Encrypted Radio Fault
We noticed this when our zones switched over and numerous officers at the time said it was going to get someone killed. It almost did this time:
- Newly acquired video from a Chicago police officer’s body camera
shows a routine “suspicious person” call turned into a struggle for the
cop’s life when a trespasser took the officer’s gun and fired two shots
as the men struggled to control the weapon on a Lincoln Park sidewalk.
The footage provides an up-close look as the men grapple for the weapon, and a CPD dispatcher complains that she can’t understand what the struggling officer is saying due to the city’s low-quality radio system.
About 70 seconds into the video, the officer asks a dispatcher to send backup.
“Unit coming in? I’m sorry. The radios are not good,” the dispatcher replies.
The officer, grappling with Tucker, doesn’t have a chance to repeat himself.
There was always a little bit of a delay in the Motorola Saber radios. If you didn't pause for maybe half-a-second, the first part of your transmission didn't always go through. The newer radios eliminated a bit of that, but this new digital system....
We talk to dispatchers sometimes and they aren't happy with it. The transmission delay has gone up, not down. And there are odd changes in the modulation (?) where you get squeals and hiccups that we never heard before, cutting out voices. We assume that's part of the "encryption"? Not a big deal if you're just running names and plates, but dangerous when you're a little panicked and rushing to get info out there.
Training and practice can eliminate a bit of the problem, but when the $hit hits the fan, a glitchy system is not going to help OEMC get you an assist car.
Labels: safety issues
posted by SCC at 12:05 AM
65 Comments:
There is a reason why aircraft still use old AM radio for their voice communications with the control tower and air traffic control. It is simple and super reliable. Digital can get you better spectrum use (which is in great demand), data transmissions and some nifty features but the systems are more complicated. Digital transmissions are of a all or nothing nature. They either work well nor not at all. AM and the prior FM systems could deal with interference a bit better.
LOTS of Sergeants quitting over the past 2 months.
Nothing to see here.. Manpower in fine huh?
Sgt. Elise M Padilla 193
Sgt. Eugene Bikulcius 166
Sgt. John M Hanlon 002
Sgt. Carol L Lawrence DIS
Sgt. Robert S Podkowa 016
Sgt. Daniel J O’Toole 193
Sgt. David P Bird 193
Sgt. Peter E Sodini 603
Sgt. Alesia Franklin 121
Sgt. Angelo J Monaco 189
Sgt. Angel F Ward 019
Sgt. Brian A Callaghan 015
Sgt. George A Granias 014
Sgt. Thomas Simon 018
Sgt. Richard J Howard 166
Sgt. Susan D Rogers 011
Sgt. Michelle Cook 006
Sgt. Raeanda L Edwards 376
Sgt. Werner J Calder 025
Sgt. Jonathon R Harmening 640
Sgt. Francisco Gutierrez 019
Sgt. Patrick G Eberlin 017
Sgt. Kelvin L Williams 610
Sgt. Joseph A Kusar 020
Sgt. Patrick T Purdy Jr 630
Sgt. Bridget C Robinson 005
It may partially be the radio frequency. Oemc’s CAD system is outdated and has been glitchy for a while now. Zone 4 has some pretty decent dispatchers for the most part but I hope you all know who majority of your dispatchers are. They aren’t your friend nor are they on your side. They live by the current political narrative and don’t ever forget; When JVD was convicted the entire police side of OEMC erupted in cheers and celebration minus a few. It’s a cesspool of lefty blue line haters and BLM supporters.
This is a bold statement now. A very bold statement but I wouldn’t be surprised if the transmission was audible and clear but the dispatcher decided to… buy some time.
Those who know Know.
Vanecko Radio Inc.
Located on Lasalle Street "over by der".
Whenever we had that jag-off female dispatcher on Zone 6 she would absolutely hate it when people whistled in the radio.
I bought the loudest whistle on Amazon and use to blow it over my cheater radio as loud as I could when she got bitchy.
Fun times.
$30,000 bail?
I'm sure some communist organization will bond him out now.
New Topic:
Mayor B.J. increases his security detail to 149 coppers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgfIWOUjo48
DEFUND THE POLICE for everyone else but NOT for him and his family.
Quality of the radios or quality of the dispatchers hired? “The radios aren’t guuudd” instead of “the transmission was unreadable”. Maybe get the earbud out and stop watching TikTok videos while working.
I wonder if the radios antennas were switched out for the short ones. Short antennas are not supposed to be used,.short antennas can't transmit as well. Also, if they had a "short stem", was the radio still on the vest pouch while they were transmitting?
It's not so much the encryption it's the switch from analog to digital. A digital radio takes your voice and converts it to digits then sends it on its way, thus the delay you hear when your partner finishes talking. On the receive side the radio has to convert the signal from digits to actual voice. Digital is required for encryption and when a good signal is present it sounds great. Anything less forget it.
another slip me the manila envelope political contract you gimme mines and you get the rest!
With encrypted radios you must depressed the transmitter key and wait a few seconds before transmitting. It's kind of a pita and takes getting accustomed to.
the illinois state police has a digital trunked radio system with NO encryption. you can hear them on a scanner clearly with no delay time.their system is still protected from highjackers with system keys.
AES encryption only jacks up the price of a radio. it maybe useful for elite groups who are truly undercover. but for regular everyday transmission its completely wasteful and probably harmful as SCC has noted.but since the city is flush with cash, whats an extra couple thousand per radio?
I remember when batteries in our radios couldn't even last a whole tour of duty. Anyways it looks like this POS came out of that building looking for a fight. And why exactly are radios encrypted anyways..? Obviously not for our safety.
Glad it turned out okay.
The Sabers were good about 30 years ago.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
With encrypted radios you must depressed the transmitter key and wait a few seconds before transmitting. It's kind of a pita and takes getting accustomed to.
8/09/2023 07:06:00 AM
Well that would be really good information to have, especially when you need help. Did anyone ever get that training? I sure didn’t.
Also be mindful that the citywide frequencies are NOT encrypted, and there is no delay.
Typically there is a 30-minute delay before our communications on the encrypted channels are available to those listening on a scanner.
Recently specialized units were working on an investigation, and because they were communicating with PH1 via CW1 to assist their investigation- the meat and potatoes of their investigation was immediately posted to social media by those listening to scanners.
This also placed covert officers in the position of being exposed.
Something to be mindful of from an officer-safety standpoint.
8/09/2023 04:48:00 AM
Exactly. Mfers to busy doing everything but listening to the fn radio
The quality is also different from zone to zone. Zone 12 I have to flip the switch and turn it up all the way to barely hear the dispatcher, while zone 1 is very loud. I’m sure we all can appreciate the hijackers with their Spanish broadcasts are gone but these new things suck.
I vote to go back to no encryption. Just have certain frequencies encrypted and have zones switch over temporarily if something super secret is afoot. Normal traffic doesn't need to be encrypted.
It may partially be the radio frequency. Oemc’s CAD system is outdated and has been glitchy for a while now. Zone 4 has some pretty decent dispatchers for the most part but I hope you all know who majority of your dispatchers are. They aren’t your friend nor are they on your side. They live by the current political narrative and don’t ever forget; When JVD was convicted the entire police side of OEMC erupted in cheers and celebration minus a few. It’s a cesspool of lefty blue line haters and BLM supporters.
This is a bold statement now. A very bold statement but I wouldn’t be surprised if the transmission was audible and clear but the dispatcher decided to… buy some time.
Those who know Know.
——
I’ll be the first one to say it, you’re a fucking idiot. Or a retired retard living in Florida, old fucking idiot. Or a troll. Officers and dispatchers can read right through your shit post.
The new encryption/radios/whatever is horrible. The echo that comes in when you're transmitting when other officers are near is distracting. The sound quality is garbage. I don't always understand what other officers are saying even when I have the volume turned up. It's all a major officer safety issue.
The new hires for zone 4 dispatchers prove that they’re hiring liberal dummies who hate police. Granny Patricia was 100x better than these people. But just like you can’t choose your bosses, you can’t choose your dispatchers. Not that other zones would even be better. They need to hire retired coppers as a priority. These dispatchers don’t care. As soon as anything starts to happen it becomes an ego battle and they want to clog the radio as much as possible so coppers can’t hear what’s going on. Give it a listen. You’ll see. Dispatchers are on the side of the criminals, probably hoping coppers get hurt half the time. Despicable behavior on the zone all the time.
Retired Sgt EP.. now the Facebook police. One of the most irritating people out there who thinks she’s still in charge of something. I love how she also takes credit for all her “work” she did and one time felt the need to say how many search warrants her team did in 312.. there’s one problem EP… THE TEAM did them… not you.. WE went out day in and day out and did the work. WE arrested people.. you would just do as many things as possible to try and get that merit bump.. like the one time you called the media to come fill when you bought a pool and set it up for kids in 005. You were sure to not start until the media came out then started the project with the media there. FORCING your team to help build it and have us all be part of your awful attempt of propaganda to get promoted. You and the other CPD Facebook nazis need to find a real hobby.. you’re not the police anymore and your little Facebook page is you last shred of any kind of control and relevance in the CPD.
The encrypted radios are crap!!! Yes they absolutely will get someone hurt or killed. They are no good for busy big city police work. Any sort of shouting or yelling from the officer or from a crowd in the background and they are unreadable. If an officer is excited at all you can’t copy anything. They are not practical for a big city department. Please go back to the old system. Sounded better, could understand it better and you could tell whose voice was speaking. If someone came up yelling you could tell whose voice it was. This new system slightly changes everyone’s voice to sound a little digital almost. The system sucks. Go back to the old zones it was way safer and if someone yelled you could hear it. This digital crap is not safe. Any police involved shooting with the digital radio and most of the communications are garbages, digitized or get scrambled from all the background noise. Terrible choice whoever decided to do it.
It may partially be the radio frequency. Oemc’s CAD system is outdated and has been glitchy for a while now. Zone 4 has some pretty decent dispatchers for the most part but I hope you all know who majority of your dispatchers are. They aren’t your friend nor are they on your side. They live by the current political narrative and don’t ever forget; When JVD was convicted the entire police side of OEMC erupted in cheers and celebration minus a few. It’s a cesspool of lefty blue line haters and BLM supporters.
This is a bold statement now. A very bold statement but I wouldn’t be surprised if the transmission was audible and clear but the dispatcher decided to… buy some time.
Those who know Know.
8/09/2023 01:34:00 AM
That is absolutely true certain groups do not like law and order. It started going downhill when civilians where hired. I wonder how bad the fire department is, the Fire Department has always been civilians I believe.
A question. How is CFD's radio system for emergency readability?
isn't it amazing how you can talk clearly to an astronaut in space but the CPD radios are junk??
Can someone explain how there is 150 people assigned to the Mayor’s Detail? It’s been increased by 60 people since Johnson took office. Why is this being ignored by the media?
Anonymous Anonymous said...
LOTS of Sergeants quitting over the past 2 months.
Nothing to see here.. Manpower in fine huh?
What is sad is how many on that list are patronage merit hacks. Getting 12 thousand dollars more than those of us on the list passed over illegally. No FOP, No wrap around like fire, just remember the rest of their life times when your bring home 80 or 85 grand for your blue shirt service these thieves are getting 95 to 105 thousand for stealing a promotion..time three percent cola, yea it all legit.
CFD radios are just as bad.
Anonymous Anonymous said...
isn't it amazing how you can talk clearly to an astronaut in space but the CPD radios are junk??
8/09/2023 03:45:00 PM
Not quite true. When a space craft is re-entering the earth there is a communications blackout due to the the friction between its surface and the surrounding air forms a plasma sheath, leading to a communication blackout lasting up to 10 minutes.
Just take a deep look at who runs the radio system.
All those self important directors, deputy directors, and project managers.
Remember, Motorola is now owned by China. It’s no longer the company it once was 40 years ago.
Eight thousand dollars for a single radio!!
Two cans and some string would work better
The nationwide push for encryption is ridiculous. This is a trend from big cities to rural counties. They cite “officer safety” as the reason usually, but as we know officer safety is more commonly endangered by these new radios not being able to get out. With old radios even if you had a low signal a lot of times dispatch or other officers could hear just enough to know there’s trouble. With encryption and digital you won’t get bits and pieces really. If the encryption key doesn’t transmit due to being in a low signal area then you aren’t getting out on the radio. To me all these agencies are being sold this snake oil by the radio manufacturers because it adds a lot to the cost. Scanners have been around almost 100 years now and I only know of a handful of incidents where officer safety was put at risk by it. I believe it’s more to do with agencies not wanting the public to know what’s going on 24/7
All part of the Junta's plan dehumanise the police praise the almighty street gangs and criminals.
Dispatchers should undergo an annual hearing test if they are not currently required to do so. Constant use of a headset with ever increasing volume levels is detrimental to hearing. Older people that are said to be "hard of hearing" doesn't mean that they don't hear someone talking it's that the higher frequencies are diminished making voices unintelligible.
Another possible solution is voice to text.
Sometimes that dispatch room sounds like a party going on and even with a headset its a wonder they hear anything not to mention what the noise going out to the troops is like when that happens
While I commend the first two responding officers with being concerned with the welfare of the officer who was attacked, they seemed to show little interest in going after the attacker.
Who pushed for the encryption and what was the real reason? Encryption just adds another layer of complexity to a radio system that should be as simple as possible for reliable communications. What's more dangerous-someone listening on a scanner to know what's going on in their community or an officer not being able to call for help when seconds count? yes the people using bootleg radios is an issue, but there are other fixes for that
I can hear the days FTO in 011 just fine. You don’t need to narrate every event you are on. Just code it, or type it.
8/09/2023 12:22:00 PM -
I don’t personally know her but do know that she thinks she’s something else. Always needs to post FIRST when some officer is injured on the job or dies or something newsworthy job wise happens. Like she’s the only one with inside info and she needs to post on fb to have people think she’s important enough to get the info first.
Get over yourself honey, you’re not all that.
Female Seattle cop's scathing 'exit' letter blames chief's 'failure'
This officer has brass balls! Could’ve been written to any of our recent supts.
She told Diaz (Chief): 'You willingly became a puppet, a spineless "yes man," perfectly willing to throw the entire department under the bus to achieve your coveted spot as chief, complete with a fancy corner office.
'Your approach reeks of a desperate hunger for control rather than genuine understanding and respect for the autonomy of our officers.
'Your controlling, bullying, and gaslighting tendencies have wreaked havoc on this department, driving away talented and dedicated officers.'
She added: 'You are a vindictive, power-hungry individual, and I wouldn't trust you as far as I could throw you.
'You offered me an opportunity for an honest exit interview, and here it is. I will always stand up for what's right and what I believe in ……..even if I am standing alone.'
"Digital transmissions are of a all or nothing nature. They either work well nor not at all. AM and the prior FM systems could deal with interference a bit better.
8/09/2023 12:49:00 AM"
As with all digital streaming pulse patterns, purity of transmission is vital to the reception of meaningful, and, thus, of value, communication information.
Any deviation, aka error, must be retransmitted, via tiny pulse packets format, until free of error, thus,the received signal stream peppered with silence, sound, silence, etc.
Analog, the nature of all reality, aka, perception of sensory stimulated inputs, has no vulnerabilty to diviation from purity of pulse patterns, as analog pulse patterns are continuously variable, aka theoretically infinite within the range of frequency utilized. This is true for both the source and the receiver.
The encryption of digital signal stream adds another layer of vital to be pure pulse patterns, purely transmitted and purely received.
Now add on the standards required by government specs, specifically our city government........
"I wonder how bad the fire department is, the Fire Department has always been civilians I believe.
8/09/2023 01:43:00 PM"
Since fire, by it's nature, is color blind, politics, to the flame, and the smoke, and the heat, has no value.
Granted, the location of the burning may have value to the perverted political retard.
For the citizen, which, for practical purpose is everyone, keep the garden hose handy and your utility bill paid.
8/09/2023 12:22:00 PM
Bravo and well said. Another useless knob who thinks she is relevant.
"Not quite true. When a space craft is re-entering the earth there is a communications blackout due to the the friction between its surface and the surrounding air forms a plasma sheath, leading to a communication blackout lasting up to 10 minutes.
8/09/2023 05:37:00 PM"
I have seen some nitpicky nimrod nitpickers on here, been occasionally accused of same, but, buddy, you take the nitpicker nitwitted nimrod knucklehead posse putz prize of the year.......
If I didn’t know anything I would say we are going out of business. Bad management everywhere and bad policy is the normal operating environment.
https://www.space.com/x-class-solar-flare-radio-blackout-august-2023
Solar activity not helping with radio problems.
I seem to recall in the old days dozens of people dozens of times a day intentionally interfering with our transmissions. Remember when some POS you were going after had his homies key up on a cheater and hold it down so NOBODY could communicate? I remember. Remember at the end of May 2020 when the commies and anarchists were doing the same while officers were getting attacked by mobs and calling 10-1’s downtown? And nobody could help because no one heard those calls of a 10-1? I remember that too. Surprised how many of you don’t.
U want to hear how it sounds for the dispatcher? Listen online with the 30min delay. Its perfectly clear. I suspect its a short between the headphone and the chair.
Anonymous said...
Can someone explain how there is 150 people assigned to the Mayor’s Detail? It’s been increased by 60 people since Johnson took office. Why is this being ignored by the media?
8/09/2023 04:15:00 PM
The guy lives in the f***en ghetto what do you expect?
The nationwide push for encryption is ridiculous. This is a trend from big cities to rural counties. They cite “officer safety” as the reason usually, but as we know officer safety is more commonly endangered by these new radios not being able to get out. With old radios even if you had a low signal a lot of times dispatch or other officers could hear just enough to know there’s trouble. With encryption and digital you won’t get bits and pieces really. If the encryption key doesn’t transmit due to being in a low signal area then you aren’t getting out on the radio. To me all these agencies are being sold this snake oil by the radio manufacturers because it adds a lot to the cost. Scanners have been around almost 100 years now and I only know of a handful of incidents where officer safety was put at risk by it. I believe it’s more to do with agencies not wanting the public to know what’s going on 24/7
8/09/2023 06:27:00 PM
So we had 13 zones. add a few citywides. If would have taken an order of 20 radios from china to shut down the entire communication of the city during an event.
Sorry, I'm not buying.
Retired Sgt EP.. now the Facebook police. One of the most irritating people out there who thinks she’s still in charge of something. I love how she also takes credit for all her “work” she did and one time felt the need to say how many search warrants her team did in 312.. there’s one problem EP… THE TEAM did them… not you.. WE went out day in and day out and did the work. WE arrested people.. you would just do as many things as possible to try and get that merit bump.. like the one time you called the media to come fill when you bought a pool and set it up for kids in 005. You were sure to not start until the media came out then started the project with the media there. FORCING your team to help build it and have us all be part of your awful attempt of propaganda to get promoted. You and the other CPD Facebook nazis need to find a real hobby.. you’re not the police anymore and your little Facebook page is you last shred of any kind of control and relevance in the CPD.
Bad body Det JM still salty about his dumping. Nobody on our team could stand being near you. Stop being a coward and say it to her face. And for Gods sake please tale a shower once a week
WTF were those 2 useless females doing? They acted like 2 moms whose kid feel off a swing. Unreal. Good job 18-12
It's 2023 for God's sake. You mean to tell me that Motorola hasn't figured out CLEAR communications by now?? I work at a court job where we use Motorola radios and the audio is so muffled you can barely understand people.
As I recall...The encrypted radio system was devised by the feds. Homeland security and the Patriot Act pushed it through with government funding. As you know, once they get their foot in the door, they get to set the rules, and control all the decisions made as long as they are funding the program. The original radios were called Stix/Styx? and the batteries only lasted about 3/4 of a tour. They are a little better now.
The original idea was that in a national emergency, such as an act of war, terrorist attack, or Martial Law being declared, these radios would provide a structured command systems communications policy. The local police would be tied into a communications system along with higher governmental agencies such as FBI, CIA, Homeland security, and the Military to name a few. The transmissions are encrypted so that anyone with a scanner can't tune in. We can't have the people just listening in here, can we?
The frequencies are dedicated and in control of the FCC. Chicago jumped in early on this trainwreck because it came with a lot of money to fund it. As usual with any federal program, it has never worked right since day one, and there is absolutely no accountability for a system that isn't any better than what we had.
It's time to cut the cord and go back to the UHF/VHF band. We would need all new radios, and probably some new transmitters as I am sure the old ones are gone by now.
Yes...Big Brother is on our back. Layered in governmental agencies too redundant to be listed here. So entwined like a liver, pancreatic, cancer...
Stay fetal my brothers, there will be at least another four years of this garbage...
What is sad is how many on that list are patronage merit hacks. Getting 12 thousand dollars more than those of us on the list passed over illegally. No FOP, No wrap around like fire, just remember the rest of their life times when your bring home 80 or 85 grand for your blue shirt service these thieves are getting 95 to 105 thousand for stealing a promotion..time three percent cola, yea it all legit.
Every police officer in top 400 should put in for a merit promotion. When denied , file a law suit . Equal opportunity, racial discrimination.
Let’s see how city defends a person with a 50-60% score on the multiple choice test , maybe also request the merits oral recorded test , many also have no patrol time , complimentary history.
Good Police Officers are being passed over for political hacks , police officers of all races are being denied a promotion.
it still could be done
Anonymous Anonymous said...
I can hear the days FTO in 011 just fine. You don’t need to narrate every event you are on. Just code it, or type it.
Only unstable person would volunteer to become an FTO and stay in or request 011. PSYCHE eval is required for this individual.
I don’t personally know her but do know that she thinks she’s something else. Always needs to post FIRST when some officer is injured on the job or dies or something newsworthy job wise happens. Like she’s the only one with inside info and she needs to post on fb to have people think she’s important enough to get the info first.
Get over yourself honey, you’re not all that.
8/09/2023 11:24:00 PM
Wack job, several us have contacted Facebook about being forced out of group that takes the name of the Chicago Police.
Copyright infringement, misusing the city for for personal benefit..
While I commend the first two responding officers with being concerned with the welfare of the officer who was attacked, they seemed to show little interest in going after the attacker.
—————
Thank you, I’m glad somebody said it
Anonymous said...
I don’t personally know her but do know that she thinks she’s something else. Always needs to post FIRST when some officer is injured on the job or dies or something newsworthy job wise happens. Like she’s the only one with inside info and she needs to post on fb to have people think she’s important enough to get the info first.
Get over yourself honey, you’re not all that.
I agree how disgusting was it when she used the tragedy of Ella French and Yanez as clout chasing solely for attention. She did it again with another Officer who unfortunately committed suicide. What a disgusting human she is using tragic situations for "look at me" attention.
Didn’t half of you idiots fall for Keefe Thornton’s charades? I think I’ve come across 2 maybe 3 coppers at most who didn’t.
The rest of you?
“Oh he’s awesome he did a great job.”
8/11/2023 03:55:00 PM
Those 2 dollies and the 1 with the horse tail hair style were afraid to chase that dude down, instead stuck around and talked and pretended to do stuff. Typical and useless.
Save CPD Pension Fund
1.End Gold Braid Immediately
2.Pension based on last rank that a sworn police officer was promoted to in rank order . Merit SGT.,LT.,Captain,Exempt will retire at a Police Officer Pension . Same for the appointed rank of security specialist .
3.End the two tier pension system . Equal pay, benefits for everyone. Young men and women were sold out by former union leaders.
4.End all Merit promotions . It's unfair for police officers of every race.
I thought Brandon Johnson said he would get rid of them while camping. I guess it was all bull.
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