Gold Plated Pensions?
- They argue ... [garbled] ...our children are a front to line their pockets, gold plated pensions for the Chicago Police, multimillion dollar pension payouts. They are using, again, that the children as an excuse?
We aren't certain if she's even speaking English. We had a hard time transcribing even that little bit. The linked video doesn't have the subtitles that appeared on the news broadcast, but we believe she was identified as [unknown first name] Tobin?
That name rang a bell, so we Googled "Tobin and pensions" and found we weren't having foggy memories at all. Someone named Jim Tobin runs the "TaxpayersUnitedofAmerica.org" website that uses the pensions of Phil Cline, Dana Starks, Terry Hillard and other gold stars to paint all cops as bankrupting the system.
Seeing as how our average pension is $48,900, we contribute upwards of 10% to our own retirement, we get zero Social Security (thanks Rosty) and we'll have to pay all of our own retired healthcare after this year, we don't know where this ass gets off describing our pensions as "whopping" by any stretch of the imagination.
Labels: pension
posted by SCC at 12:03 AM
36 Comments:
That's Tobin's daughter and she is a nut job!
Just for the record.
A person that has always contributed the max into social security from the age of 22 who pushes off retirement until they are 70 will collect a monthly check of $3,266 in 2012 dollars
$39,192 a year.
And if you retire at 65 the monthly check drops significantly to $2,310 per month or $27,720 a year.
Retire early at the age of 62 and you get $1,855 a month or $22,260
So yeah, I could see where some would call CPD's pensions golden. Although healthcare expenses are going to take it all anyway as healthcare cost are rising faster than the cost of living adjustments for us all.
The game is rigged my friends.
www.ssa.gov/oact/COLA/examplemax.html
Her name is Christina Tobin. She is a strict libertarian and hates Madigan and Daley as much as us. She's a good person just severely misguided when it comes to pensions. She and her father think that we are all becoming millionaires off of our pensions. I tell her that the reasons the pensions is so messed up from politicians raiding it and not paying thier share. I also told her what the average pension is and how much we pay but she doesn't really believe me. Her and her dad are just so dead set against government spending that it can cloud thier vision. She really is a good person and means well so don't be to hard on her.
and we'll have to pay all of our own retired healthcare after this year,
Ah, you know something I don't know? Is this contract related or have you reached that magical age?
For this job that not many want, we give up some of our rights, our freedom, our holidays, our friends and now our pensions. They van go duck them selves.
I don't know what that "woman" was yaking about but I have always felt that a boss should receive his/her pension based on their original rank when they retire. The highest rank should be captain. Politicians control all of our bosses by giving them this great perk. Most of these folks also go on to other governmet jobs after retirement to collect another check and maybe another pension. Like Dana Starks who became the Chicago Human Rights Commission director with a nice 6 figure salary. Huh?
http://www.cityofchicago.org/city/en/depts/mayor/pensionestimator/retirement_security.html
EVERYONE SHOULD LISTEN TO THIS. RAHM ATTACKING THE PENSIONS OF CITY WORKERS ON A WEBSITE
I think it's funny how that lady blames the police. How many police officers do you think want more cameras installed so that the city can generate more revenue for themselves and waste it on nonsense but then again police are the best scapegoats, and as far as alderman Burke I say " If you cant balance the budget as an alderman resign and dont do any time as an alderman because all you are doing is screwing over hard working people of Chicago".
"Just for the record" forgot to explain that his figures are for the private sector and to max out on social security deductions from pay I think you have to make around 140,000 a year for 2012 and although it goes down for previous years the amount is always in the upper bracket well beyond most peoples salary dreams.
In response to the anon. reader who posted, "Ah, do you know something I don't know" with regards to having to pay one's own retired health care next year.
I retired under a contract with the city that expires next year on 01 jul 2013. I pay 50% of my health insurance costs directly from my pension check. Fortunately for me, I turn 65 two weeks before that date and will be covered by Medicare. If I had been of Medicare age for the last 5 years, I would have been paying a reduced amount from my check and still had BCBS as my secondary/supplemental insurance. The last two weeks of the current contract, I will/should still have BCBS as my secondary/supplemental insurance but then all bets are off, come 01 Jul 2013 as that contract then expires. Most likely, I will have to buy my own supplemental insurance.
What does this mean?
There definitely are some retirees out there who will not be 65 yoa when the contract expires and unless a new medical contract for them is put in place before then, they will be without any level of city health insurance. So, yes, some retiree's will have to pay there own insurance until they reach medicare age.
Apparently the original poster did/does know something that you don't.
And, no, this arrangement does not extend into the future subject to contract talks. It has a finite ending date. Talk to the FOP if you need a better understanding.
Your "average" pension is in large part low, because of the large number of retirees who get little money, yet refuse to die off! But mostly it is low because you have the wrong number. According to the Pension Board's website, in 2010, the average Police Pension was $53,060 (This is up 35% over ten years from $34,880 in 2000). Long time retirees and their widows are surviving on a pennies. $350 per week or less. They depend on a $400 "gift" the Pension board gives them at Christmas to make their budgets. It is shameful!
NOTE: the top people, whose pensions are $100,000 and more, pay the same amount of state income tax as the 78 year old who retired in the 1990's. The recent retirees.
It's disgusting!
Tell this jag off to get hired and do this job. To deal with the worst the city has to offer, to be hated by all until ur saving a life. Then forgotten and an asshole again for writing a ticket. Get a 1% raise which doesn't even cover cost of living increases! To whomever agrees with that newscaster, go fuck yourself
Anonymous said...
Her name is Christina Tobin. She is a strict libertarian and hates Madigan and Daley as much as us. She's a good person just severely misguided when it comes to pensions. She and her father think that we are all becoming millionaires off of our pensions. I tell her that the reasons the pensions is so messed up from politicians raiding it and not paying thier share. I also told her what the average pension is and how much we pay but she doesn't really believe me. Her and her dad are just so dead set against government spending that it can cloud thier vision. She really is a good person and means well so don't be to hard on her.
4/12/2012 02:44:00 AM
Well if you told here what the average pension is and what we pay and she doesn't really believe you then she is NOT a nice person. She has an agenda and is cherry picking her facts to support it. She could look at ALL of our pensions and what we pay but then it would not support her agenda. By doing this she is no better then people like Jackson or Sharpton.
2013 is the magic year for no insurance.Every city employee received a letter to this about 10 years ago.I believe it was called the Korshak Decision after the judge.
She is NOT a nice person. How can you say that about anyone that would spew the lies that she did knowing that they are not true. She used the speed cameras to promote her agenda just like she accused the Mayor and City Council of doing. They are all phonies.
She's a good person? Really. Well fuck her and her dad and her bullshit libertarian/anarchist philosophy. And fuck you too for calling her misguided. You must be as stupid as they are. Anyone who advocates the abolishment of our hard earned and well deserved pension is the enemy.
Jim Tobin is a piece of shit. He hates the police, and for the life of me I can't figure out what he does for a living. I'd bet that he is blogging from his mom's basement. Like you pointed out, he uses specific individuals high paying pensions as an example that everyone receiving a government pension is stealing millions from the taxpayers. There is never any mention that we pay anywhere from 9%-12% out of our paychecks every payday, or the fact that the true cause of the pension crisis is the politicians either stealing from or not funding the pension systems for decades. In simple terms, Tobin and his offspring are asshats.
Holy christ! That's it?? Why am I doing this????
LK253509060CN
You are correct on the Social Security numbers, but rmember that SS recipients pay their own hospitalization with no hilp from SS, prior to Medicare. Once that kicks in they have to get a supplement on their own.
Scc, it sounds like you have some insight as to what happens when the Korshak agreement ends next year. Personally, I don't believe that we will be without at least some help from the City and Pension Board for a Medicare supplement.
Relevant...Check out the last quote.
Commissioner Proposes Fixes for Cook County Pension Funding
April 9, 2012 (PLANSPONSOR.com) - Cook County, Illinois' pension fund will go broke in 26 years without major changes, according to a new analysis.
Commissioner Bridget Gainer, chairwoman of the Cook County Board of Commissioners’ pension oversight panel said even if the county fund generally is in better shape than the state and city pension funds, that doesn't mean the county can continue to ignore a funding gap that grew to $5.2 billion by the end of 2010, according to The Chicago Tribune.....
Gainer’s report offers potential solutions, including having employees pay 9.5% — 1% more than currently — of their annual wages into the fund, which also would trigger a relatively modest $15 million increase in the county government's annual payment. The report also proposes lower annual cost-of-living increases, a higher retirement age, slightly less credit for future years worked and basing the pension payments on a percentage of each employee's highest consecutive eight years of salary, rather than the current four....
"You know, this isn't something that is going to be done to county employees," Gainer said, according to the newspaper. "It's something that is going to be done with county employees."
You can tell she had no idea what she was talking about..But of course, they give her air time!
Jim Tobin is a total assclown. You read his website you'll want to puke. EVERY single article he publishes on public sector pensions starts off with "Lavish, and "Gold plated". Also, has a real problem with police.
They give them good sound bits. But the information is garbage. The news is crap........
Every time a person says "pension reform" a Chicago thug gets shot.
I can't get the video up on my phone, but isn't Tobin the woman here? http://www.chicagonewsreport.com/2011/10/video-west-side-chicago-high-school.html?m=1
She's a good person? Really. Well fuck her and her dad and her bullshit libertarian/anarchist philosophy. And fuck you too for calling her misguided. You must be as stupid as they are. Anyone who advocates the abolishment of our hard earned and well deserved pension is the enemy.
4/12/2012 11:52:00 AM
For the most part she is a good person. While people like you have been just sitting on your ass doing nothing but bitching and complaining about all the assholes in the state government she was out there calling them out and showing them. She is obviously wrong about this and I have been trying to educate her on this. I've been on her ass all day about it today to get her to see out side while you sat on yours. I probably lost her as a friend as a result so go fuck yourself.
I don't begrudge anyone for receiving a pension. But the truth of the matter is that pensions were never meant to be paid out for 20 or 30 years for a job only worked 20. I always hear that complaint (mostly from Teachers) that everyone contributes 10% of their pay. If you were a civilian paying SS and Medicare your paying upwards of 15%. So if you want to have any money when you retire, you need to start putting it in your 401K, and then hope you don't loose it all because you have very little choice in your investments.
I have done spread sheets to show my friends who work in government jobs, that pensions are difficult to sustain. If you put in 10% and the city contributes matching funds for 20 years, along with compounded interest and ROI, and retire at 50, your pension fund savings is exhausted within 7 to 10 years. If your a teacher retiring at 70% it's less than that. Now with fewer recruits contributing, the pool of funds really shrinks. Oh, and lets not forget the corruption regarding the unions and their investments. Didn't Mr. Daley's nephew screw the pouch on investments with your money? And when the money is gone, the only thing the pols know how to do is raise taxes. When taxation gets to high, people leave. Pensions were never meant to substitute your salary, it was meant to supplement your income.
As retirement age decreases and longevity increases, the math just doesn't add up.
Finally, there are so many perk pensions in the state and county, i.e. someone who gets a huge pension for being a union boss and who never contributed or someone receives multiple pensions for jobs in which they barely worked. These all add up and are a drain on the funds.
Not trying to piss anyone off, just trying to shed some light.
If my Math is correct, every Gold Star pension equals on average 4 Patrolmans Pensions.At the current rate they're going to bleed the Pension dry.
As far as Christina Tobin is concerned, is that IF SHE DOESN'T GET IT, THEN WE LOSE IT. Just saying. The politicians which she is one of them are like a pair of scissors re pubi cans one side dumo rats the other they only cut what comes between them which is US. Pleazzze they get richer in office we get poorer. Wake up
To the number cruncher 4/12/2012 10:21 pm:
Did you spend you spend your career in the private sector or did you spend the better part of 25 years in the Robert Taylor Homes, the Ida B. Wells Housing project, the Browning buildings, 4120 S. Prairie, 4100 S. Cottage & Langley, 3800 S. whatever on Cottage?
No?
Then, BLOW ME!
I don't begrudge anyone for receiving a pension. But the truth of the matter is that pensions were never meant to be paid out for 20 or 30 years for a job only worked 20. I always hear that complaint (mostly from Teachers) that everyone contributes 10% of their pay. If you were a civilian paying SS and Medicare your paying upwards of 15%. So if you want to have any money when you retire, you need to start putting it in your 401K, and then hope you don't loose it all because you have very little choice in your investments.
I have done spread sheets to show my friends who work in government jobs, that pensions are difficult to sustain. If you put in 10% and the city contributes matching funds for 20 years, along with compounded interest and ROI, and retire at 50, your pension fund savings is exhausted within 7 to 10 years. If your a teacher retiring at 70% it's less than that. Now with fewer recruits contributing, the pool of funds really shrinks. Oh, and lets not forget the corruption regarding the unions and their investments. Didn't Mr. Daley's nephew screw the pouch on investments with your money? And when the money is gone, the only thing the pols know how to do is raise taxes. When taxation gets to high, people leave. Pensions were never meant to substitute your salary, it was meant to supplement your income.
As retirement age decreases and longevity increases, the math just doesn't add up.
Finally, there are so many perk pensions in the state and county, i.e. someone who gets a huge pension for being a union boss and who never contributed or someone receives multiple pensions for jobs in which they barely worked. These all add up and are a drain on the funds.
Not trying to piss anyone off, just trying to shed some light.
4/12/2012 10:21:00 PM
I agree with much of what you said except that the pensions could be sustained. The pensions would be fine if the city had been meeting it's obligations for the last 20 years by making the proper and agreed upon contributions to the fund. It would also be fine if it was invested properly instead of being used by Daley and his crime family for all sorts of risky bullshit. The last reason it's seeing problems now is because the department hasn't been at full strength for 10 years which means more people collecting and less people contributing. If these crooked politicians quit trying to save money off of the backs of emergency responders and kept our numbers up to budgeted strength, we'd have alot more contributions made to our fund over the last 10 years. The bottome line is that these pension funds are all in trouble because our political leaders cheated, abused, stole from, and neglected them for decades and now the chickens have finally come home to roost.
Yes, the pension underfunding has been going on in many cities and states around the country, not just here. But, now begs the question, How do you fix it? They cannot raise taxes enough to properly fund the pensions. Changes will have to be made or someday soon the pensions will be broke and the matter will end up in court. Don't count on the court telling the city to sell assets to pay pensions. It looks like, to me at least, that everyone is going to have to take ahit on this, active, and retired or there will be no pension, period
Anonymous said...
Just for the record.
A person that has always contributed the max into social security from the age of 22 who pushes off retirement until they are 70 will collect a monthly check of $3,266 in 2012 dollars
$39,192 a year.
And if you retire at 65 the monthly check drops significantly to $2,310 per month or $27,720 a year.
Retire early at the age of 62 and you get $1,855 a month or $22,260
So yeah, I could see where some would call CPD's pensions golden. Although healthcare expenses are going to take it all anyway as healthcare cost are rising faster than the cost of living adjustments for us all.
The game is rigged my friends.
www.ssa.gov/oact/COLA/examplemax.html
4/12/2012 01:24:00 AM
I am here to say that you have NO CLUE... you are the 'stud' who thinks that they are always the smartest person in the room...little do you - and others who have grown up in your "ilch" know, you are going to be called to duty... in one way or the other...
Anonymous said...
Her name is Christina Tobin. She is a strict libertarian and hates Madigan and Daley as much as us. She's a good person just severely misguided when it comes to pensions. She and her father think that we are all becoming millionaires off of our pensions. I tell her that the reasons the pensions is so messed up from politicians raiding it and not paying thier share. I also told her what the average pension is and how much we pay but she doesn't really believe me. Her and her dad are just so dead set against government spending that it can cloud thier vision. She really is a good person and means well so don't be to hard on her.
4/12/2012 02:44:00 AM
Good for you you 'tough-talking' "wanna-be", speak up or shut up!
we pay anywhere from 9%-12% out of our paychecks
--------------------
Per state law we pay 9%, excuse me if i am wrong, but, where do you get the 12% number?
4/12/2012 10:21:00 PM
I agree with much of what you said except that the pensions could be sustained. The pensions would be fine if the city had been meeting it's obligations for the last 20 years by making the proper and agreed upon contributions to the fund. It would also be fine if it was invested properly instead of being used by Daley and his crime family for all sorts of risky bullshit. The last reason it's seeing problems now is because the department hasn't been at full strength for 10 years which means more people collecting and less people contributing. If these crooked politicians quit trying to save money off of the backs of emergency responders and kept our numbers up to budgeted strength, we'd have alot more contributions made to our fund over the last 10 years. The bottome line is that these pension funds are all in trouble because our political leaders cheated, abused, stole from, and neglected them for decades and now the chickens have finally come home to roost.
4/13/2012 11:42:00 AM
----
i was always under the impression that we had between 3 and 4 Billion in the police pension .... AND, that until only recently - the fund was making MORE than it was paying out ... AND that is with the city underfunding it.
So, when the original poster says it is unsustainable ... I am suspect.
Does it all boil down to the stock market tanking? (and the city's lack of funding only came into play when it did tank)?
For how long was our pension fund in the black? Anyone know?
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