be impossible for a state to borrow money to pay workers, build roads, operate water plants, etc... and the state government would cease to exist.
Unless there are massive changes in the law, your pension payments are guaranteed regardless how the city operates the fund.
The Capt's Assoc lawyer (Gittler) saus we can't sue until someone actually gets shorted in their pension check. Another reason why he's a lying, in Daley's pocket, pice of shit. And he's negotiating our contracts? (The Capts, Lts and Sgts) we are so screwed it ain't funny.
I submitted the previous, somewhat lengthy post about the pension fund, and now realize that I made an error. The city is required to contribute 2.0 eimes the contributions of members based on the contributions of members from 2years previous, not 1 years as I originally stated. I just glanced at my 200 report, and noticed that it is dated June 30 2008, indicating that the 2009 report will be out in the next few months. I suggest that more of you take a look at it. It is the thing that shows up in roll call rooms, and lays around for several months when the janitor finally disposes of them I guess when most of you see that it does not contain a Playmate of the Month, you put it down. You really should read it, you may learn something, but then that is an anathema to most of you, isn't it?
1. The city is meeting it’s pension contributions now. Under Harold they stopped in order to balance the budget. He gave decent raises but w/o raising taxes. When the retirees went to court his lackey Judson Minor told them you guys won the battle but lost the war. That’s when the city started charging the retirees for health care. It took a long time for the city to catch back up.
That’s way the 55 threshold for health care is so important. A by product of the last two contracts was that we found out the city was over charging the retirees for health care. Their rates got lowered and they got refunds.
2. There are two major reason why the fund is under funded. The first is that we are living much longer now. Our present rate of funding is based upon actuarial rates that are ancient. We all remember the guy we knew that died two months after retiring, but never knew the guy who retired twenty-five years ago. Our funding rate needs to go up by 1.5% and the city’s by 3%. Can you see shortshanks now having a heart attack.
3. The second major reason that the fund is down is the stock market. It is up for the last three months but is way down from 3 years ago. That being said we must hold the pension board’s feet to the fire. Go to the pension board meetings and demand that they answer the IG’s request for documents. We need for the Springfield legislators to stop putting restrictions on how we invest our money. (I.e. no firms that are in parts of war torn Africa, and at home connected investment firms with figure head minority participation).
4. Even the city’s blue ribbon commission on pensions is now backing off a two tiered pension. But that could change over night!
I refuse to write parkers for Da Mayor w/o a contract. But this meter thing has the public up in arms along Toddler’s sales tax. Maybe it’s time to pour a little kerosine on the fire and start pissing off the public but deflecting it onto Da Mayor. If we start writing parkers on meters and when the public complains to us just tell them that they should call the mayor’s office that he is the one who want more from us.
And the second thing would be no cars available! On my watch everyone assigned to a rapid response car has been detailed out. I no longer worry about coming up so fast anymore except to back each other up. So this Friday night everyone on my watch plans to spend the entire 3rd watch in the station with a bull shit arrest. Let all of the kids in TRU come back to their District and answer all the calls!
How about we sue the individual board members that allowed anyone attached to the city to touch our money? We get sued individually, maybe Ken Hauser and the rest including Fruins relative future lawyer?
" the union only seems to be interested in the interest of retirees"
I am retired and get a clue. Look at your pay stub and how much you put into the pension twice a month. If you have more than a few years on the job, it makes the retro check, etc. look like peanuts.
When you are looking at these things, you have to look at the numbers young man/woman.
One would think that if the city was doing something unlawful, such as not funding the pension fund as per state statute, that the Attorney General of Illinois would take up the cause on any members complaint, instead of a member actually having to file a civil lawsuit against the city, Just exactly why do we have the Attorney general then?
Shouldn't have to kick into a lawsuit. The Attorney General of Illinois could do it for free.
5/24/2009 08:10:00 AM
You mean Daley lacky Lisa Madigan of the madigan crime family associated with the daley criminal enterprise?
It's the fucking law for Christ sake. Hold them to it and do it in a court of law.
If ghetto rats can sue for every single fucking thing, cops can't sue for their families and futures?
What are you all waiting for?
"Maybe Ken Hauser could file a lawsuit against the City of Chicago for failing to live up to it's pension obligations as per state law?
5/24/2009 04:31:00 AM"
Stop it! If I had been drink milk it would have gone out of my nose!
It scares me to see what Gov. Quinn is trying to pull on the state pensions. He wants to stop contributing the states contributions and make up the difference at a later time. If Quinn pulls this crap, just wait til Daley gets done with our pension.
"5/24/2009 11:58:00 AM"
Forget about the public.
Forget about doing anything that brings in revenue.
Deny the vampires the blood they can't survive without.
Money is the only thing that matters to them, as in the lack thereof.
I find it unbelievable that Dick Daley was allowed to dive into the pension pool and extract what he wanted.
Is everyone in this goddamn city sitting King Daley's pocket?
Two weeks ago there was a three day seminar in Springfield about municipal pensions. Subjects included funding and training for trustees amongst many others. Not a single person from Chicago was in attendance! That tells me a whole lot about the screwing we are getting from our elected representatives, they don't care enough about their positions to even stay current with proceedures.
5/24/2009 10:33:00 AM
Our pension falls under Illinois Pension code which differs from all other municipalities. Let's have our trustees go to springfield to update themselves on municipalities under 500,000??? Good argument. I'm retired and I always paid attention to our pension. maybe this mope should too
FOP does NOT cater to retirees - they don't represent us anymore - so, they CAN'T by law. WE are on our own. And, by the way, I paid into that fund for over 36 years and like all other retiree's happen to be responsible for just about every benefit YOU HAVE Junior. We got boinked in the ass one hell of alot more than you'll ever be so stop whining and do something about a problem you see. NEXT UP::::A state senator from Barrington is trying to introduce legislation to lay a state income tax on all retiree's pensions. These asswipes just can't STOP SPENDING and hiring cousins, auties and friends of friends. I can't afford a vacation the last 5 years, I live within my means - the state should learn to do the same. Donahue is a dog. Birkett was endorced by the membership and the political action committee and the Dickhead threw FOP's support behind Mikey's little girl - and he'll do the same when the bitch wants to be governor. ALSO:::: Our fund is heavily invested in some funds who's people just happen to be FRIENDS OF da Mayor - it's the worst fund out of the bunch - but, he won't let HIS board drop his buddies - so WE continue to LOSE bigtime.
Pat Quinn, Governor,another Daley Crime Family member in good standing, tax-maniac, and all around good DemocrAT. Now he's already trying hard to get into your tax wallet, with his gloom and doom will occur to the State if we don't all pay even MORE taxes. Why do all the other States taxpayers pay less than Shitcago-Crook County, Smell-inois, and not always be having all these problems, crying poor all the time, and always being totally GREEDY, and wanting more, more, more tax dollars from us, while giving us SHIT in return. Hey QUINN, G.F.Y. you rat-faced Irish Potato-Head Asshole. I hope you'll be joining Blago real soon.
Our pension falls under Illinois Pension code which differs from all other municipalities. Let's have our trustees go to springfield to update themselves on municipalities under 500,000??? Good argument. I'm retired and I always paid attention to our pension. maybe this mope should too
Did you ever stop to think that they might learn SOMETHING? The laws are not that much different concerning municipalites 500,000 and under compared with ones that exceed 500,000. You know why this is? Because there is only ONE city over 500,000 in this state.
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