Still Short Ambulances
- Mayor Lori Lightfoot has announced that Chicago will get more ambulances – in response to ongoing CBS 2 investigative reports documenting a serious shortage.
But the problems continue. And recently, 911 Center dispatchers were juggling calls from the public and even first responders needing ambulance assistance, but were told no ambulances were available.
We heard those calls by listening to publicly available radio broadcasts that the city’s fire commissioner now apparently wants to silence.
It happened Jan. 21. During a two-and-a-half-hour period, the city said there were 67 calls for ambulances on the South Side that lead to the problems.
Sixty-seven calls in one-hundred-fifty minutes? And how many ambulances are usually available citywide?
What's the solution?
What's the solution?
- Just hours after ]Channel 2] started asking questions about these cases, dispatchers at the 911 center got an email from the man who runs the city’s paramedic program.
Fire Commissioner Richard Ford wrote, “The process of indicating that CFD is out of available ambulances or asking for any available ambulances over the radio will no longer be allowed.”
We don't know what the workload involved on 21 January, but between the run of the mill stuff, we've been noticing a huge upswing in overdose calls. In fact, it's routine for the CFD Truck to respond quicker than the ambulance and then leave - lights and sirens - to another call as soon as the ambulance arrives. We've also noticed ambulance response times are going up, and not by a little bit.
CFD is already stretched thin, thin enough that we're pretty sure they're broken more often than not. What happens when shooting season gets rolling full speed?
CFD is already stretched thin, thin enough that we're pretty sure they're broken more often than not. What happens when shooting season gets rolling full speed?
Labels: fire fighters
posted by SCC at 12:01 AM
72 Comments:
How many died because of lack of ambulances? God help you if you need an ambulance.
Didn’t a guy die on the north side following a heart attack because the ambulances where baby sitting asshole neighborhood awhile ago. I remember the tribune covering it
“We heard those calls by listening to publicly available radio broadcasts that the city’s fire commissioner now apparently wants to silence.”
This is one reason we DON'T want encryption on our radio channels. The city will be able to hide this information from the media, and while they're not our friends, they are useful idiots every once in a while.
If you are going to empower violent criminals, you better have a lot of ambulances.
Don't worry, the taxpayers having heart attacks will pay the price.
House mice infestation in 024. Let cfd worry about their own problems..We need coppers on the street. How do you have 1 year on the job and be a tact secretary? And look yourself in the mirror. How about 3 years and half of it in the caps office....or 3 years on assigned to days management in 024...or dumped from days or tact and straight to 3rd watch inside spot over guys working the street for last 15 plus. Or district secretary for winning the cigarette smoking contest. Or transfer into the district and automatically get the desk because you know a boss. Or front office because a sgt gave u sh*t. Or o6 car because not enough yotj for tact. But the rest keep wearing that crap outfit/gear and do the job....just saying.....i like the street, maybe offer an oldtimer an inside spot and put the phone calls on hold.
Years ago the Battalian Chiefs had Chevy Suburban's equipped with a stretcher, and had a driver/aide. They were able to respond to the overflow calls and transport the victims to the hospital. Before this, the CFD only responded ambulabces to fires and street accidents. Residents were required to utilize private ambulances for house calls. Maybe they need to get out of the ambulance business entirely and let the peoples and folks fend for themselves.
Signs of a decaying City. Police short staffed and going into RAP and calls for bambulance impossible to keep up with. Tell me what we pay taxes for ? This is basic service.
CFD isn’t the only Department short on emergency vehicles. My squad just hit 100,000 miles and the dashboard lights up like a Christmas tree. I asked the Lt if we would be getting any new cars, he said the city isn’t buying any new cars and to make due with my death trap that shakes uncontrollably over 40 mph. Only the best for our officers! Smh..
Call me naive or heartless, but I sincerely doubt that an average of one ambulance call every two and a half minutes was made for actual medical emergencies. I’d be more willing to bet that’s it’s an abuse of resources, and the people that really needed the services suffered. A stomach ache or your foot hurting for the past two weeks is not a justifiable reason to call an ambulance.
Maybe the City should start thinking about contracting private ambulances...like Superior or lifeline, since they like using the lights and sirens anyway, respond to NON LIFE-THREATENING jobs, (drunks, mentals, etc).
67 calls within that time frame all from the south side? Perhaps certain communities need more education about calling 911 for every pain element they might have. I can see increasing ambulances along the CTA Red Line stops to cover the massive uptick in people getting shot in connecting tunnels (or from crossing railway cars), pedestrians getting sucker punched, sleeping commuters getting mob attacked, platform musicians getting stabbed, DePaul students getting sexually assaulted, Boys Town residents getting jumped, store owners in shock after ‘groups’ walk out the door with armloads of stolen merchandise, car owners hyperventilating after getting yanked out of their vehicle and carjacked, etc. Since most of the south side is on the Red Line causing this mayhem anyways, it’s a clear 2-for-1.
So now we'll just call for an ambulance and there will be no indication if there's actually one coming? Good plan. God forbid someone dies waiting for an unavailable ambulance when we could've transported or called an Uber with plastic on the back seat for easy blood cleanup in the meantime. It's much better to pretend an ambulance is coming when it could be an hour or more before one actually shows up. I guess if one of us is shot or otherwise seriously injured, we should just have a squad car drive us to the hospital. Maybe a LEMART-trained officer could ride in the back and play paramedic. Then no one will know there's an ambulance shortage. Or here's another idea: how about CFD refuse calls for service when it's a "my leg hurts" or "I have a headache" or whatever other nonsense the "community" deems worthy of an emergency medical response. The amount of ridiculous shit that gets an ambulance response for absolutely no reason is surely a major cause of ambulances being unavailable. But let's not worry about honesty and wasted resources when the "community" is involved.
"...make due with my death trap that shakes when I go over forty..."
Simple answer. Don't go over forty.
Now, kees me you fool!!!!
Maybe it’s time to put two ambulances in each fire house. Some small firehouses have none.
Anonymous said...
House mice infestation in 024. Let cfd worry about their own problems..We need coppers on the street. How do you have 1 year on the job and be a tact secretary? And look yourself in the mirror. How about 3 years and half of it in the caps office....or 3 years on assigned to days management in 024...or dumped from days or tact and straight to 3rd watch inside spot over guys working the street for last 15 plus. Or district secretary for winning the cigarette smoking contest. Or transfer into the district and automatically get the desk because you know a boss. Or front office because a sgt gave u sh*t. Or o6 car because not enough yotj for tact. But the rest keep wearing that crap outfit/gear and do the job....just saying.....i like the street, maybe offer an oldtimer an inside spot and put the phone calls on hold.
3/03/2020 01:03:00 AM
Did they buy the jacked up jeep wranglers yet?
1.03am—there are (usually) bid lists for open positions all over. Quit Bitching. It’s always been like that
Sign of the Times
Grade school kids in West Virginia being trained in the
use of Narcan Spray and sent home with 2 doses.
"It's like a squirt gun...."
The volume of hype overdose calls in 011 is crazy. Every day, all day. They take some strong shit and either pass out or act like a clown zoning out on the sidewalk or middle of the street. Either way, passersby call 911 and CFD gets dispatched, tieing up ambos from those in real need. Not to worry though, as with LEMART, I'm sure the city will make Narcan training MANDATORY so we will HAVE to render aid to od'ing hype or face legal consequences if he dies. Watch, bet it happens soon. We had no choice in LEMART we won't have one with narcan. Always putting more and more responsibility and expectations on our police yet the scrutiny is higher than ever.
Just another sign that Little LORI is way over her head!
I got a great idea lets rebuild the west-side and south side?
then everybody will take care of there houses
send kids to school
drugs will be extinct because everybody will want a minimum wage job
AND finally the RED LINE will be used by tourist to go see the World champion Chicago White soxs...
Stop broadcasting the problem thats the way to fix it, Right Commissioner? You should apply for head of the CPD you seem to know how to fix problems.
CFD isn’t the only Department short on emergency vehicles. My squad just hit 100,000 miles and the dashboard lights up like a Christmas tree.
Only 100K Ha! Those old chevy's and Crown Vic's each got well over 200K before you started to worry. Shit, I had a Ford die on the street during a tour lol live and learn kid
OD=SOL let the body snatchers help out.
Same poster, same whining. As usual, has nothing to do with the topic of the post.
Dude, half the shit you’re saying isn’t even true. You obviously have a hard-on for the commander and think this is your way of getting back. Maybe you should go someplace where you’d be a little happier. But, now we see the problem - you are always this f*cking miserable.
Wah, Wah, Wah, - House mice infestation in 024. Let cfd worry about their own problems..We need coppers on the street. How do you have 1 year on the job and be a tact secretary? And look yourself in the mirror. How about 3 years and half of it in the caps office....or 3 years on assigned to days management in 024...or dumped from days or tact and straight to 3rd watch inside spot over guys working the street for last 15 plus. Or district secretary for winning the cigarette smoking contest. Or transfer into the district and automatically get the desk because you know a boss. Or front office because a sgt gave u sh*t. Or o6 car because not enough yotj for tact. But the rest keep wearing that crap outfit/gear and do the job....just saying.....i like the street, maybe offer an oldtimer an inside spot and put the phone calls on hold.
The politicians will keep catering to those people as long as they get their votes.
looks like a homicide clearance rate booster to me.
no ambulance? no problem!
could have scored a save had help arrived.
Keep voting Democratic 👎
Theres 3 CFD ambulances that are sitting at the AMC building at Ohare collecting dust. Granted they're spares but they could be used..
And what happens next week when all the "silently incubating" coronavirus cases turn into critical condition patients needing ambulance service to ER?? Chicago is SO UNREADY for what is about to disrupt life here.
Tomorrow all those study-abroad students who were based in Italy arrive home to O'Hare to infect us all.
CFD is not short ambulances but overrun with bogus calls. Complaining about "the miseries" is no reason to call 911. The call takers at OEMC are afraid to deny service for fear of discipline even if the caller doesn't fit the criteria for an ambulance response. In some areas of the city the CFD ambulances are essentially a taxi for residents to get to the hospital with tummy aches and sprained ankles. Throwing more ambulances at the problem is not the solution...but God forbid we should say "no" once in a while to those who feel perpetually entitled.
This is all being fueled by a bitter, angry CFD EMS chief who's made his bed with Pam Zekman. Except for a small bunch of the people who work for him he has little respect in the field.
So dispatch isn't allowed to communicate that there's no ambulances available, so maybe the person ordering it can be relayed that message and call for a private ambo? For the people who actually need immediate medical attention, minutes can be the difference between life and death. And playing some bullshit politics game with someone's life is so wrong it should be criminal. The fire commissioner can go fuck himself. I'd be livid if a family member died because an ambulance arrived 20 minutes late without fair warning.
Brings back memory of a Monty Pythons scene. Villagers with torches pushing carts in the streets yelling Bring out your dead.
If you allowed the medic to take a victim or refuse him transport i.e.(belly ache),there would be more available but that will never happen.
Maybe a Freedom of Information request can see exactly what and where those ambulances were assigned to
at which location.......even for a city this size, that’s a lot of calls to a very small area.
CFD are our brothers and sisters......and are getting as short-shifted as we are.....
Those millions of dollars given for sanctuary city stuff, the Lincoln Yards TIF bucks given,
the forgiving of all the “poor folks fines and fees and water bills” could have bought some
more ambulances and patrol vehicles.
More SJW bullshit going on in this bastion of Democratic totality.
How about having the alderpeople use some of their discretionary funds to form a ward transport spot? If you haven’t shit in three or more days, call the alderscum office, instead of 911, for a ride to the Cook County colonic clinic, etc... another freaking golden idea!!!
Who needs ambulances? As long as we use tax money
where it’s most important, benefits afforded illegal immigrants
so they can assist the community by raising sexual assaults
(on children), illegal drug trafficking, and elevated violent crimes,
ALL IS GOOD ACCORDING TO THE MAYORASS AND
THE STATES ASSTORNEY!
Had a south side call recently who according to him his fiancée “stabbed” him. The ambulance was there pronto. I’ve had worse paper cuts. Yet, forget being a taxpayer and getting an ambulance as you suffer a heart attack.
Groot’s Chicago is just humming along.
So far groot gas been able to pull millions out of her ass for
pet projects, to garner votes, how about for something that
actually matters.
All non-trauma cases should be treated at the scene and if not life-threatening they should be referred to Uber, taxis, buses, or family/friends to get to the hospital. CFD transports way too many patients who are just looking for a free ride because they will NEVER pay the required ambulance fee.
Start using school buses in a pinch. They have all those flashing lights and a “stop” sign that swings out.
Back when I came on ( 1971) probably 90% of emergency runs were done by the police. The caddy ambulance were usually called for stuff the wagons could not handle, like broken bones etc.
Each district has at least 3 wagons and most of the guys were pretty good at this. Also, many were rushed in the back seats of squad cars, got the victims there in just 2 or 3 minutes. The zone would call ahead and they would be waiting at the door for you.
Right now, the city treats the ambulances as a bother, rather than a service. Fleet does not maintain the vehicles properly, they are old and need to but new ones on a regular basis, no knee jerk reactions.
What would happen if calls determined by the Responder to be frivolous ("I have a hangnail") were charged $50-$100 a pop? Cash or credit card, phone number logged for last-in-line response going forward.
Is that less moral than a ticket or tow from a no-parking zone at the hospital?
Forget the Bambalances....
Just set up 3 MASH Units: One in Garfield Park, One in the Wild 100's, and one in the Wood. You'll crank out some great surgeons who can actually help society years from now. Just use Wagons and bring back Wagon Man tips. It'll be grand.
"Signs of a decaying City. Police short staffed and going into RAP and calls for bambulance impossible to keep up with. Tell me what we pay taxes for ? This is basic service."
It's not the city that's decaying, it's the disproportional overuse of services by a minority of society, the west sides and south sides. 011, 015, 007 etc. They call CFD for every ache and pain tieing up resources. They call CPD for every little non-police matter because they don't know how to run their own lives, again spreading thin manpower even thinner. Growing up, I remember my household calling the police ONCE. My parents believed we shouldn't "bother" the police unless it was important. These mutts on the westside call everyday, all day on shit that would make normal people ask WTF? for a community that contributes the least productivity, the most crime numbers, death & destruction...they sure feel like they deserve the most CFD/CPD services. THESE residents and their milking of the system is where our tax money goes. Basic services alright, when they're not directing them to the needy areas.
Proved to pay dividends for the Local 2 endorsement of LightLoafer-2019.
CFD should be using Uber.
Wonder what the percentage of calls just require a medicaide cab ride to the St.Rogers county hospital.
Lockup are empty and the i-bond/mittimus stunts are legendary folk stories, though shootins’n killins are up most of those are self or homey transport drop offs.
Numbers just don’t add up.
Must be something IG Fergie-nuts should look into.
Manpower may also be an issue as well. Being a paramedic sucks. Not nearly as much downtime as the firemen. I do know that firemen that are not considered old timers were originally cross trained to be both a fireman and paramedic. When they’re short paramedics they pull guys from the firehouse for paramedic duty. However, they have an option to completely drop their paramedic certification and only be a fireman. Many of them started doing that so they could have an easier day at the firehouse and not run almost non stop for 24hrs as a medic.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
House mice infestation in 024. Let cfd worry about their own problems..We need coppers on the street. How do you have 1 year on the job and be a tact secretary? And look yourself in the mirror. How about 3 years and half of it in the caps office....or 3 years on assigned to days management in 024...or dumped from days or tact and straight to 3rd watch inside spot over guys working the street for last 15 plus. Or district secretary for winning the cigarette smoking contest. Or transfer into the district and automatically get the desk because you know a boss. Or front office because a sgt gave u sh*t. Or o6 car because not enough yotj for tact. But the rest keep wearing that crap outfit/gear and do the job....just saying.....i like the street, maybe offer an oldtimer an inside spot and put the phone calls on hold.
Has only gotten worse, not better. Seniority is a joke. Basically only works for district transfers. Everything else is management or exempt from seniority
See? Lightfoot IS doing something about the mass shootings, stabbings, muggings, overdoses, and illegal aliens raping 3-year-olds!
More ambulances!
Overdoses should be rated at Truck Response Only.......Don't waste ambos on them.
Maybe if the ghetto rats would not get the priviledge of a free ambulance ride every time they need an aspirin there would not be a shortage!!!!!
CFD medic here. The guy who stated that he bets the majority of calls are for non emergencies is 100% correct. In my 13 years on I've seen the call volume more than double. Spots like mine that take 10 or more years to get to are still doing 20 runs per day. 85% is for total nonsense. Last day I had a 21 year old with stomach pain for 6 months call for an ambo at 3 am, several people with colds, and a 30 year old who needed a pregnancy test. There is 1 ambo for every 50,000 citizens. The problem is,the locals are told to just call 911 for everything. They sue for whatever they can so no calls are refused. It's also not uncommon for medics to be recorded by family and bystanders just to try and catch us slipping up so they can put a lawsuit on the city.
Abuse of the Cfd ambulances have been going on forever. Most ghetto calls are for nonsense, just want a free ride to the ER for something that is non-urgent and that two aspirin can fix.
Maybe the city should stop sending an ambulance for every call that comes in. Calls for headaches need to take them selves there.
If you can walk to the ambulance, you can take yourself there. And maybe that should start doing like other cities and bring them to
an urgent care facility and use the hospital ER’s for Real Emergencies
We will drag him up to Clark Street, you pick him up there
"Blame tha' poleece! It's all they fault!"
>Rim-Shot<
>Cheers Applause<
how about the OEMC dispatcher story, 40 hours a week in OT, they can't or won't hire but can pay someone $225,000.
021 district, 1978-79 man cut bt2124 47th st, no ambulance available or wagon, squad car brought the man lying on the back seat asked for assistance at Michael Reese ER, met them there, guy was laying on the back seat cut high wide and deep, intestines hanging out.
"Overdoses should be rated at Truck Response Only.......Don't waste ambos on them."
Honestly, shouldn't get ANY response. It wasn't an accident, they weren't an innocent "victim" of a beating or robbery. They, as adults, CHOOSE to go to the hood, buy unknown poison from some unknown lowlife and freely...Enthusiastically... ingest the poison into their body. Society should not pay one dime to rescue them, allowing them to do it again and again. Want to be charitable? Emphasize the rehab clinics where they might get help and get off the shit. Go to 011 buy dope, OD on a sidewalk in the middle of the day? Get whatever fate you have coming. CFD nor CPD should be dispatched to help those people out.
Is NARCAN really $10,000 a pop? That is ridiculous. Why bring them back?
This Lightfoot person visited our fair city of Toronto. This is the mayor of Chicago? C’mon lads, quit fucking about.
Without being critical of CFD, there is a different model used in some very large metro areas. The FD's provides the EMS (all FF's trained and functioning as FF/EMT's) and a specific number of more highly trained FF/Paramedics assigned to squads.
Engine company and squad rolls to every EMS call; if the call requires less than advance paramedic level of care, the Engine company FF/EMT personnel cancel the squad and handle the call. The squad is now free to be dispatched to the next EMS call.
The FD provides no ambulance service; all ambulances are private enterprise (staffed by EMT's), with certain companies rolling in specified areas to maintain expeditious response. All three units (Engine Company, Squad and Ambulance) are assigned on the initial dispatch, and whatever is not needed is canceled.
Watch for CFD to go to new radios so the public cant listen in. Take it from a ccx guy in the radio shop
Is NARCAN really $10,000 a pop? That is ridiculous. Why bring them back?
Exactly, or make mommy and daddy pay to save their snowflake. I refuse to carry or use NARCAN.
" a 30 year old that needed a pregnancy test " . unfucking real. what is that, like 6.00 at walgreens? but no, 650.00 bambulance ride and 1200.00 e.r visit that will all be paid by medicade i.e. us. and then which govt agency is supposed to give her a ride home? i cant believe how this city has changed in my lifetime. we rarely ever " bothered " the police or the cfd and we all worked and paid maximum taxes our whole lives. im pushing 70 and have needed an ambulance twice but choose to get a ride instead, once in the burbs and once out of state. charges for these can be in the thousands, and for some strange reason the state wont pay my bills so ill hitch a ride. its amazing to me how a very small population controls and sucks up the vast majority of services and contributes less than nothing. watching the returns for super tuesday all the experts including rahm talked about all the small minority groups and how they feel about each candidate. not one of the "experts " talked about the taxpaying majority and how they felt about this insanity ! like someone said you cant unsink this ship, the public has been indoctrinated to believe this conduct is normal and we the workers owe the lazy and demented a living. vote early and often and remember, free shit is a human right ! go bernie !
Anonymous Anonymous said...
Same poster, same whining. As usual, has nothing to do with the topic of the post.
Dude, half the shit you’re saying isn’t even true. You obviously have a hard-on for the commander and think this is your way of getting back. Maybe you should go someplace where you’d be a little happier. But, now we see the problem - you are always this f*cking miserable.
Actually everything he said was true, with the exception of the one year tact secretary. So I heard from a close source in 024.
Anonymous said...
CFD isn’t the only Department short on emergency vehicles. My squad just hit 100,000 miles and the dashboard lights up like a Christmas tree. I asked the Lt if we would be getting any new cars, he said the city isn’t buying any new cars and to make due with my death trap that shakes uncontrollably over 40 mph. Only the best for our officers! Smh..
3/03/2020 01:35:00 AM
Don't know what you don't know about cars, but sounds like a wheel weight missing and a tire is out of balance. Happens from rims hitting curbs or they just fly off sometimes. Check it out or ask somebody who knows a "slight" amount of info about that stuff. If garage won't fix it , get it balanced on a meal break, ($5-10), if you can.
You all ain't seen nothing yet. Wait till this Bat Flu gets going in Chicago.
P.S, buy masks and face shields , they will be intentionally coughing in your face before too long.
"Exactly, or make mommy and daddy pay to save their snowflake. I refuse to carry or use NARCAN."
Same here. But wait until they FORCE us to take the training and mandate we carry it, just like LEMART. They'll train us and basically say "Do what you want" but if dude dies in front of you and dudes lawyer finds out you didn't do anything (you, and everyone are after all Narcan and LEMART trained) then it's YOUR fault he died...At least that's what the liberal jury will believe. I'm against ALL MANDATORY NEW TRAINING that takes away our choice to act. We should know Law, weapons, some restraint/custody physical training, report writing, etc. THAT is what we signed up for as police officers. FORCE us to take ANY medical training, and they can sugar coat it with "it's to save us" all they want, it STILL HOLDS US MORE LIABLE IN COURT. Maybe if I'm attempting to save dudes life (cause I'm now required to) and he bites me, giving me HIV or some other shit, I can sue the fuck out of the city and dept for FORCING me to take the training and mandating ne to act, therefore exposing me to the disease. Hey, lawyers get murderers off, maybe a good one could make it fly.
"Exactly, or make mommy and daddy pay to save their snowflake. I refuse to carry or use NARCAN."
Same here. But wait until they FORCE us to take the training and mandate we carry it, just like LEMART. They'll train us and basically say "Do what you want" but if dude dies in front of you and dudes lawyer finds out you didn't do anything (you, and everyone are after all Narcan and LEMART trained) then it's YOUR fault he died...At least that's what the liberal jury will believe. I'm against ALL MANDATORY NEW TRAINING that takes away our choice to act. We should know Law, weapons, some restraint/custody physical training, report writing, etc. THAT is what we signed up for as police officers. FORCE us to take ANY medical training, and they can sugar coat it with "it's to save us" all they want, it STILL HOLDS US MORE LIABLE IN COURT. Maybe if I'm attempting to save dudes life (cause I'm now required to) and he bites me, giving me HIV or some other shit, I can sue the fuck out of the city and dept for FORCING me to take the training and mandating ne to act, therefore exposing me to the disease. Hey, lawyers get murderers off, maybe a good one could make it fly.
3/04/2020 08:33:00 AM
LEMART certification doesn't require you to take any special lifesaving actions UNLESS YOU CAUSE THE INJURY. Shoot a bad guy when you have LEMART certification and you're required to use your fancy first aid kit and apply tourniquets when applicable. You're about as likely to get HIV from a bite as you are to get struck by lightning while riding a unicorn across the rainbow bridge to Asgard. And if you think making a lifesaving effort of any kind while someone dies in front of you opens you up to more liability than sitting there with your thumbs up your ass, you're not very bright. You're not expected to be a trauma surgeon, but trying to help when you're even minimally trained to do so is better than doing nothing. Imagine the two scenarios playing out in court.
"Officer, why didn't you try to help the deceased while he bled out in front of you for 20 minutes?"
"Oh, I'm not trained and I don't want him to bite me and give me HIV."
OR
"Officer, what did you do while the deceased was bleeding out for 20 minutes?"
"I applied a tourniquet to his leg, put some quikclot on his wounds, and bandaged him up to the best of my ability and training, using the equipment I had available."
Which scenario seems to open you up to more liability?
You know I'm not really worried about getting HIV from a bite right? What I'm worried about is a stupid jury being swayed by a slick talking lawyer (Been there)
How it WOULD HAVE GONE DOWN before FORCED LEMART training is...
"Officer, you were at the scene of my client bleeding out? " (whether I caused his injury or not)
"Yes"
" Did you render any medical aid?"
"No, I'm not medically trained and I don't have any medical supplies provided to me so I called for CFD and kept the person as calm as i could" "Sorry he died, but there was nothing further I could do because I was NEVER trained. I signed up to be a police officer, not a paramedic" = Not liable, by any stretch. Black & white. Can't perform acts I'm not trained in (even minimally)
Now how apparently you, the city and dept see it going down is...
"Officer, you rendered aid to my deceased client?"
"Yes"
" Well unfortunately he died anyway, but due to the good samaritan law we can't pursue further legal action. By the way, thanks for the attempt, good job. Civil case dismissed. "
Now how I see it happening in REALITY with our left leaning jurys, judges and court system (AND PAST EXPERIENCE)...
"Officer are you medically trained? Did you render aid to my now deceased client.?"
"Yes"
"Please describe (to the jury and surviving distraught family members in court) EXACTLY what you did, the extent of training you received, how much of an effort you put into trying to save my client"
"Please demonstrate the methods you used, EXACTLY what equipment did you use, is it up to date?, how many times have you used it?, was it quickly, readily avsilable? Did you deploy it in a timely manner? Is there something you could have done different? Better? etc. Etc. Etc..."
"Uh...I tried my best...Uh I had 1 day of training...uh...I really didn't know what I was doing but now under dept orders I was MANDATED to do something "
" ladies and gentlemen of the jury, it is our position that despite this officers best intentions in his attempt to save our client, he was GROSSLY negligent in the performance of his training. He did not administer his training in a timely, effective manner. The overall execution of his attempts were not in line with what he was taught in the required class and as a result of his actions, this grieving family has lost a son, brother, father. The community has lost a pillar... who was in the process of turning his life around. We would even venture to say that due to the culture of the police department, this officer PURPOSELY did not execute his training to the fullest extent, with the express intention that he WANTED our client to die. The good samaritan law NORMALLY holds responders not liable, but due to the case we present before you, the examples of the officers lack of proper training execution, we ask that you find him guilty of causing our clients death due to improper application of knowledge he should have been able to apply. He WAS trained after all, training that the department felt was adequate to put him back on the street with"
Now...you have a lawyer, with crying family present, apply a speech like that to a sympathetic jury and guess what? You lose. You and/or the city pay.
Before FORCED LEMART training we had a fool-proof defense...NO TRAINING that could be painted like the above picture by slick lawyers.
Now? Because we are trained? We are at the mercy of a fucking stupid jury (been there) and I DON'T like those odds. The likelihood that I'm going to come across a citizen needing medical attention is far greater than another officer needing ME to save their life and once again, now that we were FORCED into lemart, our greatest liability-proof tool "Squad, get CFD over here" is GONE.
That's a lot of words to prove you're clueless. Thanks. You literally said you thought you would get HIV from a bite. Keep that imaginary trial in your head going so you're too distracted to post here. It's like reading the diary of a schizophrenic.
"...wait until this bat flu gets going in Chicago..." You
Oh yes. We waited. Look what happened.
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